Fornits
General Interest => Open Free for All => Topic started by: starry-eyed pirate on December 09, 2008, 05:22:57 PM
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I was reading the paper today. Saw OJ was finally gonna do some time. The article began with a definition of the word, "justice" from dictionary.com: "the administering of deserved punishment or reward" ...
I don't know...don't seem to me that one can get "retroactive justice", which was the title of the article BTW. I was actually surprised at that definition. It doesn't sound like "justice" to me at all...more like social control or revenge or something other than justice. Maybe "compensation" of some sort. It seems to me, though, that justice is only available in the present. One can live justly or not, but I don't think one can have justice for what has happened in the past. The past is just a memory There is only the present. If you have committed crimes or been unjust in the past simply act with justice now, as you go about your day. ...Anyway... :clown:
Injustice, like when someone is trampled to death by some mob made up of the individual egos that are all so focused on what they want for themselves that they are unable to recognize the man coming to unlock the door as a human being. The key he held in his hands was all he was worth to the people who trampled him or could have. It doesn't matter what punishment you give to the tramplers, that was an injustice and no action can change that.
A friend of mine and I were talkin about "Justice" once and he said something to me I'll never forget. He said "Justice" is just not usin anybody for nothin, ever. I think that's right on. The implication bein if you are dealt injustice by some force of another's selfish ego, it is just an injustice and you cannot make it otherwise through violence or imprisonment or action of any kind. That would just be more injustice, wouldn't it ??
I guess it just freaks me out the way the society or the establishment or whatever, most people out there, don't have any sense of what justice even is. They leave that up to the law, like so many fools and suckers, and surrender their natural autonomy daily. They have no intuitive sense of it coming from within themselves. This is the problem that develops when people allow their government to regulate their own behavior. Government and law cuts us off from our potential as human beings.
Oh well just some stuff I had on my mind today, thought I'd throw up a post..."...with words they try to jail ya..."-Sting
:poison: :peace:
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That was a great post. I've often contemplated 'justice'.
I've come to the conclusion that humans are much more 'animal' than they want to admit. We're out for our own self interest and will trample anyone in our path if we can get away with it.
don't get me started on presidential pardons.....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_pe ... ge_W._Bush (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_pardoned_by_George_W._Bush)
We don't have true justice in the US or any other country for that matter. Every institution is a 'best effort' social experiment. It drives me nuts when judges and DA's get on their fucking high horse and preach about right and wrong. I want to club baby seals when I hear the term 'contempt for court'.
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Fuck OJ..
They should have taken him out back and shot him. Saved everyone the time.
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OJ isn't special. Hundreds of degenerates commit the same crime every year. He happened to be a celebrity.
And yes he's a smug, arrogant, son of a bitch. Hell, if you got paid $3 million a year to play flanker - it would go to your head too.
Your hatred is for Johnny Cockring, the judicial system, cocky attitude, and the media.
His whole ordeal was a CNN media manufactured circus. Do you know how much fucking money they made off of that trial?
Judge Ito is god.
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Government and law cuts us off from our potential as human beings.
People want their meat killed for them, and they want the government (and by proxy the law) to 'fix' everything for them, too.
"Society Is A Hole"
-Sonic Youth
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People want their meat killed for them, and they want the government (and by proxy the law) to 'fix' everything for them, too.
i like single serving friends
I want to babysitted
and don't edumacate me too far. Thinking for meself is scary.
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i like single serving friends
Cannibalism, eh? :D
Q. Why don't cannibals eat clowns? :clown:
A. Because they taste funny! :rofl: :rofl:
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OJ isn't special. Hundreds of degenerates commit the same crime every year. He happened to be a celebrity.
And yes he's a smug, arrogant, son of a bitch. Hell, if you got paid $3 million a year to play flanker - it would go to your head too.
Your hatred is for Johnny Cockring, the judicial system, cocky attitude, and the media.
His whole ordeal was a CNN media manufactured circus. Do you know how much fucking money they made off of that trial?
Judge Ito is god.
No my hatred is for OJ's string of shitty movies.
fuck him.. 1 to the temple behind the dumpster in the alley and be done with it.
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single serving friends is a 'fight club' movie reference
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single serving friends is a 'fight club' movie reference
thank you for posting about cedu, dish, on an unrelated note.
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thanks for every cedu person for coming here and calling a spade a spade.
we sat there for 2 1/2 years with buttoned lips
gladly taking the beat down
fuck that place
our time could have been spent constructively.
For ourselves and others.
Now
we can help those in need not those in swollen wallets.
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I don't know...don't seem to me that one can get "retroactive justice", which was the title of the article BTW. I was actually surprised at that definition. It doesn't sound like "justice" to me at all...more like social control or revenge or something other than justice. Maybe "compensation" of some sort. It seems to me, though, that justice is only available in the present. One can live justly or not, but I don't think one can have justice for what has happened in the past. The past is just a memory There is only the present. If you have committed crimes or been unjust in the past simply act with justice now, as you go about your day.
Nah, I'd take the retroactive justice if that op were open to me.. better than no justice at all. Your making the mistake, Pirate, of thinking the right should equal the wrong of the crime. It won't. It almost never will. But that doesn't mean that it can't go far, in helping the healing along.
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Since O.J. has this skin problem, he should stay quiet and out of sight.
He must have known that they would try to get him sooner or later after justice was done back in L.A.
His case is almost like the case of Willie Francis (http://http://www.williefrancis.com/html/enter.html) but instead the chair, O.J. got jail.
Some claim that the race card is played too often, but if some should claim that it must be us here in Europe. I cannot even call women the middle east cap Gulls as the courts have allowed us to (http://http://www.arbejdsmiljoeportalen.dk/sw71250.asp) before anyone shout "racist".
(If you translate the second article you will learn that the court granted the employee about 25.000 dollars because firing her due to that statement was an attack against our effort to support your war against terrorism.)
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OJ isn't special. Hundreds of degenerates commit the same crime every year. He happened to be a celebrity.
And yes he's a smug, arrogant, son of a bitch. Hell, if you got paid $3 million a year to play flanker - it would go to your head too.
Your hatred is for Johnny Cockring, the judicial system, cocky attitude, and the media.
His whole ordeal was a CNN media manufactured circus. Do you know how much fucking money they made off of that trial?
Judge Ito is god.
I agree, we love to hate that smug, arrogant SOB (I know I do), but you're right about all of this. His trial was in our faces, day in day out, whether we wanted it to be or not, in place of our favorite shows (I had no cable at the time and became increasingly irritated with that shithead's trial being broadcast instead of the late show w/ David Letterman (I'm a Letterman guy, fuck Leno, he sucks), just WAY too much media coverage for what it was. I wanted him dead just so I could return to regularly scheduled viewing, for fuck's sake. Yes, hate, hate, HATE....but not all for O.J.
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I don't know...don't seem to me that one can get "retroactive justice", which was the title of the article BTW. I was actually surprised at that definition. It doesn't sound like "justice" to me at all...more like social control or revenge or something other than justice. Maybe "compensation" of some sort. It seems to me, though, that justice is only available in the present. One can live justly or not, but I don't think one can have justice for what has happened in the past. The past is just a memory There is only the present. If you have committed crimes or been unjust in the past simply act with justice now, as you go about your day.
... Your making the mistake, Pirate, of thinking the right should equal the wrong of the crime. It won't.
Not sure what you mean by this...?? What do you mean by "the right". What "right" ??
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I don't know...don't seem to me that one can get "retroactive justice", which was the title of the article BTW. I was actually surprised at that definition. It doesn't sound like "justice" to me at all...more like social control or revenge or something other than justice. Maybe "compensation" of some sort. It seems to me, though, that justice is only available in the present. One can live justly or not, but I don't think one can have justice for what has happened in the past. The past is just a memory There is only the present. If you have committed crimes or been unjust in the past simply act with justice now, as you go about your day.
... Your making the mistake, Pirate, of thinking the right should equal the wrong of the crime. It won't.
Not sure what you mean by this...?? What do you mean by "the right". What "right" ??
my bad. "right" as in rectification. as in "righting a wrong". you would hope the righting of a wrong would be equal to..would cancel out the wrong. but it almost never does.
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I don't know...don't seem to me that one can get "retroactive justice", which was the title of the article BTW. I was actually surprised at that definition. It doesn't sound like "justice" to me at all...more like social control or revenge or something other than justice. Maybe "compensation" of some sort. It seems to me, though, that justice is only available in the present. One can live justly or not, but I don't think one can have justice for what has happened in the past. The past is just a memory There is only the present. If you have committed crimes or been unjust in the past simply act with justice now, as you go about your day.
Nah, I'd take the retroactive justice if that op were open to me.. better than no justice at all. Your making the mistake, Pirate, of thinking the right should equal the wrong of the crime. It won't. It almost never will. But that doesn't mean that it can't go far, in helping the healing along.
Nerp, im with Pirate on this one....
There is only one true form of justice and thats the strength to accept and not lower yourself to the dark depths of others evil acts. When my daughter and my mother in law were killed in that car wreck, well there were fifty different avenues I could have followed to get "justice'.....but you know what, it was never justice Id get...it would only ever be blame. And blame is a one sided party guys....youre the one spending your energy doing all the blaming.....makes for a nice avoidance tactic and a big fat waste of life, nothing more. I realized right away that there was no justice because there was no going back...they were gone, period, end of story. Whether or not someone else was responsible would never equal the loss...not a chance.
All that was left was for me to either spend the rest of my life pursuing the secret to time travel, or get on with it and grow as an individual based on my experience.....EVERYTHING in life can be a gift or a blessing if you have the guts to recognize it, thats real justice. You can be free of the wrongs done to you if you are strong enough to absorb them, transform them, and come out kickin'.
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Well, then, Carmel, what are you doing here?
If there is "no justice because there was no going back", why fight abusive problems at all? After all, the stuff already happened, right? Just let it roll over you and do nothing, right? If it continues on and other kids get their lives ruined because you did nothing, thats THEIR problem, right? After all there is no such thing as real justice, right?
"EVERYTHING in life can be a gift or a blessing if you have the guts to recognize it, thats real justice."
You go on do your "recognizing". Let OTHER people put their money where their mouth is.
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Well, the point is not that justice doesn't exist, but that it's only possible in the present. You can act justly toward others or not, but what's been done cannot be undone and what was done unjustly cannot be made just. It's just done. Aint it ??
...
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I don't know...don't seem to me that one can get "retroactive justice", which was the title of the article BTW. I was actually surprised at that definition. It doesn't sound like "justice" to me at all...more like social control or revenge or something other than justice. Maybe "compensation" of some sort. It seems to me, though, that justice is only available in the present. One can live justly or not, but I don't think one can have justice for what has happened in the past. The past is just a memory There is only the present. If you have committed crimes or been unjust in the past simply act with justice now, as you go about your day.
... Your making the mistake, Pirate, of thinking the right should equal the wrong of the crime. It won't.
Not sure what you mean by this...?? What do you mean by "the right". What "right" ??
my bad. "right" as in rectification. as in "righting a wrong". you would hope the righting of a wrong would be equal to..would cancel out the wrong. but it almost never does.
Nothing that occurs will ever alter what has already happened. Not physically anyway. I don't see how wrongs can ever be righted. Understanding has the potential to alter the value of memory, though.
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Well, then, Carmel, what are you doing here?
If there is "no justice because there was no going back", why fight abusive problems at all? After all, the stuff already happened, right? Just let it roll over you and do nothing, right? If it continues on and other kids get their lives ruined because you did nothing, thats THEIR problem, right? After all there is no such thing as real justice, right?
"EVERYTHING in life can be a gift or a blessing if you have the guts to recognize it, thats real justice."
You go on do your "recognizing". Let OTHER people put their money where their mouth is.
I think this is very different, coming here. I am admittedly not an activist, I share my thoughts and relate to other people who've been through what I have, and I support the idea of creating a future where kids dont have to endure what I did. Thats not justice, thats prevention, there is a difference there. I have not devoted a significant part of my life to protest or organize for this forums cause.......however if I can come here and talk about my experience so that others can get a clearer picture of what this industry is all about, I wouldnt call that "doing nothing because its THEIR problem". You mistake my attitude completely, its not my intention to block out the bad things that have happened to me and pretend they dont exist.....I am aware of the existence of the loss of my daughter every single day, every moment, always.....but along with each moment of awareness comes a choice to sink or swim. There is no amount of money or accountability from others in the world that would change that simple fact.
To me there is no real justice in the conventional sense because there can never be a complete reckoning. You may receive a measure of satisfaction from holding others accountable, but that doesnt take away the damage done to you at the outset.....that STILL must be addressed, whether the "justice" has been served or not.
These are things Ive realized in my personal experience, and it has been extremely freeing for me, I believe others should have the same opportunity.
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Well, then, Carmel, what are you doing here?
If there is "no justice because there was no going back", why fight abusive problems at all? After all, the stuff already happened, right? Just let it roll over you and do nothing, right? If it continues on and other kids get their lives ruined because you did nothing, thats THEIR problem, right? After all there is no such thing as real justice, right?
"EVERYTHING in life can be a gift or a blessing if you have the guts to recognize it, thats real justice."
You go on do your "recognizing". Let OTHER people put their money where their mouth is.
The funny thing is, this was most likely posted by a non-survivor. ::)
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Well, then, Carmel, what are you doing here?
If there is "no justice because there was no going back", why fight abusive problems at all? After all, the stuff already happened, right? Just let it roll over you and do nothing, right? If it continues on and other kids get their lives ruined because you did nothing, thats THEIR problem, right? After all there is no such thing as real justice, right?
"EVERYTHING in life can be a gift or a blessing if you have the guts to recognize it, thats real justice."
You go on do your "recognizing". Let OTHER people put their money where their mouth is.
The funny thing is, this was most likely posted by a non-survivor. ::)
My thoughts exactly; this evolution reject is talking out his/her ass.
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Government and law cuts us off from our potential as human beings.
People want their meat killed for them, and they want the government (and by proxy the law) to 'fix' everything for them, too.
"Society Is A Hole"
-Sonic Youth
Well I wish they didn't try and fix me in straight. It is the anniversary of when I went in and am having PTSD bad, as if the holidays are not stressful enough...no wonder I hated this time of year for the longest time but just recently (15 yrs later) realized why?? What unbelievable damage and I have no words just saddness and irritability. But where are those pple now who tryed to 'help me' I could use some real help now! I just don't know how to trust any help or where it would come from.
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Well I wish they didn't try and fix me in straight. It is the anniversary of when I went in and am having PTSD bad, as if the holidays are not stressful enough...no wonder I hated this time of year for the longest time but just recently (15 yrs later) realized why?? What unbelievable damage and I have no words just saddness and irritability. But where are those pple now who tryed to 'help me' I could use some real help now! I just don't know how to trust any help or where it would come from.
Start smoking marijuana, or eating marijuana-containing foods. Marijuana has been clinically shown to reduce PTSD symptoms. These findings aren't widely publicized in our nation because they conflict with the government's official stance on marijuana, i.e. that it is an illicit 'drug' and that it has no medical or therapeutic value. However, many people all over the world have used, and continue to use marijuana therapeutically and medically, by prescription and as a traditional medical practice, in addition to the number who use it recreationally.
After you've begun to regularly smoke marijuana, and the PTSD sympoms have noticeably decreased, you can begin to deal with and develop coping strategies for recovering from the damage and understanding the causes of (and finding alternatives to) the feelings of sadness and irritability. The holidays suck anyway, and having to deal with the shit we went through, and its fallout in our lives, makes an already taxing time that much more stressful. Light up and lighten up. Trust your instincts, not the bullshit they told you in Straight. Avoid the tendency to over analyze your thoughts and feelings. That shit they told you in Straight is just jive......it doesn't help you cope with the real world or your thoughts or emotions or anything like that---it just was a means of them exercising control over your thinking during the times you weren't in group or immersed in Straight culture.
I suppose there are pharmaceutical drugs, antidepressants and such, that could probably give you some kind of relief from the sadness and the PTSD and all.........BUT:
THE SIDE EFFECTS OF THOSE KINDS OF DRUGS CAN BE DANGEROUS TO YOU AND OTHERS.
Marijuana, on the other hand, has killed no one during the thousands of years it has been used.
Sometimes it helps us, psychologically, to get a little 'jump start' out of a depression or some kind of trauma. Marijuana is a safe and effective means of doing 'just' that.
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Well I wish they didn't try and fix me in straight. It is the anniversary of when I went in and am having PTSD bad, as if the holidays are not stressful enough...no wonder I hated this time of year for the longest time but just recently (15 yrs later) realized why?? What unbelievable damage and I have no words just saddness and irritability. But where are those pple now who tryed to 'help me' I could use some real help now! I just don't know how to trust any help or where it would come from.
Start smoking marijuana, or eating marijuana-containing foods. Marijuana has been clinically shown to reduce PTSD symptoms. These findings aren't widely publicized in our nation because they conflict with the government's official stance on marijuana, i.e. that it is an illicit 'drug' and that it has no medical or therapeutic value. However, many people all over the world have used, and continue to use marijuana therapeutically and medically, by prescription and as a traditional medical practice, in addition to the number who use it recreationally.
After you've begun to regularly smoke marijuana, and the PTSD sympoms have noticeably decreased, you can begin to deal with and develop coping strategies for recovering from the damage and understanding the causes of (and finding alternatives to) the feelings of sadness and irritability. The holidays suck anyway, and having to deal with the shit we went through, and its fallout in our lives, makes an already taxing time that much more stressful. Light up and lighten up. Trust your instincts, not the bullshit they told you in Straight. Avoid the tendency to over analyze your thoughts and feelings. That shit they told you in Straight is just jive......it doesn't help you cope with the real world or your thoughts or emotions or anything like that---it just was a means of them exercising control over your thinking during the times you weren't in group or immersed in Straight culture.
I suppose there are pharmaceutical drugs, antidepressants and such, that could probably give you some kind of relief from the sadness and the PTSD and all.........BUT:
THE SIDE EFFECTS OF THOSE KINDS OF DRUGS CAN BE DANGEROUS TO YOU AND OTHERS.
Marijuana, on the other hand, has killed no one during the thousands of years it has been used.
Sometimes it helps us, psychologically, to get a little 'jump start' out of a depression or some kind of trauma. Marijuana is a safe and effective means of doing 'just' that.
I must concur!!
:rasta: :rasta: :rasta: :rasta: :rasta: :rasta: :rasta: :rasta: :rasta:
No, srsly. It's true.
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Thanks for your suggestion. I do love the stuff cooked up in fried rice but I haven't had it in a while.... There is a great chinese restaurant in my hood that makes it so good! Thanks for reminding me.