Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Anonymous on October 28, 2007, 09:36:38 AM
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What "other side of the story" do you keep referring to?
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What "other side of the story" do you keep referring to?
That not everyone has bad experiences in programs, and that they are not all bad. That's it! Big fucking deal!!!!
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Would you say this about the program that you were in?
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What "other side of the story" do you keep referring to?
That not everyone has bad experiences in programs, and that they are not all bad. That's it! Big fucking deal!!!!
keep quoting her so she will hopefully stop with all her lying.
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With the ability to change everyone's posts how will you know what is truth, or what is lies?
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I think this thread is fairly safe...so, would you say this was true about the program you were in?
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My comments will be changed anyway, it doesn't matter what I think, or what I have to say anymore.
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How ironic. That's kind of what it felt like to be in one of those programs you are so fond of.
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How ironic. That's kind of what it felt like to be in one of those programs you are so fond of.
(http://http://content.ytmnd.com/content/5/3/b/53bad93d9eb7362366a3e4419bab3f3a.gif) OH SNAP
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My comments will be changed anyway, it doesn't matter what I think, or what I have to say anymore.
Jesus Christ! You enormous great whale of a hog's cunt, would you quit whining? Me, me me...CCM didn't address the Narcissism, did they my bitch? You're married, right? I'll bet your husband prays for Armageddon every night, the wretched, pussy-whipped invertebrate, or at least prays for you to get a smaller strap-on dingus.
Don't think of it as having your comments changed, you maniacal, egotistical whore, think of it as having them corrected. You worthless pig fucker, you douche nozzle.
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Parents, this is what group therapy looks like in programs...
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Maybe in your program? What program were you in again?!!
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Come over here and be in my program, CCM girl, you lil cutie pie! I've got lots of stuff I can teach a feisty lil whipper snapper like you, har har har!!!
Joseph Wait-'till-you-see-what-I-have-to-show-you Gauld, The Educator
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bump - too good to die yet.
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Parents, this is what group therapy looks like in programs...
::roflmao:: its funny because it's true... :lol:
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explains a lot of stuff here.
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My comments will be changed anyway, it doesn't matter what I think, or what I have to say anymore.
Jesus Christ! You enormous great whale of a hog's cunt, would you quit whining? Me, me me...CCM didn't address the Narcissism, did they my bitch?
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Parents, this is what group therapy looks like in programs...
::roflmao:: its funny because it's true... :lol:
We need to put CCM through a rap thread.
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My comments will be changed anyway, it doesn't matter what I think, or what I have to say anymore.
Precious quote from CCMgirl, I think she just needs some structure and rules - that's all - I mean you can't just going around saying whatever you want, whenever you want to right?
I mean (exasperated sigh), c'mon - what if you said whatever you wanted, whenever you wanted at your job or school or college - what if everyone did that! There would no ORDER!!!! No rules!!! the world would cease to exist as we know it!!! :rofl:
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:rofl: ::roflmao:: ::ftard:: ::bwahaha:: ::bwahaha2:: :silly:
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OK, OK, - you asked for the real CCM girl - here she is in all her glory - no worries it's safe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XE0dYZiJVs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XE0dYZiJVs)
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(http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XE0dYZiJVs)
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We are here, because we want to make a difference in the world! And we can't do it by sitting at home or work just talking/typing about it.
LET'S STAGE A PROTEST!!!!
I'm totally serious. I really don't care which one of these places we stage it at??? I'm thinking it needs to be one that will get us the most attention. A state that allows us to protest...I'd hate to be arrested.......as much as I love the cuffs......I hate the cells. J/K I have had enough of that! Who would seriously consider doing this? I'm thinking sometime in March......???
I'd love to hear your thoughts! If anything it would be a great party!!!!!!
We do need to make a stand. Sooner or later......... or else it will continue to just go on and on.
I'm not going to be old, and gray typing on this keyboard of mine........you all do need to do something!!!
Is it the money issue?
Taking the time off from real life?
Kids are suffering.
Think about it.
I'd like to have a commitment from 50 people. I'm not going to show up there all alone.
What are you doing in March????
I hope you all are having a beautiful day out there! And as your thinking about how great life is (because it is), think about all of those teens that are currently at WWASPS and other programs like it who can't leave, and go outside to take a brisk walk, and smell the freshness of the air, and to hear the sounds of life.
They are in desperate need of our help! I can't do it alone, and I look forward to the day when we can all come together, and make a difference.
I hope you guys had a great week, and that you have some fun things planned for the weekend! Please don't forget about the thousands of kids that are in these programs, who aren't as fortunate to have the same freedoms as us.
I just want to remind people about showing up at these seminars. There are a number of them going across the country. Please check this website to find the closest one near you.
http://www.parentsupportservices.com/se ... N=88387652 (http://www.parentsupportservices.com/seminars/schedules/index.cfm?step4&seminartypeId+1&CFID=91678&CFTOKEN=88387652)
You can get your message out in any way you'd like, it doesn't have to be full blown protest, if you've had little time to prepare. You can merely show up with some basic facts, and important information, that these parents deserve to have. Information that I am sure these seminars will not want to provide them with.
It doesn't matter if you are just one person, or fifty + people. What matters, is that you are being heard. How are these parents to know, unless we tell them what really happens at these places?
You can count on me to be at the one in San Jose, CA. it's only 2 hours from me. I used to live in Palo Alto so I have plenty of friends that I can stay with there. My style of approach is going to be cool, and calm. I am there to edjucate, and to get through to parents, not to be outta control, and scream in their face.
Now, if they were to kick me out of the hotel, and off the grounds, well then I do need to get loud. How else would I be heard??? Anyway, if there are people in the San Jose area that would like to show up, great! But, if you can't make it I understand. The only people who have no excuse are the people who live in the area who come on sites, such as this, and type away saying how awful it is, and then don't do shit about it. Those people irritate me!
I personally think the most important day to show up in San Jose, is 4-7 which is a Friday. We are all busy people, but this truely is the most important day for obvious reasons (1st day of seminar).
Hey guys!
I really need your help, and to show up in San Jose, Ca. 4-7 through 4-9. I am not sure if I will be able to be there the whole time??? The first day is the most important. If you are in the immediate 2 hour area I want you to be there!
I just got off the phone with Ken Kay. I asked him how he slept at night? He said he slept fine knowing that he's helped thousands of kids. No matter what I said.....he had no emotion........and finally got frusterated, and hung up on me.
The phone conversation lasted about 10 minutes, going back and forth.........and just the same shit we all read in the papers. What can I expect? What can we expect?
BTW....toward the end of the conversation, almost like it was an after thought, he brought up that WWASPS did not own or operate the 8 schools I mentioned.
During our conversation, he was working on his hot rod, and managed to electricute himself, I did let him know I was disappointed it wasn't at a higher voltage.....he didn't laugh at that one.
He did tell me though that I was obviousley not helped by the program, and that I was a sick individual.
Hmmm.........I haven't heard that from anyone since I was in that hell hole. Funny how it comes at me again when I talk to someone from that program. You see, that's how they treat the kids. Like something is wrong with them.
That's why I am here, that's why I'll remain.
I am in my 30's, and I am doing just fine. Except for one thing.....I came across WWASP on the internet about 5 months ago. I was very upset how they had grown in numbers, and when I had read what was still happening (and had even gotten worse since I had been there), I felt the need to start doing something about it.
It's hard since we are all very busy, but I would feel even more guilty then I already do, if I sat back and did nothing.
So, I am trying to do something. I am trying to get the truth out. Do I get something from doing this? Only the satisfaction that I am doing what is right.
It's pretty obvious to me that WWASPS staff post here. I personally could care less. I think it's great that they do this, because in order for them to post, they have to read what former students and parents have written about them.
Just as much as the owners think they can save families, by breaking the rebellious spirits of teenagers.........I think I can get in the minds of these staff who come on here to post, and hopefully get them to look at what their doing a little differently. A lot of staff that WWASPS hires has little to no schooling, and a lot of times come from small towns that have no other real job opportunities but working at a WWASP school.
So, if they can't break free of WWASP because they need to support a family, then I really hope that they might treat these kids with a little more kindness then the program would like them to.
That's all I can hope for until the day comes when these places are all shut down. It will come. The owners don't even know, but it will come. Just like the .com bust.........look what happened to the stock market......OUCH.........and look what is currently happening in California with the housing market.........???????
People always say don't worry, it's still great, blah blah blah! Then BAM!!!!! You get hit. I see the owners doing their best to patch a levy that is springing way to many leaks. It's on the verge of bursting, and will drown them all.
Who do you have to blame, but yourselves. You got too greedy. You lost sight of what was important to families. You thought you knew it all. You thought you had the answer to everyones problems. You don't. I don't think you ever did.
Are you directing this comment towards me? Because, I get this strange feeling you are?!! So, let me just say this......I was and sometimes still am angry and upset with my parents for sending me away, and into the hands of WWASP schools where I did experience abuse. It was very traumatic, and even after 15 years the pain is still there.
Look, I am a great person! I admit that I did not go about getting released from CCM the "right way". Sorry, but after being at Heritage School in Provo Utah for 3 1/2 years being sent there when I was 12, and then being shipped from Heritage School directly to Cross Creek Manor for 9 months. It was no mystery, my parents had planned to keep me there until I was 18. Just so they could travel the world with no worries. Gee, thanks!
My therapist Dr. Goodwin knew this. We talked about it openly. I was like a dog chasing it's tail for so long, thinking if I do well enough my parents will someday take me home. They never did. The fact WWASP sat back collecting my parents money, and not forcing them to take me home, or put me in a more appropriate place, it was very frusterating for me.
I regret things I have done, that may have hurt people, and caused them big time headaches. But, do they regret what they did to me? Who knows, but I doubt it.
It's in my nature to be forgiving. I also have the ability to still love those who may have hurt me. But, I cannot sit back, and let this continue. These schools, and what's happening. It's horrible, and I can't tell you how much this has been on my mind these past few months.
It drives me crazy, and for those of you who I did hurt.......I never lied. I only did what I had to do to get away. I deserved to be released, and you know that. Blackmailing people was a one time thing for me. It killed me to do it. I still feel guilty, and horrible about it. But, there was no other options. It was the only way you'd let me leave.
There was a comment that was made a few posts back......with WWASPS you are getting a particle board kitchen table at a solid oak table price. This comment really sums up how I feel about WWASPS.
WWASP pays parents and anyone else interested thousands of dollars in cash or free months to recruit for them -- and nothing you say will change that fact. Spin the facts and your own logic all you want -- it changes nothing.
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You are quite verbose.
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Look, there is no denying that is how I felt 2 years ago. I stumbled upon Fornits, not thinking about any of my experiences for 15 whole years. I came here, and started reading everyones posts. I was outraged of the allegations of abuse. I believed everything that people were saying on here, and I wanted to go after them (WWASPS), I am not denying that.
But, after I calmed down...took a look at the other side, took a long hard look at myself, I changed my mind.
I don't feel that way anymore. I figured out some things, and quite frankly with how you all were acting (and still acting), I woke up real quick. I started thinking more, and more, I am not like the majority of people on here.
I am not anti-program. I am all for getting families, and teens on the right track. However that may be. I am not an ed con, and I don't refer families to schools/programs/treatment centers. I just see things differently.
People say that I am "Programmed" but, don't you think I would of come out of there preaching how great everything was, and yada, yada, yada if I was programmed? From the get go I would've been like the programs saved my life!!! It didn't happen that way though, did it?
I finally just realized that I felt differently about my experiences then most of you felt about yours. I stopped blaming everyone else. I took some responsibility for the things that got me sent there in the first place. And now, I sit here and wonder why, or how I said the things I did say in the first place.
Was I a fucked up teenager? Yes. Did I need help? Yes. Was it the best help I could've gotten? No. Was home an option for me? No. Had I run out of options? Yes. Did I learn some things from the programs? Yes.
The one thing, that I will say, is that I was in there for too long. I think that hurt me. But, I'm not there anymore. It's nothing I will ever have to deal with again. It's called moving on folks. You're right, I can't tell you to just get over it. You will when your ready.
But, the thing we disagree with the most, is that there are a lot of kids out there who come from families that are completely disfunctional. They do need help, and by you coming on here to say all programs are evil, and abusive doesn't help. By you posting porn, and saying rude crude stuff, doesn't help.
It's late. But, just know that I've moved on. I am not blaming everyone, and I am taking responsibility. I have run out of words. But, just know that this is coming from my heart. If you choose to attack me, whatever. At this point, I don't see how things could get any worse.
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Look, there is no denying that is how I felt 2 years ago. I stumbled upon Fornits, not thinking about any of my experiences for 15 whole years. I came here, and started reading everyones posts. I was outraged of the allegations of abuse. I believed everything that people were saying on here, and I wanted to go after them (WWASPS), I am not denying that.
But, after I calmed down...took a look at the other side, took a long hard look at myself, I changed my mind.
I don't feel that way anymore. I figured out some things, and quite frankly with how you all were acting (and still acting), I woke up real quick. I started thinking more, and more, I am not like the majority of people on here.
I am not anti-program. I am all for getting families, and teens on the right track. However that may be. I am not an ed con, and I don't refer families to schools/programs/treatment centers. I just see things differently.
People say that I am "Programmed" but, don't you think I would of come out of there preaching how great everything was, and yada, yada, yada if I was programmed? From the get go I would've been like the programs saved my life!!! It didn't happen that way though, did it?
I finally just realized that I felt differently about my experiences then most of you felt about yours. I stopped blaming everyone else. I took some responsibility for the things that got me sent there in the first place. And now, I sit here and wonder why, or how I said the things I did say in the first place.
Was I a fucked up teenager? Yes. Did I need help? Yes. Was it the best help I could've gotten? No. Was home an option for me? No. Had I run out of options? Yes. Did I learn some things from the programs? Yes.
The one thing, that I will say, is that I was in there for too long. I think that hurt me. But, I'm not there anymore. It's nothing I will ever have to deal with again. It's called moving on folks. You're right, I can't tell you to just get over it. You will when your ready.
But, the thing we disagree with the most, is that there are a lot of kids out there who come from families that are completely disfunctional. They do need help, and by you coming on here to say all programs are evil, and abusive doesn't help. By you posting porn, and saying rude crude stuff, doesn't help.
It's late. But, just know that I've moved on. I am not blaming everyone, and I am taking responsibility. I have run out of words. But, just know that this is coming from my heart. If you choose to attack me, whatever. At this point, I don't see how things could get any worse.
Considering you're the only person who has taken the "red pill" then decided to get jacked back in i'm wonding what price you paid for your soul. Is it brainwashing or is there financial motivation? You seem to have enough ethics to try to get staff fired (and possiblly arrested / lives ruined) for fun... I wouldn't put it past you to work for the industry.
TSW thinks you're just dandy because you're a survivor. I don't. I think you're fucked up in the head past any semblance of sanity. You think kids fucking staff is ok! Have you been talking to Ken Kay recently? You on the payroll. Maybe you're working for ... oh wait. this makes sense: Lon Woodbury's forum. Yup. Bingo. Just like Kristin and the board programmer/admin who was in a WWASP program. You were dissatisfied with fornits, dissappeared for a while, allegedly started working with Kevin August in his referral to Magnolia (at the very least vocally supported).
I might feel sorry for you if you weren't defending the most infamous of programs in this country.... nope. I feel sorry for parents who have lost their kids to these programs and I feel sorry for survivors who realize what happened (most on thier own, fornits is a gathering place, survivors find it). I feel really sorry for those who don't recognize what happened to them, who will never be themselves again, who have become what program envisioned and never looked back. not a shread of individuality or choice left. Slaves with broken will.
You, on the other hand, figured things out then went back. I haven't seen that happen before. Reeks of Ashlyn Scheff, doesn't it. Deja-vu. You have your masters and you don't even know it, regardless. After a while you'll start working for them if you don't already. You can't walk away from this. Normal people who are insulted on an internet bulletin board just walk away. You have a connection here, for or against. If anything, that should prove to you that you were dramatically affected by program. Or there is some other motivation for your posting here... perhaps subtle advertising (beware parents: wolves in sheeps clothing are all over in this industry). I'm not accusing you of anything, just considering possibilities and thinking aloud.
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TSW thinks you're just dandy because you're a survivor.
Incorrect.
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my translation in red[/color]
Look, there is no denying that is how I felt 2 years ago. I stumbled upon Fornits, not thinking about any of my experiences for 15 whole years. I came here, and started reading everyones posts. I was outraged of the allegations of abuse. I believed everything that people were saying on here, and I wanted to go after them (WWASPS), I am not denying that.
"I was bored 2 years ago, had no friends, so I joined fornits and became a tool."
But, after I calmed down...took a look at the other side, took a long hard look at myself, I changed my mind.
"After I started taking my medication as prescribed and was hired by an edcon, I decided to begin trolling fornits and disrupting threads."
I don't feel that way anymore. I figured out some things, and quite frankly with how you all were acting (and still acting), I woke up real quick. I started thinking more, and more, I am not like the majority of people on here.
"I was getting upset with the truth and couldn't face my own painful experiences, so I decided to repress and deny them instead. The program taught me that anyone who "acts up" is bad. Plus, I got a huge bonus from private sources to keep my mouth shut like a good girl."
I am not anti-program. I am all for getting families, and teens on the right track. However that may be. I am not an ed con, and I don't refer families to schools/programs/treatment centers. I just see things differently.
"I've been bought and paid for, whether by the industry or the damage inflicted on me already in a program. Unless you are being flogged with whips and dipped in cauldron of molten lead - it's not abuse. Sex between staff and client is OK as long as the client *enjoyed* it."
People say that I am "Programmed" but, don't you think I would of come out of there preaching how great everything was, and yada, yada, yada if I was programmed? From the get go I would've been like the programs saved my life!!! It didn't happen that way though, did it?
"I was here intially because I cannot think for myself and whoever has the more persuasive argument will win me over - I will deny my own truth and my own experience & other program survivors have had."
I finally just realized that I felt differently about my experiences then most of you felt about yours. I stopped blaming everyone else. I took some responsibility for the things that got me sent there in the first place. And now, I sit here and wonder why, or how I said the things I did say in the first place.
"If it weren't for the programs I was in - I would be insanedeadorinjail - abuse saved my life - glory be to jesus. & Basically, I am a tool - not a strong tool, but a weak one."
Was I a fucked up teenager? Yes. Did I need help? Yes. Was it the best help I could've gotten? No. Was home an option for me? No. Had I run out of options? Yes. Did I learn some things from the programs? Yes.
"I am very confused about my experiences but I will put a good spin on them because I'm not insanedeadorinjail. Why else could I possibly be OK?"
The one thing, that I will say, is that I was in there for too long. I think that hurt me. But, I'm not there anymore. It's nothing I will ever have to deal with again. It's called moving on folks. You're right, I can't tell you to just get over it. You will when your ready.
"You should just forget everything you've lived through, even though you carry those emotional scars and effects of PTSD EVERY SINGLE DAY. If you can pretend everything is alright, then it must be. & nevermind other kids who are going through the same thing right now - they too can forget (if they get out alive) after they trun 18 and leave - or runaway and hid like I had to."
But, the thing we disagree with the most, is that there are a lot of kids out there who come from families that are completely disfunctional. They do need help, and by you coming on here to say all programs are evil, and abusive doesn't help. By you posting porn, and saying rude crude stuff, doesn't help
.
"I'm offended that you all don't just agree with me and constantly find ways to discredit me."
It's late. But, just know that I've moved on. I am not blaming everyone, and I am taking responsibility. I have run out of words. But, just know that this is coming from my heart. If you choose to attack me, whatever. At this point, I don't see how things could get any worse.
"I'm not leaving here - I'll be a troll forever. I'll tell those abused in programs they are just playing the victim card - & then play the victim card myself when the going gets rough."
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CCM Girl is entitled to do whatever she chooses with her own life.
CCM Girl's behaviors that became so offensive was calling suvivors WHINERS; showing outright support of people like Kevin August who REFERRED to abusive programs, like Magnolia Christian Aacademy; and the outrageous statement that sexually abused children "liked it."
Some people may have been put off by CCM Girl's shallow bragging about her collection of materialist "goodies"--her fancy house, pool, cars, horses, etc...as if she wanted to make SURE posters realized she'd married well, and was a "step above" the common poster.
The most telling of CCM Girl's 2 year posting saga; she ended up with only one friend, THE WHO. Mentally, she's still "a controlled girl whonever left HER PROGRAM." She parrots THE WHO's nonsense constantly. Like THE WHO, she changes her "story," attacks posters, downgrades survivors --CCM Girl simply lacks THE WHO's ability to write well, and to manipulate with words. She's still too emotional; but THE WHO is training her well.
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my translation in red[/color]
Look, there is no denying that is how I felt 2 years ago. I stumbled upon Fornits, not thinking about any of my experiences for 15 whole years. I came here, and started reading everyones posts. I was outraged of the allegations of abuse. I believed everything that people were saying on here, and I wanted to go after them (WWASPS), I am not denying that.
"I was bored 2 years ago, had no friends, so I joined fornits and became a tool."
But, after I calmed down...took a look at the other side, took a long hard look at myself, I changed my mind.
"After I started taking my medication as prescribed and was hired by an edcon, I decided to begin trolling fornits and disrupting threads."
I don't feel that way anymore. I figured out some things, and quite frankly with how you all were acting (and still acting), I woke up real quick. I started thinking more, and more, I am not like the majority of people on here.
"I was getting upset with the truth and couldn't face my own painful experiences, so I decided to repress and deny them instead. The program taught me that anyone who "acts up" is bad. Plus, I got a huge bonus from private sources to keep my mouth shut like a good girl."
I am not anti-program. I am all for getting families, and teens on the right track. However that may be. I am not an ed con, and I don't refer families to schools/programs/treatment centers. I just see things differently.
"I've been bought and paid for, whether by the industry or the damage inflicted on me already in a program. Unless you are being flogged with whips and dipped in cauldron of molten lead - it's not abuse. Sex between staff and client is OK as long as the client *enjoyed* it."
People say that I am "Programmed" but, don't you think I would of come out of there preaching how great everything was, and yada, yada, yada if I was programmed? From the get go I would've been like the programs saved my life!!! It didn't happen that way though, did it?
"I was here intially because I cannot think for myself and whoever has the more persuasive argument will win me over - I will deny my own truth and my own experience & other program survivors have had."
I finally just realized that I felt differently about my experiences then most of you felt about yours. I stopped blaming everyone else. I took some responsibility for the things that got me sent there in the first place. And now, I sit here and wonder why, or how I said the things I did say in the first place.
"If it weren't for the programs I was in - I would be insanedeadorinjail - abuse saved my life - glory be to jesus. & Basically, I am a tool - not a strong tool, but a weak one."
Was I a fucked up teenager? Yes. Did I need help? Yes. Was it the best help I could've gotten? No. Was home an option for me? No. Had I run out of options? Yes. Did I learn some things from the programs? Yes.
"I am very confused about my experiences but I will put a good spin on them because I'm not insanedeadorinjail. Why else could I possibly be OK?"
The one thing, that I will say, is that I was in there for too long. I think that hurt me. But, I'm not there anymore. It's nothing I will ever have to deal with again. It's called moving on folks. You're right, I can't tell you to just get over it. You will when your ready.
"You should just forget everything you've lived through, even though you carry those emotional scars and effects of PTSD EVERY SINGLE DAY. If you can pretend everything is alright, then it must be. & nevermind other kids who are going through the same thing right now - they too can forget (if they get out alive) after they trun 18 and leave - or runaway and hid like I had to."
But, the thing we disagree with the most, is that there are a lot of kids out there who come from families that are completely disfunctional. They do need help, and by you coming on here to say all programs are evil, and abusive doesn't help. By you posting porn, and saying rude crude stuff, doesn't help
.
"I'm offended that you all don't just agree with me and constantly find ways to discredit me."
It's late. But, just know that I've moved on. I am not blaming everyone, and I am taking responsibility. I have run out of words. But, just know that this is coming from my heart. If you choose to attack me, whatever. At this point, I don't see how things could get any worse.
"I'm not leaving here - I'll be a troll forever. I'll tell those abused in programs they are just playing the victim card - & then play the victim card myself when the going gets rough."
::bump::
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CCM Girl is entitled to do whatever she chooses with her own life.
CCM Girl's behaviors that became so offensive was calling suvivors WHINERS; showing outright support of people like Kevin August who REFERRED to abusive programs, like Magnolia Christian Aacademy; and the outrageous statement that sexually abused children "liked it."
Some people may have been put off by CCM Girl's shallow bragging about her collection of materialist "goodies"--her fancy house, pool, cars, horses, etc...as if she wanted to make SURE posters realized she'd married well, and was a "step above" the common poster.
The most telling of CCM Girl's 2 year posting saga; she ended up with only one friend, THE WHO. Mentally, she's still "a controlled girl whonever left HER PROGRAM." She parrots THE WHO's nonsense constantly. Like THE WHO, she changes her "story," attacks posters, downgrades survivors --CCM Girl simply lacks THE WHO's ability to write well, and to manipulate with words. She's still too emotional; but THE WHO is training her well.
Thanks for the background on this piece of work known as "CCM girl 1989". I'd say these last 2 posts are a dead-on portrayal of her.
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But, just know that I've moved on.
If this were true you wouldn't post here so often, or at all. How long have you been out of the program? Over a decade? Why are you even thinking about it if you have moved on? So long as you post on fornits, you have not moved on.
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my translation in red[/color]
Look, there is no denying that is how I felt 2 years ago. I stumbled upon Fornits, not thinking about any of my experiences for 15 whole years. I came here, and started reading everyones posts. I was outraged of the allegations of abuse. I believed everything that people were saying on here, and I wanted to go after them (WWASPS), I am not denying that.
"I was bored 2 years ago, had no friends, so I joined fornits and became a tool."
But, after I calmed down...took a look at the other side, took a long hard look at myself, I changed my mind.
"After I started taking my medication as prescribed and was hired by an edcon, I decided to begin trolling fornits and disrupting threads."
I don't feel that way anymore. I figured out some things, and quite frankly with how you all were acting (and still acting), I woke up real quick. I started thinking more, and more, I am not like the majority of people on here.
"I was getting upset with the truth and couldn't face my own painful experiences, so I decided to repress and deny them instead. The program taught me that anyone who "acts up" is bad. Plus, I got a huge bonus from private sources to keep my mouth shut like a good girl."
I am not anti-program. I am all for getting families, and teens on the right track. However that may be. I am not an ed con, and I don't refer families to schools/programs/treatment centers. I just see things differently.
"I've been bought and paid for, whether by the industry or the damage inflicted on me already in a program. Unless you are being flogged with whips and dipped in cauldron of molten lead - it's not abuse. Sex between staff and client is OK as long as the client *enjoyed* it."
People say that I am "Programmed" but, don't you think I would of come out of there preaching how great everything was, and yada, yada, yada if I was programmed? From the get go I would've been like the programs saved my life!!! It didn't happen that way though, did it?
"I was here intially because I cannot think for myself and whoever has the more persuasive argument will win me over - I will deny my own truth and my own experience & other program survivors have had."
I finally just realized that I felt differently about my experiences then most of you felt about yours. I stopped blaming everyone else. I took some responsibility for the things that got me sent there in the first place. And now, I sit here and wonder why, or how I said the things I did say in the first place.
"If it weren't for the programs I was in - I would be insanedeadorinjail - abuse saved my life - glory be to jesus. & Basically, I am a tool - not a strong tool, but a weak one."
Was I a fucked up teenager? Yes. Did I need help? Yes. Was it the best help I could've gotten? No. Was home an option for me? No. Had I run out of options? Yes. Did I learn some things from the programs? Yes.
"I am very confused about my experiences but I will put a good spin on them because I'm not insanedeadorinjail. Why else could I possibly be OK?"
The one thing, that I will say, is that I was in there for too long. I think that hurt me. But, I'm not there anymore. It's nothing I will ever have to deal with again. It's called moving on folks. You're right, I can't tell you to just get over it. You will when your ready.
"You should just forget everything you've lived through, even though you carry those emotional scars and effects of PTSD EVERY SINGLE DAY. If you can pretend everything is alright, then it must be. & nevermind other kids who are going through the same thing right now - they too can forget (if they get out alive) after they trun 18 and leave - or runaway and hid like I had to."
But, the thing we disagree with the most, is that there are a lot of kids out there who come from families that are completely disfunctional. They do need help, and by you coming on here to say all programs are evil, and abusive doesn't help. By you posting porn, and saying rude crude stuff, doesn't help
.
"I'm offended that you all don't just agree with me and constantly find ways to discredit me."
It's late. But, just know that I've moved on. I am not blaming everyone, and I am taking responsibility. I have run out of words. But, just know that this is coming from my heart. If you choose to attack me, whatever. At this point, I don't see how things could get any worse.
"I'm not leaving here - I'll be a troll forever. I'll tell those abused in programs they are just playing the victim card - & then play the victim card myself when the going gets rough."
This is classic...we need to harp on these points.
CCM girl, you're time is done here.
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maybe this will work
(http://http://www.bureau-13.com/icon/moron.gif)
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The most telling of CCM Girl's 2 year posting saga; she ended up with only one friend, THE WHO. Mentally, she's still "a controlled girl whonever left HER PROGRAM." She parrots THE WHO's nonsense constantly. Like THE WHO, she changes her "story," attacks posters, downgrades survivors --CCM Girl simply lacks THE WHO's ability to write well, and to manipulate with words. She's still too emotional; but THE WHO is training her well.
2 friends.
I respect her right to have her opinion.
I respect her regarding the need to do something, when a person is out of control. That is why we have courts. I 15 year old boy beat a man to his death last week in Aalborg and took a picture, which you properly can find on liveleak in a week or two. A 14 year old boy stabbed a man in Aarhus. It was the same boy who manage to close all kindergardens in the city by safety reasons for two weeks because he threw rocks at the children and they could not find a proper place for him. The 15 year old will properly receive a sentence of 10-16 years. The 14 year old will not be convicted because because people under 15 can not be tried in court, but they will keep him in the system until he is 18.
That is the things I respect.
We do not agree on some points, but I was not there when she was sent off. I dont know why she only were allowed home once. I dont know why she was kept in a facility, which on their homepage points out that teenagers only should be there when it is needed. I dont know why she was transferred to Cross Creek. I dont know why her family did not offer her to stay at their place sooner.
There is a lot of things, I dont know and I shouldn't know. There are a lot of things you dont know about me either.
I have been watching these treads for some time. We have to ask why we are here and what we hope to achieve.
Do we want to use our time bashing each other or should we life the carpet in the programs and show the world, what they are about?
Maybe there is a good program outthere. I don't know. But what I do know are that there is a lot in many programs, which need to be held out in the public where the general population can judge the treatment.
The GAO investigation was quoted not only in your country but also in other countries. A lot of those people who want boot camps, wilderness treatment in Europe could be smacked with the report. A television show like "Brat Camp" are just now sending the last broadcasts. The public are done with admiration of your system.
So dissagree with "CCM girl" or not. I dont care. But use your time better and go after the owners of various programs instead.
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2 friends.
Sorry to hear that, Covergaard.
It's OK to voice another opinion - but she is a primary thread disrupter, along with TheWho.
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Now you guys are not very nice! I am not sure what to say? Uh, whatever accomplishments I have, whatever nice things I own, whatever good has come out of my life, has to do with letting go of the past.
I did not let that control me for very long. Initially, in the beginning, yes. But, then I had to take care of myself. Nobody cared about my troubled past. Most people don't even know someone who has been through a program. Very few can relate.
15 years later I stumbled upon this site like I said because I did move to a new area, where I did not know a soul. My life went from working 60-70 hour weeks, to 0. So, I had time to reflect. I wouldn't say I did not have any friends. My friends were only 2 hours away. Always available by phone, and since I wasn't working I spent most weekends in the bay area with my friends.
You think you know me so well, but you really don't. Talk all the shit you want about me, like you have been, ever since I disagreed with you on some things you said. That is fine.
When it comes down to it, I have been able to take responsibility for my actions. I have been able to forgive others for theirs. Like I said as far as emotional baggage goes, some of you need a uhaul to pack it around, while I am sporting a small overnight bag. I have my issues, but not like some of you who i believe to be deeply troubled.
The reason I brought up the seducing of male staff was to let others really understand the inside scoop on it. Not because I am proud of it. Back then it was a game. A game I regret playing.
I understand that some of you may need to twist my words. I understand I am a threat to this board. Otherwise, you could care less what I say. You wouldn't be deleting or changing my posts if you weren't threatened.
You obviously are.
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CCM girl said
My comments will be changed anyway, it doesn't matter what I think, or what I have to say anymore.
[/color]
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CCM girl's words - (I just had to post it twice!
My comments will be changed anyway, it doesn't matter what I think, or what I have to say anymore.
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Now you guys are not very nice! I am not sure what to say? Uh, whatever accomplishments I have, whatever nice things I own, whatever good has come out of my life, has to do with letting go of the past.
I did not let that control me for very long. Initially, in the beginning, yes. But, then I had to take care of myself. Nobody cared about my troubled past. Most people don't even know someone who has been through a program. Very few can relate.
15 years later I stumbled upon this site like I said because I did move to a new area, where I did not know a soul. My life went from working 60-70 hour weeks, to 0. So, I had time to reflect. I wouldn't say I did not have any friends. My friends were only 2 hours away. Always available by phone, and since I wasn't working I spent most weekends in the bay area with my friends.
You think you know me so well, but you really don't. Talk all the shit you want about me, like you have been, ever since I disagreed with you on some things you said. That is fine.
When it comes down to it, I have been able to take responsibility for my actions. I have been able to forgive others for theirs. Like I said as far as emotional baggage goes, some of you need a uhaul to pack it around, while I am sporting a small overnight bag. I have my issues, but not like some of you who i believe to be deeply troubled.
The reason I brought up the seducing of male staff was to let others really understand the inside scoop on it. Not because I am proud of it. Back then it was a game. A game I regret playing.
I understand that some of you may need to twist my words. I understand I am a threat to this board. Otherwise, you could care less what I say. You wouldn't be deleting or changing my posts if you weren't threatened.
You obviously are.
& here's her post for posterity - just so you can see it isn't changed...
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I wouldn't say I did not have any friends. My friends were only 2 hours away. Always available by phone, and since I wasn't working I spent most weekends in the bay area with my friends.
I don't even know you & just trusted my intuition you had no friends when I wrote that post - but you just proved it!!!!!
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Now you guys are not very nice! I am not sure what to say? Uh, whatever accomplishments I have, whatever nice things I own, whatever good has come out of my life, has to do with letting go of the past.
I did not let that control me for very long. Initially, in the beginning, yes. But, then I had to take care of myself. Nobody cared about my troubled past. Most people don't even know someone who has been through a program. Very few can relate.
15 years later I stumbled upon this site like I said because I did move to a new area, where I did not know a soul. My life went from working 60-70 hour weeks, to 0. So, I had time to reflect. I wouldn't say I did not have any friends. My friends were only 2 hours away. Always available by phone, and since I wasn't working I spent most weekends in the bay area with my friends.
You think you know me so well, but you really don't. Talk all the shit you want about me, like you have been, ever since I disagreed with you on some things you said. That is fine.
When it comes down to it, I have been able to take responsibility for my actions. I have been able to forgive others for theirs. Like I said as far as emotional baggage goes, some of you need a uhaul to pack it around, while I am sporting a small overnight bag. I have my issues, but not like some of you who i believe to be deeply troubled.
The reason I brought up the seducing of male staff was to let others really understand the inside scoop on it. Not because I am proud of it. Back then it was a game. A game I regret playing.
I understand that some of you may need to twist my words. I understand I am a threat to this board. Otherwise, you could care less what I say. You wouldn't be deleting or changing my posts if you weren't threatened.
You obviously are.
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I understand that some of you may need to twist my words. I understand I am a threat to this board. Otherwise, you could care less what I say.
CCMgirl thinks she's a threat? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Now you guys are not very nice! I am not sure what to say? Uh, whatever accomplishments I have, whatever nice things I own, whatever good has come out of my life, has to do with letting go of the past.
I did not let that control me for very long. Initially, in the beginning, yes. But, then I had to take care of myself. Nobody cared about my troubled past. Most people don't even know someone who has been through a program. Very few can relate.
15 years later I stumbled upon this site like I said because I did move to a new area, where I did not know a soul. My life went from working 60-70 hour weeks, to 0. So, I had time to reflect. I wouldn't say I did not have any friends. My friends were only 2 hours away. Always available by phone, and since I wasn't working I spent most weekends in the bay area with my friends.
You think you know me so well, but you really don't. Talk all the shit you want about me, like you have been, ever since I disagreed with you on some things you said. That is fine.
When it comes down to it, I have been able to take responsibility for my actions. I have been able to forgive others for theirs. Like I said as far as emotional baggage goes, some of you need a uhaul to pack it around, while I am sporting a small overnight bag. I have my issues, but not like some of you who i believe to be deeply troubled.
The reason I brought up the seducing of male staff was to let others really understand the inside scoop on it. Not because I am proud of it. Back then it was a game. A game I regret playing.
I understand that some of you may need to twist my words. I understand I am a threat to this board. Otherwise, you could care less what I say. You wouldn't be deleting or changing my posts if you weren't threatened.
You obviously are.
Now you guys awe not vewy nice! I am not suwe what to say? Uh, whatevew accompwishments I have, whatevew nice things I own, whatevew good has come out of my wife, has to do wif wetting go of the past. I did not wet that contwow me fow vewy wong. Initiawwy, in the beginning, yes. Oh, dat scwewy wabbit! But, then I had to take cawe of mysewf. Nobody cawed about my twoubwed past. Most peopwe don't even know someone who has been thwough a pwogwam. Vewy few can wewate. 15 yeaws watew I stumbwed upon this site wike I said because I did move to a new awea, whewe I did not know a souw. My wife went fwom wowking 60-70 houw weeks, to 0. So, I had time to wefwect. I wouwdn't say I did not have any fwiends. Oh, dat scwewy wabbit! My fwiends wewe onwy 2 houws away. Awways avaiwabwe by phone, and since I wasn't wowking I spent most weekends in the bay awea wif my fwiends. Oh, dat scwewy wabbit! You think you know me so weww, but you weawwy don't. Tawk aww the shit you want about me, wike you have been, evew since I disagweed wif you on some things you said. Dat is fine. When it comes down to it, I have been abwe to take wesponsibiwity fow my actions. Oh, dat scwewy wabbit! I have been abwe to fowgive othews fow theiws. Oh, dat scwewy wabbit! Wike I said as faw as emotionaw baggage goes, some of you need a uhauw to pack it awound, whiwe I am spowting a smaww ovewnight bag. I have my issues, but not wike some of you who i bewieve to be deepwy twoubwed. De weason I bwought up the seducing of mawe staff was to wet othews weawwy undewstand the inside scoop on it. Not because I am pwoud of it. Back then it was a game. A game I wegwet pwaying. I undewstand that some of you may need to twist my wowds. Oh, dat scwewy wabbit! I undewstand I am a thweat to this boawd. Othewwise, you couwd cawe wess what I say. You wouwdn't be deweting ow changing my posts if you wewen't thweatened.
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CCM girl's words - (I just had to post it twice!
it doesn't matter what I think, or what I have to say anymore.
EXACTLY.
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Yes, there's alot of care for survivors, unless they have an opinon about their own personal history that doesn't match what the body politic demands.
Sick
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Yes, there's alot of care for survivors, unless they have an opinon about their own personal history that doesn't match what the body politic demands.
Sick
Hear, hear!!
And they like to complain about "groupthink.." :roll:
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Yes, there's alot of care for survivors, unless they have an opinon about their own personal history that doesn't match what the body politic demands.
Sick
Bullshit.
CCMgirl is advocating programs without actually finding her hypothetical 'good one' and making blanket, generalized statements in defense of the program mindset.
There is such a thing as ethical treatment! There is no such thing as a good program. A program is by definition (ours!) unethical and based on coercion, isolation, confinement, and making someone complete a "personal growth curriculum" of levels, LGAT, confrontation, humiliation, and basically quack bullshit.
If she finds a good place that provides treatment, ETHICALLY, without the bullshit listed above, thats fine. But, without the program shit, it ain't a program. Its good TREATMENT.
That's the distinction she seems unable to present to us or understand, herself, it seems.
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Bullshit.
CCMgirl is advocating programs without actually finding her hypothetical 'good one' and making blanket, generalized statements in defense of the program mindset.
Damn you, would you just leave the poor girl alone!! :flame:
Hasn't she been through enough?? :flame: :flame: :flame:
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Yes, there's alot of care for survivors, unless they have an opinon about their own personal history that doesn't match what the body politic demands.
Sick
Bullshit.
CCMgirl is advocating programs without actually finding her hypothetical 'good one' and making blanket, generalized statements in defense of the program mindset.
There is such a thing as ethical treatment! There is no such thing as a good program. A program is by definition (ours!) unethical and based on coercion, isolation, confinement, and making someone complete a "personal growth curriculum" of levels, LGAT, confrontation, humiliation, and basically quack bullshit.
If she finds a good place that provides treatment, ETHICALLY, without the bullshit listed above, thats fine. But, without the program shit, it ain't a program. Its good TREATMENT.
That's the distinction she seems unable to present to us or understand, herself, it seems.
Let's all ask ourselves this...
What makes Niles or CCM qualified to judge the effiectiveness of a psychiatric placement t or tbs placement?
Neither are qualified in any meaningful way to judge an adolescent placement. If either of them want that job I suggest they enroll in college, and be prepared to spend the next half dozen years engaged in difficult studies and internship.
Until then you are both just a couple of assholes arguing with each other on some small internet site, important only to those who post there.
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CCM has personal experience and has been thru a few programs so I tend to believe what she says and look forward to her posts. I dont think this guy Niles understands what it is like to be in a program and is only here at fornits to dump his anger and hate and post pornography for shock value. He doesnt seem interested in helping anyone or talking to people.
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Let's all ask ourselves this...
What makes Niles or CCM qualified to judge the effiectiveness of a psychiatric placement t or tbs placement?
Neither are qualified in any meaningful way to judge an adolescent placement. If either of them want that job I suggest they enroll in college, and be prepared to spend the next half dozen years engaged in difficult studies and internship.
Until then you are both just a couple of assholes arguing with each other on some small internet site, important only to those who post there.
The argument isn't about placement. The argument is about ethical treatment when needed vs brainwashing by any other name.
Your appeal to authority is bullshit, considering this isn't regulated anyway, and if it was, and people did their jobs, and any idiot couldn't be an Ed-Con and "do a placement", we wouldn't need to be here!
I have never presented myself as a medical professional apt to make a decision if someone needs treatment or not. I have said that people should SEEK professionals, NOT turn to a quack program!
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The argument isn't about placement.
I think that it is and always has been. You have said the kids dont need to be their, yet you have never been yourself.
How do you account for all the kids who benefit from the programs. You talk thru the side of your mouth and never present any evidence.
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Show me proof kids benefit from programs and we can start discussing if they're effective.
In the past 30 years I've seen nothing except subjective bullshit and anecdotes. I don't want to hear more, TheWho says enough of them.
Oh, wait.
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I've seen nothing except subjective bullshit and anecdotes.
The same is true for reports of abuse. If you are going to believe a kid who says they were abused you also have to accept the word of a kid who said their life was saved.
Show me proof that abuse occurs in programs. I'm waiting. No bullshit stories some spoiled kid made up to get back at their parents via guilt trip, I want hard proof.
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So since there isnt any proof either way, how do you base your opinion? Figuring there are over 20,000 kids a year graduating from these schools and it seems there are maybe 5 or 6 people here on fornits who didnt do well and cant seem to move on.
How do you make a stand based on that? Especially since you have never been to one.
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I've seen nothing except subjective bullshit and anecdotes.
The same is true for reports of abuse. If you are going to believe a kid who says they were abused you also have to accept the word of a kid who said their life was saved.
Show me proof that abuse occurs in programs. I'm waiting. No bullshit stories some spoiled kid made up to get back at their parents via guilt trip, I want hard proof.
a) the reports have been consistent for decades, among everyone who presents them, among all so-called programs. That is very significant! People don't all tell the same LIE.
b) do I have to dig the same old shit up? Moravia Academy and Casa by the sea were closed by the local authorities for abusing kids. Straight was closed in 1994 for being abusive. High Impact was caught ON FILM.
The allegations from the program survivors make it apparent that the programs utilize BITE-model techniques, LGATs among them, as well as isolation, forced confessions, confrontation, humiliation and physical punishments of various sorts - VERY consistently.
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So since there isnt any proof either way, how do you base your opinion? Figuring there are over 20,000 kids a year graduating from these schools and it seems there are maybe 5 or 6 people here on fornits who didnt do well and cant seem to move on.
How do you make a stand based on that? Especially since you have never been to one.
The figure was 20,000 kids them at any one time.
There are WAY over 5 to 6 people on fornits... wow.
I also don't need to have been to one to look at the facts anymore than I have to have stood on the moon to know what's there.
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So since there isnt any proof either way, how do you base your opinion? Figuring there are over 20,000 kids a year graduating from these schools and it seems there are maybe 5 or 6 people here on fornits who didnt do well and cant seem to move on.
How do you make a stand based on that? Especially since you have never been to one.
The figure was 20,000 kids them at any one time.
There are WAY over 5 to 6 people on fornits... wow.
I also don't need to have been to one to look at the facts anymore than I have to have stood on the moon to know what's there.
Care to share them with us?
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Yes, there's alot of care for survivors, unless they have an opinon about their own personal history that doesn't match what the body politic demands.
Sick
Bullshit.
CCMgirl is advocating programs without actually finding her hypothetical 'good one' and making blanket, generalized statements in defense of the program mindset.
There is such a thing as ethical treatment! There is no such thing as a good program. A program is by definition (ours!) unethical and based on coercion, isolation, confinement, and making someone complete a "personal growth curriculum" of levels, LGAT, confrontation, humiliation, and basically quack bullshit.
If she finds a good place that provides treatment, ETHICALLY, without the bullshit listed above, thats fine. But, without the program shit, it ain't a program. Its good TREATMENT.
That's the distinction she seems unable to present to us or understand, herself, it seems.
Let's all ask ourselves this...
What makes Niles or CCM qualified to judge the effiectiveness of a psychiatric placement t or tbs placement?
Neither are qualified in any meaningful way to judge an adolescent placement. If either of them want that job I suggest they enroll in college, and be prepared to spend the next half dozen years engaged in difficult studies and internship.
Until then you are both just a couple of assholes arguing with each other on some small internet site, important only to those who post there.
I agree with this person. I need to finish my courses (a lot of them that were in Psychology), and transfer to a 4 year. Even though I think it's very helpful to also have personal experiences as well.
I would like to assist kids, and take in maybe 4 at a time in my home. I think I could make a huge difference in their lives. Work like this is very emotionally exhausting though!
I applaud those who take these responsibilities on. I am not sure if I could, but I would like to be of some kind of help. Not just arguing with people like Niles. It's a little pointless, and sometimes a complete waste of time.
Maybe become a psychologist? Obviously, I would not be moving out of state! Not any time soon that is. So, no need to worry! I would not be working for a program LOL!!!! Not sure I would want to?
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He doesnt have any facts. If you ask him for any he says the programs should provide them. So why bring it up?
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He doesnt have any facts. If you ask him for any he says the programs should provide them. So why bring it up?
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I've seen nothing except subjective bullshit and anecdotes.
The same is true for reports of abuse. If you are going to believe a kid who says they were abused you also have to accept the word of a kid who said their life was saved.
Show me proof that abuse occurs in programs. I'm waiting. No bullshit stories some spoiled kid made up to get back at their parents via guilt trip, I want hard proof.
That's ridiculous...There is so much proof, its impossible to know where to begin, also, people's testimony about abuse isn't negated because they are youth from wealthy families. God these conversations are so circular.
The point about ccm girl was, essentially, her view is that her experience was not abusive, therefore not all institutions are necessarily abusive, and that there are times when hospitalization or intervention of some sort is necessary. I don’t necessarily agree, but think that in some cases,say, after you chop up your family with a cleaver, or you lock yourself in your house for 2 years(howard hughes) there is a moral grey area, where having a pro forced-intrusion opinion doesn’t make you evil, and worthy of abuse.
I know a bit too much about emotional battery as a tactic to make someone say or do what you want. That’s justifiable when dealing with abusers, but not to a survivor who has a not necessarily correct opinion.
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I've seen nothing except subjective bullshit and anecdotes.
The same is true for reports of abuse. If you are going to believe a kid who says they were abused you also have to accept the word of a kid who said their life was saved.
Show me proof that abuse occurs in programs. I'm waiting. No bullshit stories some spoiled kid made up to get back at their parents via guilt trip, I want hard proof.
That's ridiculous...There is so much proof, its impossible to know where to begin, also, people's testimony about abuse isn't negated because they are youth from wealthy families. God these conversations are so circular.
The point about ccm girl was, essentially, her view is that her experience was not abusive, therefore not all institutions are necessarily abusive, and that there are times when hospitalization or intervention of some sort is necessary. I don’t necessarily agree, but think that in some cases,say, after you chop up your family with a cleaver, or you lock yourself in your house for 2 years(howard hughes) there is a moral grey area, where having a pro forced-intrusion opinion doesn’t make you evil, and worthy of abuse.
I know a bit too much about emotional battery as a tactic to make someone say or do what you want. That’s justifiable when dealing with abusers, but not to a survivor who has a not necessarily correct opinion.
Exactly, because you have listened to those people. The argument is that there are also thousands of kids who benefited from the programs. You dont need to be an adult to need help or be an addict. It happens to teenagers too. These are the ones we are talking about not the ones who shouldnt be there.
Understand what I am saying?
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I've seen nothing except subjective bullshit and anecdotes.
The same is true for reports of abuse. If you are going to believe a kid who says they were abused you also have to accept the word of a kid who said their life was saved.
Show me proof that abuse occurs in programs. I'm waiting. No bullshit stories some spoiled kid made up to get back at their parents via guilt trip, I want hard proof.
That's ridiculous...There is so much proof, its impossible to know where to begin, also, people's testimony about abuse isn't negated because they are youth from wealthy families. God these conversations are so circular.
The point about ccm girl was, essentially, her view is that her experience was not abusive, therefore not all institutions are necessarily abusive, and that there are times when hospitalization or intervention of some sort is necessary. I don’t necessarily agree, but think that in some cases,say, after you chop up your family with a cleaver, or you lock yourself in your house for 2 years(howard hughes) there is a moral grey area, where having a pro forced-intrusion opinion doesn’t make you evil, and worthy of abuse.
I know a bit too much about emotional battery as a tactic to make someone say or do what you want. That’s justifiable when dealing with abusers, but not to a survivor who has a not necessarily correct opinion.
Exactly, because you have listened to those people. The argument is that there are also thousands of kids who benefited from the programs. You dont need to be an adult to need help or be an addict. It happens to teenagers too. These are the ones we are talking about not the ones who shouldnt be there.
Understand what I am saying?
Actually I AM one of these people. How about survivors are rape? Should we disregard their testimony, as well? How about holocaust survivors? Pfft?
I am also one of those kids who didn't need treatment. How do you justify an industry where anyone gets "treatment" whether they need it or not?
Any moment, all a parent needs to do is pick up a phone ,and say, "take my kid" and the kid is taken. Should there not be some sort of legal platform for a kid to protest this?
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Exactly, so what we know is you didnt benefit from it out of 20,000 kids a year who did. This says the industry is working but not for everyone. It also says the industry needs work and regulation may provide that help.
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How about survivors are rape? Should we disregard their testimony, as well?
Do you think vaginal DNA swabs are just for fun?
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The crux of the problem that people forget is kids in those places are prevented from getting help while inside there if they are being hurt.
... and none of those programs or any of the programs defenders can come up with a single good reason why that is so. People in JAIL can seek lawyers! But in programs, for some reason or some loophole, they have no rights.
That is why I'm trying to help them.
If they could reach out for help, if the world KNEW what was going on instead of it being hidden from us, if they could get out unless they were literally a danger to people if not locked up (which few if any kids in programs are) we wouldn't need to be here.
But, well, I'm sure more circular bullshit will try to dodge THAT little fact...
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That is why I'm trying to help them.
It would be funny, if not so utterly pathetic. You have helped and never will help anybody.
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*yawn*.
Wouldn't you wish I'd take your bait and incriminate yourself :rofl:
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The crux of the problem that people forget is kids in those places are prevented from getting help while inside there if they are being hurt.
... and none of those programs or any of the programs defenders can come up with a single good reason why that is so. People in JAIL can seek lawyers! But in programs, for some reason or some loophole, they have no rights.
That is why I'm trying to help them.
If they could reach out for help, if the world KNEW what was going on instead of it being hidden from us, if they could get out unless they were literally a danger to people if not locked up (which few if any kids in programs are) we wouldn't need to be here.
But, well, I'm sure more circular bullshit will try to dodge THAT little fact...
Tell that to the 20,000 kids who benefit from these programs every year. An extremely few number of kids feel they were hurt by the schools and changes should be made to prevent this from happening, but we need to look at all the kids not just the ones who didnt do well.
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Tell that to the 20,000 kids who benefit from these programs every year. An extremely few number of kids feel they were hurt by the schools and changes should be made to prevent this from happening, but we need to look at all the kids not just the ones who didnt do well.
An estimate that 20-50,000 kids in programs yearly is not 20-50,000 GRADUATES. The programs themselves admit the graduation rate is very, very low.
:rofl: You're doing rather poorly there, mr. anonymous. You have nothing to back up your claims and the programs that claim they help people have nothing to back themselves up, they just do their damnedest to keep kids in programs away from the outside world.
I'll see to that.
:lol:
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Of course, we don't know how many kids are in these places. It could be 20, it could be 100 thou. T
hat's so sick...
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Tell that to the 20,000 kids who benefit from these programs every year. An extremely few number of kids feel they were hurt by the schools and changes should be made to prevent this from happening, but we need to look at all the kids not just the ones who didnt do well.
An estimate that 20-50,000 kids in programs yearly is not 20-50,000 GRADUATES. The programs themselves admit the graduation rate is very, very low.
To whom are they talking when they say that? In my experience programs claim impossibly high sucess statistics.
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I always sort of thought programs dodged around the issue by focusing on the graduates who don't relapse or kill themselves within the first couple of years rather than the overall number of graduates.
I found it sort of odd myself at 3 springs, but now that I think back on it I remember a big old kid who came back to visit. He had relapsed pretty badly and smoked about 20 pounds of weed or something crazy like that and went on a tear with half the neighboorhoods avaliable women, livestock, and god knows what else.
The sheer irony of his statement sort of leaves me numb when I recollect it today:
"Well it sort of struck me that if I kept this up I sure wasn't going to live up to any of my own expectations."
I said, "You mean the goals you wrote down before you graduated?"
He said, "No.. the dreams I used to have about what I'd do when I was free from here."
From what I gathered he is doing pretty good. He probably smokes a little weed now and then but seriously.. who gives a shit?
Did the program help him?
Well no.. but I'd wager to say the experience itself certainly illustrated to him that there was something better out there for him than hanging out with a bunch of wierdos out in the woods listening to a bunch of sob stories created from the imaginations of his fellow group members to impress the hell out of his treatment team.
So no being at a program missing out on a year and a half of his life probably didn't do him much good socially or academically. But as a person I bet he is far stronger of a person for having come out of an experience he shouldn't have had thrown on him to begin with.
So my final response to him was:
"Well no matter what happens and where you are don't ever let anyone crush your dreams."
Now damn it if I had any sense I'd have slipped a pound of weed into the brownie mix in the dining hall, dropped some acid into the kool aid pitchers, and swapped the meds out for hits of E.. and promptly fled the place after turning in a resignation written out on toilet paper with crayons.
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Tell that to the 20,000 kids who benefit from these programs every year. An extremely few number of kids feel they were hurt by the schools and changes should be made to prevent this from happening, but we need to look at all the kids not just the ones who didnt do well.
BTW, stop posting, your posting are apologist and trite. Whatever edcon your bending over for, I sure it's worth it. $$$$$$
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Oh & plus, moron - I totally don't agree with the asinine statement -
An extremely few number of kids feel they were hurt by the schools and changes should be made to prevent this from happening, but we need to look at all the kids not just the ones who didnt do well.
I'm one of the *kids*, now an adult - who is doing extremely well for myself - I didn't have to marry well (like CCMnitwit) to achieve that. & programs are abusive.
You cannot tell what my own truth is. Or the truth of countless others....
Try as you might to tell us the earth is flat!
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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But, just know that I've moved on.
If this were true you wouldn't post here so often, or at all. How long have you been out of the program? Over a decade? Why are you even thinking about it if you have moved on? So long as you post on fornits, you have not moved on.
I really disagree with this. I can only speak for myself, but I would say for the most part I've lived my life well. I have bouts of depression, and anxiety, and I struggle sometimes. But I also get through it. I've only been on here for a few weeks but what gives me comfort is being able to communicate with people who've had similar experiences. It's hard to connect, whether you've been in a program or not, and I think that basically what it comes down to is that no one wants to feel like they're alone. So if this Fornits forum is giving people a sense of community, so what? Being at RMA was a part of my life and a part of who I am, and if you read my posts you'll see that I have good and not so good to say (I ain't badrapping, shiiiiittt).
Who's to say that moving on is necessarily a good thing? Or a bad thing? I really don't think that judgment has any place here. And who the fuck is anyone to pass judgment on anyone who comes here to vent, or connect, or whatever anyway? Just shut it.
Alright. That got my blood boiling a little. Anyway, people who don't understand simply don't understand. And I feel sad for them. But I certainly won't be smooshing with them anytime soon.
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Ok. I jumped the gun a little on that post. I didn't have the context and once I read down a few more posts I realized that. Forgive me. It's just that since I've been reading through these there are people who want to talk shit and I was feeling protective.
I still won't smoosh with them though.
And, yeah, I really don't think that the tallies will be complete for a long long time (if ever) on the residual long-lasting effects on those who've been through these programs. I think it's ignorant and foolish for anyone to think that they can speak for anyone who's been there, or to predict how anyone will come through it. It's a completely personal experience. We may share certain similar memories, feelings, etc, but like anything else, it's subjective. Plus, considering abuse, one may get through it unscathed while another will not. It's a crap shoot.
Ok. That's all. Sorry again for the misunderstanding.
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But, just know that I've moved on.
If this were true you wouldn't post here so often, or at all. How long have you been out of the program? Over a decade? Why are you even thinking about it if you have moved on? So long as you post on fornits, you have not moved on.
I really disagree with this. I can only speak for myself, but I would say for the most part I've lived my life well. I have bouts of depression, and anxiety, and I struggle sometimes. But I also get through it. I've only been on here for a few weeks but what gives me comfort is being able to communicate with people who've had similar experiences. It's hard to connect, whether you've been in a program or not, and I think that basically what it comes down to is that no one wants to feel like they're alone. So if this Fornits forum is giving people a sense of community, so what? Being at RMA was a part of my life and a part of who I am, and if you read my posts you'll see that I have good and not so good to say (I ain't badrapping, shiiiiittt).
Who's to say that moving on is necessarily a good thing? Or a bad thing? I really don't think that judgment has any place here. And who the fuck is anyone to pass judgment on anyone who comes here to vent, or connect, or whatever anyway? Just shut it.
Alright. That got my blood boiling a little. Anyway, people who don't understand simply don't understand. And I feel sad for them. But I certainly won't be smooshing with them anytime soon.
Your bellicose posting proves that you are an industry shill. It is not permissible to disagree with me, or even feel that a survivor has the right to disagree with me on fine points, without being bullied into submission and proving that you are industry shills. For the children
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Your bellicose posting proves that you are an industry shill. It is not permissible to disagree with me, or even feel that a survivor has the right to disagree with me on fine points, without being bullied into submission and proving that you are industry shills. For the children
I'm sorry, but excuse me? I never said it was a problem to disagree with me, but I do have a problem with people who are not constructive in any way. I was simply posting my opinion, and I thought I made it clear that it was just that...my opinion. Bellicose. Lovely. And thanks, but I would never even think of bullying someone into my point of view. I don't need to be agreed with, just heard.
Please define "industry shill" for me. Because you sound like a complete jackass. For the children. Uh huh. And I'm still not going to smoosh with you. Pretty please will not work.
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Dear, that was meant 4 someone else. Someone's telling people who disgree with him on certain points that they are industry shills or buttering their bread in badly, it gets ridiculous. Nevermind the bollocks
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If you say so but they quoted me before they said that shit. That's why I got so annoyed.
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Tell that to the 20,000 kids who benefit from these programs every year. An extremely few number of kids feel they were hurt by the schools and changes should be made to prevent this from happening, but we need to look at all the kids not just the ones who didnt do well.
Brendan Blum,
Omega Leach,
Caleb Jensen,
Isaiah Simmons,
Alex Cullinane.
Dillon Peak, Erica Harvey, Aaron Bacon, Michelle Sutton, Angellika Arndt, Martin Lee Anderson...
Sorry for the "drama", but these kids didn't do well. You can't hear them complaining, is that why you're ignoring them?
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Not to offend anyone's delicate sensibilities, but who cares? Without treatment they would have certainly died anyway. That's what drug addiction does.
You keep listing these few names of deaths as if they mean anything while twenty thousand kids a year are HELPED. Doesn't that mean anything to you?
What kind of nigger names her kid "Angellika" anyway?
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Not to offend anyone's delicate sensibilities, but who cares? Without treatment they would have certainly died anyway. That's what drug addiction does.
You keep listing these few names of deaths as if they mean anything while twenty thousand kids a year are HELPED. Doesn't that mean anything to you?
What kind of nigger names her kid "Angellika" anyway?
This advertisement for treatment programs brought to you by an in-bred, redneck racist who will "restraining" your kids at a future time.
Good luck with that pal.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Tell that to the 20,000 kids who benefit from these programs every year. An extremely few number of kids feel they were hurt by the schools and changes should be made to prevent this from happening, but we need to look at all the kids not just the ones who didnt do well.
Brendan Blum,
Omega Leach,
Caleb Jensen,
Isaiah Simmons,
Alex Cullinane.
Dillon Peak, Erica Harvey, Aaron Bacon, Michelle Sutton, Angellika Arndt, Martin Lee Anderson...
Sorry for the "drama", but these kids didn't do well. You can't hear them complaining, is that why you're ignoring them?
OVER 42,000 people were killed in car accidents last year and I dont see a single person here complaining that we should take all the cars off the roads to protect our children. A good percentage were kids who had no choice in the matter and were restrined by their parents inside the cars. No one is saying the schools are perfect or the car industry.
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Program troll - please go away -[/color]
Get back to work abusing kids, rather than trolling fornits.
Loser!
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CCM has personal experience and has been thru a few programs so I tend to believe what she says and look forward to her posts. I dont think this guy Niles understands what it is like to be in a program and is only here at fornits to dump his anger and hate and post pornography for shock value. He doesnt seem interested in helping anyone or talking to people.
I need to take more control of this thread, LOL (after all it is named after me)!!!! Anyway, thank you for recognizing the fact that someone such as myself who has been through a number of programs, has a better idea of what they are all about, then those who have not. I think that, and the fact I've matured, makes it easier for me to be able to look at things, and be more open minded.
A lot of people here on Fornits want me to produce a list of good programs, as well as the bad ones. If I were to do all that research, and investigation.......wouldn't that make me somehow more involved in the industry, which would make me even more hated then I already am on this board?!!
Not that it could get any worse, then it already is!
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I need to take more control of this thread, LOL (after all it is named after me)!!!! Anyway, thank you for recognizing the fact that someone such as myself who has been through a number of programs, has a better idea of what they are all about, then those who have not. I think that, and the fact I've matured, makes it easier for me to be able to look at things, and be more open minded. The fact I've been abused in programs and that has warped my tiny brain also accounts for alot of my thinking too.
A lot of people here on Fornits want me to produce a list of good programs, as well as the bad ones. If I were to do all that research, and investigation.......wouldn't that make me somehow more involved in the industry, which would make me even more hated then I already am on this board?!! C'mon do you really want to know Who (wink, wink) I'm working for?
Not that it could get any worse, then it already is! Because I have no friends, I love to troll fornits!!! hehehe
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I need to take more control of this thread, LOL (after all it is named after me)!!!! Anyway, thank you for recognizing the fact that someone such as myself who has been through a number of programs, has a better idea of what they are all about, then those who have not. I think that, and the fact I've matured, makes it easier for me to be able to look at things, and be more open minded. The fact I've been abused in programs and that has warped my tiny brain also accounts for alot of my thinking too.
A lot of people here on Fornits want me to produce a list of good programs, as well as the bad ones. If I were to do all that research, and investigation.......wouldn't that make me somehow more involved in the industry, which would make me even more hated then I already am on this board?!! C'mon do you really want to know Who (wink, wink) I'm working for?
Not that it could get any worse, then it already is! Because I have no friends, I love to troll fornits!!! hehehe
I don't work for Who! Just shut up with that stuff already! Geezus, you are pretty funny, I have to admit. But, what you are saying is absolutely untrue.
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Not to offend anyone's delicate sensibilities, but who cares? Without treatment they would have certainly died anyway. That's what drug addiction does.
What??? You're now making diagnosis' about hypothetical kids? :roll:
Do you think everyone who uses drugs is going to die? (Well, we're all gonna die but, you know what I mean).
You keep listing these few names of deaths as if they mean anything while twenty thousand kids a year are HELPED. Doesn't that mean anything to you?
Not unless you can back that up with some clinical research.
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The fact I've been abused in programs and that has warped my tiny brain also accounts for alot of my thinking too.[/color]
this is what nonsurvivor posters of fornits think of the true survivors that post.
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The fact I've been abused in programs and that has warped my tiny brain also accounts for alot of my thinking too.[/color]
this is what nonsurvivor posters of fornits think of the true survivors that post.
Ha,Ha,Ha
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Guest wrote:
The fact I've been abused in programs and that has warped my tiny brain also accounts for alot of my thinking too.[/color]
this is what nonsurvivor posters of fornits think of the true survivors that post.
Ha,Ha,Ha
& that's what an industry shill sounds like when he's too chicken to log-in under his user name. (Does ... sound familiar to you?) I guess he like things in threes.
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when he's too chicken to log-in under his user name..
Says, anonymous. ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha