Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => EdCons and referring organizations and agencies => PURE Bullshit and CAICA => Topic started by: Anonymous on July 03, 2007, 12:11:55 AM
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Hi Sandy,
Patty responded. She sounds legit, but it's hard to say. Please read her e-mail (below) and see if there are any red flags or inconsistencies that jump out at you. I will wait to hear from you before I respond to her.
The only thing she has going for her is that she holds the $$ - if nothing else this child will have money when he comes home (if he ends up staying in TB - which of course I hope he doesn't).
I need to explain more about coaching and how it has helped keep families together. [Emphasis added] It would be nice if she could convince her sister to try that. One problem is the new husband - very common! These new husbands often have no patience for the wife's teen. I've seen this over and over.
And the girl who is going out, etc., she sounds like a teen doing teen things. [Emphasis added] It sounds to me that she and her mom could be helped with coaching rather than sending this child away. I'd have to know more and be sure the child is not suicidal, etc.
Thanks for keeping me in the loop.
Isabelle
My Opinions:
Sounds "legit"???
Odd statement to make but I suppose there may be such a thing as illegitmate parents?
"Red flags or inconsistencies"
Another odd statement but I suppose it's an "advocacy" thing?
"I'd have to know more and be sure the child is not suicidal, etc."
Yes, that would be a great idea except for that fact that Isabelle Zehnder is not an M.D. , child psychologist or therapist.
She is a professional "coach".
IMO, this email or letter to Sandy, who is the step-parent of a child once in a program, raises red flags about the need for parents to seek the advice and opinions of persons who are professionally trained and qualified in child and teen adolescent behavior and psychology.
Comments anyone?
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And just what are the requirements and/or criteria for being a professional coach?
Stay tuned. Fact-Checker Activated.
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ISABELLE ZEHNDER
COACH
Isabelle Zehnder is a Professional Life and Family Coach.
She is an Active Member of the International Coaching Federation and an active member of their local Chartered Chapter, the Northwest Coaches Association.
_______________
First, what is the International Coaching Federation?
Is it Self or Independently Regulated?
http://www.coachfederation.org/ICF/For+ ... egulatory/ (http://www.coachfederation.org/ICF/For+Current+Members/Regulatory/)
A: Appears to be a self-regulated trade org.
How about Ethical Guidelines and their Enforcement?
http://www.coachfederation.org/ICF/For+ ... uidelines/ (http://www.coachfederation.org/ICF/For+Current+Members/Ethical+Guidelines/)
What are the terms and conditions of working with a professional coach?
Sample Contract
http://www.coachfederation.org/ICF/For+ ... Agreement/ (http://www.coachfederation.org/ICF/For+Current+Members/Regulatory/Sample+Coach+Agreement/)
How Does One Become A Credential Coach?
http://www.coachfederation.org/ICF/For+ ... redential/ (http://www.coachfederation.org/ICF/For+Current+Members/Credentialing/Why+a+Credential/)
What are Isabelle Zehnder's Credentials?
Choices: PCC, MCC, ACC
Using the search for each of these credentials, this is what came up:
No result!
Please try again!
Using the search with no credential box checked, this is what came up:
Mrs. Isabelle Nicole Zehnder
Positive Family Solutions, LLC
Battle Ground, WA 98604
Phone: 360.903.3951
Fax: 484.991.1828
E-mail: http://www.isabellezehnder.com (http://www.isabellezehnder.com)
http://www.caica.org (http://www.caica.org)
http://www.positivefamilysolutions.com (http://www.positivefamilysolutions.com)
In perusing each of these websites, I can find no mention of credentials.
Just membership in the ICF and a local chapter.
What credentials does Isabelle Zehnder have? Are they posted somewhere on these websites that I in error overlooked? If so, please provide a link.
Lastly, how does one become a coach and what qualifies them as "professional"?
Are there any independent studies, data, to show the efficacy of "coaching" vs. more traditional forms of counseling and/or therapy?
What are the potential drawbacks for coaching vs. individual and family therapy?
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Just in case anyone is confused, LLC is not a credential.
It stands for Limited Liability Corporation.
:lol:
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Hi Sandy,
Patty responded. She sounds legit, but it's hard to say. Please read her e-mail (below) and see if there are any red flags or inconsistencies that jump out at you. I will wait to hear from you before I respond to her.
The only thing she has going for her is that she holds the $$ - if nothing else this child will have money when he comes home (if he ends up staying in TB - which of course I hope he doesn't).
I need to explain more about coaching and how it has helped keep families together. [Emphasis added] It would be nice if she could convince her sister to try that. One problem is the new husband - very common! These new husbands often have no patience for the wife's teen. I've seen this over and over.
And the girl who is going out, etc., she sounds like a teen doing teen things. [Emphasis added] It sounds to me that she and her mom could be helped with coaching rather than sending this child away. I'd have to know more and be sure the child is not suicidal, etc.
Thanks for keeping me in the loop.
Isabelle
My Opinions:
Sounds "legit"???
Odd statement to make but I suppose there may be such a thing as illegitmate parents?
"Red flags or inconsistencies"
Another odd statement but I suppose it's an "advocacy" thing?
"I'd have to know more and be sure the child is not suicidal, etc."
Yes, that would be a great idea except for that fact that Isabelle Zehnder is not an M.D. , child psychologist or therapist.
She is a professional "coach".
IMO, this email or letter to Sandy, who is the step-parent of a child once in a program, raises red flags about the need for parents to seek the advice and opinions of persons who are professionally trained and qualified in child and teen adolescent behavior and psychology.
Comments anyone?
OH MY GOD... This... I didn't do. Where did this come from? I think I know where this came from... Thank you. You know who you are. Thank you.
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Psy - it is posted here:
http://pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/ (http://pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/)
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Psy - it is posted here:
http://pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/ (http://pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/)
DAMN... I never imagined she would ADD to the release of information... LOL... It makes sense that only Izzy of Sandy would have access to those emails. For a second, I thought it might have been Sandy who posted that. Wow. In the context of the full dialog, it's very clear what is going on, and I don't think I have to elaborate.
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Psy - it is posted here:
http://pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/ (http://pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/)
DAMN... I never imagined she would ADD to the release of information... LOL... It makes sense that only Izzy of Sandy would have access to those emails. For a second, I thought it might have been Sandy who posted that. Wow. In the context of the full dialog, it's very clear what is going on, and I don't think I have to elaborate.
Yes, it does appear the email speaks for itself ... loud and clear. Just not sure why Izzy posted it given the subject material. Circuits on overload? Blog-Itis?
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How do we know the email to Sandy that Izzy posted is the original and not edited?
To be perfectly fair, we don't.
So what's the point in even posting it on her blog?
I don't get it.
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I'm pretty sure that's the original email.
I don't understand why Isabelle would post the emails like she did. I, personally, do not care for my name to keep popping up but I understand why it does.
I grew up being taught that if you don't "feed the fire" it will die down sooner or later.
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I'm pretty sure that's the original email.
I don't understand why Isabelle would post the emails like she did. I, personally, do not care for my name to keep popping up but I understand why it does.
I grew up being taught that if you don't "feed the fire" it will die down sooner or later.
Oops, didn't realize I wasn't signed in. I don't post as "guest".
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I'm pretty sure that's the original email.
I don't understand why Isabelle would post the emails like she did. I, personally, do not care for my name to keep popping up but I understand why it does.
I grew up being taught that if you don't "feed the fire" it will die down sooner or later.
Oops, didn't realize I wasn't signed in. I don't post as "guest".
Absolutely, you are correct... But Isabelle and Sue are the only ones in danger of getting burned. The school, now defunct, that they are so fond of defending (http://http://whitmoreacademy.blogspot.com/) (Whitmore), was VERY abusive (http://http://isaccorp.org/documentsnz.asp#whitmore) (and there is a current case relating to that in progress right now). Sue Scheff made 10% of every single referral she made to Whitmore (does she tell that to parents? no.. she lies, as she did before (as was shown in the WWASP vs. PURE trial)). That's just one of many reasons I have no problem turning up the heat. Who does Sue Scheff currently refer to? Who knows! And yet Isabelle the "advocate" is more than willing to hand out her number... and that of an unlicensed escort service run by "former" WWASP employees who currently work with and recommend WWASP programs. What kind of an advocate is she? I don't at all mind seeing her and Sue roast while the truth about them is exposed.
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Isabelle saying she had permission to give out Sue Scheff's private number when in reality, the number she gave the parent was PURE's business number.
WTF? Another "whoops" it's ain't my fault excuse from Zehnder?
Come on. That simply does not pass the smell or giggle test.
:flame:
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Seems the PATTI ATWOODS blog has undergone a major "editorial" change.
The emails are gone. The pictures of Cruella DeVille - Gone.
Unfortunately, the poem presumably written by Zehnder, is still there.
http://pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/ (http://pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/)
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June 27, 2007
Written by:
Editorial Board
Coalition Against Institutionalized Child Abuse (CAICA)
______________________________________________
There seems to be some question as to who Patti Atwoods is and why it even matters. Patti Atwoods does not exist. She was made up by a deceitful woman - a liar and a fraud - someone claiming to be her in an effort to harm Isabelle Zehnder – a Child and Family Advocate - the Founder and President of the Coalition Against Institutionalized Child Abuse (CAICA). Patti called from San Antonio, Texas - 210-251-2902.
Patti found Isabelle's friend, Sandy, on MySpace and contacted her. Patti lied to Sandy and to Isabelle. This selfish caller took up over three weeks of precious time that could have been used to help other families. She claimed she wanted to remove her nephew from what she believed was an abusive program.
Why?
It now appears the motive was to try to discredit Isabelle and CAICA who have devoted the past four years to helping families whose children were abused in teen programs and to provide a service to the public by creating what others are calling the most comprehensive website on the topic of institutionalized child abuse.
Isabelle is not radical - she does not believe all programs should be shut down. What Isabelle is trying to accomplish is bringing awareness to the fact that children and teens are being abused in programs and to find a way to not only stop the abuse but to make those who abuse children accountable for their actions. As a result, the people who are radical, who do believe all programs should be shut down, continue to harass and defame both Isabelle and her friend, Sue Scheff. Sue has devoted eight years to helping these families.
Who are these people and what drives them?
We have seen a pattern that victims of abuse in these programs seem to despise anyone and anything that is not in line with their ways of thinking. Perhaps this is a result of the years of abuse they themselves endured. Many were mistreated in teen programs and they are very angry, understandably. Some are people with their own hidden agendas.
The sad thing is that victims are misdirecting their anger. The truth of the matter is there are kids who need help that their parents and local therapists can't provide. The anger should be directed at those who abuse children. And rather than stay angry it would be more useful to the cause if everyone worked to find positive solutions and to try to get this industry regulated so that kids do not have to continue to endure abuse behind closed doors. It is daunting – there is a great deal of work to be done to accomplish this. But Isabelle and those at CAICA believe it is a cause worth defending.
“Patti Atwoods” wasted three weeks of precious time that could have been used to help others. "Her" supporters continue to do everything in their power to discredit Isabelle. We believe they are former program victims. Isabelle continues to receive threatening e-mails from a young man in Virginia who claims he was abused at Benchmark. He does not know Isabelle, he has never spoken with her, and he has no idea the work she has done to help families.
He is sending Isabelle and Sue threatening e-mails which are being taken seriously and that have been forwarded to the proper authorities. There is a fine line between free speech and Internet Slander and Defamation. That line has been crossed.
Posted by Isabelle Zehnder at 2:43 PM 0 comments
Labels: caica, Isabelle Zehnder, patti atwoods, sue scheff
Since the blog has changed and I did not see the poem I thought I would post this, before it undergoes another change.
There seems to be no limits on the lawsuit threats ect.
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if everyone worked to find positive solutions
a plug for her new enterprise.
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well,
You know, having been in an abusive program and all, I know for a fact that the only people that have a full understanding are those who were actually IN an abusive program. These 'advocates' THINK they know/understand, whatever, but until they have survived an abusive program, they will never fully understand the situation. Besides, if they sue survivors of abusive programs, that is "Crossing the Line". Some 'advocates' do a better job than others, so at least it's not hopeless. :rofl:
RG 8-)
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From one old goat to another...
You are so right! ::cheers::
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Seems the PATTI ATWOODS blog has undergone a major "editorial" change.
The emails are gone. The pictures of Cruella DeVille - Gone.
Unfortunately, the poem presumably written by Zehnder, is still there.
http://pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/ (http://pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/)
Well. Regardless of her editing, the damage has been done:
http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?p=269386#269386 (http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?p=269386#269386)
She added an addendum today, entitled "In addition"
It was brought to CAICA’s attention that there are claims CAICA refers children to programs and transport companies for the purpose of placing a child or teen in a program.
CAICA does not refer children or teens to programs. CAICA has, on very rare occasion, shared resources to parents in need of safe placement for their child or teen when all other options had been exhausted.
CAICA does not refer to transport companies for the sake of transporting children or teens to any facility or program.
http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?p=264362#264362 (http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?p=264362#264362)
*sigh*...
I'm on my laptop. When I get to my desktop, i'll go find, and post the original version of the patti blog.
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I'm pretty sure that's the original email.
I don't understand why Isabelle would post the emails like she did. I, personally, do not care for my name to keep popping up but I understand why it does.
I grew up being taught that if you don't "feed the fire" it will die down sooner or later.
Oops, didn't realize I wasn't signed in. I don't post as "guest".
Did you ask that Izzy remove those emails from her blog? I assume no... since you didn't ask me to remove the ones I have, but I may be wrong.
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Sounds "legit"???
Odd statement to make but I suppose there may be such a thing as illegitmate parents?
"Red flags or inconsistencies"
Another odd statement but I suppose it's an "advocacy" thing?
These two statements have to do with trolling. Lots and lots of people create false personae. This is a good thing- it raises the suspicion level and means that these fuckclowns might push away real parents.
She sounds like an advocate, doesn't she? The problem comes in when Isabelle says she's qualified to determine when children should be sent away, and she's not.
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Wonder who asked Izzy to remove the Cruela De Vil cartoon picture?
Why doesn't she remove the disgusting POEM?
Maybe Pinochio represents herself? She doesn't say, does she?
If Izzy even wishes to be considered an "advocate" she might want to try to A V O C A T E intstead of promoting the defunct Whitmore Academy and the past owners who have broken laws in three countries; while she bashing parents and their victimized children.
Don't "advocates" show compassion for children who were victimized in a program when the owner cops a plea?
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Izzy's side-kick Sue-Sue has retained the Cruella de Vil pictures on her Whitmore Blog; so the haven't discarded their love of posting vicious pictures.
It just appears that Izzy may be trying to appease her MySpace friend, Sandy for the time-being.
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I'm pretty sure that's the original email.
I don't understand why Isabelle would post the emails like she did. I, personally, do not care for my name to keep popping up but I understand why it does.
I grew up being taught that if you don't "feed the fire" it will die down sooner or later.
Oops, didn't realize I wasn't signed in. I don't post as "guest".
Did you ask that Izzy remove those emails from her blog? I assume no... since you didn't ask me to remove the ones I have, but I may be wrong.
You assumed correct.... I did NOT ask Isabelle or you to remove anything. I realize that once something is posted on the internet, it's always going to be there to some degree even if it's deleted.
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http://http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:hXMDtV_eEsAJ:pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/search/label/sue%2520scheff+PattiAtwoods&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us&ie=UTF-8
Saved by THE GOOGLE.
:rofl:
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Yup, good ole' google is such a good housekeeper, swept that page (as it originally appeared) right up and put it in the cached inbox.
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Who or what is the CAICA "editorial board"?
The blog appears to be written in third person.
So who is the person or entity accountable for writing and publishing this blog?
My guess would be the President and Founder of CAICA, Isabelle Zehnder.
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http://http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:hXMDtV_eEsAJ:pattiatwoods.blogspot.com/search/label/sue%2520scheff+PattiAtwoods&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us&ie=UTF-8
Saved by THE GOOGLE.
:rofl:
*sigh*... I love google. I do have the original on my desktop, but since it's here, now, i'll print to pdf and upload:
http://homepage.mac.com/psyborgue/files/caicapatti.pdf (http://homepage.mac.com/psyborgue/files/caicapatti.pdf)
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Hmmm ... the cached page is no longer available.
How did that happen?
I am google-challenged.
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And that "poem" everyone is giving IZZY credit for?
It's the song from 101 Dalmations. Seems IZZY ain't no poet.
Seems it just more COPY-CAT Izzy.
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::jawdrop:: really....
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Hmmm ... the cached page is no longer available.
see my last post.. the pdf has the page there.