Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: nimdA on March 08, 2007, 11:57:58 PM
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http://www.pinnaclewilderness.org/licenses.html (http://www.pinnaclewilderness.org/licenses.html)
Ok take a look at this link and follow the redirect... I'm giving away cash money prizes to who ever can figure out what wop in the wood pile is hiding time.
This is worth a thread on its own. Dig deep my peeps and see what I have seen. Its worth it.. and you don't even have to look hard.
Come on.. Don't be lazy...
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Color me stupid, but I did not see them listed ANYWHERE using the licensee lookup & verification record for Utah. I searched under Pinnacle and Foundation and wilderness. No license.
There's a couple of suspect listings under Pinnacle Professional Services, which changed to Pinnacle Performance Management, which changed to Pinnacle Management Group. They are all listed as professional employer organizations. It jumped out at me because I have no idea what that is supposed to mean. They are based in Farmington, though, and Pinnacle Foundation is in Richfield.
Oh yeah, the other thing is that they say they are licensed as an outdoor wilderness program. Well, I looked under the list of professions and organizations and there is no such category on UDOPL.
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I am beginning to gather that utah desert is the eq in harsh climate of the Australian outback. Because of the obscenely hot dry temperatures it is not uncommon to hear of the occasional british or german backbacker who perishes and dies due to being ill equiped and running out of petrol or water in the middle of nowhere. Given this i can not think of a parent alive who would allow a hiking expidition in this part of the country. This is why it is considered a mountain and dense bush activity.
Perhaps those who bang on about self regulation should consider this as a factor before sending non compliant kids into the hottest driest part of the country in the summer!!!!
But these guys advertise for such highly qualified staff so i guess they are well equiped for any emergency that may come to pass!
http://www.strugglingteens.com/employme ... ation.html (http://www.strugglingteens.com/employment/pinnacle_foundation.html) :flame:
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kids need to fight back. the only program shut down recently was the group home for pergnant girls. when they took decisive action, the owners decided what they were doing was wrong. these kids should be applauded as heros, who protected other kids from being imprisoned against their will by smug old people who deserved that pan to the noggin. more of this is needed, it is shown to work. remember the riot at the other program a while back? shut down. your govt doesn't want you to konw this, but violence tends to work. quite well in fact.
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kids need to fight back. the only program shut down recently was the group home for pergnant girls. when they took decisive action, the owners decided what they were doing was wrong. these kids should be applauded as heros, who protected other kids from being imprisoned against their will by smug old people who deserved that pan to the noggin. more of this is needed, it is shown to work. remember the riot at the other program a while back? shut down. your govt doesn't want you to konw this, but violence tends to work. quite well in fact.
::bangin:: ::stab:: :tup:
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So, two moms start a program. One a recovering addict whose son attended a wilderness program and the other is good at "multi-tasking". Impressive....
Pinnacle Foundation is fully licensed as an Outdoor Wilderness Program by the Utah Division of Occupational and Professional Licensing.
Not very bright. UDOPL licenses individual professionals, not programs. They are licensed through DHS as an Outdoor Youth Treatment program.
http://www.hslic.utah.gov/db_results.as ... county=%25 (http://www.hslic.utah.gov/db_results.asp?corp_name=Pinnacle&service=%25&SS=%25&county=%25)
As for licensed staff.....there is one, Bagley, the Marriage/Family Therapist.
It appears that the owner, Debbie Hansen may have been licensed through UDOPL as a THERAPEUTIC RECREATION TECHNICIAN, but if this is her, the license has expired.
https://secure.utah.gov/llv/llv?action= ... _id=204527 (https://secure.utah.gov/llv/llv?action=detail&license_no=282525-4003&expiration_date=2003-05-31+00%3A00%3A00.0&license_id=204527)
Your youth are placed into a naturally therapeutic environment that is free from outside distractions.
Pinnacle Wilderness Foundation is a Non-Profit (501)(c)(3) program that has been approved for Educational Loans through Sallie Mae-the nation's leading provider of student loans.
Student Loans are an attractive option for parents considering wilderness therapy for their children. Pinnacle Foundation is one of only a few wilderness programs that qualify for this type of loan. Financing your youth?s education with student loans can allow you to make low monthly payments over a period of time.
Through a unique partnership with Blueprint Education, Pinnacle Foundation offers elective credits in various subjects to PathWalkers who complete the program. Thus, participants have the opportunity to further their academic goals through our program, whether the goal is to get ahead in school, catch up to the rest of the student?s class, or simply stay on track for graduation.
And how does 2.5 credits, all electives, accomplish that?
http://www.blueprinteducation.org/servi ... ptions.cfm (http://www.blueprinteducation.org/services/OutdoorEducation/CourseDescriptions.cfm)
The four levels of curriculum based around the "Circle of CourageTM" will provide 2 1/2 school credits if completed.
1 Credit: Physical Education [336 clock hours]
0.5 Credit: Applied English [147 clock hours]
0.5 Credit: Psychology [84 clock hours]
0.5 Credit: Art [84 clock hours]
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e=mc2
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Paging Fred Stetler.. Paging Fred Stettler.. or whatever the hell his name is.
Told you all it wasn't to hard to find.
We should make it a contest to seek out these podunk places and torment them via regulatory controls. Be a good way to pass time.
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Ya mean Ken Stettler, licensing?
(4) Programs shall provide an educational component as determined by the Utah State Board of Education for consumers up to 18 years of age who have been removed from their educational opportunities for more than one month. The administrators of the program shall meet and cooperate with the local Board of Education.
(5) Programs which advertise as providing educational credit to consumers shall be approved by the Utah State Board of Education.
Are they?
(2) Each program shall have a governing body and an executive director who shall have responsibility and authority over the policies and activities of the program. and shall coordinate office and support services, training, etc,. The executive director [Debbie Hansen] shall have, at a minimum, the following qualifications:
(a) be at least 25 years of age,
(b) have a BA or BS degree or equal training and experience in a related field,
(c) have a minimum of two years of outdoor youth program administrative experience,
(d) have a minimum of 30 semester or 45 quarter hours education in recreational therapy or related experience or one year Outdoor Youth Program field experience,
Does she?
(http://http://www.pinnaclewilderness.org/img/debbie-hansen.jpg) Debbie Hansen, Founder and Executive Director
Debbie has been in recovery for 14 years and is grateful for her experience in AA and Al-Anon. Mother of three, and Grandma to five, they are the joy of her life. She is a person that can accomplish anything she puts her mind to with perseverance. Pinnacle Foundation is her dream and she is excited to share it with the world. Having her own son participate in a wilderness program she knows firsthand how the experience strengthens and empowers your child to make positive changes. It is important to her not to just build a successful business, but a successful program that will help heal families and youth.
(3) Each program shall have a program or field director [Jeff Daniels] who coordinates field operations, manages the field staff, and operates the field office. The program or field director shall meet, at a minimum, the following qualifications:
(a) be at least 25 years of age,
(b) have a BA or BS degree or equal training and experience in a related field,
(c) have minimum of two years of outdoor youth program field experience,
(d) have a minimum of 30 semester or 45 quarter hours education in recreational therapy or related field, or one year Outdoor Youth Program field experience,
(e) demonstrate complete knowledge and understanding of relevant licensing rules,
(f) have primary responsibility for field activities and visit in the field a minimum of two days a week with no more than five days between visits,
(g) prepare reports of each visit, document conditions of consumers, document interactions of consumers and staff, and ensure compliance with rules,
(h) be annually trained and certified in CPR and currently certified in standard first aid, and
(i) have completed an initial staff training, see R501-8-8.
Does he qualify? No credentials listed in his bio.
Jeff Daniels, Field Director
Pinnacle Foundation has great pride in introducing our Field Director. Jeff?s many talents include: mapping, GPS coordinates & wilderness survival. A trained EMT-Intermediate and Wilderness First Aid Certified, Jeff spends any spare time volunteering for the Sevier County EMS. Hobbies include: Hunting and Fishing. Jeff is an experienced coordinator and will be an invaluable part of our team.
(5) Each program group shall have senior field staff [Camden Cheney] working directly with the consumer who shall meet, at a minimum, the following qualifications:
(a) be at least 21 years of age,
(b) have an associate degree or high school diploma with 30 semester or 45 quarter hours education and training or comparable experience and training in a related field,
(c) have six months outdoor youth program field experience or comparable experience which shall be documented in the individual's personnel file,
(d) be annually trained and certified in CPR and currently certified in standard first aid,
(e) have completed an initial staff training, see R501-8-8, and
No credentials listed in her bio.
Carmen is the perfect picture of health. Carmen?s hobbies include: yoga, eating healthy, long distance cycling, hiking, and skiing. Her favorite hike was in Hawaii on the island of Oahu, when she was given special permission to climb the Stairway to Heaven. It is 4080 steps straight up. She admits it was extremely strenuous, but worth the climb. Carmen is also EMT-Basic and Wilderness First Aid Certified. Carmen has an infectious love of the outdoors. We are excited to share her with our youth.
(6) Each program shall have a field staff working directly with the consumers who shall meet, at a minimum, the following qualifications:
(a) be a minimum of 20 years of age,
(b) have a high school diploma or equivalency,
(c) have forty-eight field days of outdoor youth program experience or comparable experience which shall be documented in the individual's personnel file,
(d) exhibit leadership skill,
(e) be annually trained and certified in CPR and currently certified in standard first aid, and
(f) have completed an initial staff training.
Probably safe to assume the others have diplomas or GEDs. As for their experience and abilities, only the program knows.
(8) Each program shall have a multi-disciplinary team, accessible to consumers which shall include, at a minimum, the following:
(a) a licensed physician or consulting licensed physician,
(b) a treatment professional who may be one of the following:
(i) a licensed psychologist,
(ii) a licensed clinical social worker,
(iii) a licensed professional counselor,
(iv) a licensed marriage and family counselor, or
(v) a licensed school counselor
(c) All clinical and therapeutic personnel shall be licensed or working under a DOPL training program certified by the State of Utah.
Bagsley, the Marriage/Family Therapist. Consulting physician?
(1) Each youth group shall be supervised by at least two staff members at all times, one of which must be a senior field staff.
(2) In a mixed gender group, there shall be at least one female staff and one male staff.
(3) Expedition group size, including staff members, cannot exceed sixteen people with a minimum of a one to four staff to consumer ratio.
They're licensed for 50 participants, but with one Senior staff, they're limited to 14 participants.
(1) Due to the difficulty of monitoring outdoor programs and the inherent dangers of the wilderness, a single violation of the foregoing life and safety rules may result in immediate revocation of the license and removal of consumers from programs pursuant to General Provisions as found in R501-1.
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It appears that the owner, Debbie Hansen may have been licensed through UDOPL as a THERAPEUTIC RECREATION TECHNICIAN, but if this is her, the license has expired.
Deborah, If you are going to allege that a persons license has expired and post it on the web (along with her photo) for all to see at least give her the benefit of the doubt that her license expired because she moved out of state or moved up in her career allowing her old license to expire after being licensed as a nurse or another profession. There are many reasons licenses expire. Spend a few minutes looking around, its only fair to these people and their careers. You did the same thing several times to ASR staff.
I am just asking you to be fair and look at all the evidence, not just the piece that fits for you.
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It appears that the owner, Debbie Hansen https://secure.utah.gov/llv/llv?action= ... _id=204527[/url]
The Ed/Prof credentials of several people are listed. If Debbie had credentials/licenses, don't ya think they'd be listed in her bio, bein's she's the Ex Dir? Give her the benefit of the doubt? Okay, It appears she's operating a program in violation of law.
Unfair would've been to leave the errors I made in ASR staff. I also provided an explanation. Who would've known that Frank's name was actually "Francis"?
If you want to defend this program, how bout you call them up, find out who has credentials, confirm it, and post the confirmation. Otherwise, stop whining and bitching.
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I am not defending the program Deborah, but fair is fair. You lose credability when you do this crap over and over again. These are peoples lives and careers, be fair with them, do the extra work, is all I ask.
It appears she allowed her licesnce to expire as a THERAPEUTIC RECREATION TECHNICIAN because she was working on something else.
https://secure.utah.gov/llv/llv?action= ... id=3960702 (https://secure.utah.gov/llv/llv?action=detail&license_no=282525-3102&expiration_date=2009-01-31+00%3A00%3A00.0&license_id=3960702)
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You lose credability when you do this crap over and over again.
As do you every time you open your mouth. Youre so set on contributing something, playing devil's advocate for an apparent unlicensed facility with untrained and largely unlicensed (or unassociated licensed) staff isn't contributing anything useful.
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Don't readers just hate it when THEWHO posts something that is correct and decent?
Then, there's the all-forgiving posts by TSW, and the deletion on the "Fuck all you losers" topic calling D.J. Deborah and other posters names, along with a pornographic picture?
Now, TSW has staged his own personal "welcoming home party" to fornits.
Yet, THEWHO is the bad guy?
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you gotta quote thoses posts before they can be deleted so we can all enjoy them. yeah, this forum is full of assholes and rejects... i think that has been well established before.
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Don't readers just hate it when THEWHO posts something that is correct and decent?
It happens so rarely it's hard to tell. Let's not allow the trainwreck that is Cindy derail yet another conversation. If you want to kiss his ass please do so in his designated cess pool of nonsense.
That's what its there for, right now this thread is focused on Pinnacle and whether or not they operating legally with appropriate staff.
Your thoughts?
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Over and over? Stop trolling me Who.
You, be fair. There's no mention of her being a nurse. There are 15 Debra Hansen's listed, how is it that you picked that one? Do you have some inside information? Looking over the list, I see now. Curious why you didn't pick the 'active' social worker?
DEBBIE LYNN HANSEN OGDEN SOCIAL WORK SOCIAL SERVICE WORKER 114817-3503 EXPIRED
DEBBIE LYNN HANSEN OGDEN ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH SCIENTIST ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH SCIENTIST 114817-2001 EXPIRED
DEBORAH F HANSEN SALT LAKE CITY SOCIAL WORK SOCIAL SERVICE WORKER 117683-3503 EXPIRED
DEBORAH S HANSEN SALT LAKE CITY NURSE REGISTERED NURSE 3093463-3102 ACTIVE
DEBORAH S HANSEN SALT LAKE CITY HEALTH CARE ASSISTANT HEALTH CARE ASSISTANT - OBSOLETE 3093463-6201 DEREGULATED
DEBORAH S HANSEN SALT LAKE CITY NURSE TEMPORARY REGISTERED NURSE 3093463-3104 NULL AND VOID
DEBORAH S HANSEN SALT LAKE CITY PRENEED PRE-NEED SALES AGENT 3093463-5802 EXPIRED
DEBRA HANSEN HYRUM COSMETOLOGY COSMETOLOGIST / BARBER 217518-1101 ACTIVE
DEBRA HANSEN RIVERTON COSMETOLOGY COSMETOLOGIST / BARBER 197295-1101 EXPIRED
DEBRA LOU HANSEN MAGNA HEALTH CARE ASSISTANT HEALTH CARE ASSISTANT - OBSOLETE 286866-6201 EXPIRED
DEBRA MAE HANSEN LAYTON SOCIAL WORK SOCIAL SERVICE WORKER 345045-3503 ACTIVE
DEBRA MARIE HANSEN PRICE NURSE LICENSED PRACTICAL NURSE 282525-3101 NULL AND VOID
DEBRA MARIE HANSEN PRICE HEALTH CARE ASSISTANT HEALTH CARE ASSISTANT - OBSOLETE 282525-6201 EXPIRED
DEBRA MARIE HANSEN HELPER RECREATIONAL THERAPY THERAPEUTIC RECREATION TECHNICIAN 282525-4003 EXPIRED
DEBRA MARIE HANSEN EAST CARBON NURSE REGISTERED NURSE 282525-3102 ACTIVE
The TRT fits her best, but as I stated, it may not be her.
Even if she happened to be a nurse, she still doesn't meet the requirements.
(b) have a BA or BS degree or equal training and experience in a related field,
(c) have a minimum of two years of outdoor youth program administrative experience,
(d) have a minimum of 30 semester or 45 quarter hours education in recreational therapy or related experience or one year Outdoor Youth Program field experience,
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Now I'm gonna be inclined to come down there and give you a shoe in the ass, honey.
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Well with the facts on that settled, who do we need to get on the horn with to get this place shut down?
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Well with the facts on that settled, who do we need to get on the horn with to get this place shut down?
I wouldn't waste my time. Just another prime example of how the industry operates. Programs operate illegally and Utah DHS allows it.
BTW, Robert, they are a licensed program but appear to be in violation of several regulations, and those only involve staff requirements. Apparently Stettler didn't confirm their information, just took what they said as the truth. Does that sound familiar?
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That it does, maybe he and our friend should get together and compare notes.
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Over and over? Stop trolling me Who.
You, be fair. There's no mention of her being a nurse. There are 15 Debra Hansen's listed, how is it that you picked that one? Do you have some inside information? Looking over the list, I see now. Curious why you didn't pick the 'active' social worker?
I wouldn?t choose any of them because I don?t have all the facts ? If I wasn?t sure I wouldn?t post anything
I am not trolling you Deborah, I am sorry if it appears that way. You provided a link to Debra Marie Hansen and you chose to post one of the licenses that was expired over one that was active. Without having all the facts I don?t see why you would post information at all especially when you are dealing with peoples careers, I don?t think it is right unless the person has been convicted of something and you are trying to protect other people. Corporations are one thing; they can hire people to protect their name, but you can really hurt a person?s life and career by posting inaccurate information about them
I think you have been looking at these licensing sites long enough to know an expired license isn?t necessarily bad, in fact it usually means they moved up and are licensed at a different level and allow their old license to expire or they moved to a different state.
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Pinnacle is non profit. Does this require some sort of board to decide what the directors salary is?
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Cindy you routinely claim things to be true without ever bothering to check the facts, as a result of your kind of lies kids are abused.
Deborah is trying to verify the facts concerning this place, if you want to assist her get to it, otherwise move on. It's not as if you contribute anything anyway.
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After contacting Ken Stettler's Licensing Office--I was referred to the Office of Licensing website:
This facility is licensed as follows:
Facility: PINNACLE FOUNDATION
Site: Richfield
Website: www.pinnaclewilderness.org (http://www.pinnaclewilderness.org)
Contact: Debbie Hansen, Administrator Phone: 435896-5788
Mail: 80 E 1000 N. #C
Richfield, UT 84701
Type: Initial Probationary
Begins 1/1/2007 Ends 9/30/2007
License: Outdoor Youth Treatment
Capacity: 50 Gender Ages 13-17 years old
(nothing was stated in "Gender")
LICENSOR: Jim Jennings
As Deborah stated, this facility is "licensed" but this does not guarantee that that the information provided to the LICENSOR was verified, or that the information provided is truthful.
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As Deborah stated, this facility is "licensed" but this does not guarantee that that the information provided to the LICENSOR was verified, or that the information provided is truthful.
How would that work? Woudnt this be something the licensing dept looks into before issuing?
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So what is the point in getting licensed if it doesn?t really mean anything? Why do people here push for it so much?
That may explain why these places don?t want to go thru the whole license process or pay into regulation because it doesn?t add value or mean anything. Is this possible?
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THE WHO:
Once these facilities are LICENSED...by whatever means:
When the facility is found to be in violation of student's human rights, neglectful, or when the students are physically abused--then guess what?
The LICENSING AGENCY can be forced to revoke the license, and to close down this facility.
Strange how that works, HUH?
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What "the who" doesn't get is "THE PLACES" don't want to be licensed or regulated. No one ever said they did.
It is the public that needs and demands licensing and regulation.
Again, "the who" shows his true colors.
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After contacting Ken Stettler's Licensing Office--I was referred to the Office of Licensing website:
This facility is licensed as follows:
Facility: PINNACLE FOUNDATION
Site: Richfield
Website: www.pinnaclewilderness.org (http://www.pinnaclewilderness.org)
Contact: Debbie Hansen, Administrator Phone: 435896-5788
Mail: 80 E 1000 N. #C
Richfield, UT 84701
Type: Initial Probationary
Begins 1/1/2007 Ends 9/30/2007
License: Outdoor Youth Treatment
Capacity: 50 Gender Ages 13-17 years old
(nothing was stated in "Gender")
LICENSOR: Jim Jennings
As Deborah stated, this facility is "licensed" but this does not guarantee that that the information provided to the LICENSOR was verified, or that the information provided is truthful.
Whole thing stinks like a rotten tuna sandwich. What is with this probationary period deal in Utah anyway? Is it like the 5 dollar fee you pay to get into the Captain Crunch Club?
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Utah has some pretty kickass regs. The problem is with enforcement. Sometimes it takes a little outside pressure.
Regarding Probationary licenses:
a. An applicant for an initial license shall permit the Office of Licensing to conduct an unlimited on-site evaluation of the physical facility and grounds, and to interview persons associated with the proposed program to verify compliance with all licensing requirements.
i. The Office of Licensing shall approve an application for an initial human services program license only after verifying full compliance with all licensing requirements.
ii. The Office of Licensing may approve a probationary license only after verifying substantial compliance with licensing requirements.
A. The Office of Licensing shall include an expiration date on a probationary license, which shall not exceed 6 months from the date of issue.
Hmmm. How do they justify giving Pinnacle 9 months? Do they also have the power to alter the regulations at will?
B. A probationary licensee that fails to achieve full compliance with licensing requirements prior to the expiration of the probationary license shall not be granted an extension, and shall not accept any fees, entering any agreements to provide client services, or provide any client services.
C. A probationary licensee that is not granted an initial license may submit a new application for an initial license 3 months after the expiration of the probationary license.
iii. The Office of Licensing shall deny an application for an initial human services program license when substantial compliance with all licensing requirements cannot be verified.
iv. The Office of Licensing shall permit an applicant for an initial human services program license to withdraw the application at any time prior to denying the application when an applicant requests additional time to demonstrate compliance with all licensing requirements.
A. An application that has been voluntarily withdrawn by an applicant may be resubmitted, within six months of the date of withdrawal, for reconsideration without payment of additional fees.
http://www.rules.utah.gov/publicat/code ... -01.htm#T3 (http://www.rules.utah.gov/publicat/code/r501/r501-01.htm#T3)
So, In conclusion, Pinnacle didn't cut the mustard on their inspection. Stettler gave them 9 months, rather than the 6 months mandated by law, to come into compliance. Ain't it wonderful.
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What "the who" doesn't get is "THE PLACES" don't want to be licensed or regulated. No one ever said they did.
It is the public that needs and demands licensing and regulation.
Again, "the who" shows his true colors.
Of course they dont want to be licensed or regulated. What company in their right mind does? I think we established this a while back. If the people dont push for it it wont happen.
My question is that it seems once the school/program gets licensed it really doent mean that much. They can hand in a bunch of rubber stamped paper work, get their license and they are all set, if this is true then the schools are first ones to realize it is a joke. Why bother? except if someone abuses kids there they can lose their license....just get a new one!
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The Office of Licensing shall approve an application for an initial human services program license only after verifying full compliance with all licensing requirements
Thanks Deborah, that answers my question....... So if they are fully licensed it means they have to meet or exceed certain requirements that the public can have confidence in.
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The Who,
It does not work that way,and you know it.
Once a facility has lost its license, even in the State of Utah: it does not simply "get a new one."
Don't think for ONE MOMENT that any people who initiate such procedures--license revocation, and closure against a neglectful, abusive facility would turn a blind eye against this facility, or its owners in the future.
YOU ARE FULL OF SHIT and you know it.
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THE WHO:
Once these facilities are LICENSED...by whatever means:
When the facility is found to be in violation of student's human rights, neglectful, or when the students are physically abused--then guess what?
The LICENSING AGENCY can be forced to revoke the license, and to close down this facility.
Strange how that works, HUH?
What you have to keep in mind is that Cindy doesnt give a shit about these kids. So far as he is concerned the safety and oversight that regulation/licensure brings is not worth it when faced with the paper work that's involved with licensure.
He's made this point clear many many times.
So, In conclusion, Pinnacle didn't cut the mustard on their inspection. Stettler gave them 9 months, rather than the 6 months mandated by law, to come into compliance. Ain't it wonderful.
Deb do we have this guys number? Maybe he can explain to us why the three additional months were given despite that it goes against state regualtion.
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My question is that it seems once the school/program gets licensed it really doent mean that much. They can hand in a bunch of rubber stamped paper work, get their license and they are all set, if this is true then the schools are first ones to realize it is a joke. Why bother? except if someone abuses kids there they can lose their license....just get a new one!
Your question has already been answered. Troll again with the intention of taking up bandwidth and running the thread into the ditch any and it will be split off of this discussion. This is your second attempt to waste people time and Ginger's bandwidth. Scroll up if y0u need to read the answer to your question again.
If you want to jaw on about the faults that are inherent to licensing start a thread for that. This thread is to discuss the Pinnacle Wilderness Program.
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The Office of Licensing shall approve an application for an initial human services program license only after verifying full compliance with all licensing requirements
Thanks Deborah, that answers my question....... So if they are fully licensed it means they have to meet or exceed certain requirements that the public can have confidence in.
Look closer Cindy,
ii. The Office of Licensing may approve a probationary license only after verifying substantial compliance with licensing requirements.
A probationary license being what they have, meaning they only verified a substantial amount of the requirements, not all of them. In order to get a full license all the requirements must be met.
Do you understand?
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Why not start an email writing "campaign" to Mr. Ken Stettler, the Head of Licensing of Utah, and ask him directly if he can verify that these people are actually "qualified" for the positions for which his Agency has licensed them? Especially since there are no credentials listed in their BIO on this facility's website?
Kstettler@utah.gov
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John Bagley:
He was the former Clinical Director of TOP FLIGHT ACADEMY.
He worked at TOP FLIGHT ACADEMY at the same time as Gayle Palmer DeGraff--the woman reponsible for the death of Michelle Sutton in Palmer's newly opened wilderness program.
Bagley lists that he worked at Heritage Youth Services prior to his employment at Top Flight Academy.
Seems these "bad pennies" just keep showing up.
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Look Deborah, this isnt trolling, I was looking for an answer:
Joyce Harris Wrote:
As Deborah stated, this facility is "licensed" but this does not guarantee that that the information provided to the LICENSOR was verified, or that the information provided is truthful.
After reading this I was questioning whether or not the license had any teeth. Why would the license process not guarantee this?
What "the who" doesn't get is "THE PLACES" don't want to be licensed or regulated. No one ever said they did.
It is the public that needs and demands licensing and regulation.
Again, "the who" shows his true colors.
Then I responded to this post, by indicating we had covered this previously, I wont go into it here.
Your question has already been answered. Troll again with the intention of taking up bandwidth and running the thread into the ditch any and it will be split off of this discussion. This is your second attempt to waste people time and Ginger's bandwidth. Scroll up if y0u need to read the answer to your question again.
If you look at the time line you answered my question before I asked it by about 9 minutes, I didn?t see it when I was posting?????.
This was the answer I was looking for (below). It was an open issue that requirements are verified prior to issuing a license. If you look back a page it was thought the state didn?t check up on them.
The Office of Licensing shall approve an application for an initial human services program license only after verifying full compliance with all licensing requirements
And yes I was being sarcastic about getting a new license??. Calm down, I am not trying to run the conversation off course, they were legitimate concerns.
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What does it mean that The Who's post "will be split off of this discussion?" There thread is moderated by "NOBODY," so it stands to reason that The Who can post whatever he pleases, doesn't it; regardless if he is annoying, or not?
Who got elected as "posting police?"
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No he can't. Cindy works tirelessly to distract real discussions by asking pointless questions or coming to baseless concluscions. He does so both to confuse the issue and to enrage people in the hopes that they will focus more on him rather than the issue. He does this because he's in love with himself and he believes he should be the sole focus of every topic, and because he hates these children and doesnt want the truth exposed about these places.
For a good example take a look at his above post. He knows that the program was given a probationary license and not standard one. Yet he continues to pretend and try and convince others that they were given a standard license.
Oh and Deb is a moderator so yes she can move his posts if she chooses. No sense in allowing Cindy to derail every conversation with his incessant trolling.
Back then to the issue at hand.
In Utah who does the licensing board report to? If we have the same problems with this one that we had with the last one we should be prepared to go up the ladder.
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Deborah Wrote:
Hmmm. How do they justify giving Pinnacle 9 months? Do they also have the power to alter the regulations at will?
I might be able to help with this one:
Many regulations have built in latitude that allow for special circumstances or common sense. We had a situation with one of our businesses where one of the press cutters had a marginal safety rating because it was one of our oldest pieces of equipment. The writing of the regulation determined we needed to be brought back within compliance within 30 days. We entered immediately into a contract to purchase a new piece of equipment but delivery wouldn?t be for 3 months. The equipment was built to order and they were located overseas. OSHA approved a special waiver to cover the time period based on reviewing our purchase and we modified our present equipment which held us over.
So seeing that Pinnacle was given over the 6 month period (9 months) could be an indication they entered into a good faith agreement of some type and will become fully licensed at that time. So it is probably a good sign.
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So seeing that Pinnacle was given over the 6 month period (9 months) could be an indication they entered into a good faith agreement of some type and will become fully licensed at that time. So it is probably a good sign.
Youre speculating Cindy, we're interested in facts here, nothing else. No one wants to hear your justification for endangering your employees.