Fornits
General Interest => Open Free for All => Topic started by: Anonymous on January 25, 2007, 07:21:49 PM
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While this question could have piggybacked off the "mental illness" thread ... I am going to post it separately.
What do you know about ECT treatments? Have you ever had any personal experience with them? How about any professional experience?
I understand the heated debate about the existence/non-existence of mental illness and the whole pharmacological approach to treat or not treat ... but am curious about this approach to treat mental illness.
Thanks in advance for perspectives.
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I was in a psych hopistal once that seemed ECT happy, a few people in my "group:" got it done regularly. It was pretty funny/sad/pathetic depending on how you viewed it. They were doing it willingly, afterall, and were fully grown adults. It seemed to "work", they were all happy with it. I saw the room where they did it and layed down on it. It looks really benign, it's not like the movies or anything like that. The person goes in, then when they come out they are barely concious, with a stupid grin on their face, drooling, being escorted back to their room. They wake up the next day with no memory of it, and they get a "boost" in their mood. But the fucked up thing is it only lasts for a short time, so they are doing them couple times weekly. It's not for me. When I saw this thread it made me laugh, I have to admit it was kind of funny.
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Well it was not meant to be funny. For some people who have suffered with clinical depression, and who have not responded well to meds it is a measure of last resort.
When suicide is looming, individuals and their families will try just about anything to avoid an untimely death.
With that said I just wonder what kind of sadistic person would find this thread funny and laughable?
Geesh.
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With that said I just wonder what kind of sadistic person would find this thread funny and laughable?
Probably someone who finds quackery science offensive.
(http://
[url=http://www.cerebromente.org.br/n04/historia/ect1.gif]http://www.cerebromente.org.br/n04/historia/ect1.gif[/url])
Labatomies were considered an option recently too. I bet you thought the people who criticized those were insensitive ? :rofl:
Truth do you have experience yourself with ECT or you just come here to get that self righteism boost, I need REAL information please.
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(http://http://www.med.umich.edu/psych/images/ect_treat2.jpg)
ZAP!
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Guest~
I am afraid that I have had the (recent) unfortunate experience of first hand experience with ECT.
Of course, the psychiatric professionals DO endorse such treatments. And empirical evidence suggests that it is helpful ... albeit short term. I understand that "maintenance" treatments are often required. And it is further suggested that pharmacological treatment continue.
Is it quackery? I don't know. Is it quackery when a terminal cancer patient flies to Mexico to get treatments that are not currently FDA approved in the United States? I don't know. Is it quackery when traditional medicine has failed people so they resort to holistic healing ... such as radical diets and such. I don't know.
I do know that depression can be terminal. And that we are desperate to find answers before the funeral.
You may find this thread laughable. I find the mental health system in this country laughable.
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Is it quackery when a terminal cancer patient flies to Mexico to get treatments that are not currently FDA approved in the United States? I don't know. Is it quackery when traditional medicine has failed people so they resort to holistic healing ... such as radical diets and such. I don't know.
Yes that costs peoples lives , just like the teens are diverted into quackery treatment of private cult like programs, when there are other options that dont do so much harm to the kids. The difference is that adults go to ECT willingly.. if they were shocking kids against their will, no I wouldnt find that humurous. I was friends with the people getting it and we all laughed about it together, I never said this "thread" was laughable. Call me a sadist I could care less Ive been called much worse.
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I never said this "thread" was laughable.
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Perhaps I'm misreading you ... but you said "this thread made me laugh". Short term memory issues? Here ... let me refresh your memory.
When I saw this thread it made me laugh, I have to admit it was kind of funny.
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Hmmm ... guess one of us is confused then.
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I find it interesting you have personal experience with ECT and then skip right over the question and then get into nit picking my post. Smoke a bowl or something.
Since you want to take my last sentence out of context, and judge me based on that I think thats typical of everyone here so whatever. But for other people who walk into this thread, what I meant by that was that I hadnt thought about those people in a long time and when I saw this thread it made me laugh, it brought up good memories from the past and people I hadnt thought of in a while. By "it" I mean the treatment not this thread!! Yes we all thought it was funny, we had fun in that psych hospital. Sorry if that bothers you so much!! :roll:
So how about answering the question, or did something else I say offend you? ! :rofl:
Perhaps I'm misreading you ...
Yes, you are.. but seriously what do I care.. at least this thread is getting some action now.
ZAP!
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Hmmm ... guess one of us is confused then.
Well it aint' me ! :P
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I find the mental health system in this country laughable.
Good then we agree, but how can you think an entire industry is laughable, but not one of the craziest part of it going on? Doesnt make a whole lot of sense... then again I could go on a long self righteous rant about how the mental health system saves peoples lives and you laughing at it makes you sadistic.. but what kind of silly argument is that?
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guest~
What question is it that I failed to answer? Do I have personal experience with ECT? Yes unfortunately. Thought I answered that clearly enough.
I really don't want to get into a pissing match with you .... or anyone else here. I really was looking for thoughts and experiences.
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You are skillfully evasive; have a seat.
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guest~
What question is it that I failed to answer? Do I have personal experience with ECT? Yes unfortunately. Thought I answered that clearly enough.
I really don't want to get into a pissing match with you .... or anyone else here. I really was looking for thoughts and experiences.
You did earlier. I gave my thoughts and you called me a sadist. Do you have anything else to contribute?
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I really was looking for thoughts and experiences to judge.
Fixed that for you.
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Guest~
I stand hat in hand. I asked for thoughts and experiences. You stated that you found the ECT funny and laughable. Forgive me for "judging" your response. If you found the experience laughable then well ... whatever. I withdraw my "judgment" of you being sadistic.
To each his/her own.
Obviously, I do not find the whole matter funny or laughable. But, then I'm entitled to my own experience huh?
What is frustrating to me in terms of our mental health system is that:
There are no long term care facilities. If a family member is mentally ill (to the point of not being able to perform daily activities) there is no care. We are allowed 15 days psychiatric inpatient care yearly. Period.
Now if that same family member had cancer ... there is all kinds of support available. No limits on hospital stays. All kinds of philanthropic organizations to help defray costs. Medical leaves.
I know psychiatry is not an exact science. Some would argue that it is a science period. Which brings me back to my question about ECT.
Is it a viable treatment option for those who are med resistent?
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You stated that you found the ECT funny and laughable.
Well if thats how it came across I want to at least add a caveat. Yes our group of "crazies:" who lived together for a few months would have a nervous chuckle as they walked the fresh ECT peeps out of the building to their beds. But those same people would be the ones joining our lu-nch table and do the same thing. My point is we and those people had to have a sense of humor about that shit.. if you can't laugh about something like that, or laugh at yourself for ending up in a situation like that... then yeah, you have real problems. because at that point all we had was our sense of humor, and the fact we could laugh at ourselves at least made it bearable. I was not trying to poke fun at people who do it in any way, sometimes I dont articulate myself well.
I think its silly yes because here is an industry telling these people not to take a bump of coke, or smoke pot or have a drink because its " so dangerous", but they are willing to shock their brain, they dont even know what it does or why it "helps", it seems to me that ECT is more risky than the self medicating techniques most people find. So I think its strange in that way. I think psychiatrity discounts many more simple options for dealing with depression, and comes up with these super elaborate, in my opinion, crazy ideas like giving people seizures intentionally for a short term mood boost.
if you put that person on a regimen of methamphetmine, it would work just as well or better than ECT, but that is deemed inhumane and illegal for some reason.. that is why I think its "laughable".. not I dont sit around at psych hospitals and point at them and say look at that pathetic loser. Yes we did have a sense of humor about it all though... and to be honest, it was the people who did not have a sense of humor of the ability to self depricate that really seemed to be in trouble... so no offense intended, didnt mean to offend you, and if I did i am sorry.
I think ECT is just as legitimate as any other option a human being might want to try in order to make themselves feel better, although, in my opinion if you outlaw some of the more effective of the options, of course you are going to get all sorts of weird things popping up that supposedly elevate your mood. anti depressants, ginko biloba, everyone has their thing. some people smoke pot, other people hook themselves and give themsleves seizures.. whatever works for you I am all for it. i just think its kind of extreme and the half dozen friends I knew who did it, went right back tot he same feelings within a couple weeks, so it seemed like a lot of risk for really no long term benefit .
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What little I know of ECT.
It is only done voluntarily these days. It is used for depression. It seems to help in the short term. Psychiatrists are not sure why it works, it just seems to.
It used to be more widely used, even against the patients will. My family can attest to this. A schzophrenic member spent a year at a mental hospital (insurance covered, so I don't get where the 15 day limit comes from) and was treated with ECT. She never remembered it and denied it ever occurred. I don't think it helped at all.
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Thanks Atomic Ant~
The 15 day inpatient is what our insurance company allows in a "mental health" facility.
Our state "mental hospitals" (which are an option ... just not a good one) are scary places. They are filled with mostly the criminally insane and those whose illnesses prevent them from functioning in daily life. It is an unfair, biased system IMHO.
One serious side effect of the ECT is memory impairment ... obviously true in your family members experience.
Again ... Thanks.
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Guest~Is it a viable treatment option for those who are med resistent?
Mental Health Liberation and Anti-Psychiatry Movement
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYQD3Ut1TaQ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYQD3Ut1TaQ)
Truth about ECT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BskoiBXJKFc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BskoiBXJKFc)
Depression
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sm9Il-Jn ... er&search= (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sm9Il-JntI8&mode=user&search=)
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ECT is nothing more than Electro-Lobotomy to allow
the forces of the world to be in complete control.
This is a weapon of mass distruction which Satan
uses to steal kill and distroy anyone forced to be
submissive to this barbaric bondage.
Psychologists and doctors who believe in ECT don't know that Satan has control of them as Nazi SS soldiers to help him fulfill his work in an intelectual extermination service to hinder the rebellious of worldly blasphamy and to maintain control and bondage of the world and no less different than the NAZI SS Doctors of Auschwitz.
ECT is a physical act of Hate Crimes against the week and poor and down and lost! Why else would Doctors and Psychiatrists have to lie and call this a form of treatment? To me This ECT treatment is so obviously the
work of the devil giving him all the power and control he needs! ECT he gives to those who resist his work
allowing him all the control he needs!
hmm.....
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I don't find this very funny at all, either. I have ECT done regularly, I have SAD and usually I go into inpatient during the winter months. I have tried light therapy but I did not find it as effective as ECT. I wish I would respond to the meds but they don't seem to work. :cry: :cry: :cry:
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Truth, I just have to ask this. When you say firsthand personal experience, are you speaking of having received ETC yourself or of having a role in decision making for someone else?
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When you say firsthand personal experience, are you speaking of having received ETC yourself or of having a role in decision making for someone else?
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Yes ... my husband is seriously considering this treatment option. I am very hesitant ... even opposed based on what I have read regarding the long term effects and the ineffectiveness of the
"treatment". I recently found a peer reviewed journal article (Journal of Nueropsychopharmacology) that did a longitudinal study of 600 plus ECT recipients. There was a significant loss of cognitive function and reduced memory capacity. I printed a copy for his psychiatrist ... he has yet to address the findings. He doesn't like me very much.
My hubby on the other hand says the depression is going to kill him anyway ... so what difference does it make.
The trouble I'm facing is that I would like to petition the court to disallow this treatment, but because it is endorsed by most in the medical profession, I am swimming upstream against a strong current.
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I had ECT in 2001.
It was amazing, how well it worked, zero side effects and I made
it to breakfast each morning of the treatment.
I was on many meds prior to ECT, now I am on a couple, at very
low doses.
I have not had the need for any more treatments since the first four.
Now, going on six years depression free, I am back to work !!!
I was brought into the ECT room about 6:30am, and breakfast was at 7am. I never missed a breakfast.
Curiously, I was wondering where they zapped me. I couldn't feel the spots on my temples. Then I realized all the negative comments are just anti-hype.
I think there are about 500,000 treatments done in the US every year. They are expensive, about $1,300 each. If ECT didn't work they wouldn't use it.
Notice that there has never been a wrongful death, nor malpractice ECT lawsuit ... because it works.
Yes, some have memory loss. Depression also causes memory loss. So, for me it was worth the risk. I had no memory loss.
Good luck to your husband, being in Depression is like living dead.
Finally, yes, the current theory on ECT is to have meds too, not to replace meds.
In my case the meds stopped working, now a fraction of the meds are working better than before the treatment.
If he doesn't like the treatments, he can just say no more ... just like taking meds or any other treatment choice.
I would look forward to a depression free husband ...
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Yes, some have memory loss. Depression also causes memory loss. So, for me it was worth the risk. I had no memory loss.
How do you know you have no memory loss?
My family member experienced memory loss, but would never admit to it...in fact denied it vehemently. Never remembered the ECT, either.
When psychiatrists say they don't know how or why it 'works,' I am cautious. Common sense tells me I don't want to electrocute my brain cells.
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ECT is formerly known as electroshock, is a psychiatric treatment in which seizures are electrically induced in anesthetized. The difference is that adults go to ECT willingly.. if they were shocking kids against their will, no I wouldnt get that humurous. Electroshock therapy is used for treatment of depression and manic depression.
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