Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Anonymous on January 06, 2007, 12:16:36 PM
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Do you think it's better to try and forget the bad parts of your life so you can move on? Or do you think it is better to relive the experiences through memory and writing, and by reminding yourself daily of the child torture that still continues today by reading about it?
What is your strategy for dealing with these things? Do you ever get to a point where you feel like you are dragging yourself down with negativity?
Do you ever feel like it would just be easier to forget everything about your past and start over and move on in a new city or something? Is that even possible? :-?
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There was stuff I forgot whether I wanted to or not. It's just gone. (Chalk it up to old age.) I've compared notes with a fellow survivor who was there the same time I was. He would say "Don't you remember this?" and I honestly couldn't. *poit!* gone. That's just how it is.
There is a difference between forgetting and repressing. If you try to bury a memory that was traumatic, it will come back to bite you in the ass. It will affect your behavior and ability to function when you are triggered. As a result, there might be some impaired functionality.
We all forget things. But when you try to make yourself forget, that's when you can run into trouble.
hmmm... "dragging yourself down with negativity". I think that there are some of us who are on the obsessive side. (points to self) and the self-absorbed side (points to self). All I know is, I got over most of this years ago. All the anger, bitterness, resentment. Years later I found fornits and it was actually the first time I was able to talk about the experience (after I had deprogrammed myself) with other survivors. It was weird and new. I did it for a few months, and then got bored with it and left. I was probably gone half a year... then I came back. No idea why. Started talking about it in therapy again. No idea why. Read my notebooks for the first time since I graduated. No idea why. Actually started writing about the experience in detail on my online journal. First time I ever did that. No idea why.
My point is... it never leaves you. And a lot of times, you wonder why it comes back, even after all of the work you've done up to this point. It's just that some of us are more well-adjusted regarding this than others (points away from self).
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Interesting, thanks for the input.
My memories are not so much in detail anymore, they details are blurred out a lot. But the shades of color are always there, the surface of the inner lake of tranquility that is constantly being disturbed by that darn stone thrower on my banks. The feelings never go, even if the details do. I guess I am just curious how is it people get to be happy. Is that a myth? I feel like I am going to spend the rest of my life searching for something that doesn't neccessarily exist. That's what I watched my parents do and it never panned out for them. I've watched a lot of people do it and nothing. Sometimes I think happiness is the new myth being sold so that they can sell anti depressant drugs. Like the TV people are what represents reality when the real world is much less brightly colored, and will grit your teeth.
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Happiness is always relative, never absolute. Did you ever meet one of those types of people who are always happy and cheerful? Fuck them, they're either faking or batshit insane. Regardless, they sure are annoying as fuck, and should probably be suffocated with one of their garfield dolls.
Best to simply enjoy the times you feel good, instead of making "happy" a goal. That's all anyone can hope for.
BTW, I updated my previous post. Don't know if it will help much.
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There is a difference between forgetting and repressing. If you try to bury a memory that was traumatic, it will come back to bite you in the ass. It will affect your behavior and ability to function when you are triggered. As a result, there might be some impaired functionality.
I think this is where it gets kind of confusing because how do you know if you are assigning to much importance to certain times and incidents in your life. How does your mind go about picking the things that you remember, because out of all the shit that goes on day to day, we only remember a very small portion it seems like. If two people can have the same experience and one consider it good and one consider it bad, does that make one of them deficient in some way?
Best to simply enjoy the times you feel good, instead of making "happy" a goal. That's all anyone can hope for.
What I try to do everyday. I like how you put it and you make a good point about the fake happy people. Like I was saying before, I don't think I've ever met anyone who fits the stereotypical happy and well rounded person. But a lot of people consider themselves that or try to be that, or force their children into prison until they become that, and I am just wondering if it even exists because this seems like one big cruel experiment in social science if you ask me.
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Happiness is always relative, never absolute.
Happiness is a warm gun...
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how do you know if you are assigning to much importance to certain times and incidents in your life.
Good question. I don't know. Like I stated before, I'm obsessive. CEDU is cyclic with me. It goes away for a while, and then it comes back for a while. When it comes back, I have to think about it, and I think about it a lot. Then I get tired and it goes away again.
How does your mind go about picking the things that you remember, because out of all the shit that goes on day to day, we only remember a very small portion it seems like.
Fuck, I can barely remember what I did yesterday. I don't have much of a choice in that. I also have schizoid tendencies, so I will forget people and faces who may have played an important role in my life at one point. I don't think you can choose what to remember, but when a memory is repressed, it's still there, not forgotten. Just latent. I don't really know the process that happens behind that, though.
If two people can have the same experience and one consider it good and one consider it bad, does that make one of them deficient in some way?
I don't know. But it does make for some interesting arguments. I'm not sure deficient would be the operative term, here, if there was indeed an imbalance in functionality or intelligence. The diplomatic side of me says that it's important not to invalidate someone else's experience, even if you think their perception is completely fucked up. Let me put it this way, if someone viewed it as a good experience, fine. But if they then decide to form their own school, work as a youth counselor, send their own kid to a TBS, or pimp TBSes to other parents, then I get a little more brutal in my opinion of them. It's fine if you want to view your experience positively, it's another thing entirely if you want to subject someone else to it.
I am just wondering if it even exists
No. It's a bunch of crap. It's used to convince people to consume and spend in search of it.
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Happiness is always relative, never absolute.
Happiness is a warm gun...
Only if you have mirrors on your hobnail boots.
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Multicolored. ::rainbow::
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I burned all my correspondence, letters, notes and journals years ago at the advice of a psychologist I was seeing at the time. I also wrote a letter to all the people who wronged me and then we burned it together in a symbolic gesture of moving on. But that obviously didn't work. Now I wish I had that paperwork to look through sometimes.
I think something that is pervasive is the attitude that perception is reality. Program parents are an extreme version of this. They desperately need to control the perception of what they are doing, both in public and their own minds.
It seems like a lot of people are doing that. I do it to all the time. Trying to build up an impressive exterior (good job, a house, car) to make the perception that I am doing fine and have my shit together, when the truth is much different than what people are seeing. So why are we all so obsessed with keeping up this perception in our society?
When you stop caring about keeping up your own perception, other people get angry. They don't want to see what really is there and so they try and change it. But I get to a point where I feel like building a paper castle has no point. Looking out from the inside I know it's all an illusion, so who is it really for. Not me. Time to burn this paper castle down.
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It seems like a lot of people are doing that. I do it to all the time. Trying to build up an impressive exterior (good job, a house, car) to make the perception that I am doing fine and have my shit together, when the truth is much different than what people are seeing. So why are we all so obsessed with keeping up this perception in our society?
We're ~not all "so obsessed," etc.
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Time to burn this paper castle down.
You could always try another castle. :P
"You know how they say that dreamers build their castles in the air, and lunatics live in them? Well, I clean them."
- Rita Rudner
So why are we all so obsessed with keeping up this perception in our society?
To get laid.
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I guess I am just curious how is it people get to be happy. Is that a myth?
You will never find happiness until you stop looking for it.
Lao Tzu, the Tao Te Ching
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We're ~not all "so obsessed," etc.
Yeah I know I meant a larger cultural we, that is what mainstream society defines as success at this point in history. I try not to use the word we because I dont speak for others ... should of used something different.
You could always try another castle.
"You know how they say that dreamers build their castles in the air, and lunatics live in them? Well, I clean them."
- Rita Rudner
Ill have to try that. :P Great quote.
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You will never find happiness until you stop looking for it.
Lao Tzu, the Tao Te Ching
Is this some kind of riddle or something? Happiness comes in chemical form, so maybe happiness is just chemicals in our brain.
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I guess I am just curious how is it people get to be happy. Is that a myth?
You will never find happiness until you stop looking for it.
Lao Tzu, the Tao Te Ching
I use the same philosophy for everything that I lose in my house. The thing I lost last week always pops up when I'm looking for what I lost this week. I figure, the way this keeps up, I will eventually find everything that I have lost in my life, with the exception of the very last item I lose before I die.
Maybe I should just clean my house.
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When I was in college an English teacher made an interesting statement. She said, "Maybe instead of asking if happiness is possible, we should ask ourselves if it is even desireable. Should even be set as a goal?" I found that thought provoking.
There is a school of thought that believes human learning and advancement only comes from confronting and overcoming problems. That is how we grow and change. Remove the problems (challenges) and we stagnate. Is happiness the equivilent of stagnation? Is happiness the same as complacency or contentedness? People become activists because they are not happy with the current situation.
I personally think that happiness is not an end to seek, but a by product of how you live your life. If, at the end of the day, you like the person in the mirror, you will be a reasonably happy person.
Of course, if one is clinically depressed, it becomes more complicated.
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Of course, if one is clinically depressed, it becomes more complicated.
Tell me about it. Stupid brain. :flame:
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We're ~not all "so obsessed," etc.
Yeah I know I meant a larger cultural we, that is what mainstream society defines as success at this point in history. I try not to use the word we because I dont speak for others ... should of used something different.
Ok.. my point was that some of us don't worry that much about what other ppl think of them.. There ~are those of us who really couldn't give a rat's ass on a rat that has crawled up karen's ass and died (or a fiddler's fuck) about that sort of thing.. :D
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:D :P :lol: :smokin: ::hatter:: ::burger:: ::bwahaha:: ::cheers:: ::drummer:: ::drummer:: ::deal:: ::rocker::
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:D :P :lol: :smokin: ::hatter:: ::burger:: ::bwahaha:: ::cheers:: ::drummer:: ::drummer:: ::deal:: ::rocker::
Sure, why the fuck not.
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Hello, Dead Pet Removal?
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No, that's 282-0246. This is Panda Express, can I help you?
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Sorry, wrong #..
(redialing)
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http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=20233 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=20233)
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"I burned all my correspondence, letters, notes and journals years ago at the advice of a psychologist I was seeing at the time. I also wrote a letter to all the people who wronged me and then we burned it together in a symbolic gesture of moving on. But that obviously didn't work. Now I wish I had that paperwork to look through sometimes."
Burning the letter to the people who harmed you was probably helpful since you can't take more violent measures without hurting your self but burning the other stuff may have seemed like a good idea at the time but I'm with you in that it would now be helpful to be able to go over it as you worked your way out of the psychomess you were thrown into and gained some distance and perspective. I kept many of the same type of papers then burned them because they were too traumatic to reread. Later as I matured and was able to examine past issues from an emotional distance and then reexamine from a more mature perspecitve I wished I had them to fill in the blanks.
"I think something that is pervasive is the attitude that perception is reality. Program parents are an extreme version of this. They desperately need to control the perception of what they are doing, both in public and their own minds."
Yeah aint that the truth! That is why they are such easy prey for the Edconartists.
"It seems like a lot of people are doing that. I do it to all the time. Trying to build up an impressive exterior (good job, a house, car) to make the perception that I am doing fine and have my shit together, when the truth is much different than what people are seeing. So why are we all so obsessed with keeping up this perception in our society? "
Its all a con job dedicated to keeping you in excruciating debt! You will truly have your shit together when you focus on exploring what your real values are and away from what "society" approves of. Why work for that approval? It changes all the time and you can NEVER keep up with it so fuck 'em and enjoy life!
When you stop caring about keeping up your own perception, other people get angry. They don't want to see what really is there and so they try and change it. But I get to a point where I feel like building a paper castle has no point. Looking out from the inside I know it's all an illusion, so who is it really for. Not me. Time to burn this paper castle down.
Yeah well fuck them! You will find as you exit your paper castle that you will attract people who are attrracted to "what is really there" and who won't want to change it, they will want to celebrate it! This means you are getting healthier by the minute. Good luck!
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give a rat's ass on a rat that has crawled up karen's ass and died (or a fiddler's fuck) about that sort of thing.. :D
Good one, Toker! Maybe you can smoke that program whore out of her filthy hole!!!!!! ::rocker:: :rofl:
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I'm sorry but what did this "Karen" do to piss everyone off?
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I'm sorry but what did this "Karen" do to piss everyone off?
had kids?
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I'm sorry but what did this "Karen" do to piss everyone off?
flamers from another thread, seeping into this one. If you have several hundred years, read through the carlbrook thread.
Short story version: she's a mom who sent her kid to carlbrook and then second nature wilderness. Believed in the program, and talked a lot of program crap on the boards about how great carlbrook was, and was quite persistent and obnoxious about it. Now she's starting to talk with her son and have second thoughts about it, cause he sure as hell hated it, and he's letting her know. However, she hasn't been able to entirely let go of all of the bullshit just yet. Very stubborn in that regard. Username: charly. But she will also come on anonymously.
This is not to be confused with BuzzKill, who is also named Karen.
Carlbrook thread: http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=10982&start=2205 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=10982&start=2205)
If you want to talk Karen, that's the place to do it. This thread really has nothing to do with her.
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I think everyone has a different perception of happiness because we are all individuals
While I was in India, I found the poorer people were, the happier they were, especially the children, you give them a tennis ball and you'd think you'd given them the crown jewels! They want for nothing because they have nothing
A tennis ball would not make me happy
I did learn a long time ago however, that removing all negatives from your life is a good place to start, this can be people, places etc, some of them are hard to let go - especially if they are relatives or partners, I also learnt that behind every neative is a positive, positive thinking is a fantastic way of dealing with negatives, for every bad thing that happens, there is a positive that comes out of it, if you hadn't lost that job, you wouldn't have moved to that other town and met the love of your life and so on, I believe everything has a reason to lead you down particular paths, thinking this way is hard, especially when the odds seem constantly stacked against you, but if you look closely enough, you will find a positive in absolutely everything.....try it.
mental packaging is good too - i was taught how to place bad thoughts and feelings into a box, wrap them up securely and throw them away, it does help, sort of cleaning out your closet mentally ... saying this I am of the mindset that certain bad memories are healthy to hang onto, they remind you of who you are and why you don't act in certain ways, again, another positive
i hope some of this at least, made some sense
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A tennis ball would not make me happy
****scratches that off the list of possible birthday presents for exhausted****
You're a very tough woman to please, you know that? :wink:
How about a shuttlecock? Do you have one of those? They're floaty. wheeee. ::bigsmilebounce::
Sorry to respond to your very thoughtful and serious post with cracks about sporting equipment, but I'm an idiot. :silly:
In all seriousness, I wish my mom could have taken some lessons from you. Don't get me wrong, I love her, but she is quite the typical overprotective jewish mother. "It's 70 degrees out! Put on a coat, you'll get pneumonia!"
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Hey it's my 40th next month, I at least deserve a racket with that shuttlecock :lol:
But let's not get off topic, happiness finding is important stuff
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try another castle - Thanks, I couldn't figure out why charly was being called karen or why "Karen" was treated like the embodiment of evil. Well she seemed open minded to me......
exhausted, Your post made perfect sense and I'm somewhat of a pessimist
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exhausted, Your post made perfect sense and I'm somewhat of a pessimist
I used to be, my thinking was "expect the worst then it won't be a shock and if something good happens, it'll be a bonus"
I was so unhappy thinking that way all the time, it drove people away because I was so depressive, doom & gloom
Then I started to realise everything had it's reason - i won't say I'm the happiest bunny alive, but I'm certainly happier for the way I think - and positivity realy does attract positive things and people
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I used to be, my thinking was "expect the worst then it won't be a shock and if something good happens, it'll be a bonus"
OMFG! Are you sure you aren't Jewish???
That's so scary, I've been bandying about that line forever. "Expect the worst, that way you're never disappointed." That, and "It could be worse. (We could be in Passaic.)"
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Nope Irish Catholic
It's just something I've learnt for myself over the years - get rid of that thinking, do yourself a favour, it's not healthy
As for it could be worse, i kind of use that logic entwined with my way of thinking, stupid things like I hate my legs, theyre too fat, then I think, hang on, there's a neighbours child up the road who had his leg amputated through infantile menengitis, he'd love to have my legs - so yes it could be worse, let's get some pespective here
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Nope Irish Catholic
A booze hound & hypocrite. ::fuckoff::
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Nope Irish Catholic
A booze hound & hypocrite. ::fuckoff::
:rofl: :rofl: ::bwahaha:: ::puke::
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Nope Irish Catholic
Same thing.
Why do you think your people and my people intermarry so much?
I'm better at that. Instead of expecting the worst, I try to be realistic and rational. i.e. I have no idea how this will turn out, because it hasn't happened yet, but I hope it turns out well. But I do try to keep myself from getting my hopes up. I just try to leave it open.
(But now I've started learning how.)
I leave it open.
Okay, so I like Kate Bush.
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Nope Irish Catholic
A booze hound & hypocrite. ::fuckoff::
:rofl: :rofl: ::bwahaha:: ::puke::
Is responding to yourself the new black?
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Eh?
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over your head?
not surprised.
mental note to self: ::troll::
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over your head?
not surprised.
mental note to self: ::troll::
You were saying that I was replying to my own post (I wasn't.) Also, wth is this "new black" stuff? Speak English! :rofl:
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over your head?
not surprised.
mental note to self: ::troll::
You were saying that I was replying to my own post (I wasn't.) Also, wth is this "new black" stuff? Speak English! :rofl:
Not my fault if you're not up to date on tired old catchphrases that have been around for the past five years. There's a wikipedia. Use it.
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I just tried the urban dictionary and it wasn't there. :roll:
Just for grins (and to untwist your panties,) I'll look it up on Wiki. :lol:
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:roll:
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:roll:
:roll: :roll:
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Guest must have multiple personalities ::bwahaha2::
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So must your mother. ::nod:: ::bwahaha:: ::fuckoff::
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Guest must have multiple personalities ::bwahaha2::
Actually there are two or three of us "Guests" working together on this forum right now; at least two at the moment.
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As for it could be worse, i kind of use that logic entwined with my way of thinking, stupid things like I hate my legs, theyre too fat, then I think, hang on, there's a neighbours child up the road who had his leg amputated through infantile menengitis, he'd love to have my legs - so yes it could be worse, let's get some pespective here
That can work, up to a point. It's a great tool to keep from feeling sorry for yourself, and to allow yourself to be thankful of what you DO have.
However, it can be dangerous when one uses it as an excuse to be dismissive about legitimate problems or feelings.
I'm currently working through some issues in therapy regarding my CEDU experience, which is why I came back to the boards. But at the same time, I acknowledge that I should be grateful and proud of the fact that I am as functional as I am. i.e. I could be in much worse shape. There are some seriously damaged survivors out there. Yes, I am a mess, in many ways, but I could be FAR messier. It's important to give myself credit for what I have fought for since I left.
This, and an obnoxious sense of humor, keeps me sane.
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This, and an obnoxious sense of humor, keeps me sane.
Right on, my fine, fine nigga! :rofl:
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Guest must have multiple personalities ::bwahaha2::
Actually there are two or three of us "Guests" working together on this forum right now; at least two at the moment.
So why hide behind being a guest, come on - out with you
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So must your mother. ::nod:: ::bwahaha:: ::fuckoff::
Are you over the age of five?
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:roll:
:roll: :roll:
:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Your parents really shouldn't let you play on the computer without supervision, there's lots of nasty people on the internet
bye bye now
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So must your mother. ::nod:: ::bwahaha:: ::fuckoff::
Are you over the age of five?
Are you over 40?
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No
Go away child
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Guest must have multiple personalities ::bwahaha2::
Actually there are two or three of us "Guests" working together on this forum right now; at least two at the moment.
Guest is only one person. I am responding to myself right now. :roll:
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No
Go away child
That might work for your kids, but not here lady sorry.. :oops: :oops: :oops:
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:lol: Well, i'd like to sit & play games but I have to sleep at some stage, I have kids to look after
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Not if you send them to programs then you could play all day long and not have to worry anymore.
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Such is life, I'll just have to continue worrying
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My kid went to wilderness and they are doing great now not like your kid. Grow some balls already and do something to get your kid back on track.
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My kid went to wilderness and they are doing great now not like your kid. Grow some balls already and do something to get your kid back on track.
That's exactly what I'm doing - I am trying to get my kids back on track, not leaving it to someone else to do it for me, you know, a parents job and all that?
oh no - you don't know
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I have a career and chose to spend my money to help my kid. It worked and he thanks me daily for helping him back on track. I took him out of a toxic environment and he knew it was neccessary. So yes, I do know, my children are doing excellent.
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a parents job and all that?
Part of a parent's job is also recognizing when they failed and asking for help.
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The trolls are out in force today.
Exhausted? Talking like that to the anons is rather like trying to teach a pig to sing.
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MilkMan, using the death of a child to spread his diseased hatred, calling other people trolls. Yes, I've seen it all now.
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Do you think it's better to try and forget the bad parts of your life so you can move on? Or do you think it is better to relive the experiences through memory and writing, and by reminding yourself daily of the child torture that still continues today by reading about it?
What is your strategy for dealing with these things?
Dealing with the industry itself. And when i say "dealing with it" I mean activism, finding survivors, research, organizing to shut the place down (generally raising hell).
Do i mean revenge? No. And you shouldn't do it for that purpose. Do it because you would have wanted somebody to be helping you out when you were in program. Do it to find out the full extent of how your mind was played with. Revenge can only fuel you for so long. You will eventually burn out if that is all you are after.
Do you ever get to a point where you feel like you are dragging yourself down with negativity?
It's not negativity to help others. It isn't negativity Program teaches you that your valid complaints aren't. Forget or redefine the word "negativity".
"Negativity" is the program's way of saying "shut the fuck up you worthless [generic issue] scum. You're criticising a "good thing"!"
Do you ever feel like it would just be easier to forget everything about your past and start over and move on in a new city or something? Is that even possible? :-?
It isn't possible. You don't face your past by running from it. You face your past by dealing with it. It's hard, but you will feel better afterwards. That I promise.
Oh yeah. I forgot to mention that things you repress will fuck with you in ways you won't realize until you deal with them.
You can attempt to ignore the past for a while, but the memories and the effects of program are still there. The longer you suppress things the more it will hurt when you do deal with things. You can't ignore the past forever, trust me on this.
You want to feel better? Research what was done to you(most likely far more than you realize). Talk to other survivors. Get involved in activism. Tell your story. At least in my experience, these things have helped me to feel better far more than any head-shrink could.
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MilkMan, using the death of a child to spread his diseased hatred, calling other people trolls. Yes, I've seen it all now.
You're a piece of work, aren't you? His name is a reminder of the horrible and senseless death of Angellika Arndt, and it shouldn't be forgotten. Let's talk about the diseased greed and stupidity at Rice Lake that allowed untrained staff to kill a child, and a fucked legal system that gives out smacks on the wrist to these bastards.
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Guest must have multiple personalities ::bwahaha2::
Actually there are two or three of us "Guests" working together on this forum right now; at least two at the moment.
So why hide behind being a guest, come on - out with you
Because it gets your panties in a twist. I like fucking with you, it's fun. :P :rofl:
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Guest must have multiple personalities ::bwahaha2::
Actually there are two or three of us "Guests" working together on this forum right now; at least two at the moment.
Guest is only one person. I am responding to myself right now. :roll:
Sure you are, pal. :rofl:
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Woops, there I go again.
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MilkMan, using the death of a child to spread his diseased hatred, calling other people trolls. Yes, I've seen it all now.
Shut up, penis face. :roll:
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Woops, there I go again.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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MilkMan, using the death of a child to spread his diseased hatred, calling other people trolls. Yes, I've seen it all now.
Shut up, penis face. :roll:
No Id rather not.
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Woops, there I go again.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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MilkMan, using the death of a child to spread his diseased hatred, calling other people trolls. Yes, I've seen it all now.
Shut up, penis face. :roll:
No Id rather not.
Tough shit, shut your fucking piehole.
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Internet toughmen bore me. Next.
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@Milk. i think it's time to check this guest's ip (the one flooding the forum), delete his posts (the most recent 10 or so) and ban him/her.
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@Milk. i think it's time to check this guest's ip (the one flooding the forum), delete his posts (the most recent 10 or so) and ban him/her.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Internet toughmen bore me. Next.
Your MOTHER bores you. Quit fucking her.
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Internet toughmen bore me. Next.
Your MOTHER bores you. Quit fucking her.
Meh, keep trying. You'll get it eventually.
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Milk, where are you? Can you please ban the poster who said I fuck my mother. This made me sad, and it is distracting good hard working parents who are trying to find information. I don't fuck my mother, that is gross!!!!!
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Milk, where are you? Can you please ban the poster who said I fuck my mother. This made me sad, and it is distracting good hard working parents who are trying to find information. I don't fuck my mother, that is gross!!!!!
And your mother fucks HER mother!!!!! :rofl: :rofl: ::both:: ::both:: ::bwahaha::
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How dare you suggest such a grotesque sexual act!! My grandmother is in the alzheimer's unit. Are you suggesting that my mom visits her and has sex with her on her visits? You are a disgusting pervert!!!! Milk is going to be here in a few seconds so get ready to be banned sucker!!!! ::armed:: ::armed:: ::armed:: ::armed:: ::armed::
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Yeah yeah yeah... you can all blow it out your asses... as soon as you get done fuckin' each other, that is. :rofl:
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I burned all my correspondence, letters, notes and journals years ago at the advice of a psychologist I was seeing at the time. I also wrote a letter to all the people who wronged me and then we burned it together in a symbolic gesture of moving on. But that obviously didn't work. Now I wish I had that paperwork to look through sometimes.
Your shrink is an idiot. Fire him. Fuck moving on. Do the kids in program have that option?
I think something that is pervasive is the attitude that perception is reality. Program parents are an extreme version of this. They desperately need to control the perception of what they are doing, both in public and their own minds.
It seems like a lot of people are doing that. I do it to all the time. Trying to build up an impressive exterior (good job, a house, car) to make the perception that I am doing fine and have my shit together, when the truth is much different than what people are seeing. So why are we all so obsessed with keeping up this perception in our society?
Because our society is (as it always has been) filled with greedy, materialistic little pricks who think happiness is a luxury car. Look at the uber-rich celebreties... are they happy?
The only perception of yourself that matters is your own (and possibly those of your partner/close friends if it affects them.)
When you stop caring about keeping up your own perception, other people get angry. They don't want to see what really is there and so they try and change it. But I get to a point where I feel like building a paper castle has no point. Looking out from the inside I know it's all an illusion, so who is it really for. Not me. Time to burn this paper castle down.
Bingo. Program taught you to be a generic model of the perfect citizen, a trained puppy for your parents to show off ("oh look how much you've changed, now that you have no trace of individuality left, i'm no longer ashamed to show you off to my friends.").
Be yourself, good luck finding that though, with what program did to your head. I would suggest a "backtrace" through your program journals/diary but your idiot shrink told you to burn them.
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Language like that will get you banned to. Anyone else wanna get banned tonight?
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Language like that will get you banned to. Anyone else wanna get banned tonight?
Your mother would like to get banned tonight. :lol:
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You are a pervert who has a sick interest in my mother. If we were in prison I would rape you to help you explore your interests. :evil: :evil: :evil:
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You are a pervert who has a sick interest in my mother. If we were in prison I would rape you to help you explore your interests. :evil: :evil: :evil:
Oh yeah I'm the sick one here.... :roll: :roll: ::both:: ::fuckoff:: ::bangin::
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Yes YOU are!!! ::unhappy:: ::unhappy:: ::unhappy::
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Yes YOU are!!! ::unhappy:: ::unhappy:: ::unhappy::
Keep telling yourself that. You belong in a rubber room!! :scared: :silly: :rofl:
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What happened to all your perverted talk about my mother? ::fuckoff::
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What happened to all your perverted talk about my mother? ::fuckoff::
What perverted talk? Your mother will be in to visit you next week.
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Yes YOU are!!! ::unhappy:: ::unhappy:: ::unhappy::
There's a party in your mouth and eveybody's coming!
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My mother is dead has been for a while. But I enjoy hearing your sick perverted fantasies so keep talking.
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Yes YOU are!!! ::unhappy:: ::unhappy:: ::unhappy::
There's a party in your mouth and eveybody's coming!
So funny I forgot to laugh.
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My mother is dead has been for a while. But I enjoy hearing your sick perverted fantasies so keep talking.
They have web access in your psych ward? ::bwahaha::
You enjoy hearing these things? I was just joking around, but whatever floats your boat... :rofl: :rofl:
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What happened to all your perverted talk about my mother? ::fuckoff::
What perverted talk? Your mother will be in to visit you next week.
This doesn't make any sense.
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My mother is dead has been for a while. But I enjoy hearing your sick perverted fantasies so keep talking.
They have web access in your psych ward? ::bwahaha::
You enjoy hearing these things? I was just joking around, but whatever floats your boat... :rofl: :rofl:
Yes they have web access in jail too. You have to stuff a cell phone up your ass and piggyback on another wireless.
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My mother is dead has been for a while. But I enjoy hearing your sick perverted fantasies so keep talking.
They have web access in your psych ward? ::bwahaha::
You enjoy hearing these things? I was just joking around, but whatever floats your boat... :rofl: :rofl:
Yes they have web access in jail too. You have to stuff a cell phone up your ass and piggyback on another wireless.
I could do without that kind of access, thanks! :rofl:
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Suit yourself, but don't complain you can't get fornits or something. They get mad.
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I was just joking around
Yeah and Im being completely fucking serious. :roll: :rofl: :cry2:
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My mother is dead has been for a while. But I enjoy hearing your sick perverted fantasies so keep talking.
They have web access in your psych ward? ::bwahaha::
You enjoy hearing these things? I was just joking around, but whatever floats your boat... :rofl: :rofl:
::bwahaha2:: :rofl: :nworthy:
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You certainly are easily entertained.
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I am shocked. SHOCKED at this utter distain for tatse and self censorship.
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What a twisted, fucked-up bunch of druggies.
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alls i'm saying is if it's one guy talkin to himself (which a mod can check), these pointless posts should be deleted. That isn't censorship. One guy flooding a thread drowns out what everybody else has to say.... one could argue that is an attempt at censorship via sabotage via flooding with information (a-la denial of service).
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alls i'm saying is if it's one guy talkin to himself (which a mod can check), these pointless posts should be deleted. That isn't censorship. One guy flooding a thread drowns out what everybody else has to say.... one could argue that is an attempt at censorship via sabotage via flooding with information (a-la denial of service).
How much are you willing to pay the moderator to do this?
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Fiddy beans
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Fiddy beans
psy? :rofl:
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Your mother
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Cut that out, there will be more posts to delete, and it could cost us MONEY now!!! :rofl:
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I am shocked. SHOCKED at this utter distain for tatse and self censorship.
If Bobby Brown were to go down today, would he end up in a WWASP?
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They definite needs to move forward ... but not before they have come to ending about the journey they have on.
One good method to get the most out of the system is to write about the torment and abuse. Some of it will forever stay in their system. That is a sad fact. Former freedom fighters have nightmares of german runned prisons and being on the run. So their experiences will stay inside them. But they can help them selves by telling someone who will listen their story. Put some word on the experience. Find fellow survivors and when the story is finished - publish it.
If some documents are available, remove any personal information from it - scan it - upload it.
Some day a responsible will seek information about a placement for their child. (There are responsible parents out there.) More stories means larger chance that new children could avoid being damaged.
Whenever a human being experience some shocking event, there are something called debriefing. Policemen do it, fireworkers do it, even soldiers do it (Since our army was in Croatia, they have started doing it.)
What those children in the programs have been put through is even more shocking as an old classmate of mine was put up to. In Croatia, he had been working hard all day long. So he went down to the river and took a bath (The camp was not finished.). He was all soaped up then some bodies (men, children) floated by. That meant a need for debriefing.
The problem is that they often can not debrief with their programmed parents. They need to find someone which have an understanding of the circumstances of these places. It takes some time where they will feel as they are alone in the world. Hopefully they will be able to find help. Then it is time to write their story.
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Going back to what Psy was saying about the idiot psychiatrist telling you to burn your journals.....(after I go through the stupid trolling)
In a sense I can see why he wanted you to put that to bed, that cleansing ritual can be really good for you, but obviously in your case it hasn't worked....my concern here is why do you wish you could read back on them? It's almost like you've been taught that you are to blame, you are bad (in raps perhaps?) and you still have the need to look back and clarify that - please correct me if I'm barking up the wrong tree here.
You don't need journals really, everything that's happened is there in your memory, the stuff you blocked out is meant to be blocked, I've got a few years missing from my life, it's purely self preservation to avoid you going mental
Write it down, create a blog, set up a support group for survivors who feel the same as you, whatever it takes, do it, there's no point in your brain shutting off stuff you really can do without if you're going to drive yourself mad with what you do remember, paint, write poetry, write songs, blog, talk about all of the things you need to, it's therapeutic, get angry, cry, sob, laugh, be hysterical, go with whatever that particular memory makes you feel, when you've been taught to keep your feelings in about how something makes you want to react you're left dead inside, it's tie to become yourself again and let go of the emmotions you want to feel at that particular time, only when you can achieve the ability, the freedom & the awareness that you have the right to feel these things, will you begin to feel happy again
Be aware though, no-one is happy all the time, it's not possible, striving for perfection is unrealistic.
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It's true that the mind will block things out but to leave things blocked out is not healthy. The mind blocks things out that can't be dealt with at the moment giving a person time to deal with it later on. This is common in sexual assault victims and a therapist may be needed to work through the experience in a healthy manner.
The letters and journals can be used as a mental snapshot, a little picture of your psyche at that time. It can be a great help when processing bad experiences. I understand the getting rid of bad experiences by burning old letters and such, I just don't agree with it. I feel that it's much to final for a problem that you learn to deal with, and not get rid of because it never goes away.
Being sexual assaulted and being placed in an abusive program has alot in common. Both represent a theft of power and control and its this lost power and control that the survivor needs to regain. Activism is one way as well as making your parents acknowledge what you went through and their hand in allowing you to suffer.
Look for information regarding treatment for sexual assualt victims and victims of cults to get more ideas on what you can do to heal. If you find a therapist that can deal with program survivors definitely check it out.
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In a sense I can see why he wanted you to put that to bed, that cleansing ritual can be really good for you, but obviously in your case it hasn't worked....my concern here is why do you wish you could read back on them? It's almost like you've been taught that you are to blame, you are bad (in raps perhaps?) and you still have the need to look back and clarify that - please correct me if I'm barking up the wrong tree here.
I tore up my journals, and I wish I hadn't, as they were more candid than the notebooks, since the journals weren't read by staff. Probably did a better job of giving an accurate representation of my true feelings for the place while I was there.
I wondered for a while why I kept my notebooks, and my answer was always "evidence." I brought up in another thread that sometimes some of us belittled our struggles there, or remembered them another way. The notebooks helped to put things in perspective. I just recently pulled them out, since some stuff came up. It was the first time since graduation. In a lot of ways, it assisted in validating my experience.
Even when some of us realize how traumatic our placement was, there is that small part in our brain that is "crazy making", i.e. we were making it up, remembered it wrong, deserved it, were stupid to buy into it. When your brain is fucked with like that, you question your reality and perception to some extent, even decades later.
Some people are able to destroy the evidence, shut it out, and move on. Some of us need to read and say "Oh, ok, I was right, it was crazy."
When someone goes through therapy to make sense of what happened, there often needs to be some understanding of how they were broken. When was the moment when they moved from being autonomous to programmed? It's not sufficient for everyone to simply say they were brainwashed, for some, there needs to be an understanding of how, from a personal perspective, as opposed to a clinical one. Who first confronted you? When did fear turn to euphoria? When did you start to want it? When did you start to crave affection from staff who abused you? When did you first start to abuse others?
I recently began going back through my "full-time" notebook. (See CEDU lingo (http://http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=19689&start=0) thread for definition.) What I read within those pages was the depiction of the remaining shreds of a teenager's resistance being broken over a period of 14 days. The writing assignments began with the breaking down and humiliation, and finished with the reprogramming. By the time I was released from my booth and isolation at the end, I was one of them, and I loved it. Room 101.
I needed to read this, because I was still not clear on how it had happened for me specifically. I know how it happens for everyone, but the guilt and shame are hard to exorcise until you come to an understanding of what was done to you, how it wasn't your fault, and how your eventual compliance did not entail consent.
I agree, that it is not helpful to overly obsess. Trust me, I know what it's like to be consumed by something. Obsession exists because the person obsessing gets something out of it. I've found that it's helpful a lot of times to talk in therapy about the obsession itself, rather than what specifically I am obsessing about, in order to work out what I am getting out of it, i.e. what need I am trying to fulfill through the obsession, and to try to resolve that issue.
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Don't underestimate the power of forgiveness. For me, that has been very instrumental in "moving forward" past a grievous hurt.
Forgiveness does not mean that I condone what has happened to me. It does not excuse or erase the hurt. It does not exonerate the person (or institution) that has caused the hurt. It does not mean that I "forget". Certainly does NOT mean that I enter into a relationship with the person who caused harm.
It does mean that I have chosen to let it go. Lay it down. Bury it ... use whatever word picture works for you. It means that it does not eat me alive anymore. Or that I dwell on it constantly.
By hanging on to past hurts ... by nursing my "un-forgiveness", I allow that person to continue to have a hold over my life. And in essence to continue to hurt me. Screw that.
Life is going to kick us all in the teeth. Just a part of the human experience I'm afraid. We have to decide if we are going to pick up the pieces and move forward ... or dwell in past hurts forever... and in the process let that person rob us of the joy that is available today.
IMHO.
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By hanging on to past hurts ... by nursing my "un-forgiveness", I allow that person to continue to have a hold over my life. And in essence to continue to hurt me. Screw that.
IMHO.
Yep - I am with you on that 100%, after an experience I had which was nothing less than mental and physical torture i became very untrusting of everyone, always felt they were going to do the same to me - a few years later I began to think "okay, that person gave me 6 years of hell, so how long am I going to let them continue to ruin my life" it was a turning point, that's when the fight came back
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bump
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how do you know if you are assigning to much importance to certain times and incidents in your life.
Good question. I don't know. Like I stated before, I'm obsessive. CEDU is cyclic with me. It goes away for a while, and then it comes back for a while. When it comes back, I have to think about it, and I think about it a lot. Then I get tired and it goes away again.
How does your mind go about picking the things that you remember, because out of all the shit that goes on day to day, we only remember a very small portion it seems like.
Fuck, I can barely remember what I did yesterday. I don't have much of a choice in that. I also have schizoid tendencies, so I will forget people and faces who may have played an important role in my life at one point. I don't think you can choose what to remember, but when a memory is repressed, it's still there, not forgotten. Just latent. I don't really know the process that happens behind that, though.
If two people can have the same experience and one consider it good and one consider it bad, does that make one of them deficient in some way?
I don't know. But it does make for some interesting arguments. I'm not sure deficient would be the operative term, here, if there was indeed an imbalance in functionality or intelligence. The diplomatic side of me says that it's important not to invalidate someone else's experience, even if you think their perception is completely fucked up. Let me put it this way, if someone viewed it as a good experience, fine. But if they then decide to form their own school, work as a youth counselor, send their own kid to a TBS, or pimp TBSes to other parents, then I get a little more brutal in my opinion of them. It's fine if you want to view your experience positively, it's another thing entirely if you want to subject someone else to it.
I am just wondering if it even exists
No. It's a bunch of crap. It's used to convince people to consume and spend in search of it.
Hi. Hello. Bump