Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Ridge Creek School / Hidden Lake Academy => Topic started by: Anonymous on January 04, 2007, 12:48:58 PM
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I have avoided this site as so many of the posts are mean-spirited and sensational, preying upon parents' fears. I suggest that anyone who is interested in the truth and balanced views visit strugglingteens.com.
My son has been at HLA since February 2006. We have been touched by the caring and nurturing he has received and pleased by the overall program. No program for troubled teens will be without problems, as it is the nature of such work. Still, the few problems we have encountered have been well-addressed and did not cause a moment of concern for the health and safety of our son.
Our son, as well as most of the students at HLA, is receiving excellent counseling and a good education. I would not hesitate to recommend it to any parent whose child fits the requirements. If you are a parent of a troubled teen, do not read from this site or any other like it. Talk to other parents, seek out an educational consultant.
This school has lost admissions because of a lawsuit filed in 2006. The parents involved let their child graduate before filing suit. That alone should make one question the veracity and motives behind the suit. It will do nothing but hurt the many students who hope to graduate from HLA and those who desperately need what HLA has to offer. This is a travesty.
I am a lawyer, my husband is a lawyer, and I am also a nurse. We would be quick to intervene if we saw anything that would cause us to question the effectiveness of this program or the safety of our son. There is nothing that has caused us concern as much as the thought that this school will be damaged by selfish, mean-spirited people who have nothing to lose by their lies. Our son, after his initial attempts to cause us to bring him home, has reported nothing that comes close to abuse or even apathy. He likes his counselors. He likes most of his teachers. He is doing better academically than we hoped.
Contact HLA for a list of parents who will speak to you truthfully about this school. Vicki Allen
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WARNING! TARGET == NEARLY_BEYOND_PARODY;
I have avoided this site as so many of the posts are factually accurate, countering HLA propaganda designed to prey upon parents' fears. I suggest that anyone who is interested in nothing but complete bullshit and laughably ill-constructed lies visit strugglingteens.com.
My son has been at HLA since February 2006. He has been touched by the violation and anal rape he has received, pleasing Len Buccellato quite a bit. No program for troubled teens will be without problems, as the futility of the approach is inherent in its nature. The few problems we have acknowledged have been ignored, but since we really don't give a wan fuck about the health and safety of our son, we left him there anyway.
Our son, as well as most of the students at HLA, is receiving it up the poop chute. I would not hesitate to recommend it to any parent whose child fits the requirements, as I'm getting paid for referrals. If you are a parent of a troubled teen, do not read from this site, close your ears and go la la la, the truth means nothing to you! Talk to other parents (but not the ones filing suit against this shithole!), seek out an educational consultant even though they're making money from your kid getting hurt.
This school has lost admissions because of a lawsuit filed in 2006, and OMG that was LAST YEAR now! The parents involved let their child graduate before getting the party started. That alone should make one realize the horror they must have felt when their kid came home full of hate and rage. (Sur-priiise!) It will do nothing but help the many students who hope to escape from HLA, as no one needs what HLA has to offer. This is a travesty, because I'm not being validated anymore! Waaaaahhhh...
I am a liar, my husband is a liar, and I am also a child abuser. We wouldn't intervene if we saw our kid being raped with a jackhammer. There is nothing that has caused us concern as much as the thought that this school will be damaged by Organized Malcontents who have nothing to lose by telling the truth. Our son, after his initial attempts to cause us to bring him home, has ceased talking to us. But since he's not on this forum and never will be, we can lie all we like and say that he's doing great, even though he's probably going to cut our throats out backwards Al-Qaeda style.
Contact HLA for a list of parents who will tell you the comforting lies you want to hear. Vicki Allen
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Wow. Just WOW. Lady, your head is stuffed so far up your ass that you can't even see daylight.
Almost everything you said in your post is an utter prevarication. I guess, coming from a lawyer, it's your nature to lie.
For any parents reading, just read the threads and skip the flame wars. This lady obviously doesn't have access to any inside information at HLA, or she would realize that nearly every single accusation regarding HLA has been vetted and verified by current and former staff.
Not that this matters much anyway. HLA will be gone as we know it very, very soon.
Lawyer Lady, rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic wouldn't have stopped it from sinking, now would it? Your spin is pathetc.
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BTW, Lawyer Lady, you lied about the parents who filed suit as well. They PULLED their kids and were denied a refund of prepaid tuition, as were many others.
I'd love to see HLA lawyer up with dolt like you. It'd be as sure a shot to win as anyone could hope for.
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sounds like she's looking to hook up with quack and quack cause she sure sounds like one.
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I am glad to hear that you are having a positive experience at HLA. Many families have been helped by what HLA has to offer. One statement that you wrote stands out, however:
"I would not hesitate to recommend it to any parent whose child fits the requirements."
Part of what the law suit suggests is that HLA has accepted children who do not fit the requirements, but are rather much worse off than HLA is equipped to manage. HLA has the potential to be a great place. Unfortunately, when Len Buccellato chooses to allow inappropriate children into the school, it can also be a very dangerous place. I don't doubt that you are having a good experience, but please don't dismiss what the people on this site are saying just because some of them make outrageous statements at times.
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Lady if your son has truly benefitted from his time at HLA, then I would simply say I am happy for both him and you. That being said however understand you haven't a clue as to what the experience was like for the rest of us.Therefore you are entirely unqualified to state that we are somehow lying about our testimony regarding the facts concerning hla. Whatsmore you have no right to do so. It's obvious you never actually read the lawsuit, nor are you interested in learning any facts concerning the case. If you were you would have bothered to ask questions rather than simply making stupid accusations and baseless concluscions.
On top of all that I have serious doubts about you even being a parent of a current hla student. If in the event you are you're an awful parent. No caring parent would simply dismiss the very real issues concerning hla and not bother to ask the questions that matter.
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Lady, TJ is miserable! You gotta pull him. He did nothing wrong...
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OMG. TJ asked me to cheek my meds all the time. He would brag about snorting meds with his friends in Dorm B. He was constantly talking about cravings for pot and X. And he was probably the one of the most well known klepto's in Dorm B. Go look at his closet right now.
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correction...one graduated and one was pulled...
that is the truth...from someone who knows!
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So Ms. Vicki is a nurse AND a lawyer. Hmm... HLA needs both of those right now... :rofl:
But, then looks like she's not practicing.
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VICKI LYNN ALLEN
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To VLA and other parents who have posted here, I, too have a child at HLA. Lance Henson is my child's counselor in PG79. The only reason I am not posting my real name, address, and telephone number is not because I want to hide my identity but to protect the identity of my child. My email address in my profile will tell you who I am. I didn't go to MSN or Yahoo to make one up for you, so I ask that you respect my child's privacy.
I have refrained from posting previously because I have seen how those who support HLA are treated on this board. I read the board because it contains information that concerns me, and every legitimate concern raised I have brought to the attention of HLA and have received an acceptable response. Some of the issues raised do not bother me.
My child has done well in the HLA program. According to her, the kids there are aware of the lawsuit and do visit this website, and one in her peer group posted in support of his/her treatment there and was castigated for it and accused of being one of Len's sweeties.
Some of you say that you hope the lawsuit is successful in bringing down HLA because you want to stop it from hurting kids (your assertion, not mine). Others of you want it brought down as a form of vengeance for your having been sent there.
A lot of you say we're horrible, miserable parents for (a) having children with problems in the first place and (b) putting our children in HLA. I read a post in another thread where a mother whose son has severe drug problems was advised to just bring him home, stay out of his business, love him unconditionally and without expectation, and he'll come around. I suspect that mother, just like others of us, has already tried that.
I don't know if any of you are old enough to have teenaged children yet, but if you are, or if you know somebody who is, the phenomenon of one troubled kid in the midst of siblings who don't have drug, self injury, or sexually acting out problems doesn't seem to be explained by either good or bad parenting. Most of you will have teenaged children someday, and I wish you the very best.
In any event, I don't know if anybody can comprehend the love for a child until one becomes a parent. You cannot comprehend not only the fear for his or her safety but also the despair that comes from knowing your child suffers from such intense pain and nothing you have been able to do has made it better. Parents worry because we know our child has a safety net within the family but know they're approaching the age when they'll face a world that doesn't know them from Adam, doesn't care, will not tolerate their behavior, and will kick them to the curb when they fall.
We who love our children would crawl (and some have) over broken glass for them. We would give our last dime and our very lives for them. I don't care than Len makes a profit, we all expect, or at least hope, to make money in exchange for our services. I have no problem, and take no ethical issue, with paying bonuses and commissions to counselors and edcons.
Those with the financial wherewithal send their children to places like HLA. It's the last gift we can give them, but it's their choice what they do with it. I concede that not every program can be everything to all children, but in the case of my child, HLA has been a Godsend.
Lance Henson has demonstrated his dedication to my child and to this program, and has assured me he will continue to do so at considerable personal sacrifice, considering the paycuts and additional duties. I really don't care what he and his wife look like (frankly, I think they look fine) and don't see what their appearance has to do with their competence. There has been no problem that I've heard of associated with his being married to his co-counselor.
My child is looking forward to graduating the program and high school in May. Her only worry right now is that this website's prognostications that HLA will close in February might be true. She wants to finish what she started and graduate from high school with her friends, because that's what the kids at HLA have become to her - just like any other kid in high school. Her Dad and I reassure her that HLA will not close (at least not in February) but that, regardless, she will finish her high school education and proceed to college, to which she is very much looking forward.
I doubt this will stop the diatribe to follow, but so we can cut through some of the intial speculation:
1) I am not Len, Lance, or Melanie
2) My IP address is not in Dahlonega
3) I don't plan to commit suicide, regardless of how compelling the ensuing suggestion might be
4) I don't care if you call me a troll (or anything else)
5) If I never post here again, don't break out the champagne - you haven't run me off
I appreciate the comments of those on this site, and there are few, who have responded respectfully to the posts of others.
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----- Original Message -----
From: XXXXXXXXXX
To: http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p= ... son#211056 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p=211056&highlight=erickson#211056)
-----Original Message-----
From: XXXXXXXXXXX
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2006 1:58 PM
To: 'PG79Counselors (Lance & Laura)'; 'CErickson@hiddenlakeacademy.com (http://mailto:'CErickson@hiddenlakeacademy.com)'; 'LBuccellato@hiddenlakeacademy.com'
Cc: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Subject: HLA pg83 student who threatened to slit her roommates's throat
All, on Friday, April 14, after my call from Lance Hinson, XXXX?s peer group counselor, I enjoyed my weekly phone call from my daughter, XXXX. I heard fear and anxiety in her voice, so I immediately asked her if something were wrong.
XXXX, who has voiced no complaint about HLA (other than being there, food, toilets stopped up, etc.) and has never asked or bargained for another chance at home, told me that a girl from pg83 was moved into her room. Problem: the girl had threatened to slit the throat of her prior roommate. XXXX told me she is afraid of this girl and actually slept the prior night on the floor of her suitemates so as not to have to share a room with this girl.
I told XXXX I would call the school and her Dad immediately and let them know of her fear. I was pleased that my call to the answering service was returned immediately by Clay Erickson who acknowledged that the girl had made such a threat because the roommate threatened had ?narc?ed? on this girl. Dr. Erickson explained that the consensus was that this girl would not follow through on such a threat. Dr. Erickson said he would discuss it immediately with staff and get back with me.
He called me back shortly thereafter to inform me that XXXX was being moved to another room, a private one on the first floor, and that XXXX is not happy about it.
While I was pleased that action was taken quickly, I disagree with the action taken. When any of us thinks about the worst possible thing that could happen to us, I think most of us would agree that being murdered would top the list. As parents, the worst possible thing to happen would be to have one of our children murdered. Having our children living in terror would be pretty high on the list.
Expressing a threat to kill is a serious matter demanding serious consequences; and, in my opinion, should not be dismissed. The children at HLA, so far as I?m aware, pose a one to one threat only to themselves individually, but not to the others.
What I disagree with:
1) The girl issuing the threat being allowed to remain at HLA. It appears her only consequence was being moved to another room; yet all children at HLA know of this serious threat, and they see that the consequence was minor. Should the girls at HLA all have to live in fear of this girl, especially now that they know she can threaten at will, especially if anybody narcs on her again?
2) XXXX being moved from her room. XXXX has been taught by this resolution that it?s not good to express her feelings, and the lesson was driven home by removing her from an environment where she was comfortable and happy. She had a community and friends where she lived at HLA, and because she spoke up, out of fear, she has been deprived of that. This lesson cannot be lost on this other girl, either, for now all the other girls know that, regardless of any fear they might have of her, they?d better not speak up for fear of being exiled from their home base.
It has only been just before XXXX?s spring break that XXXX was actually starting to take the risk to open up. She has serious trust issues. Teaching her that speaking up will get her punished, combined with exercises such as the one last week designed to get students to narc on each other, sends an irreconcilably confusing message.
I respectfully ask that XXXX be moved back into her room, WITHOUT the girl who issued the threat. I also ask that the girl who issued the threat be removed from HLA for the safety of ALL of the children there. Not only is her presence a threat to the others, but it exposes HLA to serious liability issues should this girl follow through on her threat.
I look forward to your response.
XXXXXXXXXX
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dommerdog
Don't you mean dUmmerdog? :rofl:
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I read a post in another thread where a mother whose son has severe drug problems was advised to just bring him home, stay out of his business, love him unconditionally and without expectation, and he'll come around.
Where was that? I'd like to see what was actually written. You're interpretation of things doesn't appear to be grounded in reality.
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NEARLY_BEYOND_PARODY;
You ain't kidding.
:o :o :o
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No program for troubled teens will be without problems, as it is the nature of such work.
What problems would you say are common with TBSs?
I would not hesitate to recommend it to any parent whose child fits the requirements.
What are the requirements, as you understand them?
This school has lost admissions because of a lawsuit filed in 2006.
What is the #1 Rule at any TBS? Take Responsibility. Be Accountable.
The lawsuit is not responsible for HLAs current situation.
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Shall I?
I shall.
Milk closes his eyes and says something unintelligible. When he opens them again he is flanked by two figures. One of them, Xavier, is a teenager- the other, the Operator, is more than three times his age, but not looking it in the least.
Milk: You two ready for this crap?
Xavier: The preparations are looking to be worse than the event.
Operator: Yes. I haven't seen something this fundamentally awful in this sphere of human relationships since [deleted], and I don't think these people can outdo that.
Milk: Very well. Let the fun begin.
To VLA and other parents who have posted here
Operator: I'll assume this is a woman. How can she direct her message 'to' anyone on a public forum?
I, too have a child at HLA.
Milk: That was your first mistake.
Lance Henson is my child's counselor in PG79.
Xavier: This Lance Henson? (http://http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=18835&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=lance+henson&start=0) That was another blunder, but I don't know whose it was.
Milk: The facility's, and hers for not recognizing it.
Xavier: Ah. The facilities do have power of direct decision.
Operator: They could hardly conduct business otherwise. Would you expect them to be answerable to parents in this regard, considering who they are?
Xavier: Point taken.
The only reason I am not posting my real name, address, and telephone number is not because I want to hide my identity but to protect the identity of my child. My email address in my profile will tell you who I am.
Xavier: This doesn't make any fucking sense at all. She's attempting to protect her identity, but then gives it away?
Milk: Not in public. And Fornits isn't about to tell everyone what it is.
Xavier: So let me get this straight. She's hiding herself, but only to everyone except the people who probably hate her the most?
Milk: That about sums it up. And since she could have made any email name she likes on the Internet, it proves nothing anyway.
Xavier: Retarded bitch.
I didn't go to MSN or Yahoo to make one up for you, so I ask that you respect my child's privacy.
Operator: If you're going to use your children as a verbal shield to protect yourself, why would we concern ourselves with your identity? Such behavior marks you as clearly not the sort of person whose opinions are worth considering, aside from educational mockery like this.
I have refrained from posting previously because I have seen how those who support HLA are treated on this board.
Milk: What were you expecting, hugs and kisses?
I read the board because it contains information that concerns me
Xavier: One would hope!
and every legitimate concern raised I have brought to the attention of HLA and have received an acceptable response.
Xavier: Let me see if I have this straight as well. You've received information from this website about serious concerns about your children, as well as additional, corroborated information that the facility's management is untrustworthy. But when you act on this information and inquire as to the veracity of such things, you simply accept what they tell you and fail to investigate with other sources?! What the fuck is wrong with you?!
Milk: Answer that one thoroughly and you'll have my gratitude, that's for sure.
Operator: Such is only valuable due to its scarcity.
Milk: Can it.
Some of the issues raised do not bother me.
Operator: Now I'm quite curious as to what the issues that don't bother you are, madam. Could you be more specific?
My child has done well in the HLA program.
Xavier: Where does that information come from?
According to her, the kids there are aware of the lawsuit and do visit this website
Xavier: That can't be right.
Operator: All of them, or just a select few?
Xavier: Aaaaah.
and one in her peer group posted in support of his/her treatment there and was castigated for it and accused of being one of Len's sweeties.
Milk: What were you expecting? You don't visit a sushi bar for the steak, you don't go to a mechanic shop to get your cat looked at, and you don't go to downtown Los Angeles trying to drill for oil. Why would anyone in favor of this sort of thing come here looking for support?
Some of you say that you hope the lawsuit is successful in bringing down HLA because you want to stop it from hurting kids (your assertion, not mine).
Operator: Well of course it's not your assertion, you're here to defend the place. Quite poorly, I must add.
Others of you want it brought down as a form of vengeance for your having been sent there.
Xavier: Okay, let me get this straight...
Milk: That's the third time you've said that.
Xavier: Well it's not making much more sense this time either. How can any sort of therapeutic facility be considered successful in any way shape or form if the people who have been released from there want to destroy it?!
Operator: Generational disconnect is probably the best way of putting it.
Xavier: If my charges wanted vengeance against me, I'd have my head disconnected.
A lot of you say we're horrible, miserable parents for (a) having children with problems in the first place
Xavier: In your situation, there really isn't anyone else to blame, is there?
and (b) putting our children in HLA.
Operator: Considering what goes on there, I'd have to say that 'horrible' and 'miserable' are adequate descriptors.
I read a post in another thread where a mother whose son has severe drug problems was advised to just bring him home, stay out of his business, love him unconditionally and without expectation, and he'll come around.
Xavier: Well, if the choice is between "no treatment" and "bad treatment", I'd have to recommend the former as well.
Milk: Actually staying out of his business is a sort of therapy that is working decently well for another parent on this site. What's more, it's free.
Xavier: How much is sixty thousand dollars a year, anyway?
Operator: Enough to hire a full-time live-in bodyguard who will make sure the kid doesn't get within a hundred feet of a joint.
Milk: No giving them ideas, Operator. They'll corrupt it like they do everything else.
I suspect that mother, just like others of us, has already tried that.
Xavier: Isn't that chronologically impossible?
Milk: Considering the 'eventually come around' usually comes after the kid's 18th birthday, yes.
I don't know if any of you are old enough to have teenaged children yet, but if you are, or if you know somebody who is,
Xavier: I know somebody who's old enough. I think everybody here does.
Milk: Don't bother with her grammar. Focus instead on the fact that she's repeating the tired old fallacy "you haven't been in my shoes!" I don't think I ever could be. If my kids ended up so hopeless that they had to inject toxins into themselves, I'd probably have eaten a bullet long since.
the phenomenon of one troubled kid in the midst of siblings who don't have drug, self injury, or sexually acting out problems doesn't seem to be explained by either good or bad parenting.
Operator: Actually, it can be more than adequately explained through the ideas of jealousy, sibling rivalry, and complementary sibling traits, along with favoritism and its resulting estrangement, treating children differently in early childhood, significant lifestyle changes at key parts of the child's development, failure to accept the child's chromosomes, organic chemical imbalances, genetic differences, and other concepts far, far above your head.
Milk: How could you explain something like that with good parenting?
Xavier: Now you're the one mincing her words. I'm just curious how 'sexually acting out' is supposed to be a problem...
Most of you will have teenaged children someday, and I wish you the very best.
Operator: My, I can almost taste her spite. Goes with the irony quite well.
In any event, I don't know if anybody can comprehend the love for a child until one becomes a parent.
Milk: Or, in your case, the thinly-disguised contempt.
You cannot comprehend not only the fear for his or her safety but also the despair that comes from knowing your child suffers from such intense pain and nothing you have been able to do has made it better.
Xavier: Haven't you already tried this fallacy?
Milk: And isn't it a whole lot more fun making the decision to make your children's lives worse, instead? See? That, you can do. Play to your strengths.
Parents worry because we know our child has a safety net within the family but know they're approaching the age when they'll face a world that doesn't know them from Adam, doesn't care
Xavier: Considering the people here have done significant research about the facility you've sent your child to and you have not, I surmise that your safety net is made of barbed wire and the rest of the world cares far more than you do.
will not tolerate their behavior, and will kick them to the curb when they fall.
Operator: So the goal here is to give them a precursor to that, or rather something much worse, so when they do end up hopeless addicts, it won't seem so bad?
We who love our children would crawl (and some have) over broken glass for them.
Milk: Video please.
We would give our last dime and our very lives for them.
Milk: You honestly want to help children? Donate your last dime to Fornits and jump off a building.
I don't care than Len makes a profit, we all expect, or at least hope, to make money in exchange for our services. I have no problem, and take no ethical issue, with paying bonuses and commissions to counselors and edcons.
Xavier: This will be the fourth time: So let me get this straight. This woman has absolutely no problem with the profit motive interfering directly with a professional judgment of her child's placement, to the point where the person making this decision will not get anything unless the child is placed in a facility like HLA?
Milk: Indeed, but it's not a professional judgment, as these people have no real credentials.
Xavier: You're kidding.
Milk: I'm not.
Xavier: Fuck this.
Those with the financial wherewithal send their children to places like HLA.
Operator: And a serious dearth of common sense.
Milk: All money, no brains.
It's the last gift we can give them
Operator: Considering many of you spent their entire college funds on it, I'd have to agree.
but it's their choice what they do with it.
Xavier: She's going to send her kid to a place like this and then tell her it's her choice?!
Milk: Yup. This is the usual.
Xavier: Fuck. This.
I concede that not every program can be everything to all children
Operator: Considering that your child is there 24/7 and they claim to be able to treat every child in there, no matter what their actual problem is, doesn't it kind of have to be?
but in the case of my child, HLA has been a Godsend.
Milk: The god of this world, maybe.
Operator: I assure you that-
Milk: No, not them, I mean Beelzebub. Lucifer. Old Scratch.
Operator: This whole business does have that sort of feeling, doesn't it?
Lance Henson has demonstrated his dedication to my child and to this program, and has assured me he will continue to do so at considerable personal sacrifice, considering the paycuts and additional duties.
Xavier: He's also demonstrated a lot of other things, most of which can be discovered by searching for his name on this board.
Milk: Child abuse uber alles.
I really don't care what he and his wife look like (frankly, I think they look fine)
Milk: "You look fine" is damnation with faint praise in most circles. And it's what they look like on the inside that matters.
Xavier: Why am I envisioning horribly malformed genetic mistakes?
Operator: Because we're conversing with one.
and don't see what their appearance has to do with their competence.
Milk: They don't succeed very well in either.
There has been no problem that I've heard of associated with his being married to his co-counselor.
Xavier: Under normal circumstances it would be an excellent arrangement. Here it's simply doubling the pain.
My child is looking forward to graduating the program and high school in May.
Xavier: Looking forward to 'graduating', or looking forward to leaving?
Her only worry right now is that this website's prognostications that HLA will close in February might be true.
Milk: I doubt that. Isn't it great to put words in your kid's mouth when they're not around to contradict you?
She wants to finish what she started and graduate from high school with her friends, because that's what the kids at HLA have become to her - just like any other kid in high school.
Operator: Human beings can get used to all kinds of things. With enough exposure, people can be led to believe that the way HLA conducts operations is normal and acceptable.
Her Dad and I reassure her that HLA will not close (at least not in February)
Operator: Considering you have absolutely no factual basis on which to make these assurances, I'm curious why you bother. If this place is closed, particularly if it's done by the government authorities investigating it, won't that simply prove you a liar?
but that, regardless, she will finish her high school education and proceed to college, to which she is very much looking forward.
Milk: You just keep right on telling yourself that.
Operator: Interesting way of verbal patching. No matter whether the facility is closed or not, you paint yourself as a wonderful parent either way. Unfortunately, you are not.
Xavier: Of course, if her daughter ends up addicted to meth or something, she'll be singing a different tune...
I doubt this will stop the diatribe to follow,
Milk: This is Fornits. Dragging retards off their high horses is one of the many things that goes on here.
but so we can cut through some of the intial speculation:
Milk: I'll let your kid do the cutting through.
Operator: Why do you insist on making such unlikely hypotheses?
Milk: I reserve the right of wishful thinking.
1) I am not Len, Lance, or Melanie
Xavier: Can she be trusted on this account?
Milk: No.
Xavier: Then why does she bother saying it?
2) My IP address is not in Dahlonega
Xavier: Can't she easily use a proxy to hide it?
Milk: Of course.
Xavier: Then why does she bother saying it?
3) I don't plan to commit suicide, regardless of how compelling the ensuing suggestion might be
Xavier: That's a shame.
4) I don't care if you call me a troll (or anything else)
Milk: Would you really have written that if you, in fact, don't care?
5) If I never post here again, don't break out the champagne - you haven't run me off
Operator: If this forum is inhospitable enough to make you leave permanently, then, by definition, haven't you been run off?
Milk: She's saying that she'll still read it.
Xavier: I don't think I've ever seen a threat that worthless.
I appreciate the comments of those on this site, and there are few, who have responded respectfully to the posts of others.
Operator: I wonder why you think you're worthy of respect.
Xavier: Are we done here? Trying to follow this woman's excuse for logic is like trying to touch your right elbow with your right hand.
Milk: She's not using logic. She's just blindly following anything HLA tells her because she isn't smart enough to figure out anything else to do.
Operator: And her daughter is suffering for it. Old music, different notes. Let's get out of here.
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I read the board because it contains information that concerns me, and every legitimate concern raised I have brought to the attention of HLA and have received an acceptable response.
Which ones? What was the acceptable response?
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I have avoided this site as so many of the posts are mean-spirited and sensational, preying upon parents' fears. I suggest that anyone who is interested in the truth and balanced views visit strugglingteens.com.
My son has been at HLA since February 2006. We have been touched by the caring and nurturing he has received and pleased by the overall program. No program for troubled teens will be without problems, as it is the nature of such work. Still, the few problems we have encountered have been well-addressed and did not cause a moment of concern for the health and safety of our son.
Our son, as well as most of the students at HLA, is receiving excellent counseling and a good education. I would not hesitate to recommend it to any parent whose child fits the requirements. If you are a parent of a troubled teen, do not read from this site or any other like it. Talk to other parents, seek out an educational consultant.
This school has lost admissions because of a lawsuit filed in 2006. The parents involved let their child graduate before filing suit. That alone should make one question the veracity and motives behind the suit. It will do nothing but hurt the many students who hope to graduate from HLA and those who desperately need what HLA has to offer. This is a travesty.
I am a lawyer, my husband is a lawyer, and I am also a nurse. We would be quick to intervene if we saw anything that would cause us to question the effectiveness of this program or the safety of our son. There is nothing that has caused us concern as much as the thought that this school will be damaged by selfish, mean-spirited people who have nothing to lose by their lies. Our son, after his initial attempts to cause us to bring him home, has reported nothing that comes close to abuse or even apathy. He likes his counselors. He likes most of his teachers. He is doing better academically than we hoped.
Contact HLA for a list of parents who will speak to you truthfully about this school. Vicki Allen
Vicky, I'd like to hear your thoughts on this....
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=20210 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=20210)
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Or this:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p= ... ole#187588 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p=187588&highlight=nicole#187588)
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To VLA and other parents who have posted here, I, too have a child at HLA. Lance Henson is my child's counselor in PG79. The only reason I am not posting my real name, address, and telephone number is not because I want to hide my identity but to protect the identity of my child. My email address in my profile will tell you who I am. I didn't go to MSN or Yahoo to make one up for you, so I ask that you respect my child's privacy.
I have refrained from posting previously because I have seen how those who support HLA are treated on this board. I read the board because it contains information that concerns me, and every legitimate concern raised I have brought to the attention of HLA and have received an acceptable response. Some of the issues raised do not bother me.
My child has done well in the HLA program. According to her, the kids there are aware of the lawsuit and do visit this website, and one in her peer group posted in support of his/her treatment there and was castigated for it and accused of being one of Len's sweeties.
Some of you say that you hope the lawsuit is successful in bringing down HLA because you want to stop it from hurting kids (your assertion, not mine). Others of you want it brought down as a form of vengeance for your having been sent there.
A lot of you say we're horrible, miserable parents for (a) having children with problems in the first place and (b) putting our children in HLA. I read a post in another thread where a mother whose son has severe drug problems was advised to just bring him home, stay out of his business, love him unconditionally and without expectation, and he'll come around. I suspect that mother, just like others of us, has already tried that.
I don't know if any of you are old enough to have teenaged children yet, but if you are, or if you know somebody who is, the phenomenon of one troubled kid in the midst of siblings who don't have drug, self injury, or sexually acting out problems doesn't seem to be explained by either good or bad parenting. Most of you will have teenaged children someday, and I wish you the very best.
In any event, I don't know if anybody can comprehend the love for a child until one becomes a parent. You cannot comprehend not only the fear for his or her safety but also the despair that comes from knowing your child suffers from such intense pain and nothing you have been able to do has made it better. Parents worry because we know our child has a safety net within the family but know they're approaching the age when they'll face a world that doesn't know them from Adam, doesn't care, will not tolerate their behavior, and will kick them to the curb when they fall.
We who love our children would crawl (and some have) over broken glass for them. We would give our last dime and our very lives for them. I don't care than Len makes a profit, we all expect, or at least hope, to make money in exchange for our services. I have no problem, and take no ethical issue, with paying bonuses and commissions to counselors and edcons.
Those with the financial wherewithal send their children to places like HLA. It's the last gift we can give them, but it's their choice what they do with it. I concede that not every program can be everything to all children, but in the case of my child, HLA has been a Godsend.
Lance Henson has demonstrated his dedication to my child and to this program, and has assured me he will continue to do so at considerable personal sacrifice, considering the paycuts and additional duties. I really don't care what he and his wife look like (frankly, I think they look fine) and don't see what their appearance has to do with their competence. There has been no problem that I've heard of associated with his being married to his co-counselor.
My child is looking forward to graduating the program and high school in May. Her only worry right now is that this website's prognostications that HLA will close in February might be true. She wants to finish what she started and graduate from high school with her friends, because that's what the kids at HLA have become to her - just like any other kid in high school. Her Dad and I reassure her that HLA will not close (at least not in February) but that, regardless, she will finish her high school education and proceed to college, to which she is very much looking forward.
I doubt this will stop the diatribe to follow, but so we can cut through some of the intial speculation:
1) I am not Len, Lance, or Melanie
2) My IP address is not in Dahlonega
3) I don't plan to commit suicide, regardless of how compelling the ensuing suggestion might be
4) I don't care if you call me a troll (or anything else)
5) If I never post here again, don't break out the champagne - you haven't run me off
I appreciate the comments of those on this site, and there are few, who have responded respectfully to the posts of others.
bitch, you don't know shit. i hope you're enjoying your vacation from the responsibilities of your shitty goddamned parenting. lance henson is an ignorant, white trash piece of scum. that whole "godsend" thing is just the illusion they've implanted into your head, you weak minded yupie whore. i hope you keep posting, we need someone to laugh at
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bitch, you don't know shit. i hope you're enjoying your vacation from the responsibilities of your shitty goddamned parenting. lance henson is an ignorant, white trash piece of scum. that whole "godsend" thing is just the illusion they've implanted into your head, you weak minded yuppie whore
Right on! Fuck these idiot parents with their fat heads stuffed up their asses! It's about fucking time people stopped trying to "play nice" with them. :evil:
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i'm sick and tired of all these parents promoting hla as some god-like entity. yes, i know that people can post whatever they want, but the ignorance can only be tolerated so much. but i should be more tolerant, i would want the safety of that illusion if i was paying that much money!! ignorace is bliss.
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i'm sick and tired of all these parents promoting hla as some god-like entity. yes, i know that people can post whatever they want, but the ignorance can only be tolerated so much. but i should be more tolerant, i would want the safety of that illusion if i was paying that much money!! ignorace is bliss.
Yeah, let them pull the wool over their own eyes if they want; just not here! :evil:
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If those of you who responded to my email want to be taken seriously, you might consider sharing what you know. Were you students there? Weeding through the written abuse and personal attacks leaves me without any more information than I had at the beginning.
I can't discern your point, except that you hate HLA. Are there other programs you recommend? That might be helpful.
Regarding kids who meet the criteria, I agree. There have been kids at HLA that should not have been there. When that happens, it is a problem.
ps: I certainly wasn't touting my status as a lawyer as giving me special qualifications, only to indicate that we aren't ignorant of the ways of the world. I inactivated my license when I quit work to be a full-time mom years ago. It would seem that you see something suspicious about that.
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Are there other programs you recommend? That might be helpful.
Yes as a matter of fact, there is:
http://fornits.com/SIBS (http://fornits.com/SIBS)
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Whether you take us seriously or not is irrelevant, as your concerns are absolutely meaningless. Frankly, the only reason we're mocking you is because it's honestly all you're good for, as you've already thrown your wholeheated support behind paying six thousand bucks a month to have your son abused.
I quit work to be a full-time mom
...do you not see the irony in this?
And as for other programs, SIBS is the only choice.
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quit work to be a full-time mom
...do you not see the irony in this?
Yeah, I sure do!
The question you should be focusing on, Vicki, is "What am I going to do when I get the call from HLA saying 'due to unfortunate, unavoidable circumstances we have closed our doors' and to pick up my kid within 24 hours"?
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If those of you who responded to my email want to be taken seriously, you might consider sharing what you know. Were you students there? Weeding through the written abuse and personal attacks leaves me without any more information than I had at the beginning.
I can't discern your point, except that you hate HLA. Are there other programs you recommend? That might be helpful.
Regarding kids who meet the criteria, I agree. There have been kids at HLA that should not have been there. When that happens, it is a problem.
ps: I certainly wasn't touting my status as a lawyer as giving me special qualifications, only to indicate that we aren't ignorant of the ways of the world. I inactivated my license when I quit work to be a full-time mom years ago. It would seem that you see something suspicious about that.
And if you want to be taken seriously than you might want to start answering some of the questions posed to you.
For example:
Quote:
I read the board because it contains information that concerns me, and every legitimate concern raised I have brought to the attention of HLA and have received an acceptable response.
Which ones? What was the acceptable response?
To answer yours, yes I was a student there for some time and no there are no programs that I would recomend off hand.
See how that works? Someone asks you a question and then you answer it, not make a bunch of stupid baseless accusations, attack people you know nothing about and call them liars, and then claim no one is going to take them seriously.
Oh and as to you being a little slow on the uptake, its not you refraining from practicing law that we find ironic (if we judge you based on the logic youve posted here you're a terrible lawyer and would be better suited not to practice.) what we or at least I find ironic is that you claim to be a full time mom, yet you shipped your kid off to a warehouse. Tough job for you huh?
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http://www.strugglingteens.org/cgi-bin/ ... u=00005082 (http://www.strugglingteens.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_profile;u=00005082)
Profile
Occupation: Lawyer
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I see why some here get so easily frustrated with parents... Their like a broken record....
I'm not to familiar with HLA but from what I've read it seems to be like every other abusive program. I find it funny how every parent says "My kid hated it at first but now they love it and feel that it's saved their life" This statement could be made by any st8/thayer/tranquility bay/insert-program-name/ parent. I have a question for any former HLA students:- Do they punish you for saying anything negative about the program?
and to the parents:- Does HLA tell you that any complaint or abuse allegations is just manipulation and should not be taken seriously?
I know that the lawsuit is mainly about unqualified staff and the intake of kids that pose a threat to the safety of other students, but reading certain survivor statements (http://http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=20210) leads me to believe that this place is psychologically abusive. I honestly wouldn't expect anything else being that HLA employs unqualified staff, it's like a butcher preforming heart surgery.
Regardless of my opinions I do hope that the parents who posted their support for HLA will take a really good objective look at HLA before writing off any complaints as lies.
Also if any one knows where I can get the cliff-notes on HLA please post a link or something.
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http://www.strugglingteens.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_profile;u=00005082
Profile
Occupation: Lawyer
Why do all of the program-parent lawyers come from Dallas?
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what we or at least I find ironic is that you claim to be a full time mom, yet you shipped your kid off to a warehouse. Tough job for you huh?
Sometimes it is nice to take a different view on things. Lets say you are a full time mechanic and your son/Daughter is going for a long trip and has a 1991 Ford Taurus. Being a loving father you spend a few nights maybe putting on new brakes, tuning it up, maybe upgrading the tires and getting the alignment dead nuts and the car is mint. But as you drive it around you hear a clicking sound coming from the transmission. Transmissions are not your expertise so you have a choice
1) Let it go and hope for the best or
2) Ship it off to someone who knows more about transmissions and have it looked at.
Question: If you chose option # 2 does this make you a lousy mechanic and a bad parent? or just a bad mechanic Hmmmm...... makes one think
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Karen likes to compare her kid to a dog in her analogies. Your kid is a car. Says a lot about you guys.
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Hmmm...I remember taking my car to a transmission "specialist" who kept claiming he had the problem fixed, but the car still ran like shit. I took it twice more, still ran like shit. Turns out the guy didn't know jack about the problems, and I had to sue him. At least my car didn't die
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Hmmm...I remember taking my car to a transmission "specialist" who kept claiming he had the problem fixed, but the car still ran like shit. I took it twice more, still ran like shit. Turns out the guy didn't know jack about the problems, and I had to sue him. At least my car didn't die
Ha,Ha, but the point is you had the foresight to know you couldnt fix it so you took it to someone else who you thought could. So does that make you a bad person? No. In hind sight, yes, you made a poor choice in who you took it to, maybe you should have done more research. But the car needed work .... something needed to be done that you couldnt do... thats what can be accomplished here!!!! Expose the bad transmission people and pass along the ones that were successful !!!
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what we or at least I find ironic is that you claim to be a full time mom, yet you shipped your kid off to a warehouse. Tough job for you huh?
Sometimes it is nice to take a different view on things. Lets say you are a full time mechanic and your son/Daughter is going for a long trip and has a 1991 Ford Taurus. Being a loving father you spend a few nights maybe putting on new brakes, tuning it up, maybe upgrading the tires and getting the alignment dead nuts and the car is mint. But as you drive it around you hear a clicking sound coming from the transmission. Transmissions are not your expertise so you have a choice
1) Let it go and hope for the best or
2) Ship it off to someone who knows more about transmissions and have it looked at.
Question: If you chose option # 2 does this make you a lousy mechanic and a bad parent? or just a bad mechanic Hmmmm...... makes one think
Wait.... in this example you would be sending the car off to someone qualified to fix it, not so in a "program" that hires unqualified staff and intakes kids with problems they can't fix....
My example: - Butcher preforming heart surgery=Most programs
[/b]
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Hmmm...I remember taking my car to a transmission "specialist" who kept claiming he had the problem fixed, but the car still ran like shit. I took it twice more, still ran like shit. Turns out the guy didn't know jack about the problems, and I had to sue him. At least my car didn't die
Ha,Ha, but the point is you had the foresight to know you couldnt fix it so you took it to someone else who you thought could. So does that make you a bad person? No. In hind sight, yes, you made a poor choice in who you took it to, maybe you should have done more research. But the car needed work .... something needed to be done that you couldnt do... thats what can be accomplished here!!!! Expose the bad transmission people and pass along the ones that were successful !!!
That really doesn't help when you are dealing with kids, a car is a car. You can always get another car. Your car won't hate you for making bad decisions or totaling it. Using a car as an example is just another thing that you can't compare to your flesh and blood. Please get your head out of your ass before posting next.
-FLCLcowdude
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what we or at least I find ironic is that you claim to be a full time mom, yet you shipped your kid off to a warehouse. Tough job for you huh?
Sometimes it is nice to take a different view on things. Lets say you are a full time mechanic and your son/Daughter is going for a long trip and has a 1991 Ford Taurus. Being a loving father you spend a few nights maybe putting on new brakes, tuning it up, maybe upgrading the tires and getting the alignment dead nuts and the car is mint. But as you drive it around you hear a clicking sound coming from the transmission. Transmissions are not your expertise so you have a choice
1) Let it go and hope for the best or
2) Ship it off to someone who knows more about transmissions and have it looked at.
Question: If you chose option # 2 does this make you a lousy mechanic and a bad parent? or just a bad mechanic Hmmmm...... makes one think
Cindy is back! Let's reflect on old times and once again tear apart your stupid analogy.
After having noticed the transmission problem you state to then be faced with two choices, either ignore the problem or send it to someone who knows more about the issue than you and try and get it repaired.
This makes sense and the wise and logical course of action would be of course to send it to someone who knows more on the matter than you do.
Here's the thing though Cindy:
You want to make sure the guy you're sending your daughters car to knows what the hell he is doing. You analogy would seem to suggest that we all advocate ignoring kids who have problems. You won't find many who take that position on here Cindy, of course you're an idiot and would never acknowledge that.
Sticking with your analogy how would you feel if after sending your daughters car to this guy who claimed to be a professional you discovered that he had done no work whatsoever on the vehicle? Or perhaps he made the situation worse? Maybe he even damaged the car and made it unsafe for your daughter? He won't give you your money back and he says he'll sue you to no end if you try and tell people the truth about him. What would your response be Cindy?
That's where we're at, the mechanic did shoddy work yet wants to be credited with having fixed the car.
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But the car needed work .... something needed to be done that you couldnt do... thats what can be accomplished here!!!! Expose the bad transmission people and pass along the ones that were successful !!!
That is what we do idiot, you just refuse to accept that any of these places (espically HLA, which you still know nothing about) are in way shape or form bad. This despite all facts to the contrary.
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That really doesn't help when you are dealing with kids, a car is a car. You can always get another car. Your car won't hate you for making bad decisions or totaling it. Using a car as an example is just another thing that you can't compare to your flesh and blood. Please get your head out of your ass before posting next.
-FLCLcowdude
Its call an analogy?. I think we are all aware the car is made of metal and people are not, you can scream at a car and it feelings will not get hurt. You can fill a person with gasoline and they will die. It was a decision making analogy on why people make decisions and if they are warranted or baseless. Try to follow along???
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Cindy are you really going to question another posters intelligence? There are a number of examples I could bring up to show everyone just how truly dumb you are. Stick to the topic and remain respectful or I'll shame you to the point that you have to run away and hide again.
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You want to make sure the guy you're sending your daughters car to knows what the hell he is doing.
Exactly!! So at least we agree the car needs work !! 6 months ago you wouldn?t agree the car needed fixing?..I take back an early statement that people haven?t grown?. I agree with you we need to do our homework before getting help for our kids.
You analogy would seem to suggest that we all advocate ignoring kids who have problems. You won't find many who take that position on here Cindy, of course you're an idiot and would never acknowledge that.
My analogy would, yes, a majority of posters, here on Fornits use to suggest that doing nothing was the best course of action for kids who were in trouble.
Sticking with your analogy how would you feel if after sending your daughters car to this guy who claimed to be a professional you discovered that he had done no work whatsoever on the vehicle? Or perhaps he made the situation worse? Maybe he even damaged the car and made it unsafe for your daughter? He won't give you your money back and he says he'll sue you to no end if you try and tell people the truth about him. What would your response be Cindy?
That's where we're at, the mechanic did shoddy work yet wants to be credited with having fixed the car.
Sue the pants off the bastards !! and expose them, I agree !! But lets not keep the car in the driveway with a cover over it, lets get it fixed. Let us do better research and have someone else look at it.
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::roll::
6 months ago you wouldn?t agree the car needed fixing
See, it's rhetorical bullshit like this that makes everyone here so God damn sick of you.
The kid was never the one with the problem.
The analogy would be more akin to sending your car to a drunken bum operating out of some back-alley lot, because you're a blind driver and convinced your car is to blame for your frequent traffic accidents.
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Yikes.
Exactly!! So at least we agree the car needs work !! 6 months ago you wouldn?t agree the car needed fixing?..I take back an early statement that people haven?t grown?. I agree with you we need to do our homework before getting help for our kids.
Cindy at no point did I ever make such a claim, nor did I ever insinuate anything remotely similar to what you are claiming. Either retract your statement and acknowledge your mistake or be prepared to back your statement up.
My analogy would, yes, a majority of posters, here on Fornits use to suggest that doing nothing was the best course of action for kids who were in trouble.
Provide the basis for this claim. I want actual numbers and statements proving that the majority of posters believe the best course of action for kids in trouble is to do nothing.
Sue the pants off the bastards !! and expose them, I agree !! But lets not keep the car in the driveway with a cover over it, lets get it fixed. Let us do better research and have someone else look at it.
And again how do you feel this statement is in any way different from what many of us are trying to do here?
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That is some scarry bullshit...
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That is some scarry bullshit...
I agree!
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Oh Cindy is just full of it. He likes to make idiotic comments and then when he can't back them up he either pretends he never made them to begin with, or he pretends someone else made them.
He is good for a laugh. Cindy I'm out for a bit, post some babbeling response for me to have a good laugh at when I get back, and of course shoot down.
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TheWho, The problem is this most program parents have not exhausted every other resource available to them. There is no easy fix for a troubled kid and any one promising such a fix is a con man at best and an idealistic fanatic most of the time.
Understand this a child should only be institutionalized when in immediate crisis, not locked a way to get "fixed". Family counseling with individual therapy is the best option, using a temporary institutionalization only in times of immediate crisis and only for a short period and not therapy.
If that sounds less attractive to parents then shady programs it simply means their lazy and unwilling to put in the necessary work in helping their family overcome a family issue
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TheWho, The problem is this most program parents have not exhausted every other resource available to them.
The parents that I have met exhausted all options before even considering anything outside the home. I would doubt many see this as a first option, although I am sure there are some that would use this as an early option.
There is no easy fix for a troubled kid
I agree and I would define an easy fix as one that could be resolved in short time.
and any one promising such a fix is a con man at best and an idealistic fanatic most of the time.
I agree 100%
Understand this a child should only be institutionalized when in immediate crisis, not locked a way to get "fixed". Family counseling with individual therapy is the best option, using a temporary institutionalization only in times of immediate crisis and only for a short period and not therapy.
Agreed
If that sounds less attractive to parents then shady programs it simply means their lazy and unwilling to put in the necessary work in helping their family overcome a family issue
Agreed, wow fornits has come a long way. I apologize. When I left in July to travel I was hard pressed to find anyone who would even agree (in theory) that it would be beneficial to having a child helped outside of the home under any circumstance. Seems discussion has expanded.
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Cindy you made some claims, are you going to back them or just do your usual song and dance routine?
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Oh Cindy is just full of it. He likes to make idiotic comments and then when he can't back them up he either pretends he never made them to begin with, or he pretends someone else made them.
He is good for a laugh. Cindy I'm out for a bit, post some babbeling response for me to have a good laugh at when I get back, and of course shoot down.
Oh, Relax.....you get so ruffled when i log in. Just say what you believe in and try to help someone. It doesnt matter who wins the argument, it matters that you care about what you are doing and you truly believe in your position and are amking a positive difference in someones life. Nobody is going to fault you for that. Dont be evil or spiteful, just be yourself.
I just stopped in, not sure when I will be back. If it makes people think more highly of you, you can tell them that you chased me away (or shamed me), I'll back you up.
TheWho
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(Yawn) Golly I never saw that one coming Cindy can't back up his claims.