Fornits

Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: wesfager on March 30, 2003, 04:17:00 PM

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: wesfager on March 30, 2003, 04:17:00 PM

Hello,

As you know between 1976 and 1993 Straight, Inc. operated one of the cruelest juvenile drug rehabilitation programs the world has ever seen. Many of you reading this were in Straight and you know what I'm talking about. Many former Straigth clients still suffer from Straight-induced PTSS, some are no longer living. But none of you will ever forget what they did to you there. Straight took in nearly $100 million for their efforts. Today there continues to operate Straight-dervived programs. There have been allegations of abuse at some legacy programs. And beyond Straight there are the western programs out in Utah, Arizona and Idaho. Kids are coming forward and telling horrid stories of abuse from some of these programs.

When you were in Straight, you thought no one knew; no one cared. But actually there were some who knew and were outraged to action to try to stop it. Richard Bradbury and Arnold Trebach come to mind. Who will lead the charge to expose current programs that abuse our kids? I have spent a long time trying to document the case against the Straights. It has always been my hope that somebody would use the data I have documented to try to make a difference. And two groups have done just that. SAFETYNET and ISAC.

Now one of those groups, ISAC, has come to a crossroads. ISAC volunteers have devoted a lot of time into trying to make a difference. But ISAC is having financial difficulty. They're just trying to keep their heads above water. And While we may not agree with everything ISAC does (I can't keep up with everything they're doing), they certainly are doing some very right things; and THEY HAVE MADE A POWERFUL IMPACT.

Now ISAC is in desperate need of financial aid. Please send what you can as soon as you can. Send $5, $10, $100. They desperately need your support.

Make checks payable to:

ISAC Corporation

and mail to:

ISAC Corporation
12800 Vonn Road # 7504
Largo FL 33774

Thank you all,

Wesley Fager
Oakton, Virginia

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Powerful Attitude on March 30, 2003, 05:29:00 PM

I'm on it. Thanks ::rocker::

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on March 30, 2003, 06:40:00 PM

well if they got jobs and woked like the rest of us as well as volunteer they wouldn't need as much financial help.

plus they (ISAC) tends to burn bridges quickly... w/out regard of the person they hurt

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: chinrse23 on March 30, 2003, 07:20:00 PM

Anon what did ISAC do to you? Im sorry i have no money to give.

[ This Message was edited by: chinrse23 on 2003-03-30 16:21 ]

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: 85 Day Jerk on March 30, 2003, 07:27:00 PM

I have a large brass Parrot Cage suitable for a large Macaw or Cockatoo that I will donate for them to sell at a rummage sale or whatever. It would cost over 500 dollars retail, I paid $50, so whatever they can get for it is theirs if they want it. I can be reached at r.patterson27@verizon.net for all the particulars.
As an added bonus, there may be DNA samples of the previous parrots still left intact inside the cage!!!! This is a serious offer, and they will need either a pick-up truck or van to haul it off as the damn thing is 3x4x5 feet all around.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: METALGOD8 on March 30, 2003, 07:44:00 PM

Thank you Wes. What bothers me the most these days is not my experience at that Gulag 5515 in 1983, it is the fact that it is STILL happening now. If people who were in the program don't care or otherwise agree to help out, then fine, that's their right. On the other hand, it would make sense to me that survivors of the Sembler programs would be the best choice in my book to help stop this mind raping, etc... that takes place everyday. Sitting around talking about how ISAC burns bridges, etc, is only wasting more time. You may want to be a little more specific about what those bridges are, btw. To make statements like anonymous made, is also counterproductive and off target. I work, many of the ISAC people work. Volunteering available "spare" time costs money, plain and simple. In order to facilitate filing fees, meetings, office supplies, traveling, and everything else that goes into operating a non-profit corporation, finances are necessary. I would hope that, through all of the volunteers' efforts, this abusive treatment modality will stop once and for all. Once again, thank you Wes, and all of the people who make all of this possible.
MG8 :smokin:

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Shelby on March 31, 2003, 12:54:00 AM

Which job would you like me to get?

Full time daycare provider? - already got it
Secretary/accountant of a computer recycling company? - got that, too
Teacher? - check
Cook? - done
Laundress? - yep
Chauffeur? - every day
Doctor/nurse? - too often
Maid? - oh yeah

I would love to be able to continue to take money that I used to spend on my children, my home, and my own bills and put it towards shutting down the open programs, but I can't. If you don't want to donate, don't. That's fine. But you should at least have your facts straight when you post. For those of you who would like to help us continue at our current pace, it would really mean a lot to me.

Shelby

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on March 31, 2003, 10:23:00 AM

What job should i get

Full time nurse and full time volunteer for isac
and full time parent

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on March 31, 2003, 10:25:00 AM

What job should i get
Full time Military volunteer
Full time parent
Full time computer analyst
Full time parent
Full time isac volunteer

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on March 31, 2003, 10:26:00 AM

What job should I get?

Full Time Car business.
Parent
Full time ISAC volunteer

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on March 31, 2003, 10:27:00 AM

What job should I get?

Full time transportation occupation.
Full time ISAC volunteer.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on March 31, 2003, 10:39:00 AM

Just so everyone is aware of the time and effort into this. I am on the ISAC financial team.

To the best of my calculations, ISAC volunteers and team has put in the following:

Over ten thousand dollars of their own money.
Countless and endless hours to the point of being physically ill. One member even took laptop to the hospital with them when they were admitted.
Some have pawned items handed down to them and lost them in order to do mail outs and research.

Some have lost hours of work because they became ill.

Children of team members have agreed to give up alot of their time with their parents to help. The kids of team members have taken on more chores in THEIR effort to support the cause to give their parents more time to spend working on ISAC business.

This does not include the thousand of dollars and man hours Wes, spent collecting information and due to that making it available to ISAC.

This does not include the thousands of dollars and man hours Richard Bradbury put into his efforts.

If you do not believe in the cause then know one could ask you to donate. Please, do not post about what the ISAC team is doing or not doing if you do not have the facts.

They are putting everything they can into stopping the abuse , the treatment modality and helpig survivors. IS that not what everyone on this board wishes for, dreams of?

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: lizzy on March 31, 2003, 02:15:00 PM

:em:

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on March 31, 2003, 03:16:00 PM

On 2003-03-31 11:15:00, lizzy wrote:
"
On 2003-03-31 07:26:00, Anonymous wrote:
"What job should I get?

Full Time Car business.
Parent
Full time ISAC volunteer"

How about full time fucking off if you don't want to help a noble cause ass-hole?"

well i know that there are some of you that do not work and the others should get their priorities in order if you are neglecting your kids and using your funds to otherwise sponsor ISAC instead of paying your own bills then BOO HOO for you... ISAC is NOT a not for profit and if you choose to spend your money that way then I have no sympathy for you if you want to take the cards dealt then go for it but what has ISAC accomplished other than a web sight that has alot of unusable information on it.. and BS propaganda about being followed ect.. PLEASE !!!GIVE ME A BREAK!!! I've heard all this before...
There are grants available for people who are incorporated and funds available for groups that truly are in need of funding so instead of your vulgar language and your whinning go out and get it...
I know from first hand experience that ISAC leaders are not working and most of you are wasting your money on an effort with no out come...
Plus I thought this was a forum and I could express my opinions....

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: lizzy on March 31, 2003, 03:58:00 PM

:em:

[ This Message was edited by: lizzy on 2003-04-07 17:55 ]

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Diane B on March 31, 2003, 07:13:00 PM

Just a note on the grants issue, I vol. for a local non profit organization that helps the working poor kids in our area with Christmas gifts and school supplies etc. and let me tell you grants are nearly IMPOSSIBLE to recive. I have put many many hours tring to get just one for the past 6 months and have gotten nowhere from the biggies right down to our local rotary club and have recived nothing but You have a wonderful charity but we cannot help. I must have sent out close to 500 grant proposals. And our charity has been in existance for 12 years, with a proven tract record and this year alone made christmas for 860 kids that would have been missed this year and supplied teachers and children with enough school supplies to equipt 1500 kids, and our ONLY means of support is private donations.

BTW If you do donate money to a non-profit organization it is a tax deduction!!!!!!!

Diane

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on March 31, 2003, 07:45:00 PM

Just so there is no confusion,
ALL ISAC team members work full time jobs. I should know since I am one of the national directors.

So, we would appreciate it if, whoever you are, would stop posting misinformation. I would also appreciate it if you would stop telling the people at ISAC how to spend their personal money (Unless of course, you are willing to take over their finances and pay all the bills)and accusing them of ALL things Neglecting their children.
The Children Of ISAC team members donated their time money and efforts of their own free will because THEY CARE...about what happened to their moms and dads.
But then again , misinformation is what warfare is all about is it not?

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: METALGOD8 on March 31, 2003, 07:56:00 PM

I am having difficulty trying to understand the reasoning of anonymous's post regarding the corporation called ISAC. For some reason, this anonymously posting person is spewing lies and I think they should stop right now.
For those of you who doubt that ISAC is a non-profit corporation, please surf on over to:

http://www.sunbiz.org/scripts/cordet.ex ... 4=ISAC&r5= (http://www.sunbiz.org/scripts/cordet.exe?a1=DETFIL&n1=N03000002400&n2=NAMFWD&n3=0000&n4=N&r1=&r2=&r3=&r4=ISAC&r5=)

As far as the working part goes, I work all the time, and I take it kind of personally when this anonymous poster writes the non-opinions that she or he is writing when the FACTS are obviously different. If you are upset or have some problem with what we are doing, I am sorry, but you should be old and mature enough to deal with that in a responsible manner.
For people who care and/or want to help and those who are curious or pessimistic, ISAC is the real deal. Actions always speak louder than words. ISAC is all about actions. ISAC will take actions where and whenever possible to ensure that drug treatment abuse will not be tolerated and companies that provide abusive treatment will be held accountable.
One last note, I hope that most people will see the truth of the matter and maintain an even keel so to speak.
Thank you,
MG8

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Powerful Attitude on March 31, 2003, 08:03:00 PM

Hey ANON, who in the hell is in that head? I just gave a clue. It really sounds like someone that has a lot of personal problems because of all the bullshit. I have kids and a family and I don't need some prick son-of-bitch telling me where I ought to put my money and insinuate that my children are being neglected or for that matter anyone's children. You have chosen to make this personal, as I have for my own beliefs, which most definitely are not yours. If you were in my face and said this shit it would have been a bigger mistake. But you?ve already made one because you hide behind your ANON. Who are you, if you can be a man? You?re probably one of the sorry son's of bitches that had pleasure doing what we know is mentally disturbing and disgusting. How many people have you ruined and enjoyed it? You are a dark angel who has come to try to cause problems and tempt what points their finger at you. Too bad you do not know the voice that drives your heart. The father of lies is his name. Talk all of your shit boy, and what difference does it make to me? None. Watch what you say because you know not what you speak. It is unfortunate that you have not been given ears to hear nor eyes that can see nor a heart that understands. Do you post at other times under ANON to cause shit? That?s one thing I can?t stand. The black heart is scared because of its deceit that it carries inside. It is ashamed so it must hide. So it?s not your fault, it?s the one that drives your heel even though he lives in you not me. Next time you want to talk about my family or responsibilities I recommend you bring it to me so I don?t have to expose you for what you really are in front of all that read. Hey ANON, I have already donated so do you have anything else you would like to say. Oh and by the way you need to get a life and a better job than posting your crap, just my ?opinion?. Why don?t you make a new post so I can join you there?

When the enemy is around there should be no mercy, especially one that is in your house. Expose him quickly so he can do now damage, he has no strength when all can see him. We should all speak the same word since we know the truth, if they speak not like us than they speak not the truth. Look at who we are up against, do they speak as we do?

As the original post is important to the rest of us, I hope after this we can resume it. I don?t care if you want to sit around, enjoy your life, and not contribute in any way to this cause. But when you feel the need to come along and try to fuck up someone else?s post that works hard and is dedicated to opening the eyes of others to the TRUTH about these programs and have personal accusations towards others, I will come along and expose you.

Many thanks to Wes Fager and ISAC volunteers and team for your dedication.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Froderik on March 31, 2003, 09:26:00 PM

OK - Here is a good example of how anonymous posting can become a pain-in-the-ass. I'll admit that I have posted as anon. once or twice myself. But I will still say this: It sucks in this case because I can't figure out at whom the above scathing rebuttal is directed. (The one by P.A.) It just crossed my mind that it would help to quote the anonymous posts so that we all have a point of reference. (I sometimes pick things up in mid-thread and don't have a historical perspective on things...) If you don't want to quote a whole post, you can quote part of it simply by using 'reply' and then surrounding the bit you want quoted (you gotta paste it in) with the word "quote" in brackets [] at the beginning, and the word "/quote" in brackets [] at the end. This causes the passage to be highlighted in the yellow box (quoted per usual) in your posted message. Thanks...

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: 85 Day Jerk on March 31, 2003, 09:27:00 PM

First and foremost, my sincere apologies to Wes Fager for having seen what has transpired. As
anyone who is above room temperature knows, I made some bumper stickers. I thought it would be a good idea to put the w.w.w.thestraights.com on the bottom of them, but I at least had the decency to ask Mr. Fager for his blessings first.
This is because I was partially raised by a grand father that imparted some values in me. How the hell do you all think the man feels right now seeing us at each other like a bunch of sea-gulls after the same McDonald's french fry?
Would you want to go through with the bother and expense of another Conference, when us animals are supposed to be the ones benefitting from it most? This is like the end of one of my favorite movies called "The Committments." It was about a bunch of downtrodden Irish musicians who form a kick ass R&B band and end up desentegrating over petty sqabbles. Now I can honestly say that I have no love for ISAC, SafetyNet, or any other damn name they come up with, but Wes Fager is the Grand Dad for all of us. Without his efforts half of us would not even know of these boards. I know I would not have. I would still be a nameless faceless soul rushing to and from work day to day going through life with a tear in my soul that could never be mended. For most Americans, all grandparents are is an unending toybox that up and dies when we are teenagers and the funeral ends up slamming the lid on the toybox. I thank God that it was not that way with me. I know I am not perfect, but I always read through my posts one last time before hitting that send button, because words can hit as hard as a fist. Please see the movie "The Committments" and think about your own committments. Take Care........

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on March 31, 2003, 10:05:00 PM

On 2003-03-31 16:56:00, METALGOD8 wrote:
"I am having difficulty trying to understand the reasoning of anonymous's post regarding the corporation called ISAC. For some reason, this anonymously posting person is spewing lies and I think they should stop right now.
For those of you who doubt that ISAC is a non-profit corporation, please surf on over to:

http://www.sunbiz.org/scripts/cordet.ex ... AC&r5=Just (http://www.sunbiz.org/scripts/cordet.exe?a1=DETFIL&n1=N03000002400&n2=NAMFWD&n3=0000&n4=N&r1=&r2=&r3=&r4=ISAC&r5=Just) because you are incorporated does not mean you are not for profit!!!!so when are you going to do that or are you just whinning about the bills you have you knew walking into this that it was your money and I don't agree w/ your work so perhaps I'll send this and your names to the IRS and ask that they look into you too... By the way it is illeagle to solicit funds w/out a solicitors license.. so put that in your pipe and smoke it!!!

As far as the working part goes, I work all the time, and I take it kind of personally when this anonymous poster writes the non-opinions that she or he is writing when the FACTS are obviously different. If you are upset or have some problem with what we are doing, I am sorry, but you should be old and mature enough to deal with that in a responsible manner.
For people who care and/or want to help and those who are curious or pessimistic, ISAC is the real deal. Actions always speak louder than words. ISAC is all about actions. ISAC will take actions where and whenever possible to ensure that drug treatment abuse will not be tolerated and companies that provide abusive treatment will be held accountable.
One last note, I hope that most people will see the truth of the matter and maintain an even keel so to speak.
Thank you,
MG8"

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Powerful Attitude on April 01, 2003, 12:38:00 AM

On 2003-03-31 18:26:00, AlexL wrote:
"OK - Here is a good example of how anonymous posting can become a pain-in-the-ass. I'll admit that I have posted as anon. once or twice myself. But I will still say this: It sucks in this case because I can't figure out at whom the above scathing rebuttal is directed. (The one by P.A.) It just crossed my mind that it would help to quote the anonymous posts so that we all have a point of reference. (I sometimes pick things up in mid-thread and don't have a historical perspective on things...) If you don't want to quote a whole post, you can quote part of it simply by using 'reply' and then surrounding the bit you want quoted (you gotta paste it in) with the word "quote" in brackets [] at the beginning, and the word "/quote" in brackets [] at the end. This causes the passage to be highlighted in the yellow box (quoted per usual) in your posted message. Thanks..."

Hey, thanks for the tip.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: 85 Day Jerk on April 01, 2003, 03:34:00 AM

This had nothing to do with all the bickering, then again it does..... I ran across Jeff Hodges
today at the place he works. It is a popular diner in the Woodlawn section of St. Pete. He has worked his way up to the position of Kitchen Manager. Last time I saw him 4 years ago he was just a lowly dishwasher. The thing is, he was in Straight back in Milton Roy, and then on to Morgan Yacht. I believe he was pulled from the program shortly after the Tampa Screw-Up. I was having a meeting with a legal adviser, so I did not have the opportunity to approach him and say Hi or anything, but it kind of bugs me in a way.
If he were to log on to this forum today as a first time visitor and see this topic in all it's glory, just what the hell do you think he would make of it all? I am gonna stop in there later on in the week and see how he is doing.

Thought For The Day---
IT IS NICE TO BE IMPORTANT, BUT IT IS MORE IMPORTANT TO BE NICE :smile: :wave:

[ This Message was edited by: 85 Day Jerk on 2003-04-01 02:53 ]

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 01, 2003, 12:42:00 PM

There is only one of them who does not work and that is because she physically can't, due to heart problems among other things. She has been hospitalized at least once in the last two months. She also risks loosing the use of her left leg according to the most recent doctor visit.
To imply that she needs to get a job Sammie is just WRONG. She is in that condition because of what Straight did to her. That is documented by both her cardiologist and neurosurgen.

Ironically enough, I sat in the first board meeting and you told everyone that you sought Marti out. That you asked her to volunteer.

It amazes me how the survivors can do more damage to each other than any Sembler , or Sembler rep.
All of us know how it feels to be attacked personally and to have one of our own do it to us and I cant believe your doing this.

Kim Fee - Kids of North Jersey.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 01, 2003, 01:48:00 PM

And Sammie, your postings do not boad well for Safety Nets reputation. Then I see a post about Safety Net wanting people to sign up and pay to go to confrence and give them money. I think not.

Kim Fee

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: kpickle39 on April 01, 2003, 01:51:00 PM

[ This Message was edited by: kpickle39 on 2003-04-01 19:06 ]

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 01, 2003, 02:46:00 PM

To imply that she needs to get a job Sammie is just WRONG. She is in that condition because of what Straight did to her. That is documented by both her cardiologist and neurosurgen.

Kim Fee - Kids of North Jersey."
[/quote]
What makes you think this is Me sammie? kim fee as a matter of fact it wasn't so you can put that in your pipe and smoke it...
It was not sammie who posted the crap flying on this board, I posted on another topic and I SIGNED MY NAME so don't go trying to spread shit you know nothing about!!! And by the way I NEVER ASKED FOR A CENT AND I NEVER ASKED FOR DONATIONS REGARDLESS OF THE MONEY I SPENT.
SO GET YOUR FACTS TOGETHER BEFORE YOU ASSUME ANYTHING ABOUT ME!!!

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 01, 2003, 02:48:00 PM

On 2003-04-01 10:48:00, Anonymous wrote:
"And Sammie, your postings do not boad well for Safety Nets reputation. Then I see a post about Safety Net wanting people to sign up and pay to go to confrence and give them money. I think not.

Kim Fee"

I AM NOT ON SAFETYNET I RESIGNED MONTHS AGO!!!
WHAT GIVES YOU THE RIGHT TO BASH ME? i'VE DONE NOTHING TO YOU AND YET YOU ATTACK.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 01, 2003, 02:54:00 PM

You are completely loosing 100 percent focus of our main goal and that is really sick.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 02, 2003, 03:14:00 PM

SuOn 2003-03-31 12:16:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2003-03-31 11:15:00, lizzy wrote:
"
On 2003-03-31 07:26:00, Anonymous wrote:
"What job should I get?

Full Time Car business.
Parent
Full time ISAC volunteer"

How about full time fucking off if you don't want to help a noble cause ass-hole?"

well i know that there are some of you that do not work and the others should get their priorities in order if you are neglecting your kids and using your funds to otherwise sponsor ISAC instead of paying your own bills then BOO HOO for you... ISAC is NOT a not for profit and if you choose to spend your money that way then I have no sympathy for you if you want to take the cards dealt then go for it but what has ISAC accomplished other than a web sight that has alot of unusable information on it.. and BS propaganda about being followed ect.. PLEASE !!!GIVE ME A BREAK!!! I've heard all this before...
There are grants available for people who are incorporated and funds available for groups that truly are in need of funding so instead of your vulgar language and your whinning go out and get it...
I know from first hand experience that ISAC leaders are not working and most of you are wasting your money on an effort with no out come...
Plus I thought this was a forum and I could express my opinions...."

Sure sounds like the same person.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 03, 2003, 08:44:00 PM

Sammi you silly silly girl. Your limited vocab and usual pissing contest tactics gave you away!!!

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 03, 2003, 09:19:00 PM

ISAC is an absolute joke ! :smokin:

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Majiktrvls on April 03, 2003, 10:17:00 PM

I am consistently baffled by the amount of garbage that is floating out there in people's heads and seeping through onto this thread. If you don't agree with helping out ISAC, why do you spend so much time and energy posting a bunch of nonsense on here? Why bother at all? Just pass thru the thread as if it did not exist. To spend the energy to spread meanness is just wasted energy, in my opinion. Don't donate money, don't speak of the group, don't do anything at all. But, for hell's sake let go of the bullshit. Is this how some people who post on here act in real life? Or do you reserve all of the garbage for postings? If you act like this in real life, no wonder you have so much negative energy, you probably have noone who will put up with you. Look into constructing a compost pile,it is a great place to put out the garbage in your heads.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 03, 2003, 10:19:00 PM

On 2003-04-03 18:19:00, Anonymous wrote:
"ISAC is an absolute joke ! :smokin:

And u are the butt of it, :rofl:

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 07, 2003, 04:55:00 PM

On 2003-03-30 15:40:00, Anonymous wrote:
"well if they got jobs and woked like the rest of us as well as volunteer they wouldn't need as much financial help.

plus they (ISAC) tends to burn bridges quickly... w/out regard of the person they hurt"

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't this the post that started all of this? Who or why would someone say this to Wes Fager? And then, the endless, "What job" posts...What's the deal? If we are all on the same team, why are people acting so unprofessionally? When you are working, leave the personal out of it. Don't loose your objective. It's self defeating. Stop trying to score points. Who wrote this?
__________________________________________________

What job should i getFull time nurse and full time volunteer for isac and full time parent-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post URL: http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... um=7#10479 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=1991&forum=7#10479) AnonymousUnregistered User Helpin out.Posted: 2003-03-31 07:25:00 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- What job should i get Full time Military volunteer Full time parent Full time computer analyst Full time parent Full time isac volunteer-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post URL: http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... um=7#10480 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=1991&forum=7#10480) AnonymousUnregistered User Helpin out.Posted: 2003-03-31 07:26:00 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- What job should I get? Full Time Car business. Parent Full time ISAC volunteer

This is sabotage.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 07, 2003, 06:09:00 PM

On 2003-04-07 13:55:00, Anonymous wrote:
"

This is sabotage.

"

Well, from my pov, Wes got talked into tacitly endorsing ISAC in the form of a solicitation for funds. I think he did it because, well, he's a softy and he knows their intentions are good and he hopes that they're actually accomplishing something.

Then some of these people who were being asked to sacrifice their earnings in order for ISAC to do more of whatever it is they do responded to this solicitation by discussing the pros and cons of ISAC and their work.

However, something hauntingly familiar happened here. Aparently, even discussion or the suggestion that there exist any cons is viewed as a personal attack or sabotage and the speaker is scapegoated and demonized as an enemy of the higher purpose.

Now, mind you, I have no dog in this race. I have never been a member of either organization and have had very little contact with members outside of these forums, except for one close friend with whom I never discuss that business because I don't want to land up in the middle of it.

But, you asked for my opinion. So there it is.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Anonymous on April 07, 2003, 06:26:00 PM

So you wrote this:

On 2003-03-30 15:40:00, Anonymous wrote:"well if they got jobs and woked like the rest of us as well as volunteer they wouldn't need as much financial help. plus they (ISAC) tends to burn bridges quickly... w/out regard of the person they hurt"

Sounds like a personal attack to me.

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Antigen on April 07, 2003, 07:04:00 PM

Sounds to me like a sharp criticizm of the idea of sending money to ISAC.

If you want to see clear examples of unwarranted personal attacks, check out the thread where you guys ran FULAW off the forums. I think we've had just about all the help we can stand. Thanks!

If only there were evil people somewhere, insidiously committing evil
deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?
Alexandr Solzhenitsyn

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Tampa survivor on April 07, 2003, 08:57:00 PM

"If you want to see clear examples of unwarranted personal attacks, check out the thread where you guys ran FULAW off the forums. I think we've had just about all the help we can stand. Thanks"
Thats about where I quit using razor sharp words to make a point on fornits. One is better served
beating mountains down with a hammer.
Fuelaw was the real deal, and no matter what I said, I got blasted, called "program" and worse. Read my old threads. Thats when I decided to get away from the Lord of The Flies crap which has broken out.
Now I just say hi to friends, zap a Jesus freak or two, and do REAL THINGS FOR REAL PEOPLE EVERYDAY.
I certainly don't need to be the Grand Exalted Founding Member of Squabbling Straightlings.
CTFD people.
Bill H

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: Powerful Attitude on April 08, 2003, 01:16:00 AM

You sound pretty cool Bill, really liked the
"One is better served beating mountains down with a hammer". So True. But the third time is a charm. If you are to keep making attacks on people's beliefs than I would like to hear your's since you speak of none. You don't worship the spirit? Then what do you worship, or do you have no higher power? I like to "zap" people too, but I won't pull that shit now. See ya around Bill.

[ This Message was edited by: Powerful Attitude on 2003-04-07 22:17 ]

Title: ISAC needs your help
Post by: mithygato on July 21, 2003, 02:00:00 AM

Oh no, not you AGAIN - :evil: when I was trapped there. Just reviewing some older postings . . .

I've read some really bizzare posts from you since I found this place, and have always wondered which Straight you fell so deeply in love with.
And then I discovered that we had in fact vacationed there together, and had a grand, bloody old time.

I cannot believe the extent to which those people seemingly still control your thought processes.
Simply amazing. I'm truly sorry they still rule your life.

However, you saw with your own two eyes, and heard it with your own two ears - what happened to us.
How children were abused in so many damn ways.

To this day, it's in all of the survivors subconciousness'whether we like it or not.
Maybe you are still very afraid even to this day to face the pain and humiliation we suffered. That's O.K.
Quite possibly they took away your ability to have any sort of real objectivity (and I don't mean based on objective reality). Having interpersonal relationships is difficult for a lot of us here! :eek:

[ This Message was edited by: mithygato on 2003-07-21 00:41 ]