Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Oz girl on September 14, 2006, 02:25:34 AM
-
My answer would be, and i have a feeling i am going to be laughed at in part by 3 springs for being some crazy hippy leftist or "liberal' as you guys like to call it;
-Anyone who cares about children and recognises that locking them in a place which is half way between a reform school and a hental health facility is a breach of human rights and needs to be recognised as such by the international community.
-The ideal mouth piece would be someone who has been involved in the industry on any level (parent, kid or ex employee) and who can artuculate its effects on all involved, without looking like a crazy person or coming off as too judgemental of those who initially sent their kid to a place like this in the first place.
-I dont think any specific educational qualification is the test. i think it is an ability to understand the issues and make the general public aware of them in a succinct and easily palatable way. ideally someone who can tug at the heartstrings of your average soccer mum.
-
Damn bleeding hearts.... at least you had it in you to respond. Thank you.
-
You see when I have been checking out fornits, my impression has been, geez all these justifiably angry people, but they don't seem to be doing anything about the problem other than sharing their stories on this page.
You make an excellent point about what qualities are neccesary in an effective activist. There are some people who can be the public face of the issue and advocate effectively, where someone will actually pay attention to what they have to say. However, everyone here has at least something to contribute.
Not trying to plug our organization too much, but CAFETY is trying to organize all the "activist" groups working on this issue, and get them to pool their efforts. It's suprising just how few people are really out there talking to political figures about this issue, but we are working on increasing public awareness. Hopefully, that will soon change.
-
can someone define what exactly is an teen help RTC activist?
is the goal to shut down every RTC and progrm in the world? or to define and only shut down the abusive ones? or to only allow wilderness programs? allow no privately run programs, only state programs? make programs regulated by the state and federal governemnt?
i am not being sarcastic i would relaly like to hear from an activist on this subject because i cant seem to find any defininite goals from activists in this field, they just make broad statements like stopping institutionalized child abuse. thats a hefty goal, does that mean shutting down all youth run state programs? juvenille hall? what about orphanages?
is this just a fight against institutionalized abuse? because lots of kids get beat at home, or is this an all encompassed fight against child abuse... lock up all the parents who beat their kids too as part of this activism? would people be fine with programs if kids weren't getting abusd? or is it any program at all even ones without any history of abuse?
id just like to know some definiable goals by the activists here. what is it exactly that you are working against, and how by solving it will it not increase child abuse in another arena,. you know that pesky law of unintended side effects. thanks!
-
The problem's hard to define, isn't it? I'll field this one.
Anyone carrying out child abuse like this at home will get arrested. See what happened in Florida. Some douchebag locked his kid in his room, installed video surveillance all around the house, etc, etc.. welcome to jail, asshole.
It's simply about equal enforcement of the laws. Anything that a parent can't do at home, a private party shouldn't be able to do either. Withholding of food and water, child labor, constant emotional and physical abuse through a wide variety of insane demands and threats.. sorry guys, that's illegal. Welcome to jail. It's simply that somehow this has all become okay when the children are institutionalized.
The real goal is to make sure police, regulatory officials, and everyone else thoroughly understand that it's still not okay. This is the real goal. Once that is established, everything else follows.
Are they locking kids up and passing themselves off as a mental health facility? This shouldn't be legal, but if they claim to be a residential treatment facility, a "therapeutic boarding school", or anything else that even resembles either (these guys get slimy in this regard), they need to be licensed and regulated by the State. This means that the kids have the right to a psychiatric examination and a hearing before a judge; if they're not actually mentally ill, they can't be locked up like that, just as it is with a state facility. Regulation also means inspections, and also means independent interviews with the kids. "But they're manipulative and they lie.." Yeah, asshole, that's the regulator's job to determine, not yours.
Are the kids living in fear? Are all of them exhibiting the same sort of automatism that's common in cults? Are they malnourished or being given drugs such as SSRIs willy-nilly, without respect to whatever actual mental problems they may have? That's not okay. It's time to shut the place down.
And that's what will happen as the result of actually enforcing laws: mass shutdowns and arrests. What happens in these places is fundamentally wrong and child abuse is still illegal. It's just a matter of getting the cops to do their jobs.
Now, if there are still some places after THAT that are still around.. let 'em go. They're not the target.
-
You see when I have been checking out fornits, my impression has been, geez all these justifiably angry people, but they don't seem to be doing anything about the problem other than sharing their stories on this page.
You make an excellent point about what qualities are neccesary in an effective activist. There are some people who can be the public face of the issue and advocate effectively, where someone will actually pay attention to what they have to say. However, everyone here has at least something to contribute.
Not trying to plug our organization too much, but CAFETY is trying to organize all the "activist" groups working on this issue, and get them to pool their efforts. It's suprising just how few people are really out there talking to political figures about this issue, but we are working on increasing public awareness. Hopefully, that will soon change.
Fornits is not an advocacy group. It's a message board.
-
I know people that could get someone out of a foreign program...
the problem is I dare not make that request unless I know FOR SURE its a bad place and FOR SURE the kid is being fucked up and FOR SURE he/she has a relative to take him in.
Yes, Im serious. No, not mercs, but close. Can't give any real details else I'd lose the ability to deny it and say I'm just bullshitting to joke around...
It is rather sad that we have even come to thinking this way, is it not? What I do not understand is given that the GOP is up to its armpits in this shit, but the DNC doesnt crucify them politically over this??
Someone let them know well before the 08 election. Yeah, its partisan bullshit, but if it stops the abuse, and the people responsible for it suffer... go for it. Its not like the GOP hasnt fucked over teenage kids before recently, DIRECTLY, now is it?
-
I know people that could get someone out of a foreign program...
the problem is I dare not make that request unless I know FOR SURE its a bad place and FOR SURE the kid is being fucked up and FOR SURE he/she has a relative to take him in.
Yes, Im serious. No, not mercs, but close. Can't give any real details else I'd lose the ability to deny it and say I'm just bullshitting to joke around...
It is rather sad that we have even come to thinking this way, is it not? What I do not understand is given that the GOP is up to its armpits in this shit, but the DNC doesnt crucify them politically over this??
Someone let them know well before the 08 election. Yeah, its partisan bullshit, but if it stops the abuse, and the people responsible for it suffer... go for it. Its not like the GOP hasnt fucked over teenage kids before recently, DIRECTLY, now is it?
Teenage kids don't vote. So why should they give a fuck. And don't fool yourself into thinking the dems are any better. When a party gets into power, they fuck shit up. ANY party. I say burn it all down.
-
I know people that could get someone out of a foreign program...
the problem is I dare not make that request unless I know FOR SURE its a bad place and FOR SURE the kid is being fucked up and FOR SURE he/she has a relative to take him in.
Yes, Im serious. No, not mercs, but close. Can't give any real details else I'd lose the ability to deny it and say I'm just bullshitting to joke around...
It is rather sad that we have even come to thinking this way, is it not? What I do not understand is given that the GOP is up to its armpits in this shit, but the DNC doesnt crucify them politically over this??
Someone let them know well before the 08 election. Yeah, its partisan bullshit, but if it stops the abuse, and the people responsible for it suffer... go for it. Its not like the GOP hasnt fucked over teenage kids before recently, DIRECTLY, now is it?
Teenage kids don't vote. So why should they give a fuck. And don't fool yourself into thinking the dems are any better. When a party gets into power, they fuck shit up. ANY party. I say burn it all down.
At least the DNC isnt up to its elbows in this shit like the GOP is.
And yes, you are right. Good politics is blaming the problem on the people who dont vote and making the voters believe it.
urgh
-
The problem's hard to define, isn't it? I'll field this one.
Anyone carrying out child abuse like this at home will get arrested. See what happened in Florida. Some douchebag locked his kid in his room, installed video surveillance all around the house, etc, etc.. welcome to jail, asshole.
It's simply about equal enforcement of the laws. Anything that a parent can't do at home, a private party shouldn't be able to do either. Withholding of food and water, child labor, constant emotional and physical abuse through a wide variety of insane demands and threats.. sorry guys, that's illegal. Welcome to jail. It's simply that somehow this has all become okay when the children are institutionalized.
The real goal is to make sure police, regulatory officials, and everyone else thoroughly understand that it's still not okay. This is the real goal. Once that is established, everything else follows.
Are they locking kids up and passing themselves off as a mental health facility? This shouldn't be legal, but if they claim to be a residential treatment facility, a "therapeutic boarding school", or anything else that even resembles either (these guys get slimy in this regard), they need to be licensed and regulated by the State. This means that the kids have the right to a psychiatric examination and a hearing before a judge; if they're not actually mentally ill, they can't be locked up like that, just as it is with a state facility. Regulation also means inspections, and also means independent interviews with the kids. "But they're manipulative and they lie.." Yeah, asshole, that's the regulator's job to determine, not yours.
Are the kids living in fear? Are all of them exhibiting the same sort of automatism that's common in cults? Are they malnourished or being given drugs such as SSRIs willy-nilly, without respect to whatever actual mental problems they may have? That's not okay. It's time to shut the place down.
And that's what will happen as the result of actually enforcing laws: mass shutdowns and arrests. What happens in these places is fundamentally wrong and child abuse is still illegal. It's just a matter of getting the cops to do their jobs.
Now, if there are still some places after THAT that are still around.. let 'em go. They're not the target.
so your goal in your own personal activism is to lobby and try to get government to come in and set up new bureaucracy that will allow kids to see judges before being locked up and then interviewees coming to the program to interview the kid and make sure everything is on the up and up... is that pretty much correct?
dont you think parents could already be doing this job if they really gave a shit... couldn't they visit the facility and act as a regulator themselves if they chose to? what you are saying is that parents cannot be trusted with the power to send kids away, and that judges and govt. employees can. i see the point... not sure whether i agree or disagree.
but what if becauase of this regulation parents now thought programs were safer, they probably would, right? so maybe now that the govt is watching over your kid, maybe more parents will send their child to a program, this would definitely be an unintended side effect but I think it is very real. also where does the money to employ all these judges and regulators come from.. do you tax everybody or just the rich parents who use programs? does the state provide 'transport' for the kid or can they stil hire private kidnappers?
why wouldn't programs be able to fool the state like they sometimes fool parentS? ive read about how the upper level kids at programs are told to say how wonderful the program is, and they give tours and make it sound lovely. they will even bring the highest level kids to city meetings involving regulation to boast about how great the program is... so how do you prevent programs ffrom fooling the govt like this, as they currently are doing now? couldnt this type of regulation be a double edged sword, because parents believe the regulation is protecting their kid, when in fact it's business as usual, so the end result is more kids in programs but no real difference.
-
dont you think parents could already be doing this job if they really gave a shit... couldn't they visit the facility and act as a regulator themselves if they chose to?
Well when i personally visited the "boarding school" i was sent to with my parents it looked like it was a fine and dandy place. We got to interview a few students who made it seem like they loved it there (later i found out they were threatened with "consequences", as was I when I was interviewed by parents.) They made up stuff here and exaggerated stuff there, and put up a good enough show for the 1hr tour to make me think I would like it there. It fooled me. It fooled my parents. It would fool pretty much anybody.
Also, NO they cannot visit whenever they want. I wasn't even allowed to talk to my parents for the first month. After that it was supervised with staff's finger on the phone so they could cut you off any time they wanted if they thought you were being "manipulative". eeh. Don't blame the parents. 95% were conned.
why wouldn't programs be able to fool the state like they sometimes fool parentS? ive read about how the upper level kids at programs are told to say how wonderful the program is, and they give tours and make it sound lovely. they will even bring the highest level kids to city meetings involving regulation to boast about how great the program is... so how do you prevent programs ffrom fooling the govt like this, as they currently are doing now? couldnt this type of regulation be a double edged sword, because parents believe the regulation is protecting their kid, when in fact it's business as usual, so the end result is more kids in programs but no real difference.
This is very true. I don't trust government beaurocracy to get anything done well, if at all. A false sense of security is a dangerous thing as well.
On the other hand, if it is done competantly, it might help curb abuse.
Perhaps inspectors (at random times) could interview children (selected by the inspectors) from programs confidentially, ensuring them safety should they report abuse. Sure a few are likely to lie, but if their stories don't line up, you know they are lying. If you get repeated stories of the same type of thing, you take action and shut the program down (cops come, collect evidence, etc...).
I doubt it would happen though. People in the US don't like the feds getting too intrusive.
-
the facilities need there admissions guidelines clearly defined. you can't throw a kid suffering from sexual abuse or ADD in with a child who's homicidal and apply the exact same treatment, which is what to many programs do. deviant peer influence occurs, and a child with ADD could leave treatment with a whole new set of problem behaviors. Residential treatment needs to be considered as a last resort, and admissions have to be strictly enforced. No "bending" of the rules to get a private pay patient into the facility.
-
i agree with all this what im asking is how do you practically implement it without making things worse?
-
so maybe now that the govt is watching over your kid, maybe more parents will send their child to a program
It doesn't work that way. If it did, you'd see a whole lot more programs submitting to licensing and regulation, just so they can impress parents. Actually a lot of the non-targets (non-abusive facilities) already do this- if nothing but to separate themselves from the hellholes. Or maybe they're run by sane people who believe in checks and balances and the idea that maybe their own staff should have another authority to fear.
Having a licensing and regulation system in place makes it easier to go after them when they commit abuses. It means cops breathing down their necks. It makes it way, way easier to get the ball rolling when these guys (inevitably) commit some atrocity.
It shouldn't take an atrocity, considering that what they do at base is legally categorizable as abuse (treating kids like hostages, brainwashing, forced "therapy"), but that's what usually gets the places closed.
The real problem is when states like Utah and Montana implement bogus regulation that doesn't actually address the problem, or simply never implement enforcement, because the programmies influenced enough politicians for them not to.
also where does the money to employ all these judges and regulators come from..
This argument's a non-starter. If the government doesn't have the money to protect vulnerable citizens, what the hell are we paying it for? In a nod to Ginger I'll say to take it out of the counter-narcotics budget.
Alternatively, if these guys don't like real authorities enforcing such things as, well, laws, and want to have their facilities made completely law-free zones, that's more than fine with me. I don't even really need to explain what happens then; use your imagination, kids. I'll make a competition out of it and upload the results to YouTube. (no TKing please)
Law or lawlessness? Pick one, programmies. I can deal with either.
-
If it did, you'd see a whole lot more programs submitting to licensing and regulation, just so they can impress parents.
you mean like in montana where three out of five of the regulators are represented by programs... and the politicians involved in the process own programs themselves? it already happened. spring creek lodge owned by wwasps in montana is a regulated facility, by the state.
-
Having a licensing and regulation system in place makes it easier to go after them when they commit abuses. It means cops breathing down their necks. It makes it way, way easier to get the ball rolling when these guys (inevitably) commit some atrocity.
you already know that they can pass sham regulation and nobody knows the difference. cops in small towns where programs are.. well they dont even have cops, they have a sherriff or two, and they aren't in a hurry to shut down a big income source for their town and piss off their drinking buddies. maybe they even dont mind the extra cash from bringing back runaways.
cops breathing down the necks of the programs... dont you remember the cops breathing down the neck of that black kid who was murdered in florida by state employees?
-
Law or lawlessness? Pick one, programmies. I can deal with either.
thats great for a fictional character on the internet but those of us in the real world dont want to end up in a private prison, employed by ibm making circuit boards for 25 cents an hour for the next twenty five years only to prove the programmies right about how crazy we all are.
-
It shouldn't take an atrocity, considering that what they do at base is legally categorizable as abuse (treating kids like hostages, brainwashing, forced "therapy"), but that's what usually gets the places closed.
and yet they dont enforce the laws today. even when the horror stories of people like that kid in the wwasp documentary come to light, the perpetrator is not held responsible... i dont get this? if some guy accuses a priest of abusing him twenty years ago it gets investigated, why not one year ago? i agree with what you say i just dont know why they dont do it already if they really wanted to. it seems they are actively working against protecting the kids to serve their business and political interests. how can you change that paradigm? because even with programs with patterns of regular abuse and even deaths they arent investigated but also have more customers than ever.
-
If you're going to reply to me, use one fucking post please.
I already addressed the Utah/Montana/bogus regulation issue in the first post on this page. Did you intentionally skip that?
A lot of the time, they do get shut down by locals.
http://www.rickross.com/reference/teenb ... boot3.html (http://www.rickross.com/reference/teenboot/teenboot3.html)
Rural Arizona + death + local sheriff with common sense = shutdown. Why? Because they figured out what the hell they were really doing there. Local yokels- small-town sheriffs, local councilmen, etc- generally aren't sadistic or even complicit. Most of them would be horrified if they understood what was being done. They just don't know how to investigate properly, or why such a thing would be required.
Treating local authorities as being somehow complicit with any of it isn't going to help. They're being manipulated. It's our job to reverse that.
Even in the case of the Florida boot camp, when serious authorities found out what was going on, the people higher on the food chain than the people committing the abuse knew they had to stop it. They had something to lose, politically.
Also, there's a major, major difference between a "licensing" system that gives them a piece of paper and a free ride and a serious investigative and regulatory branch that issues licenses only when they know what's going on.
The way to destroy these places is to break their secrecy. Lawsuits, testimony, public releases of information, and police raids. If you listen to the propaganda and the bullshit they put out, they sound like they're invincible.
And yet, when they come here to Fornits, they're terrified, because what they're doing is fundamentally wrong and usually illegal, and they know that we know it.
I'm not going to reply to this thread anymore. You want to figure out how to do it? Go to the other thread.
-
Treating local authorities as being somehow complicit with any of it isn't going to help. They're being manipulated. It's our job to reverse that.
they are corrupt i've been through the system of regulated and private programs myself and they are intertwined. nobody here is being manipulated except the kids.
Even in the case of the Florida boot camp, when serious authorities found out what was going on, the people higher on the food chain than the people committing the abuse knew they had to stop it. They had something to lose, politically.
the medical examiner covered it up. the only reason people looked into it was because there was a video of the kid getting beat to death and that is what interested the news. if therew as no video there would have been no outrage. like you said, it's about politics.. .not about wanting to help kids. if it happens in the dark it's a-okay with the govt.
The way to destroy these places is to break their secrecy. Lawsuits, testimony, public releases of information, and police raids. If you listen to the propaganda and the bullshit they put out, they sound like they're invincible.
what secret? all it takes is a google search, and even president bush knows how to do that. documentaries, news exposes, magaizine exposes, primetime news coverage, book tv coverage, several books... dude, the secret is out to anyone who even has an ounce of curiosity. the world knows, the secrets out, and the parents are still calling and this needs to be part of the equation.
I'm not going to reply to this thread anymore.
okay but if you are going to talk about activism and how people need to do stuff dont you think you should be able to offer some sort of solution that can stand up to criticism.
-
Anon,
You just cited a case in which regulations were useful. Unfortunately, it didn't save Andersen's life, but helped bring the truth to light.
Do you think those guys voluntarily installed those cameras? Some higher authority required it.
There has always been, and will always be hell holes for parents to send their kids to whether public, private, religious. ?Reform? homes, Psych hospitals, Military academies. It?s as ?American? as apple pie. Look at the history. It didn't start with the War on Drugs, although that did excellerate the industry. TBSs/EGSs are just the next iteration, with a trendy spin.
We are the most aggressive and violent 'civilized' country on the planet. We try children as adults and send them to adult prisons, and put people to death who have IQs below 50. What's a little torture to a 'pain-in-the-ass' kid? And Mr and Mrs John Doe approve cause it keeps them safe from the 'helluns'. And, I disagree, the average American still knows nothing about the industry. Take a survey in your community.
They aren?t going away. They'll never be shut down en masse. May's well remove that pipe dream from the equation. So what are we left with. The unfortunate reality is.....
Public Education- don?t underestimate the influence of sites like Fornits. Many actions have stemmed from relationships formed here. Documentaries. Tip journalists. Inform your entire sphere of influence.
On that topic and re: Trolls. Venting is good, but doesn't serve the cause. If a troll posts, avoid playing into the diversion they are attempting to creat. Post a link to information or a previous discussion on that topic or anything of relevance that a parent might need to know, and be done with it.
Advocating Regulations- as we know, don't provide assurance of safety and respect, but there are benefits, as stated before, and could provide some protection. If it saves one kids life, who's going to be there with or without regulations, it's worth it.
Advocacy isn't for the faint of heart. It's a never ending journey. A long-term commitment, sometimes with few rewards. You find the thing YOU feel is important and do it. It doesn't matter if anyone else approves. Change will come by attacking from all angles.
As for kids having rights and allowed a hearing before placement? not going to happen. The ICPC would ensure that they're evaluated and that it's been determined that services aren't available locally. It's not happening, as we know. Programs should be required to comply with the ICPC, even if it proves to only be a pain in the ass. A group of people could work on this alone. Contact the Secretariat for advice on what can be done. Inform ICPC of how many programs are operating in violation. Take one at a time. Government workers are easily overwhelmed. Like like 10 second sound bites.
I know some are opposed to regulation. But, it?s one tangible thing you can do. I don't know how much Federal regulation will help, but state regulation can be useful in the ways I expressed early. For instance, if every state adopted regs for TBSs like Utah now has, it would 'legally' limit the kinds of kids they could take. Utah has basically limited TBSs to glorified babysitters. If a child is seriously distressed, they must be placed in a 'more appropriate' setting (RTC) which has stricter regs.
http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=19064 (http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=19064)
Here's the section that defines what type of kid can and can not be admitted to a TBS.
i. A therapeutic school shall not admit or provide services to an individual who:
A. has a recent history (within the past 2 years) of attempting suicide or making serious self-harm gestures (requiring medical or therapeutic treatment),
B. has a psychosis, schizophrenia, severe depression, mental retardation, or a severe mental illness (requiring medical or therapeutic treatment),
C. is violent, highly combative, or physically or sexually aggressive,
D. presents substantial security risks,
E. requires medical detoxification,
F. lacks the ability to engage in a rational decision-making process or exhibits severely impaired judgment, or
G. has a history of repeated runaway attempts or incidents;
ii. A therapeutic school shall expel a client who exhibits high risk behavior or conditions, including but not limited to a client who:
A. attempts suicide or makes serious self-harm gestures (requiring medical or therapeutic treatment),
B. has a psychosis, schizophrenia, severe depression, mental retardation, or a severe mental illness (requiring medical or therapeutic treatment),
C. is violent, highly combative, or physically or sexually aggressive,
D. presents substantial security risks,
E. requires medical detoxification,
F. lacks the ability to engage in a rational decision-making process or exhibits severely impaired judgment,
G. runs away or attempts to runaway more than two times,
H. uses or attempts to use illegal substances (including but not limited to drugs or alcohol) more than two times, or
I. exhibits any other behavioral or emotional conditions that require more intense supervision and treatment than that permitted in a therapeutic school;
-
Do you think those guys voluntarily installed those cameras? Some higher authority required it.
Very small, long range cameras with transmitters, phone taps, bugs, etc. can all be imported from abroad. If you have the cash you can spring 50k and get a laser-mic capable of listening in on any window you can point it at.
Once you get the information, send it off to the press, release torrents of it on the net anonymously (yes there are ways of doing this). Send it to the parents, the former parents, and the students. Broadcast the abuse for all the world to see in its raw, uncensored form.
All that is needed is somebody with the know how and the cash. Programs could drop like flies. Who gives a damn about legal consequences. Who in the world would prosecute you for exposing things like that, and even if they did it would be worth it. We're talking about peoples lives being destroyed here.
It does not matter if the surveilance obtained is valid in court. Evidence can be confirmed by secondary sources (such as witnesses, confessions, survivors, or the cops raiding the place).
Call it vigilante journalism but it would work.
-
And Mr and Mrs John Doe approve cause it keeps them safe from the 'helluns'. And, I disagree, the average American still knows nothing about the industry. Take a survey in your community.
;
Great post Deb. I dont live in your part of the world and when i am there this is hardly a polite dinner party topic so i have never asked, but do people really think that this industry keeps them safe from "helluns". I could understnad if they felt that these damn kids need a kick in the pants etc because you hear this everywhere. But given that the kids who go to these places are usually minors are they really feared by the general populace? Or do people imagine that these schools are much more caring and "therapudic" than they are?
-
And Mr and Mrs John Doe approve cause it keeps them safe from the 'helluns'. And, I disagree, the average American still knows nothing about the industry. Take a survey in your community.
;
Great post Deb. I dont live in your part of the world and when i am there this is hardly a polite dinner party topic so i have never asked, but do people really think that this industry keeps them safe from "helluns". I could understnad if they felt that these damn kids need a kick in the pants etc because you hear this everywhere. But given that the kids who go to these places are usually minors are they really feared by the general populace? Or do people imagine that these schools are much more caring and "therapudic" than they are?
It's a culture of fear. You create a boogie man to scare people into buying what makes them "safe". Commonly, this phenomenon is known as FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt). Programs scare parents into believing thier kids will end up dead-insane-injail and they fork over the dough to "fix" the kids. Whether they believe it or not at the beginning, after the kids start "acting out" in program, they usually fall for it, and at the same time are glad they don't have to deal with it. It's the same principle of any government contractor: make sure a "problem" exists so you can keep "fixing" it.
-
programs like wwasps go even beyond fear based marketing and high pressure sales tactics.. they are a cult. the parents after going to seminars think they are helping kids. they all think they are saving the world. its not just about fear, but about an irrational expectation of a robotic like kid. stepford kids is what they are after, so there is a degree of selfishness to parents who want to see their kid change... even when there really isn't anything wrong with them. some parents just dont like their kids they way they are.
wwasps is a cult, they have their fanatics, they are organized and have lots of money and use it to shut people up by force. parents think its great but its nothing new. i was watching this show on exorcism and evnagelicism last night, there are peopke who believe in exorcisms. they showed a church and this 'trainer' was doing it to people and through the power of expectations and his psychological games they played into it. it reminded me of the seminars at wwasps. stupid fools giving up control of their own mind because they can't deal with the upheaval the trainer tries to instigate in your own head. too many people have given up control of their own thoughts and mind and succomb to our society's version of group think. i agee with the above poster's description for sure.
-
i agee with the above poster's description for sure. and the one before that.
these places create issues, ignore existing ones if they're not makin' it worse.
-
Lon, you the machine making man, woodbury
http://www.lymesite.com/CEDU%20resource ... ementf.htm (http://www.lymesite.com/CEDU%20resourcesforfindingnewplacementf.htm)
-
Don't go poking around that site unless you want hot rage.
-
What is CEDU?
I volunteer as the spokesperson, really. I am quite articulate, educated and a Straight escapist. Yeah baby, I'm a Cop Out, and a Misbehaver of the Highest order (puff puff). But I don't think it will do any good to say anything anymore. I personally propose that we decide on a time and place, all meet up at once, and go kidnap Sembler. Then, his wife has to pay back every cent of every parent's money that ever had a child in the Program, or we do what angry people really want to do, and then when she runs out of money, the government of every state that allowed a Program to operate within its borders continues to pay until ALL the monies are returned. And that should be our only demand. Financially ruin him, and everyone like him, because we the people said so, or pay the consequences. Now. Of course, we better get guns to back up our words, because those people are protected by people with guns, and basically we wouId all just get shot, so really, do you think this shit is ever going to change? Don't get me wrong, I am Full On the Real Deal motherfuckers, but I just don't think any of you have the balls (ovaries) to actual do anything but talk.
So, I personally am getting the fuck out of America as quickly as I possibly can, because these programs are just the tip of the iceburg kids, and there are far worse things about to happen, soon. I have little hope for the situation, short of Divine intervention, or contact with extraterrestrials. Now, if we could get the aliens on our side, all those suit wearing office working pussies that are running the world might actually listen to us. And believe me they are real. The truth IS out there! I saw it for myself, and I see clearly the people that are keeping it from us. You cannot convince or wait for or even trust Them to do what is right, or They would already have done it.
So, here it is. The call to arms. I Invoke the true God given right of all free men and women who are the children of the Earth to protect themselves from physical or psychological harm. The American Government and every organization that it supports or draws strength from is now our official declared enemy, and is a cancer that must be cut from the body of the World, before it spreads further. Yes, this is treason, and I want you all to spread the word, really. Just start saying to everyone "The time is now for us to overthrow our government, are you with us or against us?" I mean it. Coworkers, people in the checkout line, police officers, your mom, anybody. If they say they're with us, then point them to this site, and tell them to await instructions, if they say they are not, well, you probably better tell them you were joking, but try and trick them into giving you their name so we can enter it into OUR data base. I also very much suggest that if any of you have any contacts in any foriegn nations that could help us out with weapons, then get them on the horn.
Time has come, you are called out, now what?!
(silence)
-
That's what I thought. I was just kidding anyway (shhh...not really). Get over it, and move on. The aliens are real though.
-
It is CEDUs policy to provide no assistance whatsoever to students who are departing under such circumstances. This policy does not grow out of cruelty or heartlessness, but out of one of the key tenets of a CEDU education: every act has a consequence. For students who say they are determined to do it on their own, we believe that being on their own has to start as they walk away from us. Sometimes the difficulty merely of getting into town is sufficient to cause them to realize the enormity of what they have done. Any employee assisting a student to leave a CEDU school against parental wishes is subject to discipline, up to and including immediate termination of employment. Thats how seriously we take it. New employees are trained to this standard and all of us are regularly reminded to provide no help to a student going walk-about.
-
Jesus I'm glad CEDU is out of business.
I amend my statement. If you don't want hot rage, don't read Fornits.
-
Jesus I'm glad CEDU is out of business.
I amend my statement. If you don't want hot rage, don't read Fornits.
Yes but their clones are all over the place. Where do you think the staff went. They're more resiliant than cockroaches. It's like trying to break mercury with a hammer.