Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Anonymous on July 16, 2006, 06:33:15 PM
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One of my most beloved friends got sent to Cross Creek Manor for girls in Southern Utah today. She has a history of substance abuse (meth, alchohol, lsd, cocaine, etc), a mild case of anorexia, and borderline personality disoder.
I've done some research, and most of the information about Cross Creek was horrific. What can you guys tell me about it?
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One of my most beloved friends got sent to Cross Creek Manor for girls in Southern Utah today. She has a history of substance abuse (meth, alchohol, lsd, cocaine, etc), a mild case of anorexia, and borderline personality disoder.
I've done some research, and most of the information about Cross Creek was horrific. What can you guys tell me about it?
To set what follows in perspective, realize that, contrary to most here, I think that some programs are good for some people. And, I do know a number of different programs.
IF your friend's only "issues" were drug abuse, mild anorexia and borderline personality, I don't know that I'd necessarily recommend anything more than an Outward Bound experience to build self esteem, preceeded with a medically-supervised drug program, and followed with regular AA/NA meetings and perhaps a psychiatrist or psychologist to address BPD.
Under no condition I can imagine would I ever recommend Cross Creek - for anybody except perhaps the owners. Since it seems rather easy to find not-so-good things about it, and hard to find anything other than its own promotional stuff positive, that alone should suggest something. Look at the topics in the WWASPS section of this board.
To help your friend, if you can you would do her and her parents a service by bringing what you find to the attention of her parents.
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thank you for your imput...
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Not even ST can tolerate that place and that's REALLY saying something...!
http://www.strugglingteens.com/news/let ... anche.html (http://www.strugglingteens.com/news/lettertoeditor/hardyblanche.html)
Vendetta. Find your friend's mother, get her next to a computer, and show her every piece of information you can possibly find. DO NOT WAIT. Go to her mother now, make sure you hve time to talk, and calmly expose this place for what it is.
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Not even ST can tolerate that place and that's REALLY saying something...!
http://www.strugglingteens.com/news/let ... anche.html (http://www.strugglingteens.com/news/lettertoeditor/hardyblanche.html)
Vendetta. Find your friend's mother, get her next to a computer, and show her every piece of information you can possibly find. DO NOT WAIT. Go to her mother now, make sure you hve time to talk, and calmly expose this place for what it is.
ST going against a program speaks volumes.
Either, volumes of cash were given to ST by their competetors (most likely) or theres a reasonable chance CCM might fall under leagal problems, if not all of WWASPS completely.
Either way, it takes a lot of SOMETHING for ST to say any program is 'bad' at all.
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Vendetta, my reply came three minutes after yours. Are you reading this? (And are you for real? We get a number of trolls and fakers, I apologize for asking.)
Get the real information in front of her parents as fast as you possibly can. Cross Creek is a hellhole and WWASPS facilities get shut down regularly for abuse.
Make no mistake. Your friend is in serious danger.
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I'm very much for real.. And I guess I'm going to talk to her parents tomorrow night.
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Then be sure you do a lot of research right NOW.
Start with this:
http://www.helpyourteens.com/news/cross ... duate.html (http://www.helpyourteens.com/news/cross_creek_manor-story_of_a_graduate.html)
(Yes. I know. The link is from PURE. Let's deal with the Sue Scheff business AFTER this girl is out of there, okay?)
Now go here:
http://www.angelfire.com/ex/alexcross/index.html (http://www.angelfire.com/ex/alexcross/index.html)
I wouldn't even wait until tomorrow. I'd get up bright and early tomorrow morning and confront them then. (If you're usually a late sleeper the unexpected urgency on your part might spark action.)
If nothing else at least try to get her parents to read Fornits.
Vendetta's friend's mother, are you reading this? Do you know *why* I have the name Milk Gargling Death Penalty? That's because people like the people who run Cross Creek killed a girl for gargling milk. In real life.
We have a lot of people on this board who have been severely hurt by WWASPS. Do not let your daughter be among them. Pull her IMMEDIATELY.
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Last post was mine, obviously.
I have no direct personal stake in your daughter's future, nor do I have any financial motivation. The place is a hellhole and that's God's honest truth.
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Thank you for this rude awakening.
I have read a few horrific stories about that place already, but they seemed so intense that I suspected them to be an exaggeration.
I am seventeen, while my close friend (let's call her girl A) is sixteen.
Her mother is a nurse.
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Well if she's a nurse then she can definitely understand the ethics- or maybe I should say lack thereof- involved here.
Girl A's mother: They are going to feed you a huge line of crap about "manipulation" and "disgruntled" people once you decide to pull her.
When the choice is between several survivors' (yes, that term is accurate) testimony and the word of an organization that has had multiple facilities shut down for abuse and wants a considerable amount of your money, who do you think is telling the truth?
Your daughter will not be helped in any way shape or form there. She will instead be subjected to intense humiliation and emotional abuse. The stories are in fact real, and the fact that even countries such as Mexico and the Czech Republic have closed down WWASPS facilities should really say something.
Do not try to contact your daughter by the phone for accurate information. Her conversation will be monitored and she will be threatened. Listen to her after she's out.
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Thank you for this rude awakening.
I have read a few horrific stories about that place already, but they seemed so intense that I suspected them to be an exaggeration.
I am seventeen, while my close friend (let's call her girl A) is sixteen.
Her mother is a nurse.
Her mom is a PROFESSIONAL and fell for that shit?
You might want to smack her for the lapse of common sense, just FYI. With an OAR.
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Thank you for this rude awakening.
I have read a few horrific stories about that place already, but they seemed so intense that I suspected them to be an exaggeration.
I am seventeen, while my close friend (let's call her girl A) is sixteen.
Her mother is a nurse.
Her mom is a PROFESSIONAL and fell for that shit?
You might want to smack her for the lapse of common sense, just FYI. With an OAR.
Yeah....
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@Vendetta - i suggest contacting the parents and sending them some resources to check for themselves...
http://www.isaccorp.org/index.html (http://www.isaccorp.org/index.html)
http://www.wwaspinfo.com/default.php (http://www.wwaspinfo.com/default.php)
http://wwaspswatter.awardspace.info/ (http://wwaspswatter.awardspace.info/)
http://tbfight.com/ (http://tbfight.com/)
http://www.antiwwasp.com/ (http://www.antiwwasp.com/)
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If you don't have the program already, download BitTorrent and you can download a documentary about WWASP for free.
Currently it's available at
http://www.torrentportal.com/details/40 ... 0x%29.html (http://www.torrentportal.com/details/408715/Tranquility+Bay+-+WWASP+Behaviour+Modification+Camps+%282005-TVRip-d0x%29Tranquility+Bay+-+WWASP+Behaviour+Modification+Camps+%282005-TVRip-d0x%29.html) (5 seeders)
http://www.mininova.org/tor/262269 (http://www.mininova.org/tor/262269) (2 seeders)
You can burn this on a CD and give this to his parents to watch. If you need help with BitTorrent and downloading it there is a thread about it all here.
http://wwf.avigation.net/viewtopic.php? ... y&start=30 (http://wwf.avigation.net/viewtopic.php?t=14600&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=wwasp+documentary&start=30)
Good luck.
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Did the OP drop off the face of the earth?
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4 seeders on mininova now.
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Vendetta, where the hell did you go?
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All the talking did absolutely nothing..
Her parents went with her and spent about 3 days in orientation, and decided it was a safe enough environment for her to stay in.
All of my 'evidence' and pleas did absolutely nothing for the situation.
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You've got to be fucking kidding me.
Did you get them to read.. oh, I don't know.. this thread?
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Please don't patronize me, I did all I could... I've used information discussed by this thread, as well as my own research.. and it didn't make a difference.
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Backup malk Gargler, no one can make people listen to information they are not willing to hear
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Please don't patronize me, I did all I could... I've used information discussed by this thread, as well as my own research.. and it didn't make a difference.
Welcome to the club. Really sucks to see brainwashed people put their kid away without any contact with the outside world in a prison/cult like environment and fuck them up, doesn't it?
I wish I could say it gets better, but it doesnt. You just get more calloused.
Id like to believe you're a troll, but even if you're not, there are thousands of kids getting shipped off as we speak. So, yeah... you gotta learn to detach or you'll go insane.
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I don't think this thread would be the place I'd send a parent to reconsider.
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Id like to believe you're a troll, but even if you're not, there are thousands of kids getting shipped off as we speak. So, yeah... you gotta learn to detach or you'll go insane.
It's kind of really fucking hard to detach from someone you've known for about 4 years now, and have watched this someone go from bad to worse to fucking Cross Creek...
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last post was mine. :roll:
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I don't think this thread would be the place I'd send a parent to reconsider.
Of course not, it tells it like it is, it doesnt give the parents a way out to save face or give them the chance to play the victim, and it doesnt sugarcoat.
Oh, and I guess a bunch of scarred people (scarred by the very programs) are just too damned gritty for them to deal with :roll:
Why the hell cant they think of their own kids instead of themselves? Thats the most exasperating thing of all. How the hell can you be so easily tricked as to send your kid off to a bunch of strangers without any communication for A YEAR and think thats 'good for them'?
The first time I heard of any program it scared and sickened me. I dont know who the hell would think of any of them as good, unless its just a way to ditch their kid and their worry about their kid for their own sake so they can say "well, I did whats best for them!" as an excuse to themselves more than anyone else and go on about their life while they throw ten thousand dollars to a program.
:( Sometimes I want to give up, but then I realize theres 10k+ people trapped in places like that and it would be weak of me for me to take the easy way out just like the people Im mad at for doing so themselves, but theres not a whole lot I can do right now.
Oh well, Ill go kick myself around for not knowing what to say to 'vendetta' and letting another kid slip through while thousands and thousands of people are living in constant fear and mental anguish and periodic attacks to their body and mind, while some parents whine for attention in group and someone says that we're doing it wrong.
Oh what a world we're in.
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Id like to believe you're a troll, but even if you're not, there are thousands of kids getting shipped off as we speak. So, yeah... you gotta learn to detach or you'll go insane.
It's kind of really fucking hard to detach from someone you've known for about 4 years now, and have watched this someone go from bad to worse to fucking Cross Creek...
If you dont, it will eat you alive. Ive been aware of programs and doing what I can to stop them for 2 years and sometimes I dont know if I want to just run screaming into the woods and never come out or just shoot people more, but then I realize that at least I can say that out loud without being thrown in OP for weeks, beaten up, busted down levels and made to humiliate myself in a seminar every 6 weeks. Unfortunately the way things are going you have to watch what you say when you vent verbally or you might get baker acted and thrown into one of the mental hospitals owned by these conglomerates :roll:
Its going to be hard, and youre going to need to get a thick skin, or from the bottom of my heart, the only advice I can give you is get out and forget all about this before you get in too deep, because if you cant handle it, it will eat you alive. Im just barely handling it and sometimes wish I had never read about Tranquility Bay back in 2004.
But you know what? This has been going on for 30 years, its creeping into the medical 'buisness' community, school, public policy, politics... it has pretty competely and deeply infected this country and the worst part is if you tell anyone, they'll call you insane - or worse, some liberal twit looking for some issue to devote yourself to. Then you think about what youre going through and bitching about vs what the people in those programs are going through and that just makes you feel even worse about yourself.
Im not trying to scare you off or drama-queen it up, Im just telling you what to expect if you want to persue this. Dont feel bad about saying 'uncle' and running away. Thats the one thing everyone in those programs wishes they could do and wouldnt fault you for doing it.
I just dont want TWO people hurt by programs when at the very least I could spare you from getting fucked up by them, know what I mean? But if youre serious about doing something about this, youre gonna grow up really quick, and see the world in a completely different way. And no, theres no going back.
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Vendetta the best you can do now is try to get a letter to your friend, but most likely it would have to go through your parents. Back when I was in a wwasp prison they would give the parents stickers to give out to other family members who were 'approved' to send mail. If they are still doing that and you can get one of those stickers that might work. Best bet though is to piggyback your letter with her parents letter if this is possible. At this point I would just tell them you will be supporting them no matter what they do and that when they get out you will be there for them, no matter what, whether they graduate or walk. There's not much else you can do really. It's up to the parents of your friend whether they can leave now. It usually takes well over a year, more likely closer to two in order to graduate. If your friend is near 18, they will be given an option to walk, or take their exit plan at 18. It's a scary proposition though because they give you only a few dollars and a ride to town sometimes, to scare you into staying. If your friend new you were out there ready to help, no matter what wwasp tells them (they make up lies and encourage parents to as well) that would be a huge morale booster. Hopefully your friend is near the age of 18, that would be the best hope right now. Other than that, hope your friends parents are having financial trouble, that can get a teen home quick. Lastly, I guess you can try to convince them with all the writings and documentaries and press about abuse, but it seems they weren't open to that. This is a shitty, yet common situation. It is the goal of parents to break up friendships a lot of the time, I knew it was with mine. It worked, all my friends were gone when I came home. Hopefully, your friend won't become brainwashed and then befriend you on their own, which can sometimes happen too. That is one of the saddest things to see, when they seriously warp individuals and then they come home and become super self righteous, alienating themselves from everyone they used to knew. Then when they grow out of the brainwashing a few years later, they are all alone. Cross creek is not a good option, it's one of the worst. I hope your friend makes it through okay. A lot of us made it through some really shitty times at wwasps, and we are fine now. It sucks, but what can you do, the best thing you can do is just be there for your friend when they need you most... which might be soon or next year or something, you don't really know. Wish I had something more concrete to offer...
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Vendetta, I'm really sorry this happened to your friend.
I found out about this industry when one of my friends got shipped off to ASR.
Well, okay, first she was a friend of a bunch of friends, and the friends' concern spurred me, etc. She became a personal friend as a result of my keeping faith with wanting to get her out of there and never forgetting about her.
Anyway.
I know how helpless you must feel right now.
We weren't able to get my friend out of ASR until she "graduated."
She bought into the program and sounded like a robot for awhile. You have to, really, if you're sent to one of these places.
It's just that since she has a strong mind, she threw it off more quickly. Since she has the support of friends who knew all the time that it was bullshit, she threw it off more quickly.
Being able to throw off the brainwashing quickly is helping her recover, but it did damage her and recovery will take a long time.
My friend is comforted by knowing that her story may have helped convince other parents, even while she was still in that hellhole, not to send their own kids off.
The best thing you can do for your friend is keep her memory alive out here and try to prevent the same thing from happening to other kids.
See, your having been "activated" by what happened to her, and you helping stop it happen to other kids, is going to be the something good that comes out of her hell, to save other kids from that same hell.
All I can tell you is that that is going to mean something to her after she gets out.
One thing you can personally do for your friend is that if you can find things her parents say it's okay for her to have, you can ship it to her anonymously. What I found with ASR was the anonymous stuff that was pre-approved got in, because it didn't have a "forbidden" sender name attached to it.
What Jenny* said about mail censorship was, "They're not perfect. Sometimes stuff they wouldn't want to let through gets through anyway."
The more you try, the more chance something will get through. Keep copies of your letters. Reading them after she gets out and knowing she wasn't forgotten will mean the world to her.
Julie
* obviously not her real name.
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thanks, Julie and everyone else..
I'm going to talk to my friend's mother tomorrow..again..