Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: odie on June 30, 2006, 10:33:00 AM
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Okay anybody reading most of the rantings in most of these forums come to the conclusion that there are a lot of bad programs out there. But I don't see any solutions for these kids. I'd like to here something about where to send these kids with all the severe mental health issues and severe behavioral problems. And I don't want to hear just send them to a mental institution. There are far more abuses going on at these so called medical facilities then one can possibly imagine. I'd like to see specific places to send some of these kids so that parents that are at their wits end can have a glimmer of hope. It's one thing to get up on your soapbox and proclaim to the world how your opinion is the only one that matters because of how many degrees you have in this specialty area but its a different story to actually bring a solution to the table. So lets hear solutions only in this thread please. :wave:
I don't believe in God. My god is patriotism. Teach a man to be a good citizen and you have solved the problem of life.
--Andrew Carnegie, Scottish-born American industrialist and philanthropist
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Depends entirely on what's going on.
Kid hates you? There's no cure for that. Same way with "oppositional defiant disorder" and other make-believe illnesses. suck it up and deal. Change your parenting system. Ease the pressure. Focus on his future in the adult world. The kid is not, in fact, crazy.
Now if the kid is exhibiting truly psychotic or bizarre behavior, schizophrenia, etc, then it's time to talk to a serious shrink and and possibly antipsychotic or antidepressant drugs. We have entered the realm of mental health and treatment. Inpatient therapy is the very last resort but, if the kid's never needed it before, probably not necessary as a teenager.
And while the mental health system may be flawed, at LEAST there is legal oversight and there ARE people to go to in case of abuse.
Again, the real solution is always on a case-by-case basis.
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So long as parents see the solution as "where do I send my kid to get fixed" this problem will continue.
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It's not mine, or yours, or the governments place to find a solution for parents at their wits end.
But since your asking, the solution is to let parents deal with the mess they made, or the cards they were dealt. They chose to have kids, now they need to raise them, or adopt them out.
If "helpers" and "institutions" didn't exist they'd get real creative. Parenting in isolation doesn't work. The experiment is failing and all we hear is how can we prop it up and keep it going, another band-aid on a gapping wound.
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On 2006-06-30 09:47:00, Milk Gargling Death Penalty wrote:
"Depends entirely on what's going on.
Kid hates you? There's no cure for that. Same way with "oppositional defiant disorder" and other make-believe illnesses. suck it up and deal. Change your parenting system. Ease the pressure. Focus on his future in the adult world. The kid is not, in fact, crazy.
Now if the kid is exhibiting truly psychotic or bizarre behavior, schizophrenia, etc, then it's time to talk to a serious shrink and and possibly antipsychotic or antidepressant drugs. We have entered the realm of mental health and treatment. Inpatient therapy is the very last resort but, if the kid's never needed it before, probably not necessary as a teenager.
And while the mental health system may be flawed, at LEAST there is legal oversight and there ARE people to go to in case of abuse.
Again, the real solution is always on a case-by-case basis."
Well said!
:nworthy:
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While solutions are on a case by case basis, the biggest solution we can give or provide parents is EDUCATION. If we can provide education through stories and through experiences with each of these places, we can help them make the right choice for their child. They need to understand there is no end all miracle fix all cure, but there are *some* limited choices out there that can be of help.
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And what would those "some limited choices" be?
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I've posted in previous threads that i like the idea of Outward Bound's FAMILY trips. There is another program known as NOLS which is supposedly really good. I do not like any program that claims to "fix" troubled teens.
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Not too certain about Outward Bound, after reading about the death of the 12 year old boy in Florida, and the fact that Outward Bound is accepting court-appointments.
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I heard this Outward Bound program in Florida is NOT the same as the non-profit Outward Bound that's been leading adventure-education trips for 40 something years. They are in no way related.
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There are many other outward bound programs, yes they had a death at their florida Troubled TEEN facility. However most of their trips last anywhere from 8-28 days and are for families and individuals who want a "wilderness" experience.
The fact of the matter is that troubled teens is an industry and many companies like outward bound who didnt offer troubled teen programs before are now being roped into getting contracts with the department of juvenile justice as "wilderness therapy".
With ANY program that anyone gets involved with, the most important thing to remember is that if in any way you feel your SAFETY is compromised, then natually you remove yourself from the situation. Then you s h o u l d report what made you feel uncomfortable or unsafe to the head people of the organization.
Naturally, with any program or camp there is inherent risk. The difference is percieved risk verses actual risk. If you are going rock climbing, the percieved risk is that it is very dangerous and you could get hurt, fall and die. The actual risk with rock climbing is very low. The ropes are designed to hold weights up to 1 ton and even more. The ropes are tested for breaking strength before they are put on the market. The equipment such as harnesses, belay devices, anchors, and caribeaners are also tested for breaking strength. All will hold things like tractor trailer trucks.
The important thing to remember when considering risking your life is your safety. You may want to check your equipment for any signs of damage. Check a helmet for cracks, check your bike for chain and gear problems, check the brakes of a bicycle if you are on a bicycle trip.
Camping and trail hiking and biking is a great pasttime. The difference between you doing it on your own and/or placing your child in a situation are the people involved. If a company hires people who are not qualified to perform the duties other than a glorified babysitter, the outcome is going to be that of a glorified babysitter, placing your child at more actual risk than percieved risk.
Proper use of equipment does not cause death, its human error and lack of knowledge in how to use equipment. Again I reiterate that i dont endorse any Troubled TEEN program as i know that there are unqualified staff at these programs.
[ This Message was edited by: mbnh31782 on 2006-06-30 16:33 ]
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Then the good Outward Bound should sue the living fuck out of the bad one for trademark infringement, as there is some serious marketplace confusion going on.
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http://www.outwardbound.com/ (http://www.outwardbound.com/)
Troubled teen program:
http://www.outwardbound.com/discovery.html (http://www.outwardbound.com/discovery.html)
"Wilderness & residential commitment programs for court-ordered committed delinquent youth in Florida and South Carolina."
Intercept:
http://www.outwardbound.com/discovery-intercept.html (http://www.outwardbound.com/discovery-intercept.html)
Intercept (formerly Ascent) offers year round wilderness expeditions for teens and young adults beginning to demonstrate destructive behavior.
Other on the court committed:
Commitment Programs for court-ordered committed delinquent youth throughout Florida and South Carolina.
STEP (Short-Term Expedition Program) - Yulee: 30-day wilderness programming for court-ordered committed delinquent males and females ages 14 to 18 years old from throughout the State of Florida. STEP operates out of Yulee, Florida.
Overlander Programs: 120 to 180 day residential programming for court-ordered committed delinquent males throughout Florida ages 12 to 18 that operate out of Century and Arcadia, Florida.
Re-Directions: A minimum of 30-day wilderness programming and follow-up for court-ordered committed delinquent youth on parole, probation or conditional release status from throughout South Carolina. Re-Directions currently operates out of Charleston, South Carolina
**************ALL TEXT AND LINKS TAKEN FROM OUTWARD BOUND SITE***********************
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Welllllll...as you have been told over and over: these kids placed in Wilderness programs (not the holly-family crap you are talking about) DO NOT have the ability to simply REMOVE THEMSELVES, OK?
That is the part you just don't seem to get, lady.
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I do understand that they dont have the power to remove themselves from the programs, but their parents do need to take some time and question the court's decision in the best interest of their own child.
I understand what COURT ORDER means, but there are ways someone can talk to a judge to help influence the decision whether or not to place the kid in a wilderness program. Again EDUCATION is key.
Thanks for being sooo sooo nice to me and not insulting my intelligence.
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Outward Bound should stick to the adventure education business and stay the fuck away from the adjudicated youth or troubled teen business. Their voluntary youth programs have an excellent track record as do the other programs for adults.
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Oh please, there have been deaths at wilderness therapy programs and ed cons and referral agents kept sending kids. In the Obsidian Trails restraint related death, parents actually wrote positive statements about OT, saying they felt the death, tragic as it was, was not the fault of OT. The Outward Bound Wilderness trips are voluntary, the kids can most certainly leave and they DO NOT accept adjudicated or troubled teens.
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"I can tell you this does not appear to be any type of traumatic death," Pellan said. "This looks like a medical cause."
A spokeswoman for All Children's Hospital declined to discuss details of the case, citing confidentiality laws.
Peak was "treated and discharged appropriately" from the DeSoto County hospital, said that hospital's spokeswoman, Annie Curnow.
"I can tell you that an array of tests were run," she said.
Outward Bound two weeks ago brought in environmental health specialists to evaluate the center and a campground where the boys had canoed earlier in the summer, Howard confirmed.
No public health risk has been found.
A check with the Centers for Disease Control shows that both strep and encephalitis infections can become severe and fatal.
Some 2 million cases of strep infection are reported each year, but only 9,000 cases are considered severe enough to be life-threatening, according to a report on the CDC's Web site.
Another CDC report indicates that encephalitis, which is borne by mosquitoes, can occur after or in combination with an unrelated infection.
Since Dillon's hospitalization, the Peace River facility moved boys from tents, which have wooden floors and house up to six campers, into dormitories, Howard said.
However, some of the boys may be moved back into the tents soon, once reports on environmental health are completed, he said.
The Peace River Outward Bound program is one of five juvenile rehabilitation programs operated by the contractor, Hurricane Island Outward Bound, based in Tallahassee.
The local facility is one of 10 residential facilities for low-risk juvenile offenders in the state. Low-risk offenders are typically those who have committed crimes no more serious than third-degree felonies.
The 35-bed Peace River facility currently houses 20 students and employs 25 staffers.
Typically, the facility's program takes six months to complete, but some boys take as long as a year, Howard said.
By GREG MARTIN
Staff Writer
Full Article Here
http://www.sun-herald.com/NewsArchive2/ ... tp2ch5.htm (http://www.sun-herald.com/NewsArchive2/062506/tp2ch5.htm?date=062506&story=tp2ch5.htm)
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http://www.djj.state.fl.us/Prevention/h ... sland.html (http://www.djj.state.fl.us/Prevention/hurricane_island.html)
Hurricane Outward BOund
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Hope the hospital didn't screw up.
:eek:
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You mis-speak: Outward Bound DOES take court-appointed kids. READ!!!!!!!!
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These programs DO NOT TAKE adjudicated youth. You are confusing the Intercept and Juvenile Justice Outward Bound Programs with these which are purely educational-adventure programs. Please try to see there is a HUGE DIFFERENCE.
http://outwardboundwilderness.org/age/youth.html (http://outwardboundwilderness.org/age/youth.html)
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Yes, that is correct. They DO NOT.
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Hurricane Outward Bound is NOT THE SAME as these programs. Hurricane Outward Bound is part of the Juvenile Justice System in Florida. The other programs (as shown below) are totally different and not part of any juvenile justice program. Get it?
http://outwardboundwilderness.org/age/youth.html (http://outwardboundwilderness.org/age/youth.html)
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This wasn't a restraint death like Mikey Wiltsie at Eckherd which runs adjudicated wilderness programs in Florida also. Wait for the autopsy. It may turn out as the news article suggested.
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think what I "get" is, if parent want their kids to go camping and hiking and possbily be safe, then the parents should take the kids THEMSELVES!
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Gee, that makes too much sense.
As for mental health treatment: whenever anyone is hospitalized, even when it is forced ( in California, at least)the first thing they are given is a list of their patient rights. Then, if the hospital wants to keep them longer than two weeks they are entitled to a court hearing and are assigned a representative. If they end up being conserved then they are assigned a conservator who can be a family member to represent the patient and their rights. A far cry from what the TBS' follow
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The solution is the liquid part after the precipitate has settled out.
Julie
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The solution is a jeep, a crate of MREs, an ammo box, and a deer hunting rifle.