Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Anonymous on April 02, 2006, 03:26:00 PM
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http://www.strugglingteens.com/artman/p ... 5282.shtml (http://www.strugglingteens.com/artman/publish/article_5282.shtml)
Inappropriate: Boot camps operate on a punishment model, and obtain compliance through fear of being punished by the authoritarian staff. Compliance is the goal, and the assumption is that if an inmate complies and does what is required, then somehow he/ she will change his/her thinking and internalize doing the right thing. To the functional adult or teen, the connection is quickly made. He/She rapidly learns how to avoid punishment and earn whatever rewards are offered by satisfying the drill sergeant type of staff. However, this often backfires with the struggling teen. A child placed in a boot camp for rebelling, will very likely rebel even more, thus leading to greater punishment, restraints and continuing conflict. Or, he/she learns how to suck up to staff, or "jail it," which means he/she appears to comply without changing his/her thinking, or he/she plots how to escape. All of these reactions are unhealthy and do not help the teen. While a "boot camp" philosophy might help a psychologically intact teen such as a typical military recruit, it will often further damage a child that has a psychiatric disorder or is emotionally immature.
Dangerous: In boot camps, the staff mentality is such that any form of resistance to their authority is considered a challenge, and interpreted as manipulation, malingering or laziness. The boot camp staff solution will usually be to increase the pressure on the child by incorporating more punishments, threats, restraints or physically roughing the kid up to obtain compliance. Considering the population, the staff may be right even 90 percent of the time in their assessment of the cause of the non-compliance. At those times, they are successful in forcing the child to greater exertion, but that does not necessarily help heal the self-destructive thinking. However, this success seems to make the staff complacent, because in boot camp situations where a child has died, the child was in real physical distress, but the staff were either punishing him/her or forcing him/her to greater exertion. Boot Camp staff seem to misread or overlook signs of real physical distress, and that is dangerous to the child.
There are better ways to work with a child who is making very poor decisions and needs residential intervention, ways that are more effective, appropriate and less dangerous. Perhaps the national publicity of this most recent tragedy will convince Congress and Legislatures to rethink their endorsements of boot camps and consider the approaches by the more respected private parent-choice network of Emotional Growth/ Therapeutic Schools and Programs talked about in this newsletter.
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...the staff mentality is such that any form of resistance to their authority is considered a challenge, and interpreted as manipulation, malingering or laziness. The...staff solution will usually be to increase the pressure on the child by incorporating more punishments, threats, restraints or physically roughing the kid up to obtain compliance.
This sounds EXACTLY like Hidden Lake Academy. Why does Lon continue the fraud of referring to that place knowing full well that this is their exact tactic?
Shame on you, Lon Woodbury, and shame on Hidden Lake Academy.
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On 2006-04-02 13:58:00, Anonymous wrote:
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...the staff mentality is such that any form of resistance to their authority is considered a challenge, and interpreted as manipulation, malingering or laziness. The...staff solution will usually be to increase the pressure on the child by incorporating more punishments, threats, restraints or physically roughing the kid up to obtain compliance.
This sounds EXACTLY like Hidden Lake Academy. Why does Lon continue the fraud of referring to that place knowing full well that this is their exact tactic?
Shame on you, Lon Woodbury, and shame on Hidden Lake Academy."
Yup- exactly like Mission Mountain School too...touted as one of the best...very upsetting...
Former alumni across various programs have been working on developing an alliance encouraging youth activism- please come and share!
http://www.cafety.org (http://www.cafety.org)[ This Message was edited by: katfish on 2006-04-02 14:03 ]
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The only difference between programs and bootcamps is programs dont rely on physical beatings nearly as much. Programs primarily use psychological and emotional means to get compliance. And, between the level system, the constant fear of losing levels and being punished, lack of contact with the outside world, the various mindfucks and buttom pushing on the part of staff and the seminars to a greater degree, along with other stuff like being watched 24/7 and forced disclosure, its more than sufficient. While the bootcamp kids simply want to avoid further pain and humiliation, the program kids are avoiding the same, together with a more effective means of breaking down their thinking and making them really believe the programming.
Plus, just as a sidenote here, everyone who Ive talked to whose been through the emotional AND the physical torment said the emotional shit was worse, so for those of you who wouldn't know personally, keep that in mind.
Not that its unheard of in programs, its just not as common, or as necessary. But it seems to be present - even if its merely a secondary role - to ensure PHYSICAL obedience of the student, and prevent escape attempts, or 'escalated' belligerance. What I mean is anyone could get pain-submission hold restrained, put in the pokey and put in stress positions, but its easier to avoid than in a bootcamp, which seems to be just confrontational humiliation and intimidation and being beaten up. Basicaly, the bootcamps are 'unsophisticated' but not that different.
Plus, the institutionalized programs just say its restraint to hide it and make it seem to be part of the institution instead of a much more obvious fear/humiliation based "camp" where youre beaten outright if you dont participate in your own humiliation.
That, combined with excellent control if information going in and out of programs (which is another part of the emotional stress, you cant tell your parents, family, or the authorities whats going on) they can hide it behind "alternative treatment" and throw emotional buzzwords around and prevent anyone from finding this out.
Its extremely frustrating for Lon to say this, but then again, whose surprised? Hell, his own website has censorhip and restriction of communication! Hes bought into what he wanted to hear, and every program continues to tell him what they want him to hear, and he plays along with controlling information so that criticism, and INFORMATION can not get out under his watch.
This WHOLE industry is based off of breaking down and repressing criticism and thought, and glorifying emotional and emotion-based 'thinking' and feeling instead, and thats how they defend themselves and stonewall critics or people trying to dig to the bottom of it all. Its clearly effected Lon, and easily effects most people, and our job is to try to get the facts out and disseminate them and confront, counter, and defeat all this emotional nonsense so people start thinking again and see whats really going on, not feelings-based spindoctoring.
Then again, all of us knew that already. :roll: I just took this opportunity to enumate it and used Lon's carefully worded pre-emptive defence of his little cash cow to my advantage, is all.
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Just wanted to let you all know I sent an email to Lon requesting or suggesting that in their "program promotions" they include who licenses the program, etc., never got a response and was taken of the list serve. Talk about being responsible? Not! People should have this information available if he is going to promote these programs (which I am not in favor of) then he or his organization should do it responsibly.
`a
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Gee, Andrea. I can't imagine why Lon wouldn't want you on the listserve? Good work, Lon.
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On 2006-04-14 15:08:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Gee, Andrea. I can't imagine why Lon wouldn't want you on the listserve? Good work, Lon."
Take your petty, bullshit argument and get the fuck outta here. :roll:
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On 2006-04-02 13:58:00, Anonymous wrote:
Why does Lon continue the fraud of referring to that place knowing full well that this is their exact tactic?
That was rhetorical right? I mean, come on. Why??? Why the hell do ya think? :roll:
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Lon has personally expressed his opposition with certain programs to me, yet he continues to profit off those programs he has called abusive in the past. Hands down, Lon is a business man in it for the money.
The best thing we can do is to ignore his corrupt agenda and provide more online content.
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Be nice, Lon is a nice guy, well as a person anyway. I have not talked business with him in forever.
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On 2006-04-15 22:00:00, OverLordd wrote:
"Be nice, Lon is a nice guy, well as a person anyway. I have not talked business with him in forever."
Are you sucking up cos he reads fornits and you want to still be allowed to speak on his terms over there? :roll:
Sorry, but someone who wont engage me or anyone else to in an open, fair playing field, or allow others to do so, and instead censors everything and shoves it underground, wont allow any sort of criticism or 'bad' things to get out, and banned someone for posting fornits saying it "promotes anonymous posting and parent/ program bashing without accountability" doesnt really deserve to be called "Nice".
Ill put it this way. Someone who is nice to you, but not to the waitor, or to other people, isnt a nice person at all. Im sure youve heard that in some form.
A complicit apologist who squashes any sort of critical discussion or even 'specific programs' isnt worthy of anyones respect, Overlordd. He may be amicable in person, but then again Im sure Ted Bundy could hold a nice conversation. Doesnt mean jack shit, though.
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I do not suck up nihil, come on man, this is me here. And no, gees, I havent even thought about ST in ages.
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Sorry, I just have trouble accepting how 'nice' he might be to you or me when he turns around and makes a buck off of someones suffering.
That and Im just not one to be civil to assholes like that. Id give it to him just the same as those kids in those program get it, no better. Surely they can handle their OWN medicine, right?
If not, well, then why the fuck do they think a kid can take what they cant?
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On 2006-04-17 08:29:00, Three Springs Waygookin wrote:
"Niles you may want to remember that even the most evilest of men can come across as sophisticated polite gentlemen. For reference, look to Ted Bundy who was by all reports a smooth well polished "lady killer".
Other examples can be used, but I think simply put Mr. Lon Woodbury is no dummy. He will put on a civil front for the purposes of business, and manipulating those who may represent a threat to his established order.
Overlordd take the time to see through his manipulations, and hopefully someday you will see how Mr. Lon Woodbury has played you like a fiddle. The Christian faith from the beginning, is sacrifice: the sacrifice of all freedom, all pride, all self-confidence of spirit; it is at the same time subjection, a self-derision, and self-mutilation.
--Freidrich Nietzsche, German philosopher
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Allow me to say: "Duh".
Allow me to concantenate to that Staff personality disorder and Narcissistic personality disorder:
http://isnt.autistics.org/dsn-staff.html (http://isnt.autistics.org/dsn-staff.html)
http://www.mentalhealth.com/dis/p20-pe07.html (http://www.mentalhealth.com/dis/p20-pe07.html)
While thats most likely overdoing it... well, comparing Lon to Ted Bundy or Hitler is overdoing it to. Hes just a program junkie making a business firmly believing in the dogma and walking the programmie line, plain and simple.
Im just ticked at the lack of criticism, the forced censorship, and the forum full of parents who describe intervention as "wearing down a child until they cant hide whats really going on" instead of what it is, psychological torture, and are just full of belief in confrontational seminars but cant handle non-confrontational, interent criticism.
Basically, its the hypocratsy and newspeaky nonsense. I cant stand it.
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Guys, all I'm trying to say is that civility is important. We are nothing without civility my friends. Be polite, you get more of what you want. That whole flys with honey and not vinger thing.
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On 2006-04-17 11:53:00, Nihilanthic wrote:
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On 2006-04-17 08:29:00, Three Springs Waygookin wrote:
"Niles you may want to remember that even the most evilest of men can come across as sophisticated polite gentlemen. For reference, look to Ted Bundy who was by all reports a smooth well polished "lady killer".
Other examples can be used, but I think simply put Mr. Lon Woodbury is no dummy. He will put on a civil front for the purposes of business, and manipulating those who may represent a threat to his established order.
Overlordd take the time to see through his manipulations, and hopefully someday you will see how Mr. Lon Woodbury has played you like a fiddle. The Christian faith from the beginning, is sacrifice: the sacrifice of all freedom, all pride, all self-confidence of spirit; it is at the same time subjection, a self-derision, and self-mutilation.
--Freidrich Nietzsche, German philosopher
"
Allow me to say: "Duh".
Allow me to concantenate to that Staff personality disorder and Narcissistic personality disorder:
http://isnt.autistics.org/dsn-staff.html (http://isnt.autistics.org/dsn-staff.html)
http://www.mentalhealth.com/dis/p20-pe07.html (http://www.mentalhealth.com/dis/p20-pe07.html)
While thats most likely overdoing it... well, comparing Lon to Ted Bundy or Hitler is overdoing it to. Hes just a program junkie making a business firmly believing in the dogma and walking the programmie line, plain and simple.
Im just ticked at the lack of criticism, the forced censorship, and the forum full of parents who describe intervention as "wearing down a child until they cant hide whats really going on" instead of what it is, psychological torture, and are just full of belief in confrontational seminars but cant handle non-confrontational, interent criticism.
Basically, its the hypocratsy and newspeaky nonsense. I cant stand it."
He sure as fuck ain't no papa smurf for damn sure.
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I agree Lon has been reasonable in the past - I don't agree with the "troubled teen industry stuff" but do know there is a need for appropriate residential schools when all else has failed, as a last resort, programs that allow and encourage as a matter of fact require Parental input and participation at any time, on all terms, ones that are close to home, appropriatly licensed, and short term. No matter how much people may not like this it is a reality. What is horrific to me is that Lon who is so admired and followed by desperate parents in crisis, is promoting programs that he knows are BAD, have a history as being horrific and harmful, and continues to allow them to advertise, and post what is written about them all the PR stuff. All I asked for them to do is a responsible thing - if they are going to continue to work like this (until the Federal Reports come out of course with the truth), that they include all licensing information, etc., so parents and others know where they can call easily if something goes wrong. It was not an adveserial email. And for those of you who want to bash me, hey I know who I am, what I do, and why I do it, I can lay my head on my pillow at night knowing I am doing the right thing. I have learned over time, those who throw these slingshots are more in a position to have to look in the mirror and reevaluate themselves.
Have a great day!
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See! Civility! :grin:
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And for those of you who want to bash me, hey I know who I am, what I do, and why I do it, I can lay my head on my pillow at night knowing I am doing the right thing. I have learned over time, those who throw these slingshots are more in a position to have to look in the mirror and reevaluate themselves.
Have a great day!
"
Ok, why do you keep making that same statement when...
1. abuse accusations are unaddressed
2. the isolation abuse and the fact that it allows other abuse to occur is just the big pink elephant in the room, even still?
3. "Intervention" used to "Wear them down until they cant hide whats really going on anymore" is talked about in much the same way anyone would talk about cutting their toenails, and yet its not such a mundane thing, when "wearing someone down" is called TORTURE by any other means
4. THERE IS STILL NO PROOF ANY OF IT WORKS, AT ALL!
Something we've been saying for years is all of this nonsense is just for the parents, so they feel better, and feel like theyre 'doing the right thing'. Period. Its not all about you, sometimes you have to deal with the fact that that other human being has needs and wants himself or herself, and your own emotional needs have to be put on hold for their own sake.
That said, the utter lack of a real education, the lack of communication, condoning abusive practices (such as that isolation) and psychological torture so they go through a regression and disclose all their personal shit to someone with zero consent and no escape, and the lack of evidence it works, cant be ignored. That, combined with all the struggling turkeys going on about "I want my old kid back" and crying about it really leads me to wonder who this is all for and WHAT is all for.
Children grow up and their adult selves are no more like their childhood selves than you are like your childhood self. You have to make them able to be independant, not dependant on a program and/or yourself, if you want them to be adults. Training obedience and disclosure are two of the worst thinks you could ever drill into an adults head, unless you plan on living in a fascist/communist state in the future.
And yeah, guess what? Criticism is essential, and its not 'bashing'! Programs and ST are very critical of us and of children but never of themselves. What goes around comes around, at least where nobodys censored, like here. Maybe you should take a look into that mirror you hold at arms length, facing everyone else, sometime, anon.
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Well said Nihilanthic.
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On 2006-04-18 04:54:00, Nihilanthic wrote:
Criticism is essential, and its not 'bashing'! Programs and ST are very critical of us and of children but never of themselves.
Unusual clarity comes from a nostalgic dedication to the quaint old habit of paying attention.
:nworthy: The bible teaches that woman brought sin and death into the world, that she precipitated the fall of the race, that she was arraigned before the judgment seat of Heaven, tried, condemned and sentenced. Marriage for her was to be a condition of bondage, maternity a period of suffering and anguish, and in silence and subjection, she was to play the role of a dependent on man's bounty for all her material wants, and for all the information she might desire...Here is the Bible position of woman briefly summed up.
--Elizabeth Cady-Stanton
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Lon Woodbury is a vampire sucking the blood from innocent children. Somebody should drive a fat wooden stake directly through his heart. Problem solved.
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On 2006-04-18 04:54:00, Nihilanthic wrote:
That, combined with all the struggling turkeys going on about "I want my old kid back"
Something about this statement causes Luke to charge up in rage. His problems are settled, but sympathetic anger causes him to flex his electricity and his muscles. The pulse going through his brain is a single signal: Kill! Kill! Kill!
That's it. These... PEOPLE... if that's what they even are, are all going to pay. All of them! Anywhere! IN ANY WORLD! I don't care anymore.
You want your old kid back? You're getting me instead!
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Woah. No wonder Luke's been so pissed IRL. I'll get him to chill- he's not going to hurt me, but it's not good to get near him when he's pissed. Especially when swimming.
People, you're not getting your old kid back. Ever. That's the whole point of growing up. If they grew up in a direction you didn't like, you have no one but yourselves to blame. Suck it up and deal.
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Sounds to me like Luke needs to get laid alot more.
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On 2006-04-19 19:51:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Sounds to me like Luke needs to get laid alot more. "
Are you volunteering?
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well beings I ain't into fornicating with men, nor do I want a man playing around with my wiener then that would be a resounding no.
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On 2006-04-20 06:20:00, Anonymous wrote:
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well beings I ain't into fornicating with men, nor do I want a man playing around with my wiener then that would be a resounding no. "
you are very homoerotic.