Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: P.E.N.1 on September 10, 2005, 05:33:00 PM
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Would anyone have any encouraging words to help a teenager get through the hard times they are enduring? If so could you please be so kind to share some. And please, Jesus Loves You does not help.
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Tell the teen it was their own best thinking and acting that got them where they are. Suggest that they work through whatever pain inside caused them to act out enough to earn a place in the program so that they can come out and live a productive and happy life.
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If the child is still in the program...just tell him in to hang in there...stay strong....it will end...and do what ever it takes just for the sake of getting out ASAP.
AFTERWARD......
I guess....help him understand that many program survivors know how he feels and it IS possible to move on...even if at first it seems impossible. Its not easy to move on...but can and does happen. Help him have the courage to face the pain and scars left behind. Encourage him not to suppress the pain, if that's possible...
Other thoughts that I would pass along to the child if it were me in your shoes....
- Never give up on yourself
- You didnt deserve to be mistreated in a program, no matter what was going on before the program
- Only accept responsibility for what really is your fault before the program (if there is anything to really accept responsiblity for that is)....do NOT blame yourself for anything done to you while in the program
- encourage the child to get involve with things he/she enjoyed before program to help child "rediscover" his/her true individual self (to help get rid of the programmed false self)
- Encourage the child to talk about whatever he can/needs to but dont push it either - it will probably difficult if not impossible for the child to talk for quite a while...just let it be well known that its okay to talk anytime---that you'll be there for him/her
- Help child readjust to the real world---it will be a very awkward tranformation...whenever this comes up...encourage him to just keep at it, keep trying, let him talk about "feeling so different from everyone," help him find ways to develop new friendships, etc., tell him that eventually it does get easier to interract with others, it just takes time
Hope this helps ::rainbow::
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The Only Way Out Is Through ... that's what survivors of these programs would say in response to your question.
In other words, tell the child to fake it until they make it. Those who "buy" into the program do so on a short term basis. Real change must come from within ... and to do that, all you need is love and support, not a teen helper guarding you 24/7.
Kids in these programs have plenty of time to think ... what they don't have is a way to ocmmunicate their thoughts and feelings to their parents, siblings, friends, without censorship.
Parents should remember that men and women have died on the battlefields to preserve the liberty of all Americans, not just grown-ups.
It's a disgrace that parents strip their children of their basic rights in the name of "therapy".
Beware that your child knows this even if you do not.
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Tell the teen it was their own best thinking and acting that got them where they are. Suggest that they work through whatever pain inside caused them to act out enough to earn a place in the program so that they can come out and live a productive and happy life.
...
You know, as a side note, I'm on the percision rilfe team up at my college. They say I'll be able to pit a ace at 100 yards by the end of the season. This of course had nothing to do with anything the anon poster said, and was not a responce or a threat at all, just a side note about my life... ::unhappy::
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On 2005-09-10 17:47:00, Three Springs Waygookin wrote:
"Well from a ex-counselors perspective here is a few things that might help out.
1) Counselors love snitches. Meaning the kid who keeps them informed of all the things that goes on behind the scenes.
- encourage your kid to rat out as many underground activities as possible.
2) Counselors love kids who tell them they are doing a good job.
- get you kid to compliment their counselors on how much they really are helping them.
3) Validate the program
- at some point the program is wanting the kid to say that this place really did save them from being deadorinjail.
4) Admit to everything
- Look point out to your kid that the chances of him or her ever meeting anyone in their peer group is miniscule. Confess to every damn thing they want them to confess to .
5) raps or nightlies are like bowel movements. The more shit that comes out the better you feel.
- tell you kid to stage their topics for maximum dramatic impact. Remember PT. Barnum... Their is a sucker born every minute.
6) Parental involvement- actively bucking the program will only keep your kid on the inside. Keep your activities covert. No slipping your kid condoms or smokes during visiting hours. Spend your time preparing for the kids after program deprogramming.
ok... just reading this thing over makes me want to puke, but I sware all of the above is sickenly and sadly true. I saw it work time and time again. Religion is based . . . mainly on fear . . . fear of the mysterious, fear of defeat, fear of death. Fear is the parent of cruelty, and therefore it is no wonder if cruelty and religion have gone hand in hand. . . . My own view on religion is that of Lucretius. I regard it as a disease born of fear and as a source of untold misery to the human race.
--Bertrand Russell, British philosopher, educator, mathemetician, and social critic
"
Yea, as horrid as all that is. This is what will get your kid out. Kid maybe a little not quit eright when they get home, That is unavoidable. I agree spend your time preparing a safe enviroment for them once home. Set up appts w/ good therapist and letthem know your child will be comming home, Interview them if you are able.
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I agree with everything except the snitch part, cause that will get you beaten up. Life has to be livable with your peers, too, and if they all hate you, it's going to be rough. The counselors have the most power, sure, but when they aren't looking, your peers have some power, too, the power to kick your ass. Or if it's a no-violence school, like mine was, the power to ostracize you.
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Well ... since these kids are treated worse than prisoners (who have access to legal advice and can make collect phone calls to a loved one or GASP, a boy/girl friend, my best advice is to tell the kid to get a calendar and start marking the TIME off that he/she serves. At least that way the kid won't be confused about what he is really doing (TIME) as opposed to getting any real help for his/her "issues".
Sorry, but sometimes it just seems pointless to tell these kids to "buck up" and "work the program" knowing it doesn't do them one bit of good once they get out and can begin to "feel their feelings" again .... which depending upon how much of their spirit was killed, will range from no feelings at all to sadness/depression and anger/rage.
The more "institutionalized" the program, the more likely the kid will be programized (meaning lose their identity).
Hopefully this kid was placed in a real boarding school not some quasi-emotional-growth house of horrors.
Psst ... it wouldn't hurt for the kid to develop a secret code language with his/her parents but that only works if the parent actually cares about their care and treatment. Sadly, many don't and/or develop a near religious affectation for THE PROGRAM. Monkey see, monkey do.
:smokin:
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ok... just reading this thing over makes me want to puke, but I sware all of the above is sickenly and sadly true. I saw it work time and time again.
You may be right TSW but I really dont want to think about the implications if you are. I dont think I would be brave enough to institute what you said. It takes more of a effort to go along with something and not be broken than stand and fight against it.
As a side note, dont tell your kid to snitch, it will only get him hurt.
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On 2005-09-10 20:19:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Well ... since these kids are treated worse than prisoners (who have access to legal advice and can make collect phone calls to a loved one or GASP, a boy/girl friend, my best advice is to tell the kid to get a calendar and start marking the TIME off that he/she serves. At least that way the kid won't be confused about what he is really doing (TIME) as opposed to getting any real help for his/her "issues".
Sorry, but sometimes it just seems pointless to tell these kids to "buck up" and "work the program" knowing it doesn't do them one bit of good once they get out and can begin to "feel their feelings" again .... which depending upon how much of their spirit was killed, will range from no feelings at all to sadness/depression and anger/rage.
The more "institutionalized" the program, the more likely the kid will be programized (meaning lose their identity).
Hopefully this kid was placed in a real boarding school not some quasi-emotional-growth house of horrors.
Psst ... it wouldn't hurt for the kid to develop a secret code language with his/her parents but that only works if the parent actually cares about their care and treatment. Sadly, many don't and/or develop a near religious affectation for THE PROGRAM. Monkey see, monkey do.
:smokin: "
Oh .. I forgot to mention that prisoners have another advantage over kids stuck in a money making hellhole ... PRISONERS KNOW HOW LONG they will remain behind bars whereas these poor kids have no idea ... all depends upon how much money Ma and Pa have to keep em' in the program.
:smokin:
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On 2005-09-10 14:38:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Tell the teen it was their own best thinking and acting that got them where they are. Suggest that they work through whatever pain inside caused them to act out enough to earn a place in the program so that they can come out and live a productive and happy life."
This is some fucking shit here, boy. It was YOU, parent, that got them in a program, nothing they did. It's what YOU did.
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That's right, it's all the parents' fault- these kids have no problems and are perfectly normal, functional teenagers. The parents just got tired of having them live in the house so decided to spend $60K a year or so to put them in a program.
Good to see that good ol', psycho Dysfunction Junction rage coming through- again and again.
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On 2005-09-10 14:38:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Tell the teen it was their own best thinking and acting that got them where they are. Suggest that they work through whatever pain inside caused them to act out enough to earn a place in the program so that they can come out and live a productive and happy life."
I would be able to deal with all this if it were only their best thinking that got them where they were. If my teen was sitting in juvi then yes, its their thinking somewhat that got them their.Its called natural and logical consequences of behavior. You do a crime you do the time. You drink and drive you may either end up dead, in jail or end up killing innocent people and then go to prison. Being sent away by your parents is not their own choice. My teen had no idea places as these exsisted, maybe if they were warned once if they keep messing up away you go, then they would have straightned their shit up. But no, neither them nor I knew.So, no wonder your dumb ass has to wear a bag over your head, I would to if I were that stupid!Oh and for them to work on what was troubling them inside, you actually think these places give a shit about that, let alone give kids a safe place to share whats happened to them..Ha, that would require caring about these kids.[ This Message was edited by: P.E.N.1 on 2005-09-11 07:58 ]
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On 2005-09-11 07:52:00, Anonymous wrote:
"That's right, it's all the parents' fault- these kids have no problems and are perfectly normal, functional teenagers. The parents just got tired of having them live in the house so decided to spend $60K a year or so to put them in a program.
Good to see that good ol', psycho Dysfunction Junction rage coming through- again and again."
So your kid asked you to send him away, right? I didn't think so.
If you couldn't handle your job as a parent, you should have appealed to a therapist for help, not a quack (or a bunch of quacks). If your kid needed to be institutionalized, why not do it locally?
Who's raging? You read a lot of rage into my posts. I would assume it's because you're full of rage. Probably it would better be directed at yourself, i.e. the person that screwed up their kid's life as well as their own, not me.
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You seem to think that proper parenting involves allowing the kid to do whatever her or she wants. Of course they don't ask to be sent to a program. When they are small, they usually don't ask to go to bed, or to go to school. If there is a need for therapeutic intervention, and all local resources have been exhausted, placement in a reputable program may be necessary. My experience is that there are a number of excellent therapists and non-abusive, excellent programs for teens in need of therapeutic help.
I am wondering what makes you think I have ruined my kid's life. What is it you know about my kid? How do you know the kid was harmed by the program? What makes you so sure I was a bad parent?
The answer is- you know nothing. You are a psychotic, angry young man who has no life other than to bash people on a message forum and promote your own agenda which is based on ignorance.
I hope you aren't operating under the misguided notion that anything you say has any credibility with anyone other than your mutually dysfunction buddies here on this forum. No adult seeking information would view your input with anything but disgust. In fact, disgusting is probably the best adjective to describe your very being. I hope you have a good therapist (not a quack) yourself. Please print out all of your posts, take them to your therapist and have a nice double-session exploring why you feel compelled to attack any and all adults who dare to disagree with you and point out what a pathetic loser you are.
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On 2005-09-11 08:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
"You seem to think that proper parenting involves allowing the kid to do whatever her or she wants. Of course they don't ask to be sent to a program. When they are small, they usually don't ask to go to bed, or to go to school. If there is a need for therapeutic intervention, and all local resources have been exhausted, placement in a reputable program may be necessary. My experience is that there are a number of excellent therapists and non-abusive, excellent programs for teens in need of therapeutic help.
I am wondering what makes you think I have ruined my kid's life. What is it you know about my kid? How do you know the kid was harmed by the program? What makes you so sure I was a bad parent?
The answer is- you know nothing. You are a psychotic, angry young man who has no life other than to bash people on a message forum and promote your own agenda which is based on ignorance.
I hope you aren't operating under the misguided notion that anything you say has any credibility with anyone other than your mutually dysfunction buddies here on this forum. No adult seeking information would view your input with anything but disgust. In fact, disgusting is probably the best adjective to describe your very being. I hope you have a good therapist (not a quack) yourself. Please print out all of your posts, take them to your therapist and have a nice double-session exploring why you feel compelled to attack any and all adults who dare to disagree with you and point out what a pathetic loser you are."
No wonder your kid got so fucked up. Geez, you've got some REAL PROBLEMS.
This type of personal hatred is probably what led your kid to act out. You obviously have not a shred of decency or compassion.
Did you ever entertain the idea that you are the biggest problem your kid ever had? No, of course you didn't.
::soapbox::
Again, you will be asked for the umpteenth time: What program did you send your kid to and what programs are "good and effective"?
Get down off your soapbox and answer MEANINGFUL questions rather than offer your misguided speculations as to what you believe my life to be like (which are ridiculous and patently false).
Please, answer the question, you shifty-eyed little baghead. I alreadt know you won't, but others need to understand that you've been asked to support your dubious opinion with facts, but that you steadfastly refuse to answer any relevent questions and instead just bash, bash, bash to divert attention from the issue.
We're all waiting anxiously for your first meaningful statement. What program did you send your kid to and what are the "reputable" ones? Please, enlighten us...
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I have attempted to discuss programs with you before, to no avail, because you continue to resort to your "all programs are bad" tape and will never consider any other viewpoint. In fact, numerous people have attempted to discuss specific programs with you, including kids who have attended them. You insist that they are brainwashed.
Anyone reading these threads can easily see what happens when a discussion of specific programs in attempted. You are a one-trick pony, and the "no wonder your kid is so fucked up" record is getting really old. In fact, my kid could never approach the level of dysfunction as you, by your own admission in choosing your name, have attained.
I would worry about you being a parent, but I don't see much chance of that happening because no one would possibly ever be in a relationship with you. I suppose there is the horrible possibility that you could rape someone, but you probably don't leave your computer terminal long enough.
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On 2005-09-11 08:45:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I have attempted to discuss programs with you before, to no avail, because you continue to resort to your "all programs are bad" tape and will never consider any other viewpoint. In fact, numerous people have attempted to discuss specific programs with you, including kids who have attended them. You insist that they are brainwashed.
Anyone reading these threads can easily see what happens when a discussion of specific programs in attempted. You are a one-trick pony, and the "no wonder your kid is so fucked up" record is getting really old. In fact, my kid could never approach the level of dysfunction as you, by your own admission in choosing your name, have attained.
I would worry about you being a parent, but I don't see much chance of that happening because no one would possibly ever be in a relationship with you. I suppose there is the horrible possibility that you could rape someone, but you probably don't leave your computer terminal long enough."
All I can say to something like this is "WOW". You have really showed your true colors here.
When you were asked to have an academic discussion, you resort to calling me a rapist? You are a really sick person, and I'm not just kidding around here or being dramatic. You are genuinely ill.
I'm also a very happily married man with a well-adjusted, highly educated, professional spouse (a teacher).
So, I guess if you really have no interest in supporting your views with verifiable facts, you will just continue to be dismissed as you regularly have been since your first appearance on this board. Talk about your "one trick pony." That's you alright.
My opinions come from two sources. I am an MSW and and MBA and I have great understanding of treatment and the the treatment business. I also worked in two separate programs and intimately know exactly how they (don't) work, what the motivation of the owners is (profit) and the incredible damage these programs do to the developing mind.
Again, it's patently obvious that having a psychotic parent like you has contributed greatly to the maladaption of your child to societal norms.
_________________
"Compassion is the basis of morality"
-Arnold Schopenhauer[ This Message was edited by: Dysfunction Junction on 2005-09-11 09:00 ]
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On 2005-09-11 08:45:00, Anonymous wrote:
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I would worry about you being a parent, but I don't see much chance of that happening because no one would possibly ever be in a relationship with you. I suppose there is the horrible possibility that you could rape someone, but you probably don't leave your computer terminal long enough."
The person who wrote this post should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. This is all the commentary one needs to understand the Struggling Parents that post here and the deep psychological problems they have.
This is shameful and disgusting.
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"I'm also a very happily married man with a well-adjusted, highly educated, professional spouse (a teacher)"
Yeah- we believe THAT- just like we believe you have those degrees. Take a look at some of your recent posts with the crude sexual references and see how happily married you are!
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On 2005-09-11 09:17:00, Anonymous wrote:
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On 2005-09-11 08:45:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
I would worry about you being a parent, but I don't see much chance of that happening because no one would possibly ever be in a relationship with you. I suppose there is the horrible possibility that you could rape someone, but you probably don't leave your computer terminal long enough."
The person who wrote this post should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. This is all the commentary one needs to understand the Struggling Parents that post here and the deep psychological problems they have.
This is shameful and disgusting."
Apparently this person doesn't understand how awful something like this is. It reflects so badly on anyone attempting to have a real discussion. And, to make it worse, they're saying more nasty personal things about someone else instead of explaining why they said something so horrible like this.
This really does make all parents who support programs look like trash. This person clearly has some mental problems and it's probably a good thing that they were separated from their child. The child is most likely better off without this kind of role model in their life.
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You can dish it out, but you sure can't take it, can you? It is OK for you to make sexual comments about someone and accuse them of being a drug addict, but if someone gives some of it back to you- admittedly stooping to your level- it is a different story.
I am not the poster who made the remark about the horrible possibility of rape, but I think many of you have shown enough dysfunction to be capable of anything.
Good luck to ya!
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On 2005-09-11 08:45:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I don't see much chance of that happening because no one would possibly ever be in a relationship with you. I suppose there is the horrible possibility that you could rape someone, but you probably don't leave your computer terminal long enough."
Uh, your opinion really isn't worth anything anymore. You need help.
What you believe about me is really immaterial. Of course, someone with not-so-thinly-veiled psycho-sexual problems, like this poster, could never see any humor in sexual jokes.
Does your past sexual experience lead you to say things like this, or is this level of moral terpitude the norm for you? Either way, you have serious psychological problems.
Your logical fallacy is that you assume yourself to be normal and others on this BB to be "sick." You've gotten it exactly backwards.
And you worry about me being a parent, huh? I feel bad for you.
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Pen1 said ----------"Oh and for them to work on what was troubling them inside, you actually think these places give a shit about that, let alone give kids a safe place to share whats happened to them..Ha, that would require caring about these kids.--------------
PEN1 how right you are...I remember being forbidden from talking about how my parent's divorce affected me, and instead was forced to talk about drug use (which I never did), past sexual incidents (which I also had none), and fights with parents and siblings which I could talk about as long as I was fully blaming myself........
Never was one ounce of effort made to help us deal with our issues. The program was not concerned about anything except painting a very pretty FALSE image about the program so no one outside the program really knew what was going on inside the program...
Parents who blindly support these programs support only the FALSE image programs project and advertise...therefore most parents are incapable of knowing the truth...So I agree, clearly the anon you were referring to is completely ignorant and is just pissed because his/her views are challenged (how dare we challenge a brainwashed parent, god forbid).... ::rainbow::
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Well, if we're ever in your area, we'll be sure to take you up on your offer. One thing I love is a good home-cooked meal.
Wait though, NCL, we did some sexual joking around, and it was fun (and funny). Doesn't that make me a sick and twisted person worthy of society's scorn and ostracism? ("...disgusting is probably the best adjective to describe your very being... -anon)
Maybe you should rethink your offer... :sad:
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Its really sad some times. They come over there and claim to be open minded, but they start with a bash and are surpised when people react, then they just assume that they did not finish their time in the program. Seemingly program parents tend to think every one has been on a program. You don't know how many time I have been told to
"Go back to my program and finish it." They seem to think the only people that say bad things about the industry as those that were in programs, this of course is far from the truth.
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No DJ, joking around (even about sex) does not make anyone sick or have a twisted mind...its called having a sense of humor......a certain anon either doesnt see joking around for what it really is or else just jumps on anything that can be twisted and used against you.
I have no problem whatsoever with my offer... ::rainbow::
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Overlordd, you made several good points....and I am one of those so-called "successful program graduates" not a program drop out....But to me it doesnt matter because the program was a dangerous place for children whether I finished the program or not....I am also glad to hear that you dont have to be in a program to see many of them for what they really are...profit making scams posing as "help."
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On 2005-09-11 07:52:00, Anonymous wrote:
"That's right, it's all the parents' fault- these kids have no problems and are perfectly normal, functional teenagers. The parents just got tired of having them live in the house so decided to spend $60K a year or so to put them in a program.
Good to see that good ol', psycho Dysfunction Junction rage coming through- again and again."
Hello? There's a reason these programs are full of mostly white, middle-to-upper-class kids and it ain't because they are all suffering from entitlementitis. It's because they have lousy, lazy parents with enough case (or leverage) to force their kids out of the home and into one of these mind-numbing institutions.
:flame:
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On 2005-09-11 12:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-09-11 07:52:00, Anonymous wrote:
"That's right, it's all the parents' fault- these kids have no problems and are perfectly normal, functional teenagers. The parents just got tired of having them live in the house so decided to spend $60K a year or so to put them in a program.
Good to see that good ol', psycho Dysfunction Junction rage coming through- again and again."
Hello? There's a reason these programs are full of mostly white, middle-to-upper-class kids and it ain't because they are all suffering from entitlementitis. It's because they have lousy, lazy parents with enough case (or leverage) to force their kids out of the home and into one of these mind-numbing institutions.
:flame: "
typo ... that's CASH (not case) sorry~
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On 2005-09-11 12:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-09-11 07:52:00, Anonymous wrote:
"That's right, it's all the parents' fault- these kids have no problems and are perfectly normal, functional teenagers. The parents just got tired of having them live in the house so decided to spend $60K a year or so to put them in a program.
Good to see that good ol', psycho Dysfunction Junction rage coming through- again and again."
Hello? There's a reason these programs are full of mostly white, middle-to-upper-class kids and it ain't because they are all suffering from entitlementitis. It's because they have lousy, lazy parents with enough case (or leverage) to force their kids out of the home and into one of these mind-numbing institutions.
:flame: "
You got that right.
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On 2005-09-11 09:17:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-09-11 08:45:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
I would worry about you being a parent, but I don't see much chance of that happening because no one would possibly ever be in a relationship with you. I suppose there is the horrible possibility that you could rape someone, but you probably don't leave your computer terminal long enough."
The person who wrote this post should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. This is all the commentary one needs to understand the Struggling Parents that post here and the deep psychological problems they have.
This is shameful and disgusting."
This is all you need to see to understand how the Struggling Turkeys operate. It couldn't be any clearer how low-down, dirty and shameless these folks really are.
It is of no surprise that their kids don't do well. Just look at the exmple set by the parent: If people don't do what you want them to, abuse, berate, belittle and humiliate them. But, under no circumstances, ever admit you're wrong or what you're doing is dreadful, just keep pointing the finger and hammering away.
In some cases, like with this parent, the kid is probably better off (however disgusting this sounds) being abused by strangers instead of this deeply disturbed parent. It hurts less.
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Yup, these struggling parents definitly need help.
Reminds me of this family on WIFE SWAP who were raising their 5 kids in a quasi-military style home, complete with a leather strap on the back of each of their bedroom doors to remind them that if they don't obey, the WACKER awaits them.
Hyper-controlling parents are exactly the kind of parents who buy into the abusive behavior mod schools. They equate obedience with respect. Love must be earned, it is not freely given.
Sick and disgusting.
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You said, love must be earned. It is not freely given. I am confused. Who must earn the love, the teenager or the parent?
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I think he mixed love and respect, respect must be earned, Love is freely given, otherwise its not love.
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No, I meant what I said ... program parents equate obedience with respect (meaning if a kid is not obedient they are not being respectful when in truth, one can be defiant but still respectful). What is adolescence if not a time for kids to test the boundaries? Push the envelope? Exert their independence? It's called growing up.
As for love ... what I mean is program parents practice CONDITIONAL love ... which is why they see nothing wrong with kids having to earn the privilege of talking to their own parents once they are sent away. The kid has to jump through hoops to be loved enough to come home. Twisted but that's pretty much the gist of it.
:smokin:
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Shouldn't parents set the moral standard and rules for the home? I agree that it is possible to disagree and not be disrespectful. However, if I am to live in the home, I need to follow the rules of the house. Just as when I stay in a hotel I must follow the rules of check in and check out, no smoking in the rooms etc... If I don't like the rules of the hotel, I just don't stay there. If I can't or won't abide by the rules of my parents I need to find another place to stay.
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On 2005-09-12 05:17:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Shouldn't parents set the moral standard and rules for the home? I agree that it is possible to disagree and not be disrespectful. However, if I am to live in the home, I need to follow the rules of the house. Just as when I stay in a hotel I must follow the rules of check in and check out, no smoking in the rooms etc... If I don't like the rules of the hotel, I just don't stay there. If I can't or won't abide by the rules of my parents I need to find another place to stay."
This is the exapmle these parents are setting. Why should they model this type of behavior and expect better from their lids? It just doesn't make sense. These parents are the CAUSE of the kds problems, not the solution.
On 2005-09-11 08:45:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I would worry about you being a parent, but I don't see much chance of that happening because no one would possibly ever be in a relationship with you. I suppose there is the horrible possibility that you could rape someone, but you probably don't leave your computer terminal long enough."
_________________________________________________
The person who wrote this post should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. This is all the commentary one needs to understand the Struggling Parents that post here and the deep psychological problems they have.
This is shameful and disgusting."
_________________________________________________
This is all you need to see to understand how the Struggling Turkeys operate. It couldn't be any clearer how low-down, dirty and shameless these folks really are.
It is of no surprise that their kids don't do well. Just look at the exmple set by the parent: If people don't do what you want them to, abuse, berate, belittle and humiliate them. But, under no circumstances, ever admit you're wrong or what you're doing is dreadful, just keep pointing the finger and hammering away.
In some cases, like with this parent, the kid is probably better off (however disgusting this sounds) being abused by strangers instead of this deeply disturbed parent. It hurts less.
_________________________________________________
How do you expect such low-functioning people to set the example?
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Smart Snitches do their thing off to the side and keep it quiet with the counselors. Then they take the rap with the rest of the group. Trust me it works, I have sadly seen it. Not in my group, I routinely told the snitches if they could not confront the perp in front of the group, then it called into question his credibility. Further, I sometimes called a huddle on the spot and asked the kid to tell the group what he just told me.
I hated snitches. Lack of courage that made me sick. However, for other counselors they always had their toadies, and moved them through the program quicker.
I would have to disagree here, look at it this way. A kid is out in the woods with basically what amounts to a bunch of psychotics. Who?s to say he won?t have an "Accident." If some one knows he told? I sure as hell would not want to say it in front of the person if he out weighs me and has discipline issues. When it comes down to it no one is going to protect the kid accept maybe you, because the other kids just want to get the hell out of the way, keep their heads down, and keep their privileges. Damn, the kid could get killed, you TSW, have admitted there was lots of violence in the programs.
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On 2005-09-12 05:17:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Shouldn't parents set the moral standard and rules for the home?"
Not only should we set the moral standards for our homes and kids, we're absolutely helpless not to. Watching your baby evolve into an adult is very like looking in a mirror some days. Some people just can't accept that the bad they perceive in their own kids is, almost always, a reflection of our own faults and poor habits. So blame the kid for acting just like you, beat some "sense" into them and call yourself a martyr. Yeah, that'll work!
Necessity is the excuse for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of the tyrant and the creed of the slave.
-- William Pitt, 1763
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So, I'm pretty much assuming that no one has any encouraging words to share. Wasn't that the original subject? Oh well I'll figure out something to tell him, like run like hell...run forrest run!! Run to the hills! :em:
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On 2005-09-12 07:05:00, Three Springs Waygookin wrote:
"Smart Snitches do their thing off to the side and keep it quiet with the counselors. Then they take the rap with the rest of the group. Trust me it works, I have sadly seen it. Not in my group, I routinely told the snitches if they could not confront the perp in front of the group, then it called into question his credibility. Further, I sometimes called a huddle on the spot and asked the kid to tell the group what he just told me.
I hated snitches. Lack of courage that made me sick. However, for other counselors they always had their toadies, and moved them through the program quicker. I think that all right-thinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary, decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I'm certainly not! But I'm sick and tired of being told that I am!
-- Monty Python
"
Yeah, this is common. One reason why it's not such a good idea to make 'friends' while in a program, they'll turn on you in a second. Not everyone though, just be careful who your friends are and don't tell them everything, and especially nothing you don't want the facility to find out about. To the kids who do snitch, well, I think you are all fuckers-- but you have your own demons to deal with. Some of these programs pit the higher level students against the lower levels, it's disgusting.
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On 2005-09-12 08:26:00, OverLordd wrote:
"I would have to disagree here, look at it this way. A kid is out in the woods with basically what amounts to a bunch of psychotics. Who?s to say he won?t have an "Accident." If some one knows he told? I sure as hell would not want to say it in front of the person if he out weighs me and has discipline issues. When it comes down to it no one is going to protect the kid accept maybe you, because the other kids just want to get the hell out of the way, keep their heads down, and keep their privileges. Damn, the kid could get killed, you TSW, have admitted there was lots of violence in the programs."
Are you joking OL? If you were afraid of an another student, then don't snitch on them... simple as that. If you can't see the moral implication of 'getting in good' with the facility by walking all over fellow students, well.. I wouldn't want you in my group, that's for sure. And you wouldn't want to run into me once we got out, either. :em:
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Explain then how parents can have two children that behave so very differently, even when very close in age. If all they are doing is exhibiting the bad of the parents when they are rebellious why don't both children do that? Could it be that one exhibits the good of the parents? Hmmmm, seems it comes down to choices of the child.
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I'm not defending snitching, im defending the youths want to do it without seeing the person he is snitching on. Its understandable. Snitching is wrong, and i dont do it, nor should any one else do it, but if some one is going to do it, they are cowards, so treat them as such and dont get them hurt by the way you make them tell.
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Explain then how parents can have two children that behave so very differently, even when very close in age. If all they are doing is exhibiting the bad of the parents when they are rebellious why don't both children do that? Could it be that one exhibits the good of the parents? Hmmmm, seems it comes down to choices of the child.
Favoritism, the parents focus on one child and ignore the others, I have seen it many times.
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On 2005-09-12 11:20:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Explain then how parents can have two children that behave so very differently, even when very close in age. If all they are doing is exhibiting the bad of the parents when they are rebellious why don't both children do that? Could it be that one exhibits the good of the parents? Hmmmm, seems it comes down to choices of the child. "
It's inconsistency, plain and simple. Do you actually know any family where all the kids were treated identically? I sure don't.
That's also one of the biggest problems with the programs. They're harsh AND inconsistent. That's why they screw up kids so badly, just like the parents did before the programs.
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so you don't believe that any teenager has ever made a destructive choice that was of their own choosing, knowing the right choice, deliberately choosing wrong, without it being the fault of the parent? Then actually it is the grand parents fault for messing with the parents and the great grand parents fault for screwing up the grand parents and so on and so on until you get all the way back to Adam and Eve. You just made a great arguement for the creation story and original sin! We are now back to the devil made me do it! And no one accepting responsibility for their own mistakes.
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P.E.N.1 .. While I was typing this , I thought of you. Here are some comforting words for you, and a great book to share w/ your teen at an approiate time,
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... &forum=7&1 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=11686&forum=7&1)
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On 2005-09-12 11:20:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Explain then how parents can have two children that behave so very differently, even when very close in age. If all they are doing is exhibiting the bad of the parents when they are rebellious why don't both children do that? Could it be that one exhibits the good of the parents? Hmmmm, seems it comes down to choices of the child. "
My sister still resents it that she was the 'bad child' only because she got caught. I did not get caught. On the outside, I was the 'good kid.' In reality, my sister was a saint by comparison.
That said, child development is very complex and the various aspects of nature vs nurture have been under debate for years. The bottom line is that it makes no difference whether the child chooses to be bad (consciously) or is simply reacting to something they've experienced, programs are still morally wrong. It is illegal to treat an adult the way they do and it should be illegal to treat anyone the way they do.
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On 2005-09-10 14:33:00, P.E.N.1 wrote:
"Would anyone have any encouraging words to help a teenager get through the hard times they are enduring? If so could you please be so kind to share some. And please, Jesus Loves You does not help."
RUN LIKE HELL EVERY CHANCE THEY GET!!!!!!!!!!!
Call CPS on your parents and the facility too every time you run. Tell them why you are running.
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On 2005-09-10 15:11:00, Nonconformistlaw wrote:
"If the child is still in the program...just tell him in to hang in there...stay strong....it will end...and do what ever it takes just for the sake of getting out ASAP.
AFTERWARD......
I guess....help him understand that many program survivors know how he feels and it IS possible to move on...even if at first it seems impossible. Its not easy to move on...but can and does happen. Help him have the courage to face the pain and scars left behind. Encourage him not to suppress the pain, if that's possible...
Other thoughts that I would pass along to the child if it were me in your shoes....
- Never give up on yourself
- You didnt deserve to be mistreated in a program, no matter what was going on before the program
- Only accept responsibility for what really is your fault before the program (if there is anything to really accept responsiblity for that is)....do NOT blame yourself for anything done to you while in the program
- encourage the child to get involve with things he/she enjoyed before program to help child "rediscover" his/her true individual self (to help get rid of the programmed false self)
- Encourage the child to talk about whatever he can/needs to but dont push it either - it will probably difficult if not impossible for the child to talk for quite a while...just let it be well known that its okay to talk anytime---that you'll be there for him/her
- Help child readjust to the real world---it will be a very awkward tranformation...whenever this comes up...encourage him to just keep at it, keep trying, let him talk about "feeling so different from everyone," help him find ways to develop new friendships, etc., tell him that eventually it does get easier to interract with others, it just takes time
Hope this helps ::rainbow::
"
Very well said. I will recommend the same thing.
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This is all so interesting. It's been a while since I've been on the forum. Hmmm
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Hey there, Perri! Good to hear from you. How's life?
The line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either, but right through every human heart.
Alexander Solzhenitsyn
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Encouraging words: Run like hell and don't look back. And whatever you do, don't go home because your parents don't know how to help you.