Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Anonymous on August 04, 2005, 11:44:00 PM
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yeah right idiots!
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One can only dream ....
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With the new Nationally televised program, Brat Camp, these programs are only going to proliferate. The program shows very caring and loving counselors who give lots of support and hugs to the children. People aren't seeing the down side.
Reform is something that we should all try to work for to make the programs safer for children. I personally would like to see the more abusive programs closed. It has happened in Mexico and elsewhere. Public awareness is essential.
As long as there are parents who can not handle their difficult teenagers - or ordinary teenagers- there are going to be programs. We need to continually expose the abuse that goes on to educate the public and we need to support efforts to make the programs safer.
I am not a vegetarian because I love animals; I am a vegetarian because I hate plants.
-- A. Whitney Brown
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its happening, a board of independent psychologists have decided wwasp programs are safe effective! Sorry guys mission failed!
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On 2005-08-05 13:20:00, Anonymous wrote:
"its happening, a board of independent psychologists have decided wwasp programs are safe effective! Sorry guys mission failed!"
Can you provide any proof?
Are these psychologics really independent? Or are they as "independent" as Dr. Chappuis, in bed with WWASPS and covering up for the abuse?
WWASPS is an abusive treatment cult. There's no getting around that.
The message is getting out, WWASPie. More and more survivors are speaking out. WWASPS gulags are being shut down one by one. Sorry guys, mission failed!
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Coersion/fear/punishment/humilation based programs were deemed to be ineffective and dangerous by psychologists :eek:
Too bad thats what WWASPS is.I am sick unto death of obscure English towns that exist seemingly for the sole accommodation of these so-called limerick writers -- and even sicker of their residents, all of whom suffer from physical deformities and spend their time dismembering relatives at fancy dress balls.
--Editor of the Limerick Times
(Limerick, Ireland)
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"all programs soon to be shut down"
Yeah it is pretty unlikely, at least for now.
There are still PLENY of ignorant, mean-spirited, abusive, gullable, stupid parents out there left to fleece for all their cash.
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abusive wake up wake up the programs are not abuse you really do CREATE your own experience there! Is it tough? Surely! But you decide whether the experience will be positive or negative, have incidents of abuse take place, most likely although in my year + in the program I never experienced even one, you need to realize that this abuse is just ignorant staff abusing there power and is not the program itself. The program is so much bigger than the staff, and even the students, afterall it's ONLY goal is to save the lives of America's most troubled youths such as yourselves. Those of us who's lives have been changed and saved will forever stand as witnesses to the true benifits of the program, after all it's not program jargon that life is based on results it truly is, ask any ceo, doctor, lawyer, or any employer for that matter and you will see. Even ask God himself, like surely is based on results, and those of us who are sucesful are much more believable that you. Hopefully someday you'll wake up and smell the roses, until then I guess you'll continue to smell the stench one experiences where their heads are so far up the arses they can hardly even breath.
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On 2005-08-05 15:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
"abusive wake up wake up the programs are not abuse you really do CREATE your own experience there! Is it tough? Surely! But you decide whether the experience will be positive or negative, have incidents of abuse take place, most likely although in my year + in the program I never experienced even one, you need to realize that this abuse is just ignorant staff abusing there power and is not the program itself. The program is so much bigger than the staff, and even the students, afterall it's ONLY goal is to save the lives of America's most troubled youths such as yourselves. Those of us who's lives have been changed and saved will forever stand as witnesses to the true benifits of the program, after all it's not program jargon that life is based on results it truly is, ask any ceo, doctor, lawyer, or any employer for that matter and you will see. Even ask God himself, like surely is based on results, and those of us who are sucesful are much more believable that you. Hopefully someday you'll wake up and smell the roses, until then I guess you'll continue to smell the stench one experiences where their heads are so far up the arses they can hardly even breath."
The program's goal is to provide Litchfield and company with money and power.
WWASPS is a cult. The program itself is abusive. Abusive practice, such as "restraint" (violent take downs), solitary confinement, etc., are an integral part of the program. Emotional abuse in Lifespring-style seminars and "group sessions" in which the main purpose is to break the prisoner's spirit are also an integral part of the program.
The program's goal is to not to "save the lives of America's most troubled youth". The program's goal and purpose is to make you believe you've been saved.
You wake up and smell the roses. WWASPS' prisons are being shut down one by one. More and more survivors speak out about the abusive and cultic nature of the program. More and more parents realize they've been duped.
WWASPS is going down.
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yeah that person quoted above even talks like a cult. 'the program is so much bigger than the staff' oh come on, of course its not. this person is completely retarded who posted 2 posts up. my god i feel sorry for you- think for yourself... you fucking programmie.
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The goal of the programs is to make money for Lichfield and his large exteneded family and his friends. It's all about money. If even one child is abused then a program should be shut down in my opinion. By the way, several professional organizations have come out against teen programs, and research has demonstrated that they are not effective.
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Here's one from the National Institute of Health...
'Get Tough' Youth Programs Are Ineffective, Panel Says
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
October 17, 2004
WASHINGTON, Oct. 16 (AP) - Boot camps and other get-tough program for adolescents do not prevent criminal behavior, as intended, and may make the problem even worse, a new study has found.
Further, laws transferring juveniles into the adult court system lead these teenagers to commit more violence, the study said. More promising, it said, are programs that offer intensive counseling for families and young people at risk.
A 13-member panel convened by the National Institutes of Health reviewed the available scientific evidence to look for consensus on causes of youth violence and ways to prevent it. Its report was released on Friday.
"'Scare tactics' don't work," the panel concluded. "Programs that seek to prevent violence through fear and tough treatment do not work."
Youth violence has declined from its peak a decade ago but violent crime rates are still high, the panel said.
Violence can be traced to a variety of conditions. Among the possible causes are these: inconsistent or harsh parenting, poor peer relations, gang involvement, lack of connection to school and living in a violent neighborhood.
The trouble with boot camps, group detention centers and other "get tough" programs is that they bring together young people who are inclined toward violence and teach one another how to commit more crime, the panel said. "The more sophisticated instruct the more naive in precisely the behaviors that the intervener wishes to prevent."
It also rejected programs that "consist largely of adults lecturing," like DARE, the Drug Abuse Resistance Education program.
One barrier to setting up effective programs, the report said, is resistance from people operating ineffective programs who depend on them for their jobs.
"All the evaluations have shown they don't work," said the panel's chairman, Dr. Robert L. Johnson of the University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey. "Many communities are wasting a great deal of money on those types of programs."
The panel looked for programs that have been tested using rigorous research methods and concluded that "the good news is that there are a number of intervention programs that have been shown" effective.
The report cited two: a therapy program where youth and their families attend 12 one-hour sessions over three months, and a community-based clinical treatment program that targeted violent and chronic offenders at risk of being removed from their families. This second program provided about 60 hours of counseling over about four months with therapists available at all hours.
One key, Dr. Johnson said, was letting counselors observe families and children together and offer suggestions for better parenting.
Both programs reduced arrest rates and out-of-home placements, with positive effects four years after treatment ended.
National Institutes of Health
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it makes no difference what a few doctors say thousands of lives of sucesfull youth stand as witnesses of the effectiveness of these programs, I am one such "survivor" as you would call it, and I owe much of my sucess in life to my life-changing experience in a wwasp program, I have now been out for 5 years, and am nearing completion of college majoring in social work, psychology and spanish, upon completion I am planning on attending Columbia or Harvard University where I will obtain a graduate degree and then I'll open up my own program possibly with WWASP if the opportunity arises.
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The program's goal is to not to "save the lives of America's most troubled youth". The program's goal and purpose is to make you believe you've been saved
What the heck are you talking about believing i've been saved, lets take a look at the results and decide for ourselves:
Pre-program:
-Completely out of control from the time I was 12 through the time I entered the program at 17.
- Dropped out of highschool at 16, when I finally did graduate I had a 2.1 gpa.
- Daily drug use including marijuana, cocaine, lds, shrooms, and pcp.
- Several arrests for petty to violent crimes.
After graduation:
- I am currently a senior in college mantaining a 4.0 gpa with a double major in psych and social work, and a minor in spanish.
- Planning on attending Columbia or Harvard for graduate school next year.
- Very close relationships with my parents.
- Very happily married.
- Currently valedictorian at my college for the senior class.
- Member of several academic honor societies.
- Own and operate sucesful internet based business.
Now I know that you guys may say that these results are no reflection of my year in the program, however I strongly contend that they are a direct relfection, no i'm not programmed I have just chosen to apply the tools learned in the program in my life which has created lots of sucess for me. Out of curiosity where are you guys at in your lives? I'd be really interested to know, are you using drugs? Smoking? Attending college? GPA?
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Where am I now? Basically everyone here know about me- yes, I finished college. I'm a nurse, working in DC. I'm well-traveled. I have a very healthy relationship with my boyfriend, who is an MD + PhD, and will soon be a cardiologist. I don't have kids, don't abuse drugs, don't get in trouble with the law, ect... I'm active in a few charities and political groups. I'm close with many of my family members.
I have accomplished all this IN SPITE of my experience at PCS, not (in any way) because of it. Indeed, I still struggle with symptoms of PTSD, at age 26 (nightmares, though less frequently thanbefore, + anger at my parents ignorance in sending me there- though, to their credit, there just wasn't all this information from survivors available back then, in the early 90's.)
They listened to the recommendation of a local pediatrcian- Dr. Richard Schwartz of Virginia (a man who's own work does not get much credence from his peers). They send me there without even visiting the place first. (Uh, and if I remember corrently, my mother would have never placed is in an elementary school without her speaking with all the staff, and spending a day observing, while my sis, bro and I would also spend a day with the class, and also trying out the after-school activies) So I just found it to be pretty damn negligent that my mother had never even been to the state of Utah until she came to visit after I'd been there for 3 months.
**Okay, and to the person who says "...you make your own experience there..." That is such bullshit! In truth, the staff decide what your experience will be like. Every staff member has different expectations for different students, nothing is ever totally clear. First and foremost, these staff are not educated, and are not qualified to parttake in the making of implementing or evaluating of any care plan, nor are they in a position to provide any sort of therapy and care plan assessment. They just don't have the knowledge base perform these duties. Anyway, the staff there at PCS are LOSERS! And I have personally seen them push vendettas on kids they didn't like, and I have seen them directly responsibile for some children's hellish exerpience in these programs.
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Okay, you want to have a real professional, respectable program? Instead of employing local hillbillies to rein fear, get yourself a staff of RNs and MDs, and maybe a medical technician or 2, who can check vital signs or things like that (when you've got kids on all those meds, you need to have close medical supervision.). Professional medical staff have a very clear understanding about what treatments are ethical vs. unethical, or just plain legal vs. illegal. Have them create the care plans, and have the nursing staff work on the units, primary caregivers to the kids. Also have a staff of real school teachers, to teach classes like at a normal school.
THe reason many of these schools are fucked up, is because the staff is fucked up, and they have no idea what they are doing. Bring in some professionals.
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Hey Bandit,
How do we stop the madness? You live in DC, your in the healthcare industry and you're in the know. What does it take to take down an entire subindustry?
Your recommendations on Physicians, nurses and aids is healthy. Psychologists and psychiatrists should also be foremost in treatment. Would be interesting to see how many of the "patients" weren't the primary patient, but the parents were the real patient(s) that needed help.
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QUOTE: its happening, a board of independent psychologists have decided wwasp programs are safe effective! Sorry guys mission failed!
OK, where's the proof? What board of "independent" psychologists? The ones who work for WWASP and other programs, like Thayer, Mission Mountain, and so forth?
Show us the proof. If the board of independent psychologists decided WWASP is safe and effective then let us know who they are and post their opinions here for all to see.
Otherwise, nice try and go away!
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On 2005-08-05 21:30:00, Anonymous wrote:
"The program's goal is to not to "save the lives of America's most troubled youth". The program's goal and purpose is to make you believe you've been saved
What the heck are you talking about believing i've been saved, lets take a look at the results and decide for ourselves:
Pre-program:
-Completely out of control from the time I was 12 through the time I entered the program at 17.
- Dropped out of highschool at 16, when I finally did graduate I had a 2.1 gpa.
- Daily drug use including marijuana, cocaine, lds, shrooms, and pcp.
- Several arrests for petty to violent crimes.
After graduation:
- I am currently a senior in college mantaining a 4.0 gpa with a double major in psych and social work, and a minor in spanish.
- Planning on attending Columbia or Harvard for graduate school next year.
- Very close relationships with my parents.
- Very happily married.
- Currently valedictorian at my college for the senior class.
- Member of several academic honor societies.
- Own and operate sucesful internet based business.
Now I know that you guys may say that these results are no reflection of my year in the program, however I strongly contend that they are a direct relfection, no i'm not programmed I have just chosen to apply the tools learned in the program in my life which has created lots of sucess for me. Out of curiosity where are you guys at in your lives? I'd be really interested to know, are you using drugs? Smoking? Attending college? GPA?
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Daily drug use including marijuana, cocaine, lds, shrooms, and pcp <- my fucking ass, sorry. LOL. Thats got to be the biggest load of crap Ive ever heard of. I mean god damn man, for one how could you afford it? Plus if youre on a LSD trip why would you need any other drugs?
Now, as far as being on "LDS" instead of "LSD", Im definitely glad you kicked THAT habit :grin: If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there are men on base.
-- Dave Barry
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badit said "Instead of employing local hillbillies to rein fear, get yourself a staff of RNs and MDs, and maybe a medical technician or 2, who can check vital signs or things like that (when you've got kids on all those meds, you need to have close medical supervision.)"
I couldn't agree more. My child was at PCS and only had vital signs taken once - upon admission.
Also urgent medical care was denied - I think it was because they didn't want the abuse disclosed to licensed out-of-facility professionals.
The doctors, nurses and psychologists who work at Provo Canyon School should have their licenses revoked for failing to report the outrageous emotional, psychological and physical abuse of children in that facility.
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Yeah all the program graduates (missionaries) exaggerate their misdeeds before entering the program. They have to compensate for the idea that they wouldn't have died if they hadn't been locked up. This belief is necessary in their delusional world.
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Niles called you out, anon. You were abusing all those drugs, all at once??(PCP, coke, LSD, pot, ect, ect...). You are delusional.
And you ask us about "smoking"?? Smoking what, you puritan? My family is European, we all smoke! That was never a big deal. So do you think that if someone smokes (cigs or pot), that means they are "not doing well", or whatever? Dude, you really are ignorant! Puritans like that really are on the fringes of society, and should not be taken seriously.
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the programs like to convince the kids that they did all these drugs before they went into the program. The make you own up to and admit you had a crack addiction even if you've never had crack your whole life. the make you say you were a junkie even if you never even popped pills. The make you say you were a sex addict even if youre a virgin. That's what the programs do, don't know why. Guess they need to create problem so they can implement their "solutions."
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On 2005-08-06 18:59:00, bandit1978 wrote:
"Niles called you out, anon. You were abusing all those drugs, all at once??(PCP, coke, LSD, pot, ect, ect...). You are delusional.
And you ask us about "smoking"?? Smoking what, you puritan? My family is European, we all smoke! That was never a big deal. So do you think that if someone smokes (cigs or pot), that means they are "not doing well", or whatever? Dude, you really are ignorant! Puritans like that really are on the fringes of society, and should not be taken seriously.
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Really now bandit? Don't Puritans spend most of their time being angry about the fringes of society (in their minds?). And not just that, but god knows anyone having any sort of enjoyment at all is PURE EVIL to them, unless the euphoria comes from the aftermath of being beaten, rapped/seminared (yes, its a verb now, I said so) or having some seizure in a church with some guy screaming into a microphone and sweating his ass off.When we are pleading with foreign governments to stop the flow of cocaine, it is the height of hypocrisy for the US to export tobacco. Years from now, our nation will look back on this application of free trade policy and find it scandalous.
1989 testimony before the US Trade Representative,September 1989
--Surgeon General, Everett Koop
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To the anonymous person who made this statement on 8/5-------"Those of us who's lives have been changed and saved will forever stand as witnesses to the true benifits of the program, after all it's not program jargon that life is based on results it truly is, ask any ceo, doctor, lawyer, or any employer for that matter and you will see. Even ask God himself, like surely is based on results, and those of us who are sucesful are much more believable that you."-----
From one whose life was almost completely destroyed by Straight, I will forever stand witness to the true destruction inflicted by programs upon children, the programs that use abuse, humiliation, coercion, intimidation, threats, and brainwashing. After all, program jargon and lies fill the pockets of program CEO's/Administrators everywhere, all the while misrepresenting their so-called results on unsuspecting vulnerable parents. Ask any Straight or other coercive program survivor, who come from all walks of life, some of which are former counselors, lawyers and other "successful" people as you call it....
As for your assertion that successful people are much more believable than us, program survivors...hmmm if your theory is right, then a Straight Survivor who also happens to be a successful lawyer, who would verify every horrifying detail about program abuses, coercion, humilition, etc., would make a more credible and believable "witness" than you or any of your programmed, program loving sucessful friends? Ya think???
Just for the record, true credibility has nothing to do with success or career achievements, a person is credible merely by their commitment to reveal the TRUTH of their experience! And by MY definition, NOT YOURS, any program survivor is a credible witness to the horrors and emotional aftermath of these programs.
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you see my friend from my point of view there's only two types of program "survivors" those who are sucesful in their lives and tell the truth, and those who are liers for whatever reason. My experience is that wwasp programs are not abusive, and the only people who i've met whom say they are are incredibly unbelievable witnesses.
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Fine for the sake of arguement...lets do this your way...
First, Let me make sure I have your logic straight....
Survivor + Successful person = TRUTH
Survivor + Unsuccessful Person = Lies
Am I Right?
Thought so...simple math...
Let's do another easy equation....
Survivor + Successful Person/Lawyer = Truth of abusive, coercive programs that rob parents blind while breaking their child's spirit.
Now I'm starting to like your logic... :smile:
BUT I still say...
Survivor = TRUTH....period :wave:
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These people ARE on "fringes of society". So are the "Christian right", and other such freaks. They may think they are mainstream, but they're not, especially not if you included the whole world population in that analysis. Such freaks should not be taken seriously, but they should be monitored to make sure they aren't buying a million guns, or planning to blow up a Planned Parenthood clinic.