Fornits

Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones => Topic started by: absolutebest on October 24, 2005, 02:11:00 AM

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on October 24, 2005, 02:11:00 AM

This was such a great thread that I thought it should be continued...

Adam

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: dniceo7 on October 24, 2005, 12:34:00 PM

Then why didn't you continue it?

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on October 24, 2005, 03:38:00 PM

Because it is annoying to have to go to the 11th page.

- Adam

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: banana rama on October 25, 2005, 01:44:00 PM

wanna know why people were so elated when they got out of the summit?  cus they knew  they were going to eat and sleep like a normal human being and that somebody wasnt gonna tell ya that the reason you didnt get a "you live" vote from them was because you didnt deserve it, "cuz you have no dreams."  heck, we were all screwed up, but it sure does throw you into a loop when you get only one "you live" vote. i cant stand princess leah.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on October 25, 2005, 10:46:00 PM

You were Princess Leia in the costume party?  How come?

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 25, 2005, 11:21:00 PM

Quote

On 2005-10-25 19:46:00, absolutebest wrote:

"You were Princess Leia in the costume party?  How come?"

We didn't have a Princess Leia in my summit.  I'd love to hear about what anyone else had to do. We had the girl who had to do the Miss America swim suit contest. That was cool.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 26, 2005, 10:33:00 AM

We didn't have a Leia either, but we had a Luke.

--->Castle

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on October 26, 2005, 04:59:00 PM

Man, this just blows my mind.  I never did the Summit.  I was pulled after my Values, which is unusual, I suppose.  I guess I just don't understand the concept of the costume party.  What point of the experience does it happen during (which day)?  What do they do, just sit around and belittle you?  Make you act out this character and then throw your similarities to him/her in your face?  I don't completely get the concept?  Did it make sense at all?  Or was it just a creative and gripping way of putting you back into your shit?

- Adam[ This Message was edited by: absolutebest on 2005-10-26 13:59 ]

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 26, 2005, 05:39:00 PM

Well the costume party was on the 4rd or fourth day. I can't remember. But my character was Whinnie the Pooh. I guess I was supposed to let people see my honey, and whenever people said "NO" or something to me I had to yell like a mother fucker for 10 seconds. Before we were to "Act" out our character, we were supposed to do a meet and greet of sorts. I don't really remember all too clearly, but each character was supposed to represent your vices or something. Then at the end of the day, you had to "Act" your character out. It was very strange, and thinking back on it is even weirder. The day where we were supposed to find our "Contract" to get us out of our "Neighborhood" was by far the worst. It took like all day. We were supposed to say things like "I am Honest and Generous, (Your name here)" But the staff had already picked out for you what your contract was so if you didn't get it right they would like make you feel like shit. I ended up being the absolute last person to "Find" my "Contract" I thought I was never going to leave. Then everyone lifts you up on their shoulders and you are supposed to be enlightened. I think the only reason you felt better was because that stupid shit was over. I mean my Summit was like 30 people so it took all damn day. Every time someone finished their "Contract" there was like a silence before someone else would step up to the plate. It was really quite a traumatic event, one that I would never want to go again. The reason why people were so extatic (Estatic, whatever, happy) when they got out was because that shit was finally over. 5 days+ with like 8 hours of sleep. That was some fucked up bullshit. "You have to maintain an 'open' position at all times" This ment that you couldn't have your hands crossed, your legs crossed. You have no idea how hard it is to sit for 5 days with your palms facing the sky. Or how hard it was to stay awake at 5am sitting in a chair. It was totally fucked any way you look at it. It made the Propheets look like childs play.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 26, 2005, 06:40:00 PM

It has reminded me of some things, thanks.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: chinsk on October 26, 2005, 08:43:00 PM

I was Luke.. I made it entertaining   :grin:



(edit: sp)
[ This Message was edited by: chinsk on 2005-10-26 17:50 ]

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on October 26, 2005, 11:06:00 PM

So, let me get this straight... day one and two are like normal raps, day three is the raft exercise and the funeral/death/obituary day, day four is the costume party and day five is neighborhoods/contracts?  I can't get these days straight.  When do you go into Bonners and talk to people, the urban challenge I think its called (or do you)?  How does the Summit kick off?  How do they wrap it up?  What in the hell does "The Rose", roses or "Fame" (the song that everyone dances to) have to do with anything?  What in the hell is the red/green game?  I am confused.

- Adam

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 27, 2005, 01:21:00 AM

Best to just not think about it...

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 27, 2005, 10:02:00 AM

I don't really remember what days one and two were like. The red green game took place then as did the whole funeral thing. I guess the red green game was supposed to send the message that you should work together rather than try to beat each other. It's a little difficult to remember. I never had to do anything like go into Bonners Ferry and talk to people. That never happened. I guess in the first couple of days there is just a lot of bullshit. They take an obscene amount of time to do everything. It took like 2 hours to go over the "Agreements" of the Summit. You were supposed to sit while the "Agreement" was being said and if you agreed with it, you stood up.  "All those in agreement please stand (brief pause to look who agreed). All those standing please sit, all those sitting please stand." Then they would go over with you why you didn't agree with that particular agreement and why. Basically they made it appear that you had the choice to agree with the "Agreement" yet even if you didn't they would yell at you until you did. For example: I didn't agree with the "Agreement" that you would do anything they told you too. They said that "you have to do anything we tell you too, even if it means hitting someone" or something to that affect. I didn't agree with that. I said, hell no. I'm not going to hurt someone just because Steve Rookey wants me to. Fuck that. Well, it was either agree with the "Agreement" or I guess leave the Summit. I wasn't about to leave the Summit, my high school education depended on it, and since I was so close I figured that I would just comply. The first few days were spent doing a lot of bullshit. I remember there was a TON of "break" time where you had really long journal assignments. At one point they read your journals and since the assignments were so damn long, no one ever had time to finish them. So at the end of like day 1 or 2, while the staff went to sleep in the dorms or something, they made everyone stay up until they had finished their assignments. That took forever, to say the least. Most of the people in my Summit were only like half done, so instead of sleeping for like 3 hours everyone had to write. But since it was like 3 or so in the morning, no one could focus. It was a bunch of bullshit. The "Agreement" where you were supposed to hit someone if they asked you came into play. It was like "Partner up with someone (I think you were assigned a partner for the whole Summit though, and you had to keep tabs on them. Like were they not sitting with their hands in the neutral position, or had they masturbated, which you weren't allowed to do either) and slap them as hard as you can. "One the count of three, partner A slap partner B. One...Two...Switch partners. Partner B slap partner A. One...Two...Hug." It was pretty lame, but I already knew about this becuase I had read someone elses Summit Journal. There were some yelling excersises too, but nothing too weird, or too weird in CEDU terms. Basically after you got your "Contract" it was a state of euphoria. Everything after that was no where near as intense, but still just as weird. Near the end, they brought in all this dank food, but instead of eating it, you had to feed it to someone else, and they in turn had to feed it to you. Fucking weird, I know.

To sum it all up to the best of my memory: Day one is spent going over the agreements and doing some other bullshit. Day two was the red green game and some yelling shit. Day three was the Costume party. Day four was the "Contract". And day five was the feeding people and like reveling in the fact that you were almost done. Day five I'm sure had some smooshing and some other gay ass shit in it as well.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: try another castle on October 27, 2005, 11:35:00 AM

odd. I recall the feeding each other thing happening after the 4 day solo on the wilderness challenge. Maybe they moved it to the summit after the expeditions changed.

In my summit, they did do the urban challenge. I hated it. It was the stupidest fucking thing ever. But we didn't go to Bonners Ferry, we went to Spokane. I didn't finish all of my requirements, so I had to go back weeks later after the summit was over with other people who hadn't finished it and complete it. It was very embarassing. If I had had a clue, I would have just kicked back and used that money playing video games at the arcade at the mall the whole time, and then come back into the summit and lied and said I completed the challenge.

The thing that sucked the most about the urban challenge was that you couldn't tell these strangers you went up to that you were being made to do this, so people just thought you were nuts, or a loser who was really lonely (unless you had a lot of finesse and could come off really natural at casual conversation with strangers.) If you did tell them, then you were automatically out of agreement, and you would have to do the assignment over. And I was so socially stupid anyway, I just made myself look stupider. One of the people I talked to basically confronted me outright and said "You're really lonely, aren't you?"

Some of the requirements were really weird. Like, you had to exchange phone numbers and addresses with someone, you had to buy someone lunch (one guy in my peer group had the right idea about this requirement, he bought food for a homeless guy. That idea didn't even occur to me. I stayed inside the mall the whole time. I didn't even realize we could have gone outside.) I remember one of the easier ones were to talk to someone of the opposite sex. (Which in my case, got a result of an incredulous "How am I DOING?????" and then them getting up and storming away.)

I'm surprised nobody in the history of the summit got abducted or at least punched. Maybe that's why they stopped doing it, because the potential for a mishap was just too high.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 27, 2005, 12:00:00 PM

I didn't make it to the summit.  What was the whole costume party thing?  What was the purpose/challenge of it? How were characters picked?

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 27, 2005, 12:33:00 PM

What was the Urban Challenge? They sent you to a mall to meet people or something? To talk to people? What was the purpose?

As far as the costume party was concerned...It was supposed to have you put your "Contract" to use. THAT'S RIGHT! The costume party came AFTER the contract. The purpose was so you could feel your way through your neighborhood and use your contract. Basically it was just another dumb thing to do in the Summit. I thought it was really gay. For example: someone in my Summit had to play Mr. Rogers because he was a real hard ass. It was supposed to make you use the tools you had already learned. But in actuallity it just made you even more afraid to stand up in front of the group. The staff who were running the Summit had already picked out what it was that you were supposed to do, just like they had picked out your contract for you. The staff picked out what character you were supposed to be. They kind of had a vote on who was going to get what character by proposing the character then saying "ok, who do you think should play...Jane from Tarzan?" People would say "Max." The staff would say "No, who else?" Eventually the group would pick the right person and they would be chosen for the role.

I guess the whole point of the Summit was for you to "Find" yourself, I guess. But in reality, it was just a terribly frightening thing to go through. Having to stand up in front of 20+ people and talk about your feelings. Fuck, it's hard enough to talk in front of 20+  people and talk about football. The staff made fun of you by playing games, litteraly. They would play with a "Bop-It" toy while we were all standing around.

What made things worse was the fact that when people were done with "Finding" their "Contract" they would act all high and mighty. They would get lifted, litteraly, onto the shoulders of the rest of the group. They would then participate in the confrontations when you were at the front of the room just trying to get that shit over with. They would be able to dance around and be all happy once they were done and basically rub it in everyone elses face who wasn't done.

Man that was some fucked up shit. I've got to read my Summit journal to remember what happened.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: try another castle on October 27, 2005, 01:16:00 PM

Sounds like they changed some things. In my summit, the carrying around happened after the party. The party happened in two parts. The first was the actual "party" where everyone milled around and did their thing, and the second part was when each person went up in front of the group and played out their character. Similar structure to the contract. When the staff felt that you "nailed it", they played "Fame" and you got carried around by the rest of the peer group. I actually didn't mind the party too much. I thought it was the only thing from the Summit that was actually marginally funny. But this is compared to all of the other crap you had to go through, so it isn't saying much.

I also recall the party happening the day before the contracts instead of the day after.

Yeah, and the point of the urban challenge was to "make the world a better place" (not literally, but at least feel like we were) it was based on a writing assignment we had the night before. That was the part where you worked your contract, since the contracts were the day before.

So it sounds like it changed around, and the party became the part where you worked your contract, instead of the urban challenge.

Did you guys still get keys? We each got a key. (I think in the Summit reunion.) I remember hurling mine into the middle of a large grassy area on my college campus to get rid of it when I first started deprogramming myself and working through all of that resentment. Yeah, I know, totally dramatic.

_________________
[ This Message was edited by: sorry... try another castle on 2006-01-14 19:22 ]

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: banana rama on October 27, 2005, 01:29:00 PM

i was the last one to fulfill by character role.  i dont remember why they picked princess leia.  probably cuz i had a real potty mouth and could be pretty harsh.  the whole thing was rather humiliating and the effects to this day have been troublesome.

the whole placement of the hands thing was harsh for me as my bone-structure wouldnt allow it.  they conceded to this and allowed me to let my arms go inward--palms still up.  the fact that i had to tell them this and ask permission was incredulous.  anybody could see that i was in pain--my face was contorted from it.

i had to go back into town to complete the urban challenge.  the first time was in spokane and the second time in bonners ferry.  supposedly the schools thought i split the second time and kept trying to pick me up.  i had to walk all the way back to bca--little me in my stick legs.  i learned that i had to bullshit and lie to get through this, like giving my money to a homeless person.  funny that i felt guilty.

at the time i was a vegetarian--still am--so the fare they gave me was rather meager.  not saying they everybody enjoyed eating stale sandwiches, but i think i just got a slab of cheese and mayo.

i remember tidbits, but my memmory lacks continuity.  i remember instances as splotchy  or indistinct, except for a few key experiences.  one day, i suppose, i wont be scraping the pieces together into the semblance of a remembered past.  perhaps i dont want to or there is a reason i cant.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 27, 2005, 01:29:00 PM

Yup, they played that damn "Fame" and it was madd hard to keep people up in the air for like 4 minutes. There was one really REALLY fat staff member in ours and they like cut the song off after like 1 minute. She was too damn fat to carry around for that long! hahahah. But there was a mingeling thing before you went in front of everyone. It was kind of strange don't you think? Well, I guess everything was strange there. Instead of saying "Nailed it" they said "Sing it!" That indicated to you that you could then sign your contract and get lifted up or whatever.

They did a lot of acting out little skits also for the kids when we came back from breaks. Like they would play the song from Chariots of Fire and run around the room in slow motion and trip everyone to illustrate that things should be a "Win Win" Then they would do it after the game and they wouldn't trip each other, but pat each other on their backs. That was some fucked up shit.

About the only thing that was remotly ok about the Summit were the breaks. They were madd long and there were a lot of them. But they were kind of bad too. You never knew when you were going to get called back in. So there was this terrible waiting. Sitting on the edge of your seat.

Another thing I just remembered about the Cosntume party was the costumes themselves. You had to make them. They gave you some shitty supplies and you had to make makeshift costumes. Then they had you come in and evaluated the costumes. Every person got yelled at that theirs wasn't good enough. That they had to go back and only had like 10 minutes to fix shit. That just made things even more stressful.

At the begining they made everyone get a partner for the whole Summit. This person you were to keep an eye on. They were to be your support, or something. If they were out of "Agreement" so were you. One person straight bounced, and no one knew where he went. We all thought that the staff were playing a trick on us or something. We thought it was a part of it. Well it wasn't. This dude was like "Fuck you, I'm gone" He just walked out during a break, went back to the dorms, packed, and walked away. It was pretty gutsy I think.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: banana rama on October 27, 2005, 01:35:00 PM

was there something in which they rocked each participant to, like, "your song?"  or was that the i and me?

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 27, 2005, 01:41:00 PM

No! That's was the Summit too! I forgot about that. I can't remember when that was but it was weird too! I remember they brought in John Gurney for me, he and I are sort of friends, SORT OF PEOPLE, and it was supposed to be this great thing. Well it freakes me out to think about it now. I don't remember what that was all about but it did happen, I know that.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: banana rama on October 27, 2005, 01:47:00 PM

the lights were all dim and shit.  one staff member--a female-sang along with good ol' lennon's "beautiful boy (darling boy)" to a grown man.  weird, i say.  was it before the life-boat?

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: If u want to know..then a on October 27, 2005, 01:59:00 PM

Omigod, we almost dropped someone when we were trying to fly them (not to be mean, but they were the biggest person in there), so none of us could keep them up.  They shut off the music and yelled at us.  They didn't care whether it was our fault or not, and then one of the staff had to step in and help fly them around!  I was laughing because it turned out to be the same staff that yelled at us!

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on October 27, 2005, 02:52:00 PM

I still look back fondly on my IWTL, but I'm actually quite glad I never went through this.  The more and more I hear it just seems weird.

I still don't understand the "your song" part and haven't heard anything about the red/green game.  I'm just so curious about the Summit.  It seems like it was just one long, drawn-out workshop to make you feel as low and uncomfortable as one possibly can, followed by a building up of sorts in which they build you to feel a sense of euphora (half because of what they do, half because the shit is over... you're essentially done with the program).  I'm just blabbing now, but this is the only way that I can make sense of this thing.  

Oh, did they read anything out of any books or anything?  The Prophet maybe?[ This Message was edited by: absolutebest on 2005-10-27 11:53 ]

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 27, 2005, 03:07:00 PM

I can't remember them reading anything out of the Prophet, but I don't rule it out. As far was what the reg green game detailed...I don't really remember except for the fact that they seperated everyone into two groups and made them sit on opposite sides of the building(or the breakroom). The two groups couldn't be able to see or hear one another, they had to be seperate. I know that staff members had to relay messages between the groups. But I don't know what the actual game looked like. The POINT of the game was to realize that both teams could be right. It was to emphasize the "Win Win" "Tool." Like I said though, I don't remember how the game was played, just the outcome.

One girl in my group thought that she was "Dirty." She thought it was another sort of a "Disclosure Circle" and started to say all this weird shit. I think she said something like "I didn't do my dishes when I was living in the OSD."

My Summit took place at RMA's campus at the time. It was in that building on the hill or whatever, Emerson?!

But you are correct in your thinking that it really didn't have much to do with emotional growth. It was just one very long mind fuck where they broke you down and made you feel like shit, then somehow by lifting you up on their shoulders and playing John Denver or "Fame" they built you back up.

I know that when everyone saw people coming out of their Summit, holding roses and going "Pssstt" they thought it was lame, and it was. But coming out of the Summit myself, that's actually how I felt. Mind you it wasn't a real feeling or anything, but I was just so damn happy to be done that dancing was easily the best thing to do at the moment. It was a strangely happy moment (But not as happy as the WHITE SOX WINNING THE WORLD SERIES YESTERDAY! I'm from Chicago, sorry.)

Why do you still look back fondly on your I Want To Live? That shit was fucking dumb. OOOHHH hit a pillow for a long time and imagine that it's your father or the bully at school. I thought that shit was lame. It had this big reputation surrounding it also. Maybe that's because you could always hear yelling coming from the "Propheet Room" (what ever one that happened to be) and it scared the crap out of you if you just got there. Actually it scared the crap out of you even if you had already done it.

Did anyone ever assist, or help or support, with a propheet? I can't remember what that was called, but I had to one time. I did the Childrens again, and it was just as weird the second time around as it was the first. The only thing that was different when I was supporting was the fact that I didn't get yelled at as much in the rap. That was all. I had to do the same stuff as I did when I went through it the first time. The Diads or whatever (Yelling at someone: "My father told me...My mother told me.." Man, why didn't we burn that place down?!

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: try another castle on October 27, 2005, 03:17:00 PM

I remember the scariest thing about the IWTL (and some of the workshops, mainly the I & Me) is seeing the older students come out of them and they had lost their voices, and you would wonder WTF they did in there that would make them scream themselves hoarse within such a short amount of time, and what was so special about the IWTL versus the other propheets that would make people lose their voice.

I honestly don't remember why that was, myself.

To answer your question, yes, I supported a propheet. It was the childrens.

_________________
[ This Message was edited by: sorry... try another castle on 2006-01-14 19:22 ]

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 27, 2005, 03:29:00 PM

You're right. Seeing someone not be able to speak after like half a day of shit, that is scary!

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 27, 2005, 05:12:00 PM

I supported in a Truth Propheet with three of my other friends, all of who had been there longer than I had.  Funny thing is that they all were dirty as hell and got busted when the RMA Underground of '96 got busted.  The Truth was a cakewalk as a support.  It was pretty fun, really.  I had a mellow facilitator, though.  Nicole Rauls (Rawls?), I think.  Maybe it was Laura Curos?  I dunno.  |I think it was Nicole's first propheet as a facilitator, if anyone remembers her?

As far as the IWTL is concerned, yes, I remember it fondly.  I was a real angry kid that kind of fell between the cracks in both the school and my peer group.  Plus, I always thought I was getting pulled until right before my IWTL (I actually did after the Values).  The legendary Sheila was our facilitator and my team leader, Tony Almaras, made an important appearance.  I was angry as hell and really hadn't dealt with shit yet.  The IWTL is the first time I was really focused on within my peer group.  It was also the first time I really opened up, found a voice and let myself be angry.  I just remember walking out feeling like a new person.  After that the entire school's perception of me changed for the better.  I didn't really change that much (was never much of a rap presence or "powerful" older student), I just let go of a lot of shit in there and felt better about myself afterwards. That is why.

My next question is this... Did The Summit really have to be five days?  It seems like they could have done it in two, but just wanted it to be a long, grueling process.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on October 27, 2005, 05:13:00 PM

That last one was me, sorry...

Adam

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 27, 2005, 05:27:00 PM

I think the Summit was however long "They" wanted it to be. I mean a lot of the shit was not necessary (well, all of it was unncessary). But the larger the group the longer it's going to be. One of the Summits I saw was 6 days long! So I guess it just depended on the group and the people running it.


Shelia! Tony Almaris! Fuck both of them. When I was going to NWA "changes" were made. That ment that like some staff left NWA and moved over to BCA, I think Sam Zugg was one of them. A few of the staff at BCA and RMA moved to NWA. Well I had Glenn Sutton as a team leader at NWA, who I thought was the best at the time and now realize he was just as much of a tool as the rest of them, and I was pissed that Sheila was going to be my new team leader. When I was in the "Summit" phase and didn't have to go to raps or anything, Sheila was a total bitch to me. A rule for those in "Summit" at NWA was that they were allowed to make as many phone calls as they wanted whenever they wanted. Well, of course you had to have the approval of the team leader, but it was supposed to be more of a formality than anything else. Not with Sheila. She wouldn't let me call anyone. I had to call colleges to set up interviews and shit and she wouldn't let me do that! I had to call my parents to let them know what was going on with regards to graduation, she wouldn't let me do that. Basically she revoked all the "Summit" privledges because she didn't like me. Even when I graduated, she went up to my mother and said something like "Your son and I don't get along...good-bye!" My mom was pissed! I fucking hated Sheila.

Tony Almaras was a dick too. He had a lisp if I remember correctly. One night at NWA a kid from Phoenix AZ, said Tony smacked him. I doubt it was true but Tony got suspended until the situation could get figured out. I think he eventually went back to RMA because the kids at NWA hated him so much.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: try another castle on October 27, 2005, 08:05:00 PM

Wow, they cut off a day. Well I guess they would, since they got rid of the urban challenge. Summit in the 80s was six highly structured days.

What blows me away is the lifespring angle of this. The only part of the summit that wasn't originally lifespring is the costume party. I can't believe that people actually paid good money (hundreds of dollars) to go through this workshop THEMSELVES! And then they went out and recruited other people to go through it! People are STUPID!

and also, Dr. Phil had a four/five day workshop that I saw excerpts from on the Oprah site years ago. The parts that they showed had the red/green game (except that he called it the red/black game) and the "are you a giver or a taker" deal. So he basically took at least some parts of the lifespring workshop and used it, even though lifespring had been debunked years before as a white collar cult. One of the many reasons why I think he's full of shit.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on October 28, 2005, 12:08:00 AM

Yeah, Sheila could be a bitch.  I really didn't have a problem with her, but she definitely played favorites.  No doubt.  And sometimes she would just pick on people that she didn't like, if she wanted to.  She was pretty cool to me, though.  I had a big problem with Jon Aaron for awhile, if I remember correctly.  Laura Curos, too.  Treated me like shit when I moved to her team.  Put me on all-school bans and a booth because I was the most "negative in-agreement student ever", which is kind of contradictory, but I guess I did tend to talk shit about the school a lot.  I got in trouble for doing a skit of raps, that apparently went way overboard.  I also got busted for coming up with tons of parody songs about the school (One that really pissed them off was a spin on "Cheers" that everybody took a liking to... "You wanna go where everybody bust your games... and every day is the god damn same..." (forgot the rest, but it really wasn't as big of a deal as they made it).  Basically, they made my life hell because I was cynical and sarcastic.  For three weeks I only could talk to Mike Nailor (the president), Ned Murray (headmaster), Laura and Tony.  I spent all day, every day building a huge rock wall that is most likely still there.  It was bullshit.  I kind of got pulled because of that.

Tony was cool to me most of the time, but he was my team leader from the git-go.  I think he fell apart when he got divorced, at least that is what I heard.  We did butt heads a lot, though.  He didn't have a lisp, he just got loud and spit a lot.  And Tony could be ridiculously "out of touch" sometimes, but I think he meant well.  At least when I was there.  But yeah, I could see him being a prick if he didn't get along with you.

I liked Glen Sutton.  I thought he was a legitimately nice and well-meaning guy.  His wife was pretty solid too.  She was my cross country coach.
[ This Message was edited by: absolutebest on 2005-10-27 21:11 ][ This Message was edited by: absolutebest on 2005-10-27 21:12 ]

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: try another castle on October 28, 2005, 05:18:00 AM

Quote

On 2005-10-27 21:08:00, absolutebest wrote:

I spent all day, every day building a huge rock wall that is most likely still there.  It was bullshit.  I kind of got pulled because of that.

Hey! I bet your rock wall replaced MY rock wall from MY full time! Would it by any chance be the one in the main driveway leading up to the house?

Mine was pretty damn sturdy back in the day, and it took me a 14 day full time to build, but I'm sure by the time you were there, it was a mess, if it was still around, even.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 10:37:00 AM

Propheets and workshops or whatever were bad, but the worst part were those fuckers that would "soft seat" them. Those kids were miserable.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 10:41:00 AM

what the hell does that mean? "Soft Seat?"

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 11:14:00 AM

Did you guys have students - usually ones in new horizons but sometimes it would be the real ass kissers of challenge - that would co-facilitate propheets? or workshops? By the way I don't know what the phases were at RMA or Running Springs - maybe that's all just a bunch of BCA talk.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 11:31:00 AM

We had supporters in our Propheets at NWA too. I don't remember what phase you had to be in, but they existed. I supported once in a Childrens propheet. Does anyone rememeber what the phases were. It went Voyager...Challege? New Horizons, Summit? Something like that.

The guy who supported in my Truth Propheet was a real tool. I had just gotten there when I went through my truth. I didn't know what the fuck was going on. Wasn't there a dance at the begining or something? I just remember thinking, "This is kind of weird, but ok. I'll dance" Then when we all "Came Out" everyone was supposed to share. I was like "Fuck that. I don't want to stand up in front of everyone and say something." Someone was like "You have to!" I said "I had a really good time."

A few weeks later I was talking to another student who hadn't gone through it yet and I said it was pretty lame. Somehow word got around that I didn't think it was too cool and boy did I hear about it in a rap. Man! The dude who was supporting in the Propheet got soooo pissed. I guess I learned a lesson not to talk shit about Prohpeets anymore.

Does anyone know what they all were? Truth, Childrens, Dreams, I Want to live?, Values, Imagine, I & ME, and Summit? Is that all of them or am I missing some?

Trying to explain that shit to people on the outside now is so strange. It's only when you try to explain it to people and they look at you like your fuckin' nuts, that's when you realize that what happened there was fuckin' nuts.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: dniceo7 on October 28, 2005, 12:45:00 PM

I don't even bother trying to explain those things to people these days. You got them all except the Brothers. By the end of CEDU's time, the Imagine and I & Me had been combined into one, 2-day workshop, but then they split them again. We had people that supported in those things, but that was a completely different game from soft-seating aka co facilitating.

Supporters were basically just going through the thing again for whatever odd reason. I supported a couple times, but once was to avoid a restriction, and the other was to get into the OSD. You had to do everything that damn script called for right along with the younger peer group going through it. Soft-seaters, however, just made you sick. Instead of sitting on the floor or on one of those plastic chairs for hours at a time with you and the supporters, they were in the nice, comfortable chairs with the staff. Essentially, for however long you were in there, they were staff. They even got the good staff grub. And they'd sit there yelling at you and trying to 'call you out' and get you 'back in agreement' and really just soaking up their chance to be staff for a day.

I can understand why people supported those, but I still want to strangle some of the kids that soft-seated them. People usually got asked to support, and often it was a 'yea you have a choice, but actually you don't' situation. But unless LaTresa or one of the 'big dogs' themselves asked them to do it, it was the ass kissers themselves that went out of their way and begged to soft-seat.  [ This Message was edited by: dniceo7 on 2005-10-28 09:48 ]

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: banana rama on October 28, 2005, 12:58:00 PM

damn, i detest neil diamond.  i dont remember supporting a propheet to be cushy.

yeah, its nearly impossible trying to explain propheets to the non-survivor--so many details.  i have maybe one or two friends who get the jist of it and are utterly sickened by it.  every therapist and psychoanalyst that ive talked in some sort of detail have this look of horror on their faces.

i supported a couple of propheets.  yeah, maybe i was a kiss ass.  then again, maybe i was just a kid trying to survive.  the fact is is that people do different things to make it through however they can.  chrissakes, we were KIDS!!!  KIDS undergoing sensory deprivation, emotional and physical distress, things that adult survivors of synanon have a hard enough time coping with.

how the cedu system misappropiated certain texts, art, philosophies and music (such and transcendentalism--remember the i and me? lennon, etc.) and folded them in with cultish practices such as synanon, etc. for brainwashing children at the hands adults speaks for itself.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 01:16:00 PM

Quote

On 2005-10-28 02:18:00, sorry... try another castle wrote:

"

Quote

On 2005-10-27 21:08:00, absolutebest wrote:


I spent all day, every day building a huge rock wall that is most likely still there.  It was bullshit.  I kind of got pulled because of that.

Hey! I bet your rock wall replaced MY rock wall from MY full time! Would it by any chance be the one in the main driveway leading up to the house?



Mine was pretty damn sturdy back in the day, and it took me a 14 day full time to build, but I'm sure by the time you were there, it was a mess, if it was still around, even.
"

Yes.  I rebuilt that wall in 1996.  I had to take it down rock by rock and rebuild the wall.  I finished 90% of it then got taken off of my 3 1/2-week booth.  Some other guy finished the wall.  My back still isn't right.  My friend Mike--who I still talk to--had something like an 80-day full-time.  He built half of the shit at RMA.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on October 28, 2005, 01:19:00 PM

Did people soft-seat in The Summit?  I remember people doing soft-seating at RMA every so often.  Most were pricks, but one or two of them were cool.  I remember thinking that this one girl--I won't mention ex-student's names--must be the biggest kiss ass on God's green earth.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 02:21:00 PM

I don't think anyone ever soft-seated a summit during my time. Even the I & Me...I think the last one they would let you soft-seat was the Imagine. Someone soft-seated my Imagine and made it considerably worse than it really had to be.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 02:27:00 PM

What is soft-seating?

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 02:52:00 PM

It's when you are an "Upperclassmen" student or whatever and you assist with a propheet. It's just doing it all over again but supposedly you're supposed to be helping the staff out and the other students. It's wasn't supposed to be like going through the whole thing again, but it usually ended up being just like the first time you did. We didn't call it "Soft Seating" at NWA, we called it Supporting.

The one that I did was basically like the first time except that they didn't focus so much on me as they did the other students. But it was totally gay. And while you sort of voulnteered to do it, the staff had a great influence. It was just the illusion of choice. They would suggest it to you and if you chose not to do it, negative consequences would follow. Totally lame.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 04:55:00 PM

Quote

On 2005-10-28 11:52:00, Anonymous wrote:

"It's when you are an "Upperclassmen" student or whatever and you assist with a propheet. It's just doing it all over again but supposedly you're supposed to be helping the staff out and the other students. It's wasn't supposed to be like going through the whole thing again, but it usually ended up being just like the first time you did. We didn't call it "Soft Seating" at NWA, we called it Supporting.



The one that I did was basically like the first time except that they didn't focus so much on me as they did the other students. But it was totally gay. And while you sort of voulnteered to do it, the staff had a great influence. It was just the illusion of choice. They would suggest it to you and if you chose not to do it, negative consequences would follow. Totally lame. "

You're missing what I'm saying. We had supporting at BCA as well. It was completely different from soft-seating. Let me explain...

Supporting: You were usually through at least your Dreams (the 4th in our program), but sometimes you could do it after the Brothers. You were basically going through the propheet for a second (or third, or 4th, whatever) time. You did everything the actual peer group did...you were just there to give them a 'model' of how to do the propheet. Essentially the same as an 'upperclassmen' supporting in a voyager rap.

Soft-seating (aka co-facilitating): You weren't partaking in the experience, you were actually running it. You had to be through your I Want to Live to soft-seat, but often had to be through the Values as well. Soft-seating got its name from the fact that you actually sat in one of the soft seats that the staff sat in the entire time. You had your own little notebook with the entire script in it and you would run all the little activities. If someone had soft seated the I & Me, they would've been the one next to you reading those bullshit 'fantastic voyage' words into your ear instead of actually being on the mattress like a supporter would have been. Soft-seaters were staff for the duration of the 'experience'. They didn't sit in the break room with you, they were in the break room with the staff eating real food instead of ham sandwiches.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 05:06:00 PM

Ah ha. I was missing your point. There weren't any "Soft-Seaters" whan I was at NWA. I was wrong, sorry. So you mean students actually helped run the Propheets?! That's messed up. Nothing likt that ever happened when I was at NWA. The only students that were in the Prohpeets besides the peer group were the supporters. Wow, I can't imagine other students acting like they were staff. That's beyond me.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 05:39:00 PM

In the early 90's at cedu (can't speak for before or after then), there were only supporters, not soft-seaters.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on October 28, 2005, 06:26:00 PM

I was there from '99 to '02. It wasn't rare to see someone soft-seat, but it was rare that it would actually be a different group of students. In my first 6 months, if someone soft-seated, it was one of the same 4 or 5 kids...the ultimate of the ass kissing, 'look good', self righteous idiots who always snitched on you for breaking bans and things like that. I would've loved to get one shot at one of them, but hey.

It really was amazing to see these kids actually imitating staff. It was bad enough to have staff in there doing what they did in propheets, but to have some kid trying to pull it off as well? Made me sick that kids actually allowed themselves to do it. They were already in New Horizons or Summit, already had their privileges and could taste their freedom, but still, for pure pleasure, wanted to run a propheet. Assholes if you ask me.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: try another castle on October 28, 2005, 09:49:00 PM

Holy crap, I've never heard of anything as crazy as soft seating in my life. As if the staff weren't unqualified enough. Talk about a "propheet kapo"!

We didn't have anything like that when I was there. Supporting at RMA in the 80s was a lot like what the anon said it was like at BCA, except that you had to have gone through your IWTL to be eligable. You sat in the plastic chairs just like all the other students, and you went through all of the same things they did, it's just that you were there as a "role model" and to essentially be supportive. When the staff went to confer between breaks, you didn't go with them or speak with them. You stayed with all the other students.

There was also the situation where students just went through a propheet again, because they were having a hard time. This was essentially the antithesis of supporting a propheet. You were viewed as a loser. I went through my Truth again when I was in Quest. (Or was it Challenge?) I can't even remember what I had done wrong to warrant it. I think it was that I just simply wasn't "getting with the program" and was having a hard time in raps "getting in touch" with things. I wasn't developing at the same rate as my peer group, essentially. I was put on a work detail and then put through the Truth again. The irony of this whole thing is that I didn't have a speck of "dirt" on my "dirt list", aside from little piddly piss-ant crap that everyone has on theirs, like forgetting to tuck in your shirt one day. It totally wasn't about whether or not I had broken any rules. It was all about "emotional growth" stuff.

Quote

Yes. I rebuilt that wall in 1996. I had to take it down rock by rock and rebuild the wall. I finished 90% of it then got taken off of my 3 1/2-week booth. Some other guy finished the wall. My back still isn't right. My friend Mike--who I still talk to--had something like an 80-day full-time. He built half of the shit at RMA.

Wow, that's about a decade after I built it. I'm sure several students had re-built it inbetween those two times. But you essentially had to do exactly what I did. Take it out rock by rock.

Did you used to do that full-time trick of making a sundial by plunking a stick in the dirt so you knew what time it was? (We weren't allowed watches on a full-time. I don't know if that changed or not.)

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: TheSummitGives on October 28, 2005, 10:17:00 PM

Please, what is this slander of the beautiful soft seat? Those children who sat in the soft seat were the most wonderful butterflies of you all. All they wanted was to give to your life as much as the ultimate giver, the Summit itself.

It seems that some of you have forgotten just what the Summit has to offer you. I invite you to come join me for a picnic on Clifty. If enough of you join me, we can even play my favorite, the red and green game!

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on October 29, 2005, 12:50:00 AM

"He's baaaaaaacckk!"

I don't know if it's captain brainwashed or captain sarcasm, but something is going on with this dude.

When I supported in the Truth they would occasionally let us in the break room to grab snacks and get coffee, and if they wanted to talk to us.  We also were allowed to take a few breaks and leave (Walden?) for a few.  But we definitely had to sit in a plastic chair and share about ourselves.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on November 01, 2005, 10:12:00 PM

Reading the posts brought back some memories.   I just like to start with a big "FUCK YOU RMA".

The The Summit, I and Me, Imagine, Values, I Want to Live, Dreams, Childrens, and Truth -- what strange non-applicable crap.

At the summit I attended, we had the so-called 'urban challenge'.   I have no memory of what I had to complete during that time.   I just remember it being a sunny day, and hanging out at a park.   The "Urban Challenge" was a welcome reprieve from the RMA bullshit. I think we were not allowed to talk to anyone from RMA during the challenge -- not being able to talk to anyone from RMA was a blessing.

Thanks to person who mentioned the Key.   I had an old key, and I did not remember what where it was from.

I do remember the contract.  Mine was I am a beautiful forgiving woman.    Huh -- more bullshit.   Who I am cannot be summed up into some cheesy one-liner. I did not recall all the arguing around determining what my one-liner would be, until reading what other folks posted.   I remember the confusion around should my one-liner have the word 'powerful'  in it.    I was amazed that group [or was it facilitators] was having hard time choosing between such dichotomous words.  At that point in the program, I did not have an opinion about what the phrase should be.   I just wanted out!

The costume part -- I thought that was fun.   I liked getting dressed up, and acting.   Sure there were folks making fun of me, but in my mind that was just part of the sucky RMA experience.   In retrospect,  I think I should have been hurt by having to act out that character.   I was Dorothy, from the Wizard of Oz, and I had to walk around saying there is no place like home.

I was one of those kids that did not have a home.   For holidays, I stayed at RMA.   That sucked!

Wow, I was so many years ago.

I remember in The I and Me having to run, and then beat a mattress for hours.   It seems like that path to run was either a trail above the house or down to the farm and then back to whatever that big 'new' was building.    

I think the thing that I liked the best about the I and Me was somewhere in the middle of the night we were given time to be alone.   I walked down to the pond.  The pond was frozen over.   The moon was shinning brightly, and reflecting off of the pond.   I was sitting on top of the diving platform.  I think we were not allowed to smoke during the 'sessions', but I smoked part of a cigarette.  

Oh yeah, there was also the part where people held you down and you had to fight your way out.  Did the group have to push you down too?

For some reason, I remember my mouth hurting from gripping and pulling something with my mouth for so long.   Gosh, I hope that?s a false memory. What a fucked up place!!

Yes, I am conflating the Summit and the I and Me.   But this was many years ago.

On another note,   I went back to the place that I lived at from when I was 7-14.   For some reason I thought that going back to look at the house would be very hard.   But once, I got there the only thing that came to mind was thankfulness that I no longer lived in that house and with those people.   At this moment, I feel thankful that I am no longer at RMA.   Thankfully, as an adult, I have the resources to never be put in placement again.

At the same time, last week I was reading Auschwitz and After by Charlotte Delbo.   Great book -- I highly recommend it. The author speaks to the experiences of French political prisoners in Nazi Germany.   I was surprised at how closely, some of my behavior after leaving and during RMA closely mirrored those women.   I am not suggesting that RMA was anything like horrors seen in Nazi Germany. The two are not even remotely comparable.  But if you have time read the book, and post your opinion.   Maybe PTSD is PTSD regardless of the catalyst. The women in the book re-acted akin to the ways that I have although GREATLY amplified.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: try another castle on November 01, 2005, 11:21:00 PM

Quote

For some reason, I remember my mouth hurting from gripping and pulling something with my mouth for so long. Gosh, I hope that?s a false memory. What a fucked up place!!

Yeah, that's from the I&Me. It's one of the few things I remember from it. You had to lay down and bite a towel and pull upwards with your arms while they played the theme song to Rocky. One of the more absurd exercises, to be sure.

I remember hearing that song years later and I was like "Shit man, that's a long-assed fucking song! Did we actually have to do it for the whole thing?"

So you ran on a trail for the I&Me? I think they just had us run in place inside.

Smoking... you must have been at RMA in the 80s, they banned smoking halfway through my stay there. It was so nice that I never had to clean up any more butt cans on Saturday crews.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on November 02, 2005, 08:26:00 AM

I don't know how anyone could read this shit and not know this stuff is totally inappropriate and fucked up for children.  This is not emotional growth, folks! And to think, some students were only 12 or 13 when they first came to CEDU.  Those years are so pivotal in the growing up process how in the hell do you develop any compass or reference point for proper emotional development after that? UGH!

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on November 09, 2005, 07:23:00 PM

I really am curious (mostly for my play) on what music was played, what kind of signs decorated the room, about the agreements, etc...  I also want to hear more costume party stories.  Just bizarre...

Adam

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on November 10, 2005, 09:46:00 AM

Agreements huh? Have to sit in the open position. Can't talk to anyone outside the Summit. Have to do exactly as the staff say, no questions asked. I think that this wasn't an agreement, but whatever you did "Out Of Agreement" in the summit, you had to make up for later. Like if you talked to someone outside the summit, you would have to work for a day, or something like that. I can't really remember too many of the agreements.

Tools/Signs: "Win Win" "They are giants" or something like that. That sign changed like the last day. It read for the first four days "They COULD be giants" then once you found your contract or whatever it changed to "They are giants" "Love is letting go of fear" I can't remember too many of those either. I have them all written down in my Summit notebook though. I think they made you write them down.

Music: They played the "FAME" theme a lot. The song from Chariots of Fire. "All night long" and those are the only ones I can remember. I'm sure there was some John Denver and some John Lennon though.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on November 13, 2005, 01:20:00 AM

Quote

On 2005-10-26 20:06:00, absolutebest wrote:

"So, let me get this straight... day one and two are like normal raps, day three is the raft exercise and the funeral/death/obituary day, day four is the costume party and day five is neighborhoods/contracts?  I can't get these days straight.  When do you go into Bonners and talk to people, the urban challenge I think its called (or do you)?  How does the Summit kick off?  How do they wrap it up?  What in the hell does "The Rose", roses or "Fame" (the song that everyone dances to) have to do with anything?  What in the hell is the red/green game?  I am confused.



- Adam"

wow... its been like 10 years... but let me see if i can shed some light.... lol... day one was beginning or contracts and who you really represented, as well as your dirt list... etc... then at night you had writing assignments (this was every night)... day 2 was partner day trust crap.hiking throught the woods.. and then epitaphs (or what people would say bout you if you were to die) and then laying in a coffin, day 3 was partnering up with the person you hated most, and seeing through other people's eyes how they saw you.... the night time was the raft and other excersises... day 4 was same partners and finding things for a party... and then the party which was a charactor that was suppose to be the most like our actions.... which is where whinnie the pooh, and leah, and skywalker and everything comes from... for me it was oz... and when you hit your charactor, perfectly, then they would lift you through the room as they did after contracts.  Day 5 was graduating the summit, where you were given your contract, and then the key to your life... etc....

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on November 13, 2005, 01:20:00 AM

Quote

On 2005-11-12 22:20:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

Quote

On 2005-10-26 20:06:00, absolutebest wrote:


"So, let me get this straight... day one and two are like normal raps, day three is the raft exercise and the funeral/death/obituary day, day four is the costume party and day five is neighborhoods/contracts?  I can't get these days straight.  When do you go into Bonners and talk to people, the urban challenge I think its called (or do you)?  How does the Summit kick off?  How do they wrap it up?  What in the hell does "The Rose", roses or "Fame" (the song that everyone dances to) have to do with anything?  What in the hell is the red/green game?  I am confused.





- Adam"

wow... its been like 10 years... but let me see if i can shed some light.... lol... day one was beginning or contracts and who you really represented, as well as your dirt list... etc... then at night you had writing assignments (this was every night)... day 2 was partner day trust crap.hiking throught the woods.. and then epitaphs (or what people would say bout you if you were to die) and then laying in a coffin, day 3 was partnering up with the person you hated most, and seeing through other people's eyes how they saw you.... the night time was the raft and other excersises... day 4 was same partners and finding things for a party... and then the party which was a charactor that was suppose to be the most like our actions.... which is where whinnie the pooh, and leah, and skywalker and everything comes from... for me it was oz... and when you hit your charactor, perfectly, then they would lift you through the room as they did after contracts.  Day 5 was graduating the summit, where you were given your contract, and then the key to your life... etc.... "

oh... and i wrote this... joe keuter pg-56 rma, 9june 96 graduation cedu.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on November 16, 2005, 02:08:00 AM

Quote

On 2005-11-12 22:20:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

Quote

On 2005-11-12 22:20:00, Anonymous wrote:


"

Quote

On 2005-10-26 20:06:00, absolutebest wrote:



"So, let me get this straight... day one and two are like normal raps, day three is the raft exercise and the funeral/death/obituary day, day four is the costume party and day five is neighborhoods/contracts?  I can't get these days straight.  When do you go into Bonners and talk to people, the urban challenge I think its called (or do you)?  How does the Summit kick off?  How do they wrap it up?  What in the hell does "The Rose", roses or "Fame" (the song that everyone dances to) have to do with anything?  What in the hell is the red/green game?  I am confused.







- Adam"

wow... its been like 10 years... but let me see if i can shed some light.... lol... day one was beginning or contracts and who you really represented, as well as your dirt list... etc... then at night you had writing assignments (this was every night)... day 2 was partner day trust crap.hiking throught the woods.. and then epitaphs (or what people would say bout you if you were to die) and then laying in a coffin, day 3 was partnering up with the person you hated most, and seeing through other people's eyes how they saw you.... the night time was the raft and other excersises... day 4 was same partners and finding things for a party... and then the party which was a charactor that was suppose to be the most like our actions.... which is where whinnie the pooh, and leah, and skywalker and everything comes from... for me it was oz... and when you hit your charactor, perfectly, then they would lift you through the room as they did after contracts.  Day 5 was graduating the summit, where you were given your contract, and then the key to your life... etc.... "

oh... and i wrote this... joe keuter pg-56 rma, 9june 96 graduation cedu."

Thanks, Joe.  It's Adam Best.  I don't know if you remember me or not.  We got along well at times and butted heads at times also.  Hope all is well with you.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on November 16, 2005, 02:10:00 AM

Quote

On 2005-11-12 22:20:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

Quote

On 2005-11-12 22:20:00, Anonymous wrote:


"

Quote

On 2005-10-26 20:06:00, absolutebest wrote:



"So, let me get this straight... day one and two are like normal raps, day three is the raft exercise and the funeral/death/obituary day, day four is the costume party and day five is neighborhoods/contracts?  I can't get these days straight.  When do you go into Bonners and talk to people, the urban challenge I think its called (or do you)?  How does the Summit kick off?  How do they wrap it up?  What in the hell does "The Rose", roses or "Fame" (the song that everyone dances to) have to do with anything?  What in the hell is the red/green game?  I am confused.







- Adam"

wow... its been like 10 years... but let me see if i can shed some light.... lol... day one was beginning or contracts and who you really represented, as well as your dirt list... etc... then at night you had writing assignments (this was every night)... day 2 was partner day trust crap.hiking throught the woods.. and then epitaphs (or what people would say bout you if you were to die) and then laying in a coffin, day 3 was partnering up with the person you hated most, and seeing through other people's eyes how they saw you.... the night time was the raft and other excersises... day 4 was same partners and finding things for a party... and then the party which was a charactor that was suppose to be the most like our actions.... which is where whinnie the pooh, and leah, and skywalker and everything comes from... for me it was oz... and when you hit your charactor, perfectly, then they would lift you through the room as they did after contracts.  Day 5 was graduating the summit, where you were given your contract, and then the key to your life... etc.... "

oh... and i wrote this... joe keuter pg-56 rma, 9june 96 graduation cedu."

Thanks, Joe.  It's Adam Best (PG 61, RMA).  I don't know if you remember me or not.  We got along well at times and butted heads at times also.  Hope all is well with you.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: nashari on November 16, 2005, 05:59:00 AM

I do remember you, and it has been a long time... over 10 years I do believe... lol... if you want to get ahold of me, you can always reach me on my site... http://forums.nashari.net (http://forums.nashari.net)

I think I still have my Summit notebook somewhere..

-Joe

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on November 17, 2005, 12:38:00 AM

Quote

On 2005-11-16 02:59:00, nashari wrote:

"I do remember you, and it has been a long time... over 10 years I do believe... lol... if you want to get ahold of me, you can always reach me on my site... http://forums.nashari.net (http://forums.nashari.net)



I think I still have my Summit notebook somewhere..



-Joe"

Yeah, I'm writing a play based on RMA in the form of a Summit-like final experience, but I never went through the Summit,  because I was pulled after the Values.  Just trying to dig up as much info as possible.  Any info you or anybody else could give me would be great, but only what you are comfortable giving.  Thanks, I really appreciate your help as well as everyone elses.  Hopefully this will be a faithful and eye-opening piece...

- Adam

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: nashari on November 18, 2005, 01:18:00 AM

ha ha ha.... as you remember, i was never shy about much... cause to be honest, i don't really care... lol....

It was what it was... and will be what is was...If you want the writing assignments, i will gladly write em up on a notepad file and email it to you... just email if you want... [email protected]

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: absolutebest on November 23, 2005, 12:01:00 AM

I was also wondering if I could get what the rest of those signs said.  I shot you an e-mail.

- Adam

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on December 01, 2005, 03:05:00 PM

They could be giants/they are giants  was always my favorite. Never really understood it though. Just always gave me funny visuals. Hmmmmm...Giant CEDU students.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: nashari on December 01, 2005, 03:33:00 PM

The Summit Tools were as follows:
-They may be Giants
-Peace of mind is my single goal
-love is letting go of fear
-forgiveness is my single function
-This workshop is a true and accurate representation of how you live your life -total and complete acceptance within agreement -All that I give, I give myself -Stop! Look! Choose!
-Get out of your square
-No magic pills
-Do your knowledge
-You are totally responsible
-End results equal original intentions
-The seeds of your future are being planted now -Direct, Hones communication- No rip offs -Be careful! You may just get what you want.
-Surrender!
-"To win... is to be right.  To be right is to have power. To have power is to have control.
To have control is to be safe....->Doesn't even work -I am never upset for the reason I think.
-today I will judge nothing that occurs... judgment = fear -All pain-mental and physical = resistance -feel the feelings and let them pass -get a new idea! Getting a new idea enables growth.
-I am determined to see things (myself) differently -Neighborhoods........  love------ anger ...... weakness------ strength -All resistance must go!
-They are Giants (sign changed from they may be giants) -Teach only love for that is who you are.
-Bringing my love to others.
-Hi. My name is ______________
-"To live a life of value under and circumstance".
-"bless them" (if someone says fuck you to you because of their stuff)

4 Keys to my life
1.love
2.trust
3.honesty
4.my contract


Writing assignments: day 1
1. 25 things that I do not trust in others 2. 25 things that I do not trust in myself 3. at least 1/2 page on how I plan to sabotage this workshop 4. at least 50 things/ideas of negative energy (hold against yourself) 5. at least 1 page on how this game is a perfect mirror of what I do everyday and how I relate to others. (red green game) 6. Giver/Taker (what everyone in the peergroup thought you were) 7.10 words that describe my negative behavior and what would happen if I let it go 8.Personal Writtin (after dinner)
9.25 times I was denied love
10.25 times I failed to give love to others 11.The Lifeboat experience 12.How I cast die votes everyday

Day 2
1.my experience this morning (death exercise) 2.The message (from the death exercise) and what it means
3.25 times I have broken agreements with myself
4.25 times I have broken agreements with others 5.The visualization and importance of agreements 6.how I slap people in the face everyday and its results 7.The rocking experience 8.dear mom and dad, I want my freedom and I forgive you for....
9.The importance of love
10.my value in bringing love into the world 11.how are you going to stay in touch with all the love inside yourself?
12.how are you going to go about sharing that inner love with the world?

Day 3
1.The three false beliefs that I hold onto the tightest 2.Other false beliefs that I hold onto 3.personal thoughts on false beliefs 4.the greatness of love and how important I am in bringing that love to the world 5.how my contract allows me to bring love to the world 6.my contract (personal writing)

Day 4
1. Party Notes
Agreements for party
-all summit agreements are in effect
-you are totally accountable for your buddy -the veggie prep, you walk in, maintenance, the front and back kitchen, the farm, mir hut, faculty offices, middle school are all off limits -no one at anytime must see the party goers in costume -you are never to be seen with party supplies and special props -at no time must your action interfere with the school or call attention to yourself or the summit workshop -all food and beverages will be served on and in containers befitting a party -classroom and costume room are available -please enter and exit through back deck

2. My stretch and how I used my contract

Day 5
1. agreements for soup kitchen (homeless shelter that we went to give food to the homeless) -no conversation until arrive at destination -no conversation on ride back until workshop begines -while you are there, you will engage with 3 individual conversations with someone you do not know... with people of both sexes -these conversations will be with people that you feel uncomfortable with.
-you will be in complete service at your destination -you will follow directions by the designated person -you will not let anyone know that you are taking part in a summit workshop

2.Post summit projects
3.75 blessings in my life
4.25 times I gave love
5.25 times I received love
6.personal writing (day 5)
7. my negative statement-----------------my contract
   Out of the darkness--------------------into the light
   Fear/death-------------------------------love/life

That should be everything... if there is anything else that you need, let me know
-Joe

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on December 01, 2005, 03:41:00 PM

Fuckin' a that shit is sick. Thanks for posting that Joe. I was already glad I got pulled right before my Summit, but now I'm thanking God that I was pulled. I seriously can't imagine having been sent back into the world trying to juggle all that bullshit on my mind. Trying to forget about my 'fantastic voyage' was bad enough.

What was the red and green game? That's the one I heard the most stories about.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: nashari on December 01, 2005, 03:48:00 PM

the red green game was when we broke into 2 groups, and had to basically argue with each other, to win points..the 2 groups were suppose to represent our positive and negative statments.. they told us that to win we basically had to argue until we were able to see each other's points.... but the purpose of the game was to get both groups working together.. which was the point of the 2 groups... to show that you can get your negative and positive statements to work together and work for you... kind of like they did in the I and Me

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on December 01, 2005, 03:59:00 PM

Geez! I can only imagine what it was actually like to have to do all that stuff. Some of those "Tools" were pretty funny. Like the one about control. "There are no magic pills" HA! Tell that to someone who's in madd pain!

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: nashari on December 01, 2005, 03:59:00 PM

oh... and if anyone wants the writing assignments from the i and me.. let me know... cause i have those somewhere too... lol

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on December 01, 2005, 04:07:00 PM

Well I don't know anything about magical pills, but I know allll about magical plants. In fact, I think I'll go pick some up right now! Thanks guys! THANKS FOR CONTRIBUTING TO MY DRUG PROBLEM! FUCK.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on December 01, 2005, 04:08:00 PM

Quote

On 2005-12-01 12:59:00, nashari wrote:

"oh... and if anyone wants the writing assignments from the i and me.. let me know... cause i have those somewhere too... lol"

Yeah, I'd love to see the assignments from the I & ME. I didn't stay there long enough to do that stuff but I would love to know more about it.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on December 01, 2005, 04:49:00 PM

The Summit! What a damn joke. Your contract. Fuck that. I used to carry around my key whatnot for like 2 years after, but then it dawned on me how much of a crock of shit that was.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: nashari on December 01, 2005, 05:25:00 PM

I and Me Tools
I= thinking              I=Lies
Me= Feelings             Me=knows (feels)
I=Uses past to predict the future
Me= Now

Point of the workshop is to give me a voice.
Me is who you really are.

Me=Rockbottom
I=Negative Statement

I =Justifies

"To be or not to be" -hamlet
"know thyself" -socrates

Disease = dis-ease (self-inflicted)
The seeds of your future are being planted now.

good business= owner -me, employee-I "I" is working for me

bad business= employee-I, Owner-Me, I is in charge of me

Friday night at the fights
winners ticket to fantastic voyage(good for one voyage)
Me came before I

Writting assignments Pre-session 1:
1. what me wants from this workshop
2. all the ways I is going to take this workshop away from me

Pre-Session 2:
1. The session vizualization
2. The sign
3. The fantastic Journey
-going into the body and the dungeon
-the fear of dad, in my room , the curtains
-Me's special place
-Mes letter
-Me's keys
-Me crawling out and flying (soaring)
-recommendation

Day 1
1. The dungeon Fantasy
2. How I supports My negative statement

Day 2
1. Personal writing time.
2. The business discussion
3.Debreif the run
4. The fight (Me's)

Day 3
1. How does me feel being a champion
2. As a champion, Me can...
3. Me's dreams are?
4. I can help me achive my dreams by...
5. I can work for me in my's friendships by...
6. with me's family, me wants....
7. I can work for me with me's family by....
8. Me's best qualities ...
9. I's best qualities...
10. Me's special place (drawing)
11. Final Exam
-I lies and thinks
-me know and feels
-Who lets whom exist? Me lets I exist
-Who was there first? me
-all power is centered in me.
-i will always live in the past and future
-there is only now
-what is I's true function? To work for me.
-what is the only question? To be or not to be.
-I am respinsible- To be continued in the summit.

12. The fantastic voyage
13. The dance


The reunion:
-Never lose touch with who you are.
-white rose (we got white roses at the end. Everyone put them up in the air and swated them. there was a garden... a garden of white roses ready to bloom.

Think this covers it all... if i forgot anything, just ask and i will do my best to remember...

-Joe

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: try another castle on December 03, 2005, 07:58:00 AM

I don't know how you can remember all of that fucking shit, dude. The summit is just a big blob to me now, with pockets of clear memories here and there. Same with the I&Me and the propheets. I still have my notebooks, too, but out of curiosity, I tried re-reading one a few years ago, and I had no idea what it was talking about or which exercises it was referring to.

All I have to say is, thank god for that. Who wants to relive that kind of shit anyway?

_________________
[ This Message was edited by: sorry... try another castle on 2006-01-14 19:09 ]

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on December 03, 2005, 01:22:00 PM

True that, I can't remember a damn thing from those workshops, and that's fine by me.

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: nashari on December 03, 2005, 03:18:00 PM

its not that i want to remember... lol... i just still had my notebooks, and people kept askin and guessin on what happenned on what day... so i thought i would just set the record straight... lol

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on December 31, 2005, 03:00:00 AM

Damm Straight

Title: The I and Me/The Summit 2
Post by: Anonymous on December 31, 2005, 03:03:00 AM

Quote

On 2005-10-25 10:44:00, banana rama wrote:

"wanna know why people were so elated when they got out of the summit?  cus they knew  they were going to eat and sleep like a normal human being and that somebody wasnt gonna tell ya that the reason you didnt get a "you live" vote from them was because you didnt deserve it, "cuz you have no dreams."  heck, we were all screwed up, but it sure does throw you into a loop when you get only one "you live" vote. i cant stand princess leah."

Damm Straight