Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => News Items => Topic started by: Anonymous on January 14, 2005, 03:44:00 PM
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Andrew Mazur
MAZUR _ Andrew Blair May 17, 1983 - January 8, 2005 It is with heavy hearts that we announce the passing of our beloved son, Andrew at the age of 21 years. Andrew is survived by his father Lawrence Mazur, stepmother Amanda Mazur of Calgary; and his mother Teresa Bastian of Toronto; maternal grandfather Blair Bastian; paternal grandmother Hazel Mazur. He also leaves to mourn, his brothers, Sam and Adam of Calgary; and sister Megan of Toronto. He was predeceased by his Grandpa Walter Mazur; his Grandma Dorothy Bastian; and his dog Sarge. Andrew was a very caring and loving person - anyone who met him could tell you this. He will be deeply missed by everyone who ever met him. May his light shine in our hearts forever. Funeral Services will be held on Thursday, January 13, 2005 at 2:00 p.m. at Advent Lutheran Church, 11 Scenic Acres Gate N.W., Calgary, Alberta. Cremation will follow the Service. In lieu of flowers please make all donations to the Alberta Adolescent Recovery Center, 303 Forge Road S.E., Calgary, Alberta. PIERSON'S FUNERAL SERVICE in charge of arrangements. Telephone: 235-3602.
Published in the Calgary Herald from 1/11/2005 - 1/12/2005.
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Another suicide?
I give money for church organs in the hope the organ music will distract the congregation's attention from the rest of the service.
--Andrew Carnegie, Scottish-born American industrialist and philanthropist
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His funeral was a wake up call for many. And some people disagree that this is a fatal disease. That was the saddest funeral I have ever been to. The pain his family is going through. Not that this site even deserves this kind of information :roll:
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Since you saw SOME kind of a need to post this here (even though we don't deserve it :roll:) you might want to give a few more details. Guessing from what you wrote about it being a 'fatal disease' I'm guessing he died from something drug related. Kinda blows their credibility doesn't it? And now they want people to donate to a program that obviously didn't do him any good and could quite possibly have contributed to his problems. I'm sorry he passed. I'm sorry people are in pain.
If you don't think we 'deserve' this kind of info either then don't post it, or deal with the reactions that you're going to get if you choose to do so. Simple.
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Sun, March 7, 2004
Cop dodges slug from own pistol
Crook grabs rookie's gun, takes a shot
By MICHELLE MARK, Sun Media
CALGARY -- A quick-thinking rookie police officer stared down the barrel of his own gun and knew it wasn't his time to die. Const. Jean-Marc Boucher, a member of the Calgary Police Service for less than a year and a former Canadian Armed Forces peacekeeper, was nearly murdered in cold blood by a thug who stole his gun.
But Boucher's quick wits and presence of mind to grab the gun and point it away just as the culprit pulled the trigger, spared him his life as a bullet went whizzing past his head.
ROUTINE TRAFFIC STOP
The drama unfolded during a routine traffic stop just before midnight Friday.
Boucher and his partner of only a few hours, Sgt. Richard Nyberg, were pepper sprayed by a culprit as they attempted to arrest him and another man.
"They got (Nyberg) but not enough, so he took off after him in a foot pursuit after that individual," said police Insp. Robb Befus.
Meanwhile, a scuffle ensued between Boucher and the second man on the hood of one of the vehicles.
At some point, the suspect grabbed Boucher's gun.
"Whether the gun fell during the struggle and he picked it up or whether the suspect actually grabbed the gun we can't say at this point because the officer doesn't know," Befus said.
But as the suspect pointed the pistol at him, Boucher's training took over.
"He had the presence of mind to grab the slide of the gun, just like he's instructed to do, and pointed the gun away just as the suspect pulled the trigger, narrowly missing him," Befus said.
As police and RCMP from across Canada mourned the shooting death of Sherwood Park RCMP Const. Jim Galloway just hours earlier, Befus said there is no question that Boucher is lucky to be alive.
"Of course, with God being on our side, he walked away from the incident," he said.
Minutes after Boucher's potentially deadly encounter, K-9 and tactical unit members -- some of whom had just returned from Galloway's funeral -- arrested the suspect still brandishing the stolen handgun in a backyard about a block away.
Police continue to investigate and were still searching for the second suspect.
Boucher became a CPS officer in September, 2003 after eight and a half years of military service, including duty in Bosnia as a corporal with the Lord Strathcona's Horse (Royal Canadians).
Andrew Blair Mazur, 20, of Calgary has been charged with attempted murder and a host of other criminal charges.
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Date: Sat Mar 6 14:56:59 2004
Subject: UPDATE TO SHOOTING IN FOREST LAWN
From: Duty Inspector
-----BEGIN MD5 -----------------------------------
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CITYBEAT - CITY OF CALGARY PRESS RELEASE
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The Calgary Police Service has charged a 20 year-old Calgary
man in connection with the incident that occurred just before
midnight on March 05th, in the southeast community of Forest
Lawn.
Andrew Blair MAZUR, 20 years of Calgary has been charged with
Attempted Murder; Discharging a Firearm with Intent to
Endanger Life; Use of a Firearm during Flight After the
Commission of Offence; Pointing a Firearm; Possession of a
Weapon Dangerous to the Public; Assaulting a Peace Officer;
Possession of a Weapon Contrary to a Prohibition Order; and
two counts of Failing to Comply with a Probation Order.
The investigation into this incident continues under the
direction of the District 4 General Investigative Unit. The
second suspect, who is known to police, has not been located
at the time of this release.
Further details will be released as the investigation
progresses.
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How did this guy die??????? The article talks about him being charged with attempted murder.
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He was charged back in March, 2004. I presume he passed away in January 2005.
There is no indication anywhere that I can find that he ever went to trial and in view of the seriousness of the charges, it's not unreasonable to suspect that he died a suicide.
It's also not unreasonable to suspect that he had been in AARC. The question is, if he was, when? If he was not, the question is, why do his parents want donations to AARC? Either way, the implication is that
a) his crimes were drug-related.
b) his decease was drug-related.
If it was a suicide, in any event, there ought to be some sort of inquiry. So, ppl keep your eyes open for more news items.....
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On 2005-01-14 15:18:00, Anonymous wrote:
"His funeral was a wake up call for many. And some people disagree that this is a fatal disease. That was the saddest funeral I have ever been to. The pain his family is going through. Not that this site even deserves this kind of information :roll: "
What happened????? You were at the funeral, how did he die??????
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And no mention of drugs anywhere in those articles either.
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He had a previous record, which is why he was on probation.
He also was charged with breach of a weapons prohibition order.
Either his previous offence(s) for which he had probation were
a) weapons or violence related, or
b) trafficking.
I suppose we could speculate, but it would be nice if someone in Calgary could find out, though it might be difficult...
Did his probation order include an order that he attend treatment as directed by his probation officer, and if so did his probation officer order him in to AARC? (remember, the Courts cannot order AARC, they can only recommend)
If so, had he run from AARC?
:???:
The more I think about this thread, the more questions I have. Does anybody else?
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Routine Traffic stop? What's that?
Why were they arresting the guy?
No stolen vehicle, so why an arrest? Don't they need cause to stop somebody? Doesn't there have to be an offence to arrest somebody?
Sounds to me that the "routine" traffic stop was youth profiling.
Were the police riding this guy?
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On 2005-01-14 15:18:00, Anonymous wrote:
"His funeral was a wake up call for many. And some people disagree that this is a fatal disease. That was the saddest funeral I have ever been to. The pain his family is going through. Not that this site even deserves this kind of information :roll: "
What "fatal disease" is that?
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Canada keeps a closer eye on drinking and driving than the states do which could be a reason for a "routine traffic stop". However usually we set up road blocks and the article didn't mention that the car was passing through one.
I did a search and didn't find anything on this person (including the obituary) so who knows what the truth is. [ This Message was edited by: velvet2000 on 2005-01-15 18:44 ]
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The amazing thing to me is that this keeps happening. Velvet, how many times have people posted obits in this forum w/ an appeal to donate to AARC? Does that strike anyone else as sort of a bizarre marketing strategy?
I've had a few customers go under. I don't think it was necessarily my fault, mind you. There are always other factors. But I certainly don't go around advertising the fact when it's happened. What would be the point "Please send me some money so I can take a marketing course or two and maybe learn how to save my poor customers"?
So doesn't this show just how detached from reality these people are? "There goes another poor sop who we couldn't help. Please send us some more money so we can try it again and maybe get it right next time." :roll: Religion is based . . . mainly on fear . . . fear of the mysterious, fear of defeat, fear of death. Fear is the parent of cruelty, and therefore it is no wonder if cruelty and religion have gone hand in hand. . . . My own view on religion is that of Lucretius. I regard it as a disease born of fear and as a source of untold misery to the human race.
--Bertrand Russell, British philosopher, educator, mathemetician, and social critic
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Oh, and btw, I'm not sure Canada is really tougher on drunk drivers than some US jurisdictions. So. Florida has roving road blocks. It's been a matter of contention and litigation quite often. PA is much tougher than that, even. They'll pull just about anybody over for a sobriety test and probably half the yenzers I know have had their license suspended at some point for DUI.
Revelation indeed had no weight with me.
--Benjamin Franklin, American Founding Father, author, and inventor
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On 2005-01-15 14:02:00, Antigen wrote:
"The amazing thing to me is that this keeps happening. Velvet, how many times have people posted obits in this forum w/ an appeal to donate to AARC?
Really? THat is pretty strange. I haven't seen that before. :eek:
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On 2005-01-15 14:37:00, Anonymous wrote:
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On 2005-01-15 14:02:00, Antigen wrote:
"The amazing thing to me is that this keeps happening. Velvet, how many times have people posted obits in this forum w/ an appeal to donate to AARC?
Really? THat is pretty strange. I haven't seen that before. :eek: "
To be fair, Ginger, There aren't any in the AARC forum. That doesn't mean to say they haven't been posted in the obit columns of the Calgary Herald. however, that could just be an assumption.
In Canada, if you are detained by a police officer there has to be a basis. "check-stops" are legal for roadside breath samples. This does not look like that to me, otherwise I suspect the newspaper item would have said "check-stop".
The police will use the term "routine traffic stop" when it is nothing of the sort, when, in fact, they are profiling, the same as in the States. Example: young person driving a Cadillac in a poor area of town. That is not sufficient cause.
It really sounds to me as if there was no basis to stop the car in the first place, and the kid gave attitude and it escalated from there.
Lawyers are always dealing with cases of illegal searches from "routine traffic stops". And police are always doing them because they know they can get away with it most of the time because people do not know their rights.
This unfortunate kid had already had contact with police, so we can only speculate about what had happened, and it is still speculation as to the cause of his death. However, I think it is very important that we know exactly what his connection was with AARC before we get carried away.
The evidence needs to be examined.
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On 2005-01-15 14:05:00, Antigen wrote:
"Oh, and btw, I'm not sure Canada is really tougher on drunk drivers than some US jurisdictions. So. Florida has roving road blocks. It's been a matter of contention and litigation quite often. PA is much tougher than that, even. They'll pull just about anybody over for a sobriety test and probably half the yenzers I know have had their license suspended at some point for DUI. Revelation indeed had no weight with me.
--Benjamin Franklin, American Founding Father, author, and inventor
"
What are yenzers?
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I'll be damned! I stand corrected. At least I can't seem to find an example of another obit w/ a solicitation. Maybe it was another program I was thinking of.
Oh, yenz never heard of yenzers? Must not be from around here. LOL! It's a local Pittsburgh area thing. People around here say "yenz" the way southerners say "ya'll". Flatlanders sometimes call them yenzers. It's meant affectionately, really. Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you recognize a mistake when you make it again.
Mark Twain
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On 2005-01-15 14:02:00, Antigen wrote:
"The amazing thing to me is that this keeps happening. Velvet, how many times have people posted obits in this forum w/ an appeal to donate to AARC? Does that strike anyone else as sort of a bizarre marketing strategy?
Ginger I think your recalling something either posted on one of the old forums or perhaps some info I'd sent you. Off the top of my head I can recall two obituaries asking for money to be donated to AARC. Neither of the deaths were youth. One was a parent who's daughter was currently in AARC and the other was someone related to AARC through other means.
I'm sure that every state varies regarding drinking and driving. The states that I've spent Saturday nights in downtown I've always been amazed at the lack of traffic stops and the obvious drunk drivers on the road.
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On 2005-01-14 17:30:00, Anonymous wrote:
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On 2005-01-14 15:18:00, Anonymous wrote:
"His funeral was a wake up call for many. And some people disagree that this is a fatal disease. That was the saddest funeral I have ever been to. The pain his family is going through. Not that this site even deserves this kind of information :roll: "
What happened????? You were at the funeral, how did he die??????"
He (after a w) committed suicide by loading himself up on pills. None of anyones business here.. but theres the deal. Pick it apart all you clowns want. :roll:
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On 2005-01-15 23:39:00, Anonymous wrote
He (after a w) committed suicide by loading himself up on pills. None of anyones business here.. but theres the deal. Pick it apart all you clowns want. :roll: "
What's a W? I'm not picking apart anything. I'm always sad when I hear that a kid that was in one of those places commits suicide. It happens quite a bit.
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On 2005-01-15 23:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
He (after a w) committed suicide by loading himself up on pills. None of anyones business here.. but theres the deal. Pick it apart all you clowns want. :roll: "
What's a W? I'm not picking apart anything. I'm always sad when I hear that a kid that was in one of those places commits suicide. It happens quite a bit. "
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So in other words he did kill himself after AARC. Still no connection between drug addiction or alcoholism and his death. I can see why an AARC person would be afraid to post the information here.
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On 2005-01-16 06:50:00, Anonymous wrote:
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On 2005-01-15 23:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
He (after a w) committed suicide by loading himself up on pills. None of anyones business here.. but theres the deal. Pick it apart all you clowns want. :roll: "
What's a W? I'm not picking apart anything. I'm always sad when I hear that a kid that was in one of those places commits suicide. It happens quite a bit. "
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So, what we seem to have here is the following:
Young person commits suicide.
Before he commits suicide it appears that:
He attended AARC.
He had been charged with a criminal offence for which he was on probation:
While on probation he committed a much more serious offence (attempted murder)
While charges against him were pending he committed suicide.
He was basically a nice guy.
He is presumed to have a "drug problem"
The question is:
Did his drug problem cause the suicide?
Did his treatment at AARC cause the suicide?
Did his fear of the consequences of his charges cause the suicide?
I think we have some extremely serious assumptions her and we need to know whether the chicken came first or the egg.
Was he in AARC before or after his first set of charges?
Was he placed there by his parents or by the Solicitor-General?
Of course, there could well be a cover-up because Ron Stevens, who is on the record as endorsing AARC in 1999 (see AARC's web page) is now the Attorney General for the Province, and who's going to believe a few disgruntled AARC survivors when some of our most senior government officials support it?
And do not think that cover-ups don't occur in KKKlein's Alberta. Right now there is an enquiry going on into how a young offender came to fall down an elevator shaft and be killed in the courthouse in Edmonton. But THAT is another story...
If he was so unhappy that he would "load himself up with pills" you have to ask why he was in that state. No explanation from AARC groupies really seems to address that problem. And Dean Vause is probably just too stupid to understand the significance of that question.
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"Could it be that life in our highschools has gotten so horrible as to cause young boys to go on shooting sprees? Nah! It's Emenem and his dirty lyrics!"
Every sensible man, every honorable man, must hold the Christian sect in horror.
--Francois Marie Arouet "Voltaire", French author and playwright
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Nah! It's Emenem and his dirty lyrics!
Ha! Or maybe it's gays getting married in San Francisco and ruining America's family values.
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Maybe we should all be attacking the justice system of Alberta. After all Andrew was in jail serving a sentence for his already noted crimes when he overdosed. Whether you believe that addiction is a disease or not...it was drugs that took Andrew's life. It was a hard funeral to attend. Andrew was the first grad to die. He was a good kid. For someone who felt so unworthy of love, a whole lot of people who loved him showed up to his funeral. He will be sadly missed. AARC may seem really messed up to some of you, but to me its the reason I am not where Andrew is now. I would much rather be "brain-washed", "identity stripped" or whatever else this site says we AARC grads are now...then pushing up daisies.
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If overdosing on pills equivilates drug addiction, does slitting your wrists make you a cutter? People take their lives by overdosing on pills all the time, it has nothing to do with addiction.
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You are right. If Andrew had overdosed on pills we may have something there....but it was not pills he had overdosed on. The amount and type of narcotics found in Andrew would suggest previous experience. I encourage you to research about the disease of addiction...the World Health Organization, American Medical Association, DSM 4. A lot of people can make AARC wrong but you would have to argue with a lot of other associations about what makes someone an addict. Andrew falls on the spectrum with his death alone, never mind his criminal charges. If these organizations were to have a conversation with Andrew's family and have them recall times they experienced Andrew drunk or high they would come to the same conclusion. Don't take my word for it...research it...they will all tell you the same results.
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On 2005-01-17 20:13:00, Anonymous wrote:
"You are right. If Andrew had overdosed on pills we may have something there....but it was not pills he had overdosed on. The amount and type of narcotics found in Andrew would suggest previous experience. I encourage you to research about the disease of addiction...the World Health Organization, American Medical Association, DSM 4. A lot of people can make AARC wrong but you would have to argue with a lot of other associations about what makes someone an addict. Andrew falls on the spectrum with his death alone, never mind his criminal charges. If these organizations were to have a conversation with Andrew's family and have them recall times they experienced Andrew drunk or high they would come to the same conclusion. Don't take my word for it...research it...they will all tell you the same results. "
How condescending of you.
The WHO does recognize, however, that Harm Reduction is more effective than anything AARC can dream up, IF you are dealing with genuine addiction. But then, AARC is so quick to label its inmates through a misapplication of the DMV4 by unqualified people.
Yah still don't get it do yah? Was he born an addict? or was he made? What part of the Chemistry of his brain do you not understand.
Maybe the autopsy should examine the brain and they'll be able to find some physical manifestation of this dreadful "disease."
So, he killed himself in jail, eh? Now I would REALLY want to see an inquiry. How come nothing in the newapapers though?
Sad that donations should be going to an institution that failed him so badly.
But hey, we are hearing contradictory stories here. One says his autopsy shows previous drug use, not "a handful of pills."
Now we all (should) know that drugs are more readily available in jail than outside, but... The more we hear, the more questions we have.
But... the amount and type found would suggest previous experience? THAT's a wierd comment.
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Psychoactive Drugs & Harm Reduction
Heather, Nick, et al, Eds. Psychoactive Drugs & Harm Reduction: From Faith to Science. London: Whurr Publishers Limited. April 1993, 345 pages.
World Health Organization
Psychoactive Drugs & Harm Reduction is based loosely on the Third International Conference on the Reduction of Drug-Related Harm held in Melbourne, Australia at the end of March, 1992.
"As the HIV/AIDS pandemic accelerates and people around the world search for ways beyond the ineffective and harmful drug war policies of the past, this book arrives to lead the way forward. It has the scope, strength and depth to bring "harm reduction" squarely into the arena of public and professional attention. This book goes far beyond advocacy, to consider the evidence, the experience and the insights - precious lessons learned in the practice of harm reduction. Fine editing, superb organization and diverse perspectives - from government ministers to police and from criminologists to political scientists - are linked with a strong commitment to exploring international experience - North, South, East and West. This is one of those very rare books which has the power to influence the course of history. For all concerned with drugs (licit and illicit), health and society - this is the single book to read now. Read this book, introduce yourself to harm reduction - and the world may just possibly never the same."
-- Jonathan Mann, MD, MPH, Professor of Epidemiology and International Health, Harvard School of Public Health and Founding Director, World Health Organization's Global Program on AIDS.
"This book stands as a milestone in the growth and development of harm reduction. (It) contains contributions from some of the most influential figures in the harm-reduction movement and will establish itself as essential reading for all who are involved in the field."
-- Michael Gossop, PhD, National Addiction Center, London.
"The term 'harm reduction' has become a popular sound bite and has heralded a new social movement in drug policy reform. Yet, until now, no comprehensive document about harm reduction has been available. This book fills this important void...(It) is sure to become a reference work in harm reduction and a necessary resource for those involved in drug prevention, treatment, research and policy."
-- Marsha Rosenbaum, PhD, former Director, Center for Drug Studies Institute for Scientific Analysis, San Francisco.
"With the publication of this volume the harm reduction approach achieves a new maturity. It presents a growing body of data and experience, conceptual models and ethical judgements all of which point the way to new solutions to our massive drug problem."
-- Ernest Drucker, PhD, Director, Division of Community Health and Professor, Department of Epidemiology and Social Medicine, Montefiore Medical Center/ Albert Einstein College of Medicine, New York.
About the Authors
Nick Heather is Professor of Drug and Alcohol Studies and the Director of the National Drug and Alcohol Research Centre, University of New South Wales, Sydney, Australia.
Alex Wodak is the Director of the Alcohol and Drug Services, St. Vincent's Hospital, Sydney.
Pat O'Hare is the Director of the Mersey Drug Training and Information Centre, Liverpool, UK.
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LMAO! I didnt even need to read the "Hamilton Horseshit" or the persons before his to know they are doubting it was an addiction.
Dear defender of harm reduction.. learn a little more and realise he went through a program that purveyed that garbage before he went to AARC. As many others was likely high or drunk while attending one of those tax-dollar-grabber-meetings. Thanks for coming out. Hamilton, Im betting no-one read what you wrote, no one cares. Your fake intellectualism will not work... you are a fake as is the owner of this section of the board.
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On 2005-01-17 21:29:00, Anonymous wrote:
But... the amount and type found would suggest previous experience? THAT's a wierd comment.
It's very, very difficult to accomplish a lethal overdose using pills. Most of the time, when someone dies of a drug overdose, they've injected the drugs. And most IV drug users are not novices; people inject because they have a high tolerance and can't afford enough of the drug to get a fix from snorting.
So if the kid had a huge amount of opiates in his system, then that would indicate (but not prove) that he had been an habitual user. Of course, there's this niggling little catch that the law-n-order types don't like to think about. When your kidneys quit functioning, all kinds of things change. Some levels go up in preportion to others, which go down. This happens pretty quickly, and even faster once the lungs quit doing their job. So the level of a particular substance in the blood after death is often many times the level that it had been just minutes before. So it could even have been murder. Lots of murders go down as accidental overdoses.
Ya just never know.
Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
--Bruce Lee
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On 2005-01-18 11:37:00, Antigen wrote:
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On 2005-01-17 21:29:00, Anonymous wrote:
But... the amount and type found would suggest previous experience? THAT's a wierd comment.
It's very, very difficult to accomplish a lethal overdose using pills. Most of the time, when someone dies of a drug overdose, they've injected the drugs. And most IV drug users are not novices; people inject because they have a high tolerance and can't afford enough of the drug to get a fix from snorting.
So if the kid had a huge amount of opiates in his system, then that would indicate (but not prove) that he had been an habitual user. Of course, there's this niggling little catch that the law-n-order types don't like to think about. When your kidneys quit functioning, all kinds of things change. Some levels go up in preportion to others, which go down. This happens pretty quickly, and even faster once the lungs quit doing their job. So the level of a particular substance in the blood after death is often many times the level that it had been just minutes before. So it could even have been murder. Lots of murders go down as accidental overdoses.
Ya just never know.
Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
--Bruce Lee
"
Maybe it was aliens. What a ridiculous assertion. So who "murdered him?" Dr. V.? Andrew was looking at 8 years in the penitentiary, he saved up his medications and took a pile of them at once.
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On 2005-01-18 00:35:00, Anonymous wrote:
Dear defender of harm reduction.. learn a little more and realise he went through a program that purveyed that garbage before he went to AARC.
My understanding is that this kid graduated AARC and died of an overdose while in jail. Have I got it wrong? Cause I was told repeatedly and in no uncertain terms that that only happens to people who do not graduate the program.
(Unfortunately, that's a lie. Almost everyone I know who's deadinsaneorinjail are Program vets, many of them graduates)You need only reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence.
--Charles Austin Beard
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On 2005-01-18 11:45:00, Anonymous wrote:
Maybe it was aliens. What a ridiculous assertion. So who "murdered him?" Dr. V.? Andrew was looking at 8 years in the penitentiary, he saved up his medications and took a pile of them at once.
You seem to have a lot more detailed information about this tragedy than what was in the papers. How do you come by this info.?Our Bible reveals to us the character of our god with minute and remorseless exactness... It is perhaps the most damnatory biography that exists in print anywhere. It makes Nero an angel of light and leading by contrast.
--Samuel Clemens "Mark Twain", American author and humorist
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"My understanding is that this kid graduated AARC and died of an overdose while in jail. Have I got it wrong? Cause I was told repeatedly and in no uncertain terms that that only happens to people who do not graduate the program.
(Unfortunately, that's a lie. Almost everyone I know who's deadinsaneorinjail are Program vets, many of them graduates)"
Really? I lost several friends when I was using to suicide, murder and drunk driving. I know two other people in over a decade who committed suicide - one was a guy who never dealt with his stuff from childhood and in abude in KIDS. The other was a guy who was depressed and over stressed who only chose to get support after he would relapse and lose everything - he never went through treatment.
"You seem to have a lot more detailed information about this tragedy than what was in the papers. How do you come by this info.?"
I'll leave it up to your imagination. I'm just interested that the truth be put out there rather than stupid speculation. AARC is not responsible once clients graduate and decide the can use drugs or get involved in a criminal lifestyle. It is notable that many come back looking for help once they do decide to deal with the reprucussions of relapse.
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On 2005-01-18 12:31:00, Anonymous wrote:
I'm just interested that the truth be put out there rather than stupid speculation. AARC is not responsible once clients graduate and decide the can use drugs or get involved in a criminal lifestyle. It is notable that many come back looking for help once they do decide to deal with the reprucussions of relapse."
I'm interested in the truth getting out there too. In particular, those astounding success rate claims and those dire warnings about what might happen to someone who doesn't complete the program. Seems asthough AARC doesn't take responsibility for their fuckups and they do try to take responsibility whenever something goes right for a former client.
Right here in this thread we have someone who sincerely believes that her involvement in AARC has saved her from the dire fate that befell this poor unfortunate . . . AARC graduate!
How much more obvious can it get???? In all history, there is no instance of a country having benefited from prolonged warfare. Only one who knows the disastrous effects of a long war can realize the supreme importance of rapidity in bringing it to a close. It is only one who is thoroughly acquainted with the evils of war who can thoroughly understand the profitable way of carrying it on.
--Sun Tzu (author of The Art of War
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"I'm interested in the truth getting out there too. In particular, those astounding success rate claims and those dire warnings about what might happen to someone who doesn't complete the program. Seems asthough AARC doesn't take responsibility for their fuckups and they do try to take responsibility whenever something goes right for a former client.
Right here in this thread we have someone who sincerely believes that her involvement in AARC has saved her from the dire fate that befell this poor unfortunate . . . AARC graduate! "
AARC has never claimed any responsibility for my success. Once I was graduated, my success was my responsibility. They are pretty clear about the hard work, committment and determination their successful clients put in. AARC carries a message. That's it. Do you blame Straight for your successes or just your failures? I blame no one but myself for my mistakes and "fuckups". I am sure Andrew didn't blame AARC for his situation. AARC was a spring board for me. I cleaned up my life, then I moved on, and my decisions determined whether I was a success or not.
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On 2005-01-18 12:31:00, Anonymous wrote:
I'll leave it up to your imagination. I'm just interested that the truth be put out there rather than stupid speculation.
Look at the absurdity of those two statements being put together. :roll: You're interested in the truth coming out, you seem to be the only one who was there and actually HAS the information, but you're going to leave it up to our imagination. Hmmmm. Interesting.
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On 2005-01-18 13:14:00, Anonymous wrote:
AARC has never claimed any responsibility for my success. Once I was graduated, my success was my responsibility.
...
Ok, here's a quote from the post I'm refering to (around page 4 or 5 of this thread, I think)
For someone who felt so unworthy of love, a whole lot of people who loved him showed up to his funeral. He will be sadly missed. AARC may seem really messed up to some of you, but to me its the reason I am not where Andrew is now. I would much rather be "brain-washed", "identity stripped" or whatever else this site says we AARC grads are now...then pushing up daisies.
This person certainly seems to attribute his or her existance to AARC, don't they?
But you don't, right? You would be OK either way, right? Or do you think it was AARC that saved you? If so, please explain why AARC was unable to save Andrew. Do you think it may have had a little something to do w/ Program dogma about how worthless and unlovable you were before AARC saved you and would be if you rejected it now?
Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed people can change the world. Indeed it is the only thing that ever has.
-- Margaret Mead
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"But you don't, right? You would be OK either way, right? "
No idea, my crysal balls are broken
"Or do you think it was AARC that saved you?"
My hard work in AARC, participation in AA, willingness to ask for help when I need it, individual, marriage and grief counselling when needed, a strong spiritual belief, good work ethic, constant thirst for knowledge, and a need to better myself year after year have a lot to do with "what saved" me.
" If so, please explain why AARC was unable to save Andrew. "
AARC can't "save" any one. AARC helped me to help myself. It gave me some great tools and some excellent counselling, as well as a safe place to withdraw from the lifestyle I was in. Andrew made some bad choices after AARC - which I would submit goes against any ideas that AARC brainwashes anyone. He had free will just as I do, and he made choices with full knowledge of consequences.
"Do you think it may have had a little something to do w/ Program dogma about how worthless and unlovable you were before AARC saved you and would be if you rejected it now? "
Not at all, I was never told I was "worthless and unlovable you were before AARC saved" me. I felt that way for 10 years prior, and when I entered AARC I was reunited with a family that worked just as hard as I did, and we have a great relationship now. I was shown a great deal of love and understanding in treatment, and it helped me to gain back some of the positive feelings toward myself that I had lost. Your assumptions are a mile wide, but only an inch deep. Again, AARC was a springboard for me, what I did afterward was totally up to me. What other people experienced is for them to voice. I believe all voices should be heard and honored.
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When does it stop being AARC's fault? Or are they responsible for life? Andrew was out for awhile...if he did this when he was 50 would AARC be to blame then? Where is the line between the institution's fault and the individual's? If AARC is this big terrible place that is responsible for killing a kid then why are they still in existance? Do they have everyone fooled? or is it just the handful of people that visit this site that don't agree with the program's results? Is it a conspiracy? I think if it was a abusive, confining place, that destroys lives ( add killing one of them now I guess)... A: this site would have way more posts then it does,Montel would have done an episode about AARC today instead of WASP B: it would have been shut down years ago...not been in existance for the last 12 yrs, you know... the same building, same name, same director, consistent board members C: would not have become certified by social services( an investigation process that happens to every social services agency once every three years...and I mean investigation including confidential interviews with staff, clients from all levels past and present, and report audits) Then again maybe they don't know what two AARC grads that started this site, a so-called lawyer, someone who went through a treatment center in the states, and a handfull of run aways know. There are a lot of us out here not buying into the blame game that happens here....not only grads but it would seem the government, police, parents, doctors, schools, other provinces wanting to purchase the model,and Montel Williams. Thats a lot of people to convince different, insult, make wrong, or choose not to hear.
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Wow! Take a breath! :smile: Nicely said though. But don't worry, these folks won't let the facts get in the way of a good blame session.
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I was never told I was "worthless and unlovable you were before AARC saved"
Are you conciously lying about this or do you really not understand it? Not everyone had the same level of abuse in aarc but everyone is taught that they are worthless before it.
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On 2005-01-18 20:23:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
I was never told I was "worthless and unlovable you were before AARC saved"
Are you conciously lying about this or do you really not understand it? Not everyone had the same level of abuse in aarc but everyone is taught that they are worthless before it. "
I guess all the other 280 clients would have had to witness these different levels of abuse? To date the only complainants are marnie and jessica.
"Your assumptions are a mile wide and an inch deep" <--those are words of someone with uber intelligence, listen to them, they know what is good for you.
1.) Person talks about what aarc helped them do.
2.) Moron on this site defaults to calling them a liar.
I have a friend working on finding me the admin details for this site.. I will keep it open, but posts of no credit or value will no longer be available, as well, no posts will be deleted that make sense. This is the problem when you have 2 fat chicks running the place.
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[RING!] ... [RING!] ... [RING!]
Hello?
Hi, is this Ginger Warbis?
Yes, who's calling?
This is John Fitzpatrick from Canada's dumbest criminals? It's a show aboot, well, aboot Canada's dumbest criminals. Did somebody actually post to your forum saying they're trying to crack your website?
Why yes, yes they did! Can you believe it!
...We did not inherit this land from our ancestors, we borrow it form our children.
Haida
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On 2005-01-19 16:47:00, Antigen wrote:
"[RING!] ... [RING!] ... [RING!]
Hello?
Hi, is this Ginger Warbis?
Yes, who's calling?
This is John Fitzpatrick from Canada's dumbest criminals? It's a show aboot, well, aboot Canada's dumbest criminals. Did somebody actually post to your forum saying they're trying to crack your website?
Why yes, yes they did! Can you believe it!
...We did not inherit this land from our ancestors, we borrow it form our children.
Haida
"
By golly its freedom of information Jack! Call it.... an involuntary donation :grin:
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On 2005-01-19 13:04:00, Anonymous wrote
I have a friend working on finding me the admin details for this site.. I will keep it open, but posts of no credit or value will no longer be available, as well, no posts will be deleted that make sense.
Are you fucking kidding me??? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Idiot!! :lol:
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Another good one : ) Where could we find the admin, where or where? It's such a well protected secret! Anyone remember the movie zoolander when he was told the files were in the computer so he cracked the monitor open?
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U mean this turkey is saying he needs help from a smart friend to find out who owns the domain? Oh my! :rofl:
for it is a truth, which the experience of all ages has attested, that the people are commonly most in danger when the means of insuring their rights are in the possession of those of whom they entertain the least suspicion.
--Alexander Hamilton
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Let's go easy on him. Maybe being in aarc is like being amish. They don't have much access to those fancy futuristic computers in their parts!
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On 2005-01-19 20:56:00, velvet2000 wrote:
"Another good one : ) Where could we find the admin, where or where? It's such a well protected secret! Anyone remember the movie zoolander when he was told the files were in the computer so he cracked the monitor open?"
I almost spit my Cheetos all over my keyboard laughing so hard when I read that!!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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On 2005-01-20 14:33:00, Antigen wrote:
"U mean this turkey is saying he needs help from a smart friend to find out who owns the domain? Oh my! :rofl: for it is a truth, which the experience of all ages has attested, that the people are commonly most in danger when the means of insuring their rights are in the possession of those of whom they entertain the least suspicion.
--Alexander Hamilton
"
*I* Could crack this website using my toes. What if he isnt joking though?
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On 2005-01-21 17:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
*I* Could crack this website using my toes. What if he isnt joking though?"
Then he's fucked! :rofl: The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being of His Father, in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.
--Thomas Jefferson, U.S. President, author, scientist, architect, educator, and diplomat
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Andrew died on christmas day after doing a speed ball {mix of heroine & meth} its pretty much playing rusian roulette when you do it. He was in AARC in 1999 and returned many times up to his incarceration. He was a good man with problems, like many of us, and I am saddened by his passing. I thought I would answer ur question. :cry:
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On 2005-01-27 22:19:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Andrew died on christmas day after doing a speed ball {mix of heroine & meth} its pretty much playing rusian roulette when you do it. He was in AARC in 1999 and returned many times up to his incarceration. He was a good man with problems, like many of us, and I am saddened by his passing. I thought I would answer ur question. :cry: "
That's simply not true. Why do you AARC supporters continue to lie. And so barefacedly too? The first post on this thread is clear. He died January 8th, 2005. THAT is a fact. You can be wrong in your opinions but you have no right to be wrong on your facts.
But then, that's what AARC is based on. Not only wrong opinions, but also misrepresentation and lies about the facts.
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Can't you see? They're profoundly addicted to drama. Christmas day... in a jail cell... in the frozen north... So Dickensonian! :roll:
There never was a good war or a bad peace.
--Benjamin Franklin, (1773)
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Just to clarify, I believe he went into a coma on Christmas day, and finally succumbed after 14 days off life support. I may be wrong, but this is what I was told. So were fact misrepresented? I don't think so, so have a little empathy for those who suffered, and don't be so quick to judge.
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On 2005-02-27 11:19:00, Anonymous wrote:
so have a little empathy for those who suffered,
I have great sympathy for those who have suffered at the hands of AARC.If only there were evil people somewhere, insidiously committing evil
deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?
Alexandr Solzhenitsyn
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On 2005-02-27 11:19:00, Anonymous wrote:
So were fact misrepresented? I don't think so, so have a little empathy for those who suffered, and don't be so quick to judge.
Oh, I absolutely do. And I don't think it's right at all to use this tragedy to pile the AARC legend a little higher and deeper.
A bishop keeps on saying at the age of eighty what he was told to say at the age of eighteen.
--Oscar Wilde
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On 2005-02-27 11:19:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Just to clarify, I believe he went into a coma on Christmas day, and finally succumbed after 14 days off life support. I may be wrong, but this is what I was told. So were fact misrepresented? I don't think so, so have a little empathy for those who suffered, and don't be so quick to judge."
Multiple Choice Exam
Now that you've had a chance to read this thread again, here is a multiple choice comprehension test:
1. Andrew Mazure died on
a January 8, 2005
b. After attending AARC in 1999
c. After graduating from AARC
d. While on bail
e. All of the above
f. None of the above
g. This is really a trick question
2. Andrew Mazur died of
a. A suicide by overdosing on pills
b. After taking a speed-ball on Christmas day
c. Natural causes
d. from falling down an elevator shaft
e. we don't know
c. he was murdered
3. Andrew Mazur was sent to AARC
a. when he was 15
b. when he was twenty
c. because he was an addict
d. because he was behaviourally disordered
4. He was ordered into AARC by:
a. his parents
b. the courts
c. social services
d. youth justice (solicitor general)
e. none of the above, he went voluntarily.
please do tell, AARC supporters, so that we can get the story straight.(excuse the pun)
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Andrew Mazur was sent to AARC by his parents when he was 15, because of a drug problem as well as behaviorial problems. He dies on January 8 2005 after being in a coma for 14 days He took morphine on Dec 25, and went into a coma. After attending and graduating AARC in 1999 There are your answers. Trust me i know I was the girl he was going to marry.
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"Graduated" 1999. Died 5 years later from a drug overdose. Great going AARC
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On 2006-04-22 09:53:00, Anonymous wrote:
""Graduated" 1999. Died 5 years later from a drug overdose. Great going AARC "
Yes, great going AARC! Thanks for giving Andrew the choice to lead either a sober and positive life or the the one he did choose. Thanks for giving his family a place to go for support and friendship. Thanks for not "brainwashing" him, but giving him the ability to take responsibility for his choices and actions. Thanks for not closing the door on him once he chose to go back to drugs. Addiction kills. AARC can temporarily take a kid out of the lifestyle and give them skills to get them mentally and physically healthy. No one holds a gun to a graduates head so they won't relapse. They are either attracted to a drug free life or not.
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On 2006-04-22 09:53:00, Anonymous wrote:
""Graduated" 1999. Died 5 years later from a drug overdose. Great going AARC "
You fuckin meathead... I wouldnt give you a 2 piece puzzle to try and figure out. He had the choice of being clean and happy and decided against it.
For people so intent on free will, you sure don't lend it credit when it looks bad for you..
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its so depressing..... THe leaps of anti logic you subject your poor knotted brain to when trying to explain away how a kid who was a "graduate" of your program ended up dying means that .....AARC needs more support to help kids!!!
Honestly, AARC doesnt take credit for sucesses' of prisoners? Perhaps anyone interested in this bullshit should go to the Albertal Web site and check out its "sucess's" page
This would lead one to suspect that it indeed credits itself with the sucess of its "graduates".--that being on its page and all
..but one doesnt really need to do that to be aware of the bullshit of the pathetic and grotesque poster above. Listening to him is like listening to the Bush administration recently try to deny they ever said that Iraq had WWMD.... the same semantical cowardice.
You are either trying to lie youre culpibility away , or as a "cult member"...your identity is so based in your cult's omnipotent infallibility that you subject us all to bizare contradictions to deny what is absurdly plain- Your prison did not help this graduate.
Obviously, we cannot expect you to admit that your prison beat this child into the pulp that he became....that which is was merely true-
Id like to invite people who went to Alberta to tell relate how they were told AARC would be their salvation and life w/o aarc be their doom...
Id also like anyone to discuss the idiocy of the phrase "being given tools" being applied to being held captive and tortured.
Do pimps who kidnapp and subject their child-captives to endless rape also give them something? Perhaps self sufficiency? Perhaps when one is captured and held against their will subgected to endless debasemnt and torture it ceases to be a gift.
SOmething is not being given it is being forced, lets not lie
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On 2006-04-27 20:52:00, Anonymous wrote:
"its so depressing..... THe leaps of anti logic you subject your poor knotted brain to when trying to explain away how a kid who was a "graduate" of your program ended up dying means that .....AARC needs more support to help kids!!!
Honestly, AARC doesnt take credit for sucesses' of prisoners? Perhaps anyone interested in this bullshit should go to the Albertal Web site and check out its "sucess's" page
This would lead one to suspect that it indeed credits itself with the sucess of its "graduates".--that being on its page and all
..but one doesnt really need to do that to be aware of the bullshit of the pathetic and grotesque poster above. Listening to him is like listening to the Bush administration recently try to deny they ever said that Iraq had WWMD.... the same semantical cowardice.
You are either trying to lie youre culpibility away , or as a "cult member"...your identity is so based in your cult's omnipotent infallibility that you subject us all to bizare contradictions to deny what is absurdly plain- Your prison did not help this graduate.
Obviously, we cannot expect you to admit that your prison beat this child into the pulp that he became....that which is was merely true-
Id like to invite people who went to Alberta to tell relate how they were told AARC would be their salvation and life w/o aarc be their doom...
Id also like anyone to discuss the idiocy of the phrase "being given tools" being applied to being held captive and tortured.
Do pimps who kidnapp and subject their child-captives to endless rape also give them something? Perhaps self sufficiency? Perhaps when one is captured and held against their will subgected to endless debasemnt and torture it ceases to be a gift.
SOmething is not being given it is being forced, lets not lie "
I know it will bother you to learn that I only read half of the first sentence in your long winded diarrhea filled post. I took enough out of it to deduce that you blame AARC for it's client "failure", and you won't give AARC credit for any success.
Ok, nevermind, I read the rest of it.
You brought up Iraq and WMD. You mentioned Torture and coersion. You in a roundabout way touched on capitalism in one of your other posts.. To all of this I say; You are lucky I spent the time responding to you.
Your post in itself lacks any logic and sense that you claim to posess an abundance of.
YOUR ignorance is absurd. I suspect you are the type of person that practises odd forms of auto-eroticism... which i suppose is besides the point.
I'm almost at ten years of clean and sober time. I was clearly in an earlier group of clients when the center hadn't had 200-300 graduates.. A time in which YOU would probably say AARC was in its infancy. I was never beaten, smashed, de-humanised, or restrained. I rarely felt as though I was being made fun of (unless I did something incredibly stupid, that said; who doesn't)
AARC did me well. I have the opportunity to either be successful or fuck up my life. I've met people that have helped me get along in life, I've learned a lot about human dynamics and how to get along better with difficult people. A jackpot in terms of social integration... I figure.
Regardless, your post is full of hatred, blinded by some sort of maligned rage towards... me or whoever. Good luck with that. Being pissed off at aarc because you still shit the bed in your mid-20's is pretty useless. You clearly aren't applying yourself in a correct manner.
You calling me ignorant would be similar to a morbidly obese person calling an underweight anorexic a fatass.
Get some realistic credibility if you want to argue with me, return, and represent yourself correctly next time. If you achieve all of those things, you will notice you have nothing to argue with me about and that I'm the money. You will wish you were me and you will want to be my friend.
Thanks,
-Josh[ This Message was edited by: THEJOSHUAFACTOR on 2006-04-27 23:49 ]
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On 2006-04-27 20:52:00, Anonymous wrote:
Id like to invite people who went to Alberta to tell relate how they were told AARC would be their salvation and life w/o aarc be their doom...
Id also like anyone to discuss the idiocy of the phrase "being given tools" being applied to being held captive and tortured.
Do pimps who kidnapp and subject their child-captives to endless rape also give them something? Perhaps self sufficiency? Perhaps when one is captured and held against their will subgected to endless debasemnt and torture it ceases to be a gift.
SOmething is not being given it is being forced, lets not lie "
I went through AARC. I was never told it would be my salvation. I was told that if I work had, deal with the pain in my life, stop using drugs and alcohol and make better choices my life would improve. They gave me support network, people who would listen to me, respect, responsibility, a routine, discipline (self). I was 21 and could leave at any time. When I entrered AARC I had my own home and my parents were unaware that I was using. I was not coerced but was offered a choice - keep doing what I was doing or learn some ways of dealing with life and reentering the mainstream. 14 years later I am doing just fine thank you. AARC was a starting point; I made the rest of the decisions, good and bad that got me here.
I was not held captive, nor tortured. True, my parents let me know they would no longer give me any financial support (all of which I used for drugs), but that was the kindest thing they could have done. I was approaching the point of homicide or suicide. The took me home after 6 years of criminal and antisocial behaviour. They fed me and clothed me and engaged in a process where they became better people. My mother finally dealt with years of pain and abuse. It was amazing.
A lot of people have gone through AARC since I did. Some are doing well, a few are not. Those that are doing well are making better choices. Those that are not hopefully will in the future. They deserve patience and understanding. We all do.
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It is easy to make fun of you josh
"You will wish you were me and you will want to be my friend."
Hint- if people want to be your friend, you usually don't have to inform them they want to be your friend
Double hint- have you considered starting a cologne for all the people who want to be you? They could bask in your heroic musk. You could call it "I inspire transcendant awe" (or alternatively "I have a transparent need to convince strangers on the internet that I am
respected by other people and so overcompensate")
Its easy to make fun of you josh, but not rewarding. What is at issue is your organizations obscene exploitation of the suicide (induced?) of one of their "patients". If the child they reared under their program killed himself, the program FAILED this kid. Yet they use his corpse as evidence that their program deserves more money... so they can do this to other kids? OBSCENE! If I offer to imprison a child in seclusion in such away that they will be content, competent and drug free when they emerge and they commit suicide by OD this is PROOF IN THE MOST PROFOUND way possible that I FAILED or DESTROYED that child. Yet, you people are so disconnected from reality that you showcase his body as evidence of the need to give your "treatment" to more children?
This is of course the opposite of how a genuine medical program is conducted.
At the same time, if you go to the AARC website the many "successes" of AARC are listed alongside pleas for donations...You are right EUDORA, a bizarre marketing strategy!. Look how many kids they "save"!! Look how successful the AARC is. If the AARC "succeeds" give it money, if the child dies, give AARC money. No matter what give AARC $!
What you GENUINELY manipulative villains have done is create a system where no matter what happens to the child, the AARC is regarded as life saving.
It will be unaccountable for any negative outcome to the children it handles.
IF THE CHILD "SUCCEEDS" THAT IS BECAUSE THE AARC HAS MADE IT SUCCEED!! IF THE CHILD DIES, IT IS THE FAULT OF THE CHILD FOR NOT USING THE TOOLS GIVEN TO IT BY AARC!!!!
Wow! Can I get in on this? Can I be a Dr where I can force someone to undergo my operation? Even though there is no recorded objective evidence that they are sick? When they "live" I get the credit. When they die, I claim it's their fault. I always win. But not so the child, lying mutilated beyond recognition on my table.
most importantly....
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On 2006-05-01 15:00:00, Anonymous wrote:
At the same time, if you go to the AARC website the many "successes" of AARC are listed alongside pleas for donations...You are right EUDORA, a bizarre marketing strategy!. Look how many kids they "save"!! Look how successful the AARC is. If the AARC "succeeds" give it money, if the child dies, give AARC money. No matter what give AARC $!
"
Show me a charitable orgainzation that does not use testimonials next to pleas for funding. The difference is that AARC is successful. It does not claim to control the clent's life forever, just treats the addiction so the person can go on to make their own choices. Think about the BILLIONS of dollars poured into cancer "research" and "treatment" but spent on administration and advertising. AARC's success record is far better. How many suicides or accidental deaths of former AARC clients? One that I know of, five years after treatment. One out of over 300 is pretty amazing.
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"If AARC is this big terrible place that is responsible for killing a kid then why are they still in existance?"
You fucking moron! Do you live in goddamn Happy Fairy Land or something? Horrible, evil things are committed by corporations and various organizations every day and nobody gets punished.
Pull your head out of your ass, you idiot!
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On 2006-05-01 16:49:00, Anonymous wrote:
""If AARC is this big terrible place that is responsible for killing a kid then why are they still in existance?"
You fucking moron! Do you live in goddamn Happy Fairy Land or something? Horrible, evil things are committed by corporations and various organizations every day and nobody gets punished.
Pull your head out of your ass, you idiot!
"
Yeah! Corporations like Molsons and Labatts who market their product to young people. Cigarette companies. Pharmaceutical companies. Porn companies. Organizations that advocate legalizing illegal drugs.
Show me credible, documented evidence that AARC has done any harm. Or continue to rave hysterically.
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On 2006-05-01 15:00:00, Anonymous wrote:
"It is easy to make fun of you josh
"You will wish you were me and you will want to be my friend."
Hint- if people want to be your friend, you usually don't have to inform them they want to be your friend
Double hint- have you considered starting a cologne for all the people who want to be you? They could bask in your heroic musk. You could call it "I inspire transcendant awe" (or alternatively "I have a transparent need to convince strangers on the internet that I am
respected by other people and so overcompensate")
Its easy to make fun of you josh, but not rewarding. What is at issue is your organizations obscene exploitation of the suicide (induced?) of one of their "patients". If the child they reared under their program killed himself, the program FAILED this kid. Yet they use his corpse as evidence that their program deserves more money... so they can do this to other kids? OBSCENE! If I offer to imprison a child in seclusion in such away that they will be content, competent and drug free when they emerge and they commit suicide by OD this is PROOF IN THE MOST PROFOUND way possible that I FAILED or DESTROYED that child. Yet, you people are so disconnected from reality that you showcase his body as evidence of the need to give your "treatment" to more children?
This is of course the opposite of how a genuine medical program is conducted.
At the same time, if you go to the AARC website the many "successes" of AARC are listed alongside pleas for donations...You are right EUDORA, a bizarre marketing strategy!. Look how many kids they "save"!! Look how successful the AARC is. If the AARC "succeeds" give it money, if the child dies, give AARC money. No matter what give AARC $!
What you GENUINELY manipulative villains have done is create a system where no matter what happens to the child, the AARC is regarded as life saving.
It will be unaccountable for any negative outcome to the children it handles.
IF THE CHILD "SUCCEEDS" THAT IS BECAUSE THE AARC HAS MADE IT SUCCEED!! IF THE CHILD DIES, IT IS THE FAULT OF THE CHILD FOR NOT USING THE TOOLS GIVEN TO IT BY AARC!!!!
Wow! Can I get in on this? Can I be a Dr where I can force someone to undergo my operation? Even though there is no recorded objective evidence that they are sick? When they "live" I get the credit. When they die, I claim it's their fault. I always win. But not so the child, lying mutilated beyond recognition on my table.
most importantly....
"
The program (Being AA did not fail him) in fact, it was quite successful when he applied it. Negligence is what failed him. It's similar to someone refusing to go in for surgery when their well being depended greatly on it.
AARC never took kudo for my success, I gave it. They never EVER tell people that THEY are the reason they succeed, people tell AARC that they are one of the biggest reasons they succeed.
Not only is your brain backwards, but I think your dick is inside out.
What you pathetic naysayers have done is exploited some drug addicted greasballs resentment towards AARC and turned it into layers upon layers of inaccurate and twisted accounts of reality.
Insult my penis again... please.
-Josh
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On 2006-05-02 16:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2006-05-01 15:00:00, Anonymous wrote:
"It is easy to make fun of you josh
"You will wish you were me and you will want to be my friend."
Hint- if people want to be your friend, you usually don't have to inform them they want to be your friend
Double hint- have you considered starting a cologne for all the people who want to be you? They could bask in your heroic musk. You could call it "I inspire transcendant awe" (or alternatively "I have a transparent need to convince strangers on the internet that I am
respected by other people and so overcompensate")
Its easy to make fun of you josh, but not rewarding. What is at issue is your organizations obscene exploitation of the suicide (induced?) of one of their "patients". If the child they reared under their program killed himself, the program FAILED this kid. Yet they use his corpse as evidence that their program deserves more money... so they can do this to other kids? OBSCENE! If I offer to imprison a child in seclusion in such away that they will be content, competent and drug free when they emerge and they commit suicide by OD this is PROOF IN THE MOST PROFOUND way possible that I FAILED or DESTROYED that child. Yet, you people are so disconnected from reality that you showcase his body as evidence of the need to give your "treatment" to more children?
This is of course the opposite of how a genuine medical program is conducted.
At the same time, if you go to the AARC website the many "successes" of AARC are listed alongside pleas for donations...You are right EUDORA, a bizarre marketing strategy!. Look how many kids they "save"!! Look how successful the AARC is. If the AARC "succeeds" give it money, if the child dies, give AARC money. No matter what give AARC $!
What you GENUINELY manipulative villains have done is create a system where no matter what happens to the child, the AARC is regarded as life saving.
It will be unaccountable for any negative outcome to the children it handles.
IF THE CHILD "SUCCEEDS" THAT IS BECAUSE THE AARC HAS MADE IT SUCCEED!! IF THE CHILD DIES, IT IS THE FAULT OF THE CHILD FOR NOT USING THE TOOLS GIVEN TO IT BY AARC!!!!
Wow! Can I get in on this? Can I be a Dr where I can force someone to undergo my operation? Even though there is no recorded objective evidence that they are sick? When they "live" I get the credit. When they die, I claim it's their fault. I always win. But not so the child, lying mutilated beyond recognition on my table.
most importantly....
"
The program (Being AA) did not fail him in fact, it was quite successful when he applied it. Negligence is what caused his failure. It's similar to someone refusing to go in for surgery when their well being depended greatly on it.
AARC never took kudo for my success, I gave it. They never EVER tell people that THEY are the reason they succeed, people tell AARC that they are one of the biggest reasons they succeed.
Not only is your brain backwards, but I think your dick is inside out.
What you pathetic naysayers have done is exploited some drug addicted greasballs resentment towards AARC and turned it into layers upon layers of inaccurate and twisted accounts of reality.
Insult my penis again... please.
-Josh"
Had to fix a bad sentence.
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You are aware, of course, by that rationale, if every single child who leaves AARC commits suicide that AARC is "sucessful"?
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On 2006-05-02 20:00:00, Anonymous wrote:
"You are aware, of course, by that rationale, if every single child who leaves AARC commits suicide that AARC is "sucessful"?"
If you want to pin it down to a dime; yup. But I wouldn't expect anyone on this site to propose anything close to a realistic situation.
People who generate unqualified banter in this thread are pretty tasteless and disrespectful.
I realize that most of you are trolls, that will attempt to dissect every last pixel of grammar I type (in an effort to discredit and libel aarc) but eventually what I am saying to you will sink in, or you will concede.
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There is always something to take away from one of these old posts. Apparently All About Recieving Cash gave young Mazur the choice to lead a sober life. How fortunate for him that the Entity allowed him that. Does it not allow some? I also like the idea that all AARC provides is a message. That sure doesn't sound like a facility providing treatment for a "disease". But then again, AARC's own day plan calls it a "spiritual" treatment. That sure sounds like a church doing faith healing to me.
By the by, if it is a disease, is the Wizard not practising medicine without a license?