Fornits

Fornits Home for Wayward Web Fora
An open discussion about the troubled parent industry

If any of you can offer an opinion or first hand knowledge on this, it would be greatly appreciated. (First hand knowledge appreciated much more, since pretty much anyone can form an opinion about something, even with little to no facts, or only hearsay.)

My ex worked for Walden House for a while, one of the synanon first gen offshoots, with a drug rehab-styled program, as opposed to the CEDU "emotional growth school" one. I asked him if they ever talked about Synanon there. He said "Oh my god, all they talked about was synanon. It was ridiculous." So.. it sounds as if Walden was essentially proud of their parent program, and spoke of it freely.

The first of my many questions is... does anyone know if Phoenix House did this too? (For those who don't know, they are also first-gen). They used to come and do drug awareness crap at our school when I was an adolescent, but mostly that consisted of a multiple-choice quiz to test our drug awareness, with the most obviously labeled correct answers I've ever seen, and *I* even noticed as a sixth grader. Synanon was not mentioned, but that could have been for many reasons... such as we weren't considered old enough to understand or appreciate.... but probably would if we ever ended up there. That last part, is, of course, pure speculation, so lets just go with the fact that the limited contact I did have with them as a child, no Synanon was mentioned.

Regardless if any pro-synanon general sentiment was kept strictly in house or not, if there was, indeed any mention of it at all at Phoenix House, (I'm trying to be fair, here.), think about this:

At the CEDU schools, when we were there: (Myself, 1987-89)

Synanon was never talked about:
In raps
In the house
In workshops
To our parents
To us
To ANYONE


Now, the story goes that Mel changed the meaning of the acronym CEDU from Charles E. Diederich University to "see yourself as you are and do something about it" when it really hit the fan with the rattlesnake incident. That attempted homicide happened in the late 70s. (And also, has anyone officially verified yet what the original meaning of CEDU is? Chuckie or SeeDo?)

IF there was indeed a period of time at CEDU where Synanon was mentioned often and with pride, and IF Mel decided to distance himself from Synanon after that obvious display of fruit-loopery on the synanites' part... (or even if he did it *before* that... even as far back as the school's inception.)

Why didn't Walden House? Where does Phoenix House stand?

Is it really a question how much kool-aid you ingested while you were at synanon?


So, (speculation again) IF Mel's motivation for distancing himself from the program was a result of rational thought, (regardless of when he did it).

Why did he still teach the program?

How much closer was Mel's template to the original Synanon program, as opposed to Walden and Phoenix House's?


Because, if Phoenix House still talks synanon, and is different from the original program in similar ways to walden house's...

Isn't that a suspiciously inversely proportional?


I hope this makes sense.


Regardless of what the real answer is for any of this, whether it goes with any half-baked theory I may or may not have at the moment (which is at this point, closer to "may not have"... too many question marks to be filled.) it will be interesting, even if inconsistent.... to me, anyway.

I lovez obzervink peoplez. Zey are so qvaint.

Yup, that's what it said when I submitted a message. That it would have to be approved by a moderator.


Do I even NEED to say anything about this? Really?


If this is anything other than a mistake, there's no explanation that could possibly be valid in my eyes.


But feel free to try. I'm quite curious.


You will be rated on content as well as style points.


If it's a glitch or mistake, then never mind.

We always talk on here about all of the twatwads who excelled in fucking our ears to cornhole our brain, and rightfully so.


Who were the staff who either truly tried to make a difference, or at least removed themselves enough from the program, whether they were in raps or not, to develop a decent, somewhat functional (as much as is allowed at the duck farm) relationship with the kids?

This doesn't mean they weren't human. blownaway told me a story of one of my favorite staff totally decompensating while he was teaching a class. He just started screaming and yelling. Based on what he told me, it sounds like this teacher had reached his breaking point with the bullshit program and temporarily went looney tunes.

So... if you would like to contribute, here are some things to talk about:

Which staff you thought was cool.
Respond (if applicable) to other posts where someone thought the staff was cool, but you most certainly did not, and can remember times when they were being quite un-cool.
Echo if you agree with positive sentiment about a staff, and elaborate, if you would like to.


One thing I found concerning the cool staff is that they didn't work as counselors. They were always on the periphery, such as a teacher, someone who worked in the kitchen, etc.

Most of these people had to go through the program themselves, and most also sat in on raps. But for some reason, they managed to hold their own.

So... here's mine.

1. Lou. He was the supervising staff at the farm in the 80s. Soft-spoken, rather wise (IMO), pragmatic and had the respect of almost everyone I knew while I was in quest. His one big, non-negotiable rule was that you never abuse the animals, and he was hard-core about that. (Too bad he wasn't around during the BCA era.) It appears, from all intents and purposes, that he felt the same way about us. As shitty as quest was, he was a gentle presence during work crews. Never barking at us. Never getting on our case if we were slacking. Or... if he did, it was always in a respectful manner. He was sometimes in raps. Hell, I heard that a few years before I got there, he RAN raps, which surprised the hell out of me. I remember raps with him. Whenever he offered feedback, it was sensible and in a normal tone of voice. I always felt that he cared about the kids, and respected their feelings in a way that the other staff didn't. He never called people names. He never yelled at anyone. (But he probably would if someone hurt one of the farm animals.) Staff never got on his case about it, because he was old school. He was there when RMA started.

2. Wendy. The super-awesome "kitchen lady" who pretty much ran the show, despite the fact that the fat hosebag, Patsy, was officially in charge. Wendy went through the program with Lou, and was old-school. When I found out that she and Lou both traversed the nine circles of hell, I was shocked. How could this be possible? They didn't act like all of the other raisin-cakes there. Like Lou, she was also a still-waters type of personality. Soft-spoken, matter-of-fact, and in possession of a complete lack of interest in impressing anyone. She didn't need to. Her quiet demeanor belied her obvious confidence and security in herself. In addition, she could out arm-wrestle anyone in the school. Soren, in all of his massive, muscular scandinavian physique, was thoroughly owned when he challenged Wendy to a duel. She, on the other hand, rarely spoke about her amazing ability. If you asked her about it, she would nod and say yes, and that was about it. She and Lou never talked program. Never mentioned propheet or workshop tools. All they seemed to really care about was working with the kids.

3. Will Vernard. Will was more involved with the program, and *would* mention tools occasionally, he attended raps, but he never yelled at anyone. At least, not when I was there. He also possessed a gift for finding driftwood, working it and finishing it to look like a polished version of... well... driftwood. Here one of the reasons I liked Will... one, he would tell us wickedly cool "war stories" (for lack of a better word) about his time in the Navy when he supervised the reactor on a nuclear submarine. Not only that, he would also regale us about the hijinks he and his comrades pulled on shore leave. Here is the other reason I liked Will... he was one of only two teachers at the school who actually TAUGHT me something. Having a pedagogue who possessed a background in nuclear physics had its advantages. He taught algebra, geometry, trig and calculus. If it hadn't been for him, I never would have passed my SATs. Not only that, he didn't pull punches with grades. After my summit, I got real busy with the program. I vaguely recall upper school students being required to get their affairs in order prior to graduation. What this entails, I honestly don't remember. Any other teacher there would have given me leeway. Oh she's going to be graduating soon, she's going to be busy with the final stages of the program. Let's give her a break. Not Will. I was astonished to find a C on my report card, which was mailed to me after I graduated. I called him, simply to ask what happened. He said "Well, towards the end of your stay, you only sporadically turned in your homework, and sometimes, you didn't even show up to class." I stated that I was really busy, as were all of the other people in my peer group. He said, "I understand, but I can't just give you a good grade because you were busy and couldn't make it." Brownie points for you, Will. Rock on.

Stephen and Susan Drinkard. I've mentioned these two in this forum before. This couple were also teachers, were required to go through the program, and also had the dubious distinction of being required to attend the Here Forever staff workshop, since their timing unfortunately coincided with the every-five-years ritual of Mel browbeating the fuck out of everyone who worked there under the guise of a grand vision, such as camelot or here forever. Steve taught literature and creative writing. Susan taught journalism. Steve was downright subversive, albeit subtly. He tried to influence us through literature and writing. He assigned us books like Lord of the Flies, 1984, Brave New World, Fahrenheit 451... he showed us films like Brazil and The Third Wave. He never yelled at anyone in a rap, and went off on the staff in a propheet when they were accusing him of being in his thinking. (He said something to the effect of "You know what? My thinking has saved my ass more times than I can count, so I think I'll hang on to it, thank you very much.") Susan was smart, and, like Will, pulled no punches with grades. She turned in the class grades one time before she went out of town for christmas. There were several people in the class who received Cs, Ds and even Fs. While she was gone, the creepy and incessantly annoying Bob Sulfies, who was the acting "academic director" at the time, changed all of her grades to As and Bs. When she confronted him on this, she was promptly fired, and when Steve brought his grievance to Doug shit-faced Brown, he was also let go. Well... they tried. A for effort on both of their parts, seriously.


Rod Barkley. Okay, there are things I liked about Rod, and others I did not. One thing I liked was that he was super smart, probably on par with Will. Specializing as a geologist, that is what he taught. Most of us, at the time, thought he was dorky, nerdy and awkward, and he was. However, these days, I find those to be admirable traits. The only beef I had with Rod was that he was an easy grader, and it annoyed the hell out of me. It was rare that I ever got less than an A with at least two pluses following closely behind. One time, I had pluses going all the way across the page. A+++++++++++++ "great work! amazing!" It drove me crazy. I don't know if he was easily impressed or what, but it wasn't fair... to any of us. Still, he seemed to be a good egg.


Ed Katz: Ed Ed Ed.... one of the Voyageur staff who worked down at the wood corral with John Aaron, Ed was also kind of a borderline staff for me. I do recall him yelling at people in raps, but it never seemed to be so abusive. It was almost as if he was yelling the same stuff that wendy and lou would talk normally about, but I could be misguided in my memory of him. He also ran his anger, if I recall. Here's the one thing that always enchanted me about Ed... his smile and laugh. That would always brighten my day. It was genuine, and had nothing to do with the glazed over CEDU/Miss America fakey grimace that everyone else wore around their pie-holes.

Greg Springett. Okay, Greg sometimes gave me a creepy vibe, but I also never remember him yelling, and he seemed quite gentle for the most part. He was required to tell part of his story at a challenge first light one time, and he seemed downright embarrassed having to talk about what taunts the kids said to him as an adolescent. Who wants to reveal that shit? Really! Here is why I have fond memories of this guy... fishing. Fishing was one of my few solaces there and one of a bunch of "hiding out" techniques I would use to avoid having to socialize with anyone up at the house. I loved it, and I was one of the few girls who actually did it, which made me the subject of quite a bit of ridicule from my peer group. For the longest time, I had one of those cheap-assed rods that really weren't all that sturdy. By the time I reached challenge, I was bored with the cast and reel routine of my one-step-up-from-a-pocket-fisherman rod. Greg lent me one of his fly rods, and two flies. He taught me the proper way to cast, and how to tie and untie a fly from the line. I was addicted to fly fishing from then on. My old pole collected dust in the dorm, while I reeled in countless steelhead with the new one. He let me keep it for the rest of my stay there, and probably would have let me leave with it, had I not always remembered to keep to my word and return it to him upon graduation. He never asked for it back, if memory serves. I simply gave it to him.


Here is another category to ponder... staff who started out somewhat cool, and then got sucked in so deep not only did  they become fully indoctrinated, but they became power staff. I can think of two prime examples of this.

Chuck Selent. When I was at RMA in the late 80s, Chuck was this unassuming specimen of Aryan genetics. Also soft spoken, he was an artist and craftsman. I attended almost all of his classes, which included scrimshaw, 2D animation (done with a video camera that could not shoot frame by frame. I seriously doubt RMA would have sprung for a pencil test setup), and stop motion animation (done with same camera.) Chuck could certainly get annoyingly pissy if you got distracted and didn't pay attention in some of the required classes he taught. (of which I don't remember) It was obvious he was well on his way to becoming the asshole he turned out to be, but when I was there, he was relatively decent.


Kristen Gilje. Kristen was already towing the party line when I was there. Running raps, pulling people up, etc. However, nobody respected her authority. She was such a mellow, soft-spoken hippie child that people just thought she was a joke for the most part. It was quite obvious that this kind of behavior was not in her nature. Unfortunately, she eventually learned to work the program. However, when I was there, she was mostly gentle. Possessing an amazing gift for water colors, her classes did something that the classes at my alma mater didn't even teach.... method. I actually learned HOW to use watercolor, instead of simply letting the students go express themselves without any guidance concerning the media. She taught me about layers, helped me hone my gesture and figure drawing, and introduced me to decoupage. I considered her a close friend, and was one of her favorite students. Unlike other staff who ride their favorites hard, she was incredibly sympathetic when I was in one of her raps... even when I was on my full-time. It is a crying shame how the broke her and molded her into the apparent monster that later alumni said she had become.

Anyone have any good info on the candidates for the primaries? I read a few statements. Christine Smith sounds the best so far, but I haven't read everyone's yet.

Obama, Clinton and Kucinich can go suck a rotten tuber. The libertarians are pro guns n drugs. I can get behind that.

See how you do on this quiz...

Do you deserve your high school diploma?

Yo, man, where the fuck are you? ::poke::

Please help alleviate the extremely boring nature of this most recent batch of trolls by regaling us with stories about butterflies.

Seriously. Tell me about those motherfucking butterflies.

For those of us unfortunate sods who had the additional burden of being responsible for the costumes in the summit stretch exercise, we will most likely have in our notebooks a painstaking description of the stretches, who they were assigned to, and all of the additional behavioral shit that was tailor made to each person. (Although I do believe that other people have that in their notebooks who didn't have to help with costumes. Not sure on that.)

I was one of those people. I had to help the staff participant. (You know, the one who goes through everything with your peer group.) She was in charge of the costumes.

However, not every summit utilized every stretch. There were too many of them.

So, this is a call to all of those costume mules out there who still have their notebooks. Let's pool our resources and see if we can discover every stretch. Granted, none of them will be completely the same, because there were tasks that were assigned to that person based on how the staff viewed their behavior.... or something opposite their behavior, in an effort to take them out of their "comfort zone."

In addition, some characters were unisex. i.e. they had male and female versions, such as raggedy ann and andy, pinnochio and pinnochia, etc.

The other thing that blew me away about this was the ridiculous amount of minutia that had to be dealt with in the construction of our costumes. A task that we only had a few hours to accomplish.

Before I list our stretches, here is a copy of the guidelines:

Totally in agreement. No private areas or possessions are to be taken. Both lodges, decks and major work areas are off limits. No one is to know what is going on. All agreements are in effect. Totally responsible for buddy. Taped area is off limits. Costumes made to last. Have 3 hours to do this stretch. At 1:15, no one is left in this room.

Anyway, here were the stretches in my workshop:

Superman comes to party dressed as Clark Kent working on assignment. Brings newspaper. Wears hat. Rumpled suit. Unsure, insecure. Clark Kent must bring a phone booth. Must be big enough to change in. Wear superman clothes. Once he changes, say superman speech "faster than a speeding bullet.." Find someone in distress and do a good deed. Then changes back to Clark Kent and looks for Lois.

Pinnochia must dress as a little girl. Shorts w/suspenders. Knee socks. shoes. strings attached to every major joint in her body. She wants to become real. Has nose that grows every time she lies or manipulates. The bigger the nose, the less real she is. Sings "I got no strings". Skips around party and lies, tells  untrue stories, flirts with guys. When they respond, she rejects them. She is in charge of the girls bathroom.

Peter Pan: Come to party dressed in green pixie tunic exactly thigh length. Green tights. Pointy hat w/feather. Green shoes (elfin). Also must bring an attached shadow. Spend time at party being fun and irresponsible kid, singing "I won't grow up". Must bring a hand made gift for everyone at party.

Winnie the Pooh comes dressed like a bear, overstuffed. Real chubby. Whiskers. Bear ears. Has a shirt that says Pooh. (It's a) little too small. Has honey pot. Trying to get everyone to like his honey. Kind  until someone says "no" and then he explodes on them, then goes into corner and pouts, "nobody loves me, nobody understands me, I can't trust anybody." Then goes back to party. He carries sack with him, his precious shit. Weighs a minimum of 10 pounds. Tries to make everyone else feel sorry for him. (Weight that represents shit.)

Dudley Doright wears a red jacket w/black chest band. Wears gun. Black pants with single stripe goes down the outside. Badge. Mountee cap. White gloves. Shiny boots. Brings his horse. Impeccably dressed. Must have a whistle. Any time at the party blows his whistle 3 times. Shouts "I am right, and you are wrong. When you are wrong, I am right. Because I'm Dudley Doright of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police." (Also) looking for Sweet Nell.

Luke Skywalker wears total white including the shoes. Luke looks at and sees only the light in people. Very neat and clean. Will receive a manicure from somebody else invited. Says "May the force be with you." Sings the star wars theme music until he finds someone in trouble, helps them, and moves on. Must come with a light saber that really sheds light. Talks about forgiveness and the force within. Periodically, he will be overcome by dark force from past and must fight Darth. After each battle, make peace and move on.

Cinderella wears Cinderella cleaning woman rags. Cleaning floor, keeping room clean and neat. Supplies, cleaning stuff. Down and messy hair. Constantly facing floor, talks about how sad her life is. Talks about her mother. How she always wants to quit. When Luke says "May the force be with you and you are beautiful", she turns into a princess. High heels, hair out of face. Tiara. Long gown. Dance with your prince at the ball. Doesn't stay Cinderella. Someone gongs clock 12 times. She must turn back into cleaning woman before 12.

King Arthur. Party in Camelot. Host of the party. Dress as king w/cape, crown, shoes. Very neat. Carries excalibur. Represents love and generosity. Brings shield w/eagle & heart. Goes to all characters - talks about Camelot, the dream, round table, importance of knights, says "this is the time of King Arthur, and by god, I shall be king." Gets royal haircut from Pinnochia. Will get a royal manicure from a character.

Indiana Jones wears leather jacket, whip gloves. Hat that Indy would wear. Boots and a gun. Come with real hair on his chest and arms. Dashing, handsome, adventurous. Takes chances, nothing he won't do. Looking for Ark. (It) represents all the love and peace in world. Must bring ark - includes secrets of peace. Talks of all the women waiting for him in all parts of the world. Comes with a black book with 8 (at least) names, address and phone numbers of girls waiting for him.

Annie Oakley: She is nothing but fun, outrageous, wild, (tells) dirty jokes. Out of control. Wears cowgirl hat. Two guns. Wears vest, cowgirl shirt. Cowgirl boots with spurs. Wears hair in two braids with two bows. Direct power into life. Fun, outrageous and obnoxious. Always saying "I have the power to do anything I want, anytime I want to." Brings her own dead horse. When she feels especially bitchy, she kicks dead horse. Assisting with all of the costumes.

Tarzan wears leopard skin loincloth, long and untidy hair, bare-chested, bare-legged. Brings club and vine that he swings on. Outrageous and powerful. Looking for adventure. Tries to bring value and beauty. Yells tarzan call. Looking for Jane. Can only use primitive, jungle-like phrases. Must bring a cage. He gets into his cage, starts talking about negative thinking and about how he tricks people to think he's giving. Also wear 6 inch key, so he can get himself out.

Raggedy Andy wears exactly Raggedy Andy (clothes). Shorts with suspenders, red and white striped shirt, red yarn for hair, big smile, lashes painted on eyes, big rouge cheeks. Come with knee socks that match shirt. Little boy type shoes. Sailor cap that wont fall off. Completely silent. Anybody can play with you, drag you around, put you into any position they want.


Dorothy wears cute knee-length dress, ruby slippers. Wears her hair in braids with matching bows. Little white ankle socks. Brings her dog Toto in a basket. Always singing "Somewhere over the rainbow". Knows song by heart. Looking outside of herself for her home. Sometimes stands and clicks her heels together 3 times with hands on cheeks, saying "There's no place like home." Kind to everyone at the party. Looking for Oz. When she's scared she goes to Oz. Talks about how home is within each of us. Talks about how we each have a home inside of us. In charge of putting away all costumes.

Quasimodo has a hump, drags himself around, really ugly and distorted. Wears cape with hood. Drools. Has beauty inside and he wants to share it with people. Brings a little bell that he rings. Every time he rings it, he says "sanctuary". He likes to touch the beauty of people at the party and of course they run away. Keep break room in order, helps put costumes back.

Scarecrow: stuffed with man made straw. Clumsy, tripping all the time, dependent on dorothy. Trying to find Oz to get his brain. Sings "If I only had a brain." Every time he falls, says "I'm so stupid, I'll never get this right." When he sees everyone else enjoying life, he goes into a rage for at least 15 seconds. Responsible to clean up room after party and the boys bathroom.

Wizard of Oz: Man of many faces. Has all kinds of contraptions to make noise, flashing lights. Stays behind a stationary screen at all times. He's always giving answers to people that are confusing, elaborate, dishonest answers. Wizardly language. Must have directions for dorothy to go home. Has a Phd of psychology for scarecrow. This Oz is very disconnected. He becomes unplugged. Has extension cord tied around his waist. Occasionally he comes out from behind screen, has hysterical fit. Then says "Don't pay any attention to that man behind the screen."

Glenda: Good witch with bad witch blood. Wears long beautiful gown, high heels, hair up on her head. Wears tiara. Smiles at everyone. Makes nasty put-downs, rejections, constantly with a smile. Very kind to the Oz group, though. Finds fault with everyone. Doesn't use foul language. Brings a fishing pole. Has at least 6 hooks on the pole. Each has a beautiful red heart on it, with names of boys she's hooked. Each heart is two inches in width. Brings four different witch outfits with obvious design labels. Assist with the girls bathroom.

Tin Man wears tin all over his body. Totally covered. Must carry oil can and safe axe. Looking for his heart. Sings "If I only had a heart". Wears funnel. Very protective of all Oz characters. Every time he is touched, he cries and rusts. Goes to Oz to get heart. Oiled by dorothy. Will receive haircut from Annie Oakley.

Wonder Woman has silver bracelets, big, 2 inches thick. Represents her power. Wears leotard tights with boots. Wide, sparkling headpiece, huge belt buckle, stars all over her leotard top. At least a dozen. Has a lasso. Whoever she catches in her lasso must tell the truth. Sings wonder woman song and twirls. Can't quite give to herself. After someone tells the truth, she doubts herself and says to herself "I tricked him/her. I can't trust my own power." Gives very powerful manicure to Luke and Arthur. Must be in charge of costumes. Bring at least 21 toll house cookies 3" in diameter.

Mad Hatter. Wear white shirt, vest, bow tie, top hat w/large rabbit ears. Have 8" diameter pocket watch w/chain, shiny shoes, exactly 15" long, w/nice slacks. Constantly in motion. Says "There's never enough" and "I'm late, I'm late, for a very important date." Speaks very fast. Dings 12 times for cinderella. Rings phone for Clark Kent. "Never enough time."

Mr. Rogers: Wear nice pair of slacks, coat and tie and nice pair of polished shoes. Create space in party that represents his home. When enters, change into a button down sweater and sneakers. Sings "A beautiful day in the neighborhood." Speaks very slowly. Very safe to be around him. Very safe and slow. Gentle. Brings everyone into his home to show all the toys for children. Tells them stories. Has written 3 stories that he reads to people when they visit him. Whenever he comes out, he has to change. Tries to get people to come to his home.




I actually started to feel ill writing this. I used to look upon the stretch experience as really the only relatively fun thing in the summit. Then when I read my notebook again I was like "Wow, this is uh... pretty sadistic." and remembered how exhausting the party was, how we were scrambling to get our costumes together. How we had to present our costumes to the staff, which they went over meticulously, looking for any error or inaccuracy that did not meet the assigned guidelines. i.e. the tin man's armor keeps falling off, Wonder Woman's toll house cookies aren't 3" in diameter, etc. Then we had to go back and fix whatever they found wrong with it before the party could start. And then the party itself was so fucking draining, going around having to repeat the same actions, loudly, to music. Or, in the case of raggedy andy, do nothing at all and let people touch you and move you around.

Whatever. I was wrong. It was not fun. It never was. The only bright moment was that some people did their stretch brilliantly in terms of utilizing some really great humor. The guy in our group who had to be the wizard was the best by far, because he was really creative and could come up with a lot of very funny contraptions. It also seemed that he was making fun of the fact that he was assigned this silly thing to begin with.