Author Topic: Experts: almost anyone could torture  (Read 1628 times)

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Offline Nihilanthic

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Experts: almost anyone could torture
« on: March 14, 2005, 09:21:00 PM »
Copied from: http://members.aol.com/mlucen/041201_torture.htm

Experts: almost anyone could torture
Psychologists call for greater attention to role of peers and superiors in prison scandal

Posted Dec. 1, 2004
Courtesy Princeton University
and World Science staff

When news broke about the abuse of prisoners at Abu Ghraib in Iraq, many people questioned: who could do such a thing? According to Princeton University psychologists who reviewed decades worth of studies, the answer is: anyone.
Writing in the Nov. 26 issue of the research journal Science, researchers contend that many forms of behavior, including acts of great evil, are influenced as much by authority figures, peer pressure and other social interactions as by the psychology of the individual.

?Could any average 18-year-old have tortured these prisoners?? said professor Susan Fiske, one of the researchers. ?I would have to answer, ?Yes, just about anyone could have -- unfortunately.??

Fiske and her colleagues, two graduate students, drew their conclusions from a range of studies involving 8 million participants. The studies examined how factors, ranging from the stress of war to the expectations of superiors, can combine to cause ordinary people to commit seemingly inexplicable acts.

?Ordinary people can engage in incredibly destructive behavior if so ordered by legitimate authority,? Fiske and colleagues wrote, referring particularly to landmark studies conducted by Stanley Milgram in the early 1970s. Milgram showed that normal volunteers would deliver what they understood to be lethal electric shocks to other people when they were told that it was a necessary part of carrying out an experiment. ?Subordinates not only do what they are ordered to do, but what they think their superiors would order them to do, given their understanding of the authority?s overall goals,? the researchers wrote.

When discussing the Milgram experiment in classes, Fiske said, students swear they would never behave the way the study subjects did. ?But when they are put in similar experiments, they do,? said Fiske.

Fisk noted that there are cases of isolated individuals who torture other people. However, it is more likely that the abusers at Abu Ghraib were conforming to the culture and expectations of their environment than violating them, she said. The incidents occurred within a very hierarchical organization; the abusers had no particular background to suggest they would behave outrageously; and the abusers asserted they were following orders and documented what they did.

?Society holds individuals responsible for their actions, as the military court martial recognizes, but social psychology suggests we should also hold responsible peers and superiors who control the social context,? the researchers wrote.

The reasons for abuse go beyond simple adherence to authority. ?The situation of the 800th Military Police Brigade guarding Abu Ghraib prisoners fits all the social conditions known to cause aggression,? the researchers wrote. ?The soldiers were certainly provoked and stressed, at war, in constant danger, taunted and harassed by some of the very citizens they were sent to save, and their comrades were dying daily and unpredictably. Their morale suffered, they were untrained for the job, their command climate was lax, their return home was a year overdue, their identity as disciplined soldiers was gone and their own amenities were scant. Heat and discomfort also doubtless contributed.?

At the same time, the Iraqi prisoners were part of a different societal group that was seen by Americans as threatening cherished values. The more that people see others as ?interchangeable members? of a different group, rather than as unique individuals, the more their behavior is influenced by parts of the brain associated with alarm and disgust, the researchers wrote. Fiske and colleagues recently conducted their own surveys showing that similar feelings arise in less extreme situations: U.S. citizens surveyed, on average, ?viewed Muslims and Arabs as not sharing their interests and stereotyped them as not especially sincere, honest, friendly or warm.?

The point of looking at the complex social and psychological forces behind the Abu Ghraib abuse is not to excuse people from responsibility for their actions, but to develop a scientific understanding of what causes evil actions so they can be better prevented, the researchers said. ?People?s hunches are to look at the individual for the reasons, but as a society we can?t afford to do that,? said Fiske. ?People who are in charge of other people on a large scale, whether CEOs or military officers, need to know the conditions that produce evil behavior. The conditions are not that complicated. And if they can be understood, then they can be prevented in large part.?

One of the most effective ways to prevent abuse is for members of different groups to have positive contact with each other, which is one reason why it is important for Iraqi soldiers to train and fight with Americans, Fiske said.

Another step, Fiske said, would be for the military to ensure that soldiers have alternate means of communication, such as military chaplains or other semi-independent figures, so they can voice deep concerns without violating the chain of command. The goal is not to eliminate obedience and conformity, which can spur acts of heroism as well as evil. The researchers wrote that firefighters who rushed into the World Trade Center were obeying orders and conforming to the culture of their organization in addition to displaying individual bravery and self sacrifice. The conduct of war itself requires obedience and conformity, Fiske noted.

Indeed, authority and social pressure can be tools for combating abuse. Fiske said that her experience in consulting with industry on racial and gender discrimination suggests that leadership is critical for good behavior throughout an organization. ?I do think the CEOs are responsible for the atmosphere in the company,? she said. ?If the CEOs say, ?It?s really important that we do things a certain way,? they can have a real impact.? However, focusing blame on a ?few bad apples? will hinder the social and cultural changes necessary to prevent further abuses, Fiske said.

* * *

?Ordinary people can engage in incredibly destructive behavior if so ordered by legitimate authority,?

It shouldnt take too long to think of why I posted this article into this forum. I think this is an important read for anyone considering a program for a child. The accusations are there, its largely unregulated, and now there is a mountain of evidence that such controlled environments can become torturous - such controlled environments as a prison, or a program.

the war on drugs is but one manifestation, albeit a very dramatic one, of the great moral contests of our age -- the struggle between two diametrically opposed images of man: between man as responsible moral agent, 'condemned' to freedom, benefiting and suffering from the consequences of his actions; and man as irresponsible child, unfit for freedom, 'protected' from its risks by agents of the omnicompetent state.
--Thomas Szasz

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Anonymous

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Experts: almost anyone could torture
« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2005, 09:40:00 PM »
What can you say? Many of these teens will be well groomed for the military... huh?

http://www.bioethics.umn.edu/publicatio ... aug_21.pdf
The medical system collaborated with designing and
implementing psychologically and physically coercive interrogations. Army officials stated that a physician and a psychiatrist helped design, approve, and monitor interrogations at Abu Ghraib.

http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/121304E.shtml
For many Latin American victims of torture, the infamous pictures of abuse at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison brought back not only chilling recollections of their own experiences, but also confirmed what they have long maintained: that their torturers were following interrogation guidelines set by the U.S. Army School of the Americas (SOA).
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Antigen

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Experts: almost anyone could torture
« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2005, 10:10:00 PM »
:nworthy:

Now, I wonder what we'd have to do to get Alberto Ganzales (or one of his staff, at least) to read this article in this context?

"...In general, it's just an overall sign in America that there doesn't seem to be as much respect for authority figures, and that's a bad trend. It just strikes me that people can say whatever they want to and get away with it, and that's not good."

--But David Murrell, exec. dir. of the Florida Police Benevolent Association

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
~ Crosby Stills Nash & Young, Sweet Judy Blue Eyes

Offline Nihilanthic

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Experts: almost anyone could torture
« Reply #3 on: March 14, 2005, 10:31:00 PM »
A political donation?

If I am of the opinion that it is inexpedient to assign to the government the task of operating railroads, hotels, or mines, I am not an "enemy of the state" any more than I can be called an enemy of sulfuric acid because I am of the opinion that, useful though it may be for many purposes, it is not suitable either for drinking, or for washing one's hands.
http://www.mises.org/liberal/ch1sec7.asp' target='_new'>Ludwig Von Mises

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."