Author Topic: YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED  (Read 7131 times)

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Offline Dr Fucktard

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #30 on: March 03, 2005, 01:01:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-03-03 09:18:00, JMA wrote:

"I think another way to look at it is, not what we did while in there since it was a truly unbearable situation, but how we all deal with it now, since we can now think what we want, say what we want, do what we want, and go where we want. I truly believe we all did the best we could under very extreme situations. Another way to look at it is, doing what you have to do to survive doesn't make you weak, it makes you strong. "

This is the 'now' part of the rap.. :lol:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #31 on: March 03, 2005, 02:10:00 PM »
Well I know that Fucktard may not be people's favorite person to converse with, but this is ridiculous! Don't everyone talk at once now..
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Offline Dr. Miller Newton

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« Reply #32 on: March 03, 2005, 03:09:00 PM »
Probably too busy getting high, having pre-marital sex and/or rocking out to second-rate druggie music. You snooze, you lose. A bunch of lazy, good-for-nothing druggies...
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Offline PerfectStraightling

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« Reply #33 on: March 03, 2005, 04:37:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-03-03 10:01:00, Dr Fucktard wrote:

"
Quote

On 2005-03-03 09:18:00, JMA wrote:


"I think another way to look at it is, not what we did while in there since it was a truly unbearable situation, but how we all deal with it now, since we can now think what we want, say what we want, do what we want, and go where we want. I truly believe we all did the best we could under very extreme situations. Another way to look at it is, doing what you have to do to survive doesn't make you weak, it makes you strong. "



This is the 'now' part of the rap.. :smile: And I agree...  :grin:  

And to Mr. F., I mean, DR. F.  :wink: ,
just because the people in straight used to say something doesn't necessarily make it wrong. It may be more likely....but if it makes sense then it makes sense. Being able to decide and think for yourself is what I'm talking about.
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Offline Dr Fucktard

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« Reply #34 on: March 03, 2005, 04:44:00 PM »
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just because the people in straight used to say something doesn't necessarily make it wrong. It may be more likely....but if it makes sense then it makes sense. Being able to decide and think for yourself is what I'm talking about.

You're goddamned RIGHT it doesn't make it wrong! Who in the hell do you think you're talkin' to??  Of course it makes sense! Being able to successfully use the Tools of Personal Change is what I'm talking about, druggie! :flame: :lol:
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Offline PerfectStraightling

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« Reply #35 on: March 03, 2005, 04:47:00 PM »
Sorry, I get all of my Pro-Straight Trolls mixed up. I guess that would be you?? To be honest, I usually don't read the troll posts much...
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Offline Dr. Miller Newton

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« Reply #36 on: March 03, 2005, 04:49:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-03-03 13:47:00, JMA wrote:

"Sorry, I get all of my Pro-Straight Trolls mixed up. I guess that would be you?? To be honest, I usually don't read the troll posts much..."



Maybe you should, Druggie.....then maybe you'd have a snowball's chance in hell of getting Straight.  The way you're heading now is directly to jail, institutions , and DEATH!
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Teenage Drug Use Is A Disease

Offline Dr Fucktard

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« Reply #37 on: March 03, 2005, 04:50:00 PM »
Typical druggie laxed attitude.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #38 on: March 03, 2005, 05:22:00 PM »
I really do hope to avoid jail, institutions, AND untimely death if at all possible    :em:  :em:  :em:
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Offline PerfectStraightling

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« Reply #39 on: March 03, 2005, 05:22:00 PM »
That was me.
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Offline ehm

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« Reply #40 on: March 04, 2005, 09:37:00 AM »
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On 2005-03-02 18:15:00, formerly known as wrote:

"i read an old post about you being homeless after getting out. i admire that."


Hard to believe a rich Dallas girl with a doctor for a daddy could end up homeless, but freedom is good, even without whipped cream and a cherry on top. Sleeping on the ground in an abandoned building, waking up to ants crawling in my hair, and still being happy to be there instead of Straight...I may not have made it out of Texas without that "freedom."
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Offline `

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« Reply #41 on: March 05, 2005, 08:54:00 AM »
PA: Who is calling whom a "Semblerite"? I am not calling you one, but you troll around anonymously, failing to engage in the dialogue that might help you understand what a person is saying. I won't stand down from saying what I think because of Anonymous yackers. Did you read some other things I wrote? I hope that helped. Keep in mind that if you see a piece of "Semblerism" in something someone says, it might be because you are assuming the old lexicon when someone is really speaking in a different one. It might be because you expect everyone else to understand their experience in the same way that you do. It might be because that person still has layers of Straight language and beliefs to purge. Just possibilities I thought of. However, that you could accuse me of being a "Semblerite" shows one thing only: you have never spoken with me. You don't see me these days. Soldier, hold your fire. My god, she's not the enemy after all.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #42 on: March 11, 2005, 10:43:00 AM »
Several years ago someone named Julian Roberts devised the concept of something called the ?locus of control?. The locus is a continuum between the extremes of external and internal. To quote, ?People with an external locus of control believe that the things that happen to them are unrelated to their own behavior and, therefore, are beyond their control. People with an internal locus of control believe that negative events are a consequence of personal actions and thus potentially can be controlled.? Many studies have shown that people with an internal locus of control are less prone to illness. Of course, statistics can be easily skewed and I will refrain from jumping to any conclusions about there being a direct relationship, but one has to accept there is at least a relationship between the two. From Formerly?s posts, it seems that she is trying to progress toward the internal side of the continuum. Please excuse me if I am mistaken about this assumption. If we were speaking of every-day life, I would encourage such behavioral modification attempts; health may benefit greatly from such a change in outlook. It is physically, and probably mentally, much better to feel that one has control over one?s life from day to day. However, with that being said, there is another side to the argument that must also be examined; especially if one wants to know the ?truth?.
Truth, being applied to psychology, let alone to what happened in Straight, is a slippery and subjective thing. Being factual is obtainable through use of science, and showing a perspective is obtainable through arts, such as painting, drawing, photography, literature, conversation, etc. If we wished to be only truthful about Straight, we would be very limited in what we could say. We would merely be able to list the facts and would have to divorce all feeling and speculation from those facts because, as we all know, we can sometimes be mistaken about our interpretation of events and feelings may not fully and accurately correspond with events. Let?s take our most obvious and appropriate example and apply it to our locus of control.

Truth: I was admitted to Straight as an adolescent. (Other facts, devoid of feeling, may be inserted here. I have omitted them because everyone?s experience differed to some extent.)

External locus of control extreme: I was the complete victim of my parents/guardians. I did nothing to cause my parents/guardians to consider treatment. Staff and the group had no reason to react to me the way they did. I was forced to do everything that I did in Straight. I accept no responsibility for any actions I took while in Straight. I had no choice.

Internal locus of control extreme: I was the bad child. My family was dysfunctional because of me. I deserved to be in Straight because of what I did previous to my admission. Staff and the group treated me the way they did because my behavior dictated it. Anything that happened to me while in Straight was entirely my fault. I accept all responsibility for any actions I took while in Straight. I made all choices.

Now, is either extreme entirely correct? I would have to say that both are incorrect. The only completely factual view would be a listing of the facts. That the listing of the facts does nothing to assist in physical or emotional wellness, one has to determine what the healthiest, or most beneficial, view to have is. As humans we need to have something to fill in the gaps that a mere listing of facts leaves us with.
Let me say that in the case of Straight, I think it is highly detrimental to adopt a view leaning toward an internal locus of control. While that attitude is good to have on a regular basis, I think it is only beneficial in tearing apart the self-value of an individual when used in relation to situations of abuse. In the process of growth toward self-actualization I believe the victim of abuse must play a balancing act upon this locus of control. The end result will be different for each person. It is my assumption that those who have suffered abuse that adopt a heavily internal rationalization may be at risk of suicide and other self-destructive behavior in an attempt to punish themselves for their actions. Those of us in Straight saw this manifest itself though self-destructive behavior such as carving. With that being said, I hope it clarifies why many on this board lean toward external rationalization.
Do not think that I am condoning the external extreme. I am not. I think it is just as crucial to recognize the responsibility we had in our situations. In the end however, one cannot overlook the highly authoritarian structure of the program; enforced by the use of physical violence and emotional torment. If one is leaning toward the internal side of the locus, I have to notice the similarity of the speech between the ideas ground into the individual during the program, and what the individual currently espouses. This could be the reason Formerly was mistaken as a Semblerite. Even though you don?t like the word victim, it is what we were. Though yes, we had some control; we were primarily at the mercy of those who wished to harm us in the name of recovery.
You could have tried to run, or you could have attempted all of the things you suggest you might have done. Perhaps you could have succeeded. There are stories of people that did; however, there are far more stories of people that didn?t. Also remember that hindsight is not accurate. Your perspective of the past is now influenced by all you have learned since then. You were much different the decade or two past. It sounds like what happened to you then would never be able to be inflicted on you again. That is good, and I hope that is the case with all who are here on this board. Perhaps your behavior did justify your parent?s actions of seeking treatment for you, but you are not responsible for the violence and emotional trauma enacted upon you, no matter what staff and the group told you, and regardless of what you currently believe. You are no more responsible for being admitted to Straight and what happened to you in Straight, than is a girl who wears a short skirt is responsible for her own rape. It is ok to have control now, and ok that that you didn?t have control then. You weren?t even of the age you were legally responsible for your actions. I hope that you come to a perspective that gives you peace and security, that you are questioning and testing your rationale shows you are well on your way.
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Offline PerfectStraightling

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« Reply #43 on: March 11, 2005, 01:47:00 PM »
That was a good post, about the Locus of Control. I think a better way to look at it than the two extremes is when DO you have control and when do you not. In straight we really didn't have much, if any. That isn't faulty thinking or whatever, it is the reality of the situation. I think that theory is supposed to apply to people who don't do anything for themselves because they believe it won't matter, which is what we were sort of being taught in straight, unfortunately. Why try to understand the program? It won't ever make any sense. Why make your own decisions about how to learn and how to approach your own life? You'll probably be wrong. I think looking at it this way, you can still have an "internal locus of control" and believe that we had no control while in there, because it's the truth. It's all relative anyways, and I don't this theory (my feeling anyways) was meant to be applied to people in such extreme situations. The problem comes later in life, if we carry on what was taught to us while in there, that we can't think for ourselves, that we can't understand what is good for us. If we keep thinking that way, then we have moved into having an "external locus of control."
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Offline `

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« Reply #44 on: March 11, 2005, 06:20:00 PM »
i had not realized that it was unclear what i meant about culpability. i don't believe i am responsible in any way for my imprisonment in Straight or any of the abuse i suffered in there. i only meant that i felt responsible for my choice to comply most of the time, and for i don't know whatever happened inside me that i became a Straightling. no, i hate myself for that but friends have suggested to me that i am being too hard on myself.

how i could have been so terrified of the other phasers i do not know.

thank god it's friday. i am so emo today. i am so glad there are people to talk to about this. that is something, ain't it.
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