Author Topic: YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED  (Read 7083 times)

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Offline Druggie Friend

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #15 on: March 02, 2005, 11:19:00 AM »
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On 2005-03-02 03:01:00, formerly known as wrote:

"Sorry pathetic suckers. uh huh, right. "brainwashed". sure, whatever. just face it, you suck. pathetic. "but i believed they would court order me so i had no choice".

Some were, some weren't, and the effects were different with different individuals.  Maybe the term "conditioned" would be more appropriate, and less dramatic.

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2. who would believe what two evil blodthirsty vampires told them?

Ignorant, ineffective, or just plain lazy parents.


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4. you could have run. fucking pathetic. give me a break.

I know someone that tried running from the foster home they were in one morning after the door was unlocked.  They said that they couldn't run because they were out of shape from sitting in a blue chair for 12 hours a day, and were easily caught.  A better strategy, IMO, would have been to comply outwardly long enough to leave from a higher phase.

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5. at the VERY LEAST, you could have spared yourself years of mental anguish by misbehaving.

 I would agree with this point.  If more people had misbehaved, Straight would not have been nearly as effective, or as boring.

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i am the pathetic spawn of pathetic christians.

  So am I.

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6. you still believed in the love of your parents. god what fucking farce. i possibly got most of you topped with xtianity bullshit in the home

  Not sure about that.  I had to wade through a ton of that Xtian bullshit at home.  I am pretty sure they hated me as a teen, and the feeling was pretty mutual.

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7. rise up and fight.
OK.


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8. why did you think anyone would or could rescue you.


 This actually happened once or twice.  A female phaser's 'druggie boyfriend' and his friends rescued her from the parking lot one night.  I think a lot of people may have entertained that thought as a means of giving themselves hope, which could have enabled them to more effectively resist.  When hope is gone, resistance is pointless.  Despair, and they win without a fight.

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9. you caved and showed your ass to your captors. anyone who took off their clothes and let themselves be strip searched CAVED IN. at the end of the day you had a choice.

A strip search before entering a jail or institutional facility is not uncommon, and many of us may have believed the "I'll be out of here in 14 days" lie that was commonly told, and saw it as a merely unpleasant condition to endure.  I'm sure that if people knew exactly what they were getting themselves into, their resistance would have been much greater.  I thought I was going to be playing ping-pong and watching TV for two weeks, then sign myself out.

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wouldn't you rather know the truth about yourself so you can fix what the original problem was?

Of course.  But that wasn't what Straight was about.  Many, if not most, of us didn't have any kind of problem before entry, only ineffective parents who were freaked out by normal, healthy adolescent rerbellion.

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I HAVE HIGHER EXPECTATIONS


Of yourself?  Or of everyone?  One way to begin may be to drop the self-hatred for not resisting more.  You were a kid caught in a fucked up situation that was neither your fault nor your choice.  Now you know better, and should be able to better resist indoctrination/assimilation/brainwashing if (and I sincerely hope you don't) you are faced with it again.  Cut yourself some slack.  You are stronger than many---many did not survive with their will intact, and some lost their lives.  The fact that you are here posting and addressing these ideas shows that you have some strength of character and intelligence. I think you might be letting your emotions cloud your judgement, though, and you're being a bit harsh on youreself and others.

--------------------------------------------------
Let's Get High
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
et\'s get high

Offline RTP2003

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #16 on: March 02, 2005, 11:49:00 AM »
Quote
On 2005-03-02 03:01:00, formerly known as wrote:


5. at the VERY LEAST, you could have spared yourself years of mental anguish by misbehaving.


Maybe so.  I know I had some fun misbehaving, but the real kick was LEAVING, and the most effective way to do that was to haul ass from school or work, anywhere away from the building or the foster home.  A head start of a couple of hours could be the difference between being caught and being successful.  To do this most effectively, complying long enough to reach a higher phase was necessary.  It was possible to do this without fucking with anybody, too, with the posssible exception of confronting people in group, and if you weren't a "strong confronter", you wouldn't have been called on much to do that, anyway.
Misbehaving was fun, and helped to vent frustration, but it didn't have shit on LEAVING.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
RTP2003 fought in defense of the Old Republic

Offline ehm

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #17 on: March 02, 2005, 12:35:00 PM »
I HAVE HIGHER EXPECTATIONS



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On 2005-03-02 08:19:00, Druggie Friend wrote:
Of yourself?  Or of everyone?  One way to begin may be to drop the self-hatred for not resisting more.  You were a kid caught in a fucked up situation that was neither your fault nor your choice.  Now you know better, and should be able to better resist indoctrination/assimilation/brainwashing if (and I sincerely hope you don't) you are faced with it again.  Cut yourself some slack.  You are stronger than many---many did not survive with their will intact, and some lost their lives.  The fact that you are here posting and addressing these ideas shows that you have some strength of character and intelligence. I think you might be letting your emotions cloud your judgement, though, and you're being a bit harsh on youreself and others.
--------------------------------------
Let's Get High


Nice post, Druggie Friend.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline webcrawler

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #18 on: March 02, 2005, 05:29:00 PM »
After running away in a strange city twice and being brought back and then walking for the doors and being restrained I just decided to give up. There was no one to help me even if I left. I also felt like I deserved to be where I was as much as I hated it. I admit I did a lot of terrible things (most likely resulting from enviromental influences) to people before I got sent there so it was real easy to buy into thier crap how they were the only one's that could make me a good kid again.

I was actually in a pysch ward and then put in Straight. Before that a run away home. I had no idea Straight would be anything worse than those places. Boy was I ever wrong.

Another thing that got me caught up in wanting to graduate was that I made a lot of friends in Straight and at my new school. I wanted to stay in touch w/ people. I also had 2 host families that I became very close to. They were wonderful to me and treated me as if I was their child. For me to actually be in a stable 2 parent home was actually something I craved and needed.

Hindsight is 20/20 so no point in beating myself up for not continuing to run away.

(edited due to endless typos)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
am looking for people who survived Straight in Plymouth, Michigan. I miss a lot of people there and wonder what happened and would like to stay in touch.

Offline `

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #19 on: March 02, 2005, 05:49:00 PM »
i haven't read anyone's replies to this thread yet, but i see it is a hot topic.

i had a dream when i got out of Straight. I was in the desert, a southwest kind of desert, flat and scrubby. i don't remember much about the dream, except that there were massive scenery backdrops hanging from the sky. there were four of them, they surrounded me but at a distance. they were painted to look like the desert, but i knew that they were a curtain in front of the real world and i was trying to get around them.


if you have ever been in the desert, the thing about it is the space

p.s. now that i have read everyone's replies i am only flattered to have generated animals (or whoever) traffic  :lol: , and i appreciate the responses from other people as well. i know my original post was uhm inciteful, no spelling error, it is really not meant for other people to take personally. Krystene you are the last person i would want to alienate, and thank you for writing your point of view here. this question has been tearing me up for a long time.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline ehm

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #20 on: March 02, 2005, 08:56:00 PM »
I didn't get close enough to anyone to want to stick around, I just knew I was tired of being in the system. I was turning 17, and I wanted out. No more camps, no more psych wards, no more lies, no more cops, no more control.

As far away from my mother as possible.
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Offline `

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #21 on: March 02, 2005, 09:15:00 PM »
i read an old post about you being homeless after getting out. i admire that.
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Offline webcrawler

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #22 on: March 02, 2005, 11:21:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-03-02 14:49:00, formerly known as wrote:

"i haven't read anyone's replies to this thread yet, but i see it is a hot topic.



i had a dream when i got out of Straight. I was in the desert, a southwest kind of desert, flat and scrubby. i don't remember much about the dream, except that there were massive scenery backdrops hanging from the sky. there were four of them, they surrounded me but at a distance. they were painted to look like the desert, but i knew that they were a curtain in front of the real world and i was trying to get around them.





if you have ever been in the desert, the thing about it is the space



p.s. now that i have read everyone's replies i am only flattered to have generated animals (or whoever) traffic  :lol: , and i appreciate the responses from other people as well. i know my original post was uhm inciteful, no spelling error, it is really not meant for other people to take personally. Krystene you are the last person i would want to alienate, and thank you for writing your point of view here. this
question has been tearing me up for a long time."



No worries. No bad feelings about your post from me. Even though the Michigan program was screwed up, I know it was the least abusive Straight and I can totally empathize with people who were in programs in other states. I have heard some very disturbing and horrific things so it is no surprise why you feel the way you do.

We all coped in the way we thought best to survive. Most of us were kids and lacked the resources to leave even if we wanted to.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
am looking for people who survived Straight in Plymouth, Michigan. I miss a lot of people there and wonder what happened and would like to stay in touch.

Offline `

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #23 on: March 02, 2005, 11:37:00 PM »
cool. it is good to see you back here.

there are a lot of ways to explain "what happened" to us in straight. by the way, anonymous, if you seriously think i am in the least a "semblerite" you have not been paying attention. now go do all the homework you missed while you were gone. as for "flake", wrong again. i am loyal to a fault, in the present time, 2005.

anyway, how can anyone know the truth about what happened if they just buy what everyone tells them? ptsd, brainwashing, cult, etc. they are just words. sometimes, using those words, i feel like i felt back when i was still in NA and even in Straight: taking a definition of something and fitting my experiences to it. it's all a cultural thing anyway. hell, we could all be shamans of the age. i'd say we have been on more intense vision quests than most.
i really don't like the word "survivor", or "victim" either. i could be all wrong about human nature. if i understood where i went wrong, because i did go way wrong, because before straight i was cutting classes, i was walking off from principals who were calling me back, etc., i had my own code & wasn't going to sit in a windowless room to make the grade to go to college then grad school then lemmings in shiny metal boxes every morning... so whatever happened. why. i really don't know. i don't understand how in that congressional record thing Sam Ervin is talking about how they ignored us for three days then we changed. defeated, like i was saying before. i see a lot of things. i don't know what is right. i really don't want to temper my words so they don't offend anyone because then how will i know if i am ever telling the truth? and i also don't want to make myself believe something that i really don't know.

today i saw a homeless woman at the music store. she smelled like old clothes or unwashed hair. it scared me, i am afraid of ending up that way. (i really like showers.) in case you can't tell, everything is hitting me like a storm right now.

animals (or whoever anonymous), can't you understand that?

i did misbehave once. i made the mistake of resisting, and this one girl kept twisting my head and i was screaming that she was going to break my neck. when i remembered that a month or two ago, a long-standing obsessive fear of mine went away -- that's how terrified i was. who knows what effect that had at the time. but the reason i misbehaved is because i didn't take my shot at the truck door handle. i just don't think it's wise to give up all culpability. if i understand all this history and know that i would be different now, then i can come back.
[ This Message was edited by: formerly known as on 2005-03-02 20:40 ]
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Offline Anonymous

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #24 on: March 03, 2005, 12:19:00 AM »
Where things went wrong:

1)Father just came back from Vietnam, a biker, using heroin, abusing my mom in front of me.

2)Parents divorcing at 5 after I witnessed my mother laying in a pool of blood and I told her I wanted to leave. Felt guilty for not feeling guilty for years.

3)Dad remarries when I'm 6 to an 18 year old woman that was abusive to me.

4)My mom working full time and attending college. College in mornings then working 3-11. Being sent to live w/ father on weekends, summers, and holidays. Rarely seeing my mom.

5)Mentally and physically abusive babysitter who fed me the bare minumum. Teasing and taunting from her grandsons who were forced to walk me to school.

6)Avoiding the babysitter until it was dark and being at my friend's house where they could sneak me food. Mental abuse my their alcoholic parents. Witnessed DV against them and their mom daily. Both parents drunk morning till night.

7) Dad still on drugs, no longer employed, has 5 more kids. Spending money on drugs. Hardly any food, never seconds. Feeling hungry and miserable at his house. Dad becomes more paranoid, delusional, and abusive as the years go by.

:cool: Teachers and principal label me as trouble maker. Becomes self fullfilling prophecy. Best friend's crazy drunk mother writes constant notes to the school to not let me hang around her daughters because I did "XYZ". Lies. Constant pinching, shoving, and swatting is done to me from 1st to 6th grade from teachers and principal. Only told my mother once and she did nothing. After that I told no one. Who was there to tell anyways?

9)Mother moves a man into out house in 5th grade. All hell breaks loose. Never again feeling comfortable in my own home.

10) Start smoking and skipping school in 5th grade. Start using drugs in 6th.

11)B/f in 6th grade. Start having sex.

12)Start skipping school daily, smoking weed, and drinking almosy daily in 7th grade. Stealing non stop.

13)Physical fights w/ other kids and my mother non stop.

14) Running away, sent away, moving back and forth between parents,relatives, and friends.

15) Sexually assaulted numerous times.

16)Attempting suicide, then freaking out and telling.

17) Forced attendance in an abusive church.

18)Several schools.

19) Being an emotional basket case.

20) Being admitted to Straight almost one month after turning 15.
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Offline Froderik

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« Reply #25 on: March 03, 2005, 12:20:00 AM »
I liked what you had to say about the lexicon.

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i did misbehave once. i made the mistake of resisting, and this one girl kept twisting my head and i was screaming that she was going to break my neck. when i remembered that a month or two ago, a long-standing obsessive fear of mine went away -- that's how terrified i was. who knows what effect that had at the time. but the reason i misbehaved is because i didn't take my shot at the truck door handle. i just don't think it's wise to give up all culpability. if i understand all this history and know that i would be different now, then i can come back.

I know what you mean..
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Offline Froderik

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« Reply #26 on: March 03, 2005, 09:08:00 AM »
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Dad still on drugs, no longer employed, has 5 more kids.

 ::bangin::  ::bangin::  ::bangin:: ::bangin:: ::bangin::
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Offline PerfectStraightling

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« Reply #27 on: March 03, 2005, 12:18:00 PM »
I think another way to look at it is, not what we did while in there since it was a truly unbearable situation, but how we all deal with it now, since we can now think what we want, say what we want, do what we want, and go where we want. I truly believe we all did the best we could under very extreme situations. Another way to look at it is, doing what you have to do to survive doesn't make you weak, it makes you strong.
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Offline ehm

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #28 on: March 03, 2005, 12:58:00 PM »
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anyway, how can anyone know the truth about what happened if they just buy what everyone tells them? ptsd, brainwashing, cult, etc. they are just words. sometimes, using those words, i feel like i felt back when i was still in NA and even in Straight: taking a definition of something and fitting my experiences to it. it's all a cultural thing anyway. hell, we could all be shamans of the age. i'd say we have been on more intense vision quests than most.
i really don't like the word "survivor", or "victim" either. i could be all wrong about human nature. if i understood where i went wrong, because i did go way wrong, because before straight i was cutting classes, i was walking off from principals who were calling me back, etc., i had my own code & wasn't going to sit in a windowless room to make the grade to go to college then grad school then lemmings in shiny metal boxes every morning... so whatever happened. why. i really don't know. i don't understand how in that congressional record thing Sam Ervin is talking about how they ignored us for three days then we changed. defeated, like i was saying before. i see a lot of things. i don't know what is right. i really don't want to temper my words so they don't offend anyone because then how will i know if i am ever telling the truth? and i also don't want to make myself believe something that i really don't know.


Here?s the deal. These things are real, back then you were getting bullshitted. You have to stop thinking everything is ?program-like? in the real world or you will always be confused as to how to perceive and respond to it.  Does that make sense?

We were victims, we are survivors. That doesn't make us weak for admitting that, it makes us strong for getting here. Straight was very fucked up, and it fucked up many people. You didn't have a choice as I child/teen but you know better now. Right?  :grin:
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Offline ehm

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YOU WERE NOT BRAINWASHED
« Reply #29 on: March 03, 2005, 01:01:00 PM »
Haha... I hadn't read Jane's responce yet. Nice. Great minds... :smile:
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