Author Topic: I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos  (Read 5422 times)

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Offline MG

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #15 on: May 22, 2005, 12:57:00 AM »
Does anyone remember my brother.  He ran away from the seed in Ohio.  I had him put in really because the staff asked a lot of questions and I told them he smoked pot.  I think he smoked one joint with me and a friend and I put him up to it.  They got more money out of my mother.  My mother confided in a Realtor friend at work because I had run away and she told her of the seed.  Their family was very involved with the seed and I think it was a matter of having to do it that lead her to do it.  How could you not get help for your kids?  When my brother split she let him stay out.  I was paid up for. To this day he hates the seed and always acted like something terrible was done to him.  He hated having a freak for a sister. SEEDLING....SEED SUCKS........I LOVE YOU.....MOONIE  We were very, very close and never really have been again like we were.
If anyone wants to mail me you can do that at
mgg1975@aol.com I am happy to have found this and grateful for it.  The afformation this has brought me these past few days is uncharted.  I almost never speak of it but over the years have told a few that my mother commited me to a place that brainwashed me when I was fourteen.  I talk about my gymnastics scholarship I got down there when I talk of living in florida and don't say out of shame I followed them there like a ZOMBIE.  It's great to know I'm not alone.  I wanted sometimes to try to look people up but didn't know where there heads would be at and I am after all an outcast.
Thank you for having this site....whoever did it!
Oh, and Love,
Mg
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline GregFL

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #16 on: May 22, 2005, 01:06:00 AM »
:nworthy:
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Offline Antigen

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #17 on: May 22, 2005, 01:46:00 AM »
Wow! Ya' know, I'm more convinced than ever now that you later day Seedlings might find a lot of common ground w/ the Whitmore ppl. And it looks like some of the more recent victims are about to hold the king and queen of that little fiefdom to account legally. Might be fun to watch.  :lol:

so long as the universe had a beginning, we could suppose it had a creator. But if the universe is completely self-contained, having no boundary or edge, it would neither be created nor destroyed it would simply be. What place, then, for a creator?
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« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
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Offline MG

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #18 on: May 22, 2005, 03:53:00 AM »
Please translate that for me...I am too new here.  Where, or what is Whittmore and ????????
E-mail if I'm too not there to get code please?  Somewhere I wrote also about Art and the Playboy Club.  Tell me he didn't alway's say that he worked at the Playboy Club in New York and that he had his boat docked there and would come in to work and that that is where he met Shelly.  That is the Ohio story I remember.
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Offline Anonymous

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #19 on: May 22, 2005, 07:24:00 AM »
It was the Playboy Club in Miami & thats where his boat was docked.  My father was a fireman for years right next to that Playboy club.
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Offline cleveland

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #20 on: May 22, 2005, 02:30:00 PM »
Wow, MG, I remember this vaguely. As always, everything happened in secret. I remember the Safecard group, because they all seemed so tight. Leeann and Terry - especially  prominent people in my mind. And of course, Patty H., who told me not to go to art school because 'art is for girls.'

 It seemed that maybe you didn't get called on as much in the group, is this true?

Anyway, when you 'left,' I just remember - what happened to her? When a guy disappeared, we might never speak about him again. But the girls - I knew nothing about what was happening there. Remember the joke about the 'chicks' doing nothing but cooking, cleaning and sewing?' Meanwhile the guys were sneaking peaks at porn when the newcomers weren't around!

Anyway, that is so sad. Who knew what they thought you had done? And why? Did someone plant a rumor, or was it jealousy or what? All this in the name of love. I feel for you on this. At least I left on my own, which was hard enough at the time.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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Offline Antigen

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #21 on: May 22, 2005, 03:22:00 PM »
Sorry for being cryptic, MG. I'm talking about a group (sometimes it's a school, other times it's a treatment center... depending on legal advice of the day, it seems). It's called Whitmore Academy and is operated by Cheryl and Mark Sudweeks.

Here's the forum:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewforum.php?forum=35&3860

And here's the initial topic on them:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rum=35&673

When I read your story, it just reminded me of someone who very occasionally posts as mom2three
Here are those posts: http://fornits.com/wwf/search.php?term= ... mit=Search

Now that I look over that whole mess, it probably is too cryptic and confusing for anyone to just jump in and get it. But you might want to drop a line to mom2three.

Heroism on command, senseless violence, and all the loathsome nonsense that goes by the name of patriotism--how passionately I hate them!
--Albert Einstein

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
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Offline MG

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #22 on: May 22, 2005, 06:48:00 PM »
Hi,
I will check out all those links, and thank you.  I don't even know who those people are.  I was unaware even of Straight, which apparantely started before I left the seed in 81'.  The answer Wally's question about me being called on.  Sometimes I got called on a lot and other times it felt like I was in the doghouse........which would make you go look in the mirror a lot, in your own eyes, and chew yourself out, and wonder what the fuck was wrong with you?????  Anyone else?  The whole "your eyes are the mirror to your soul".  I remember getting one inch from the mirror and looking in there like I would see something amazing floating by that would give me the answer to it.  all.......... :rofl: Other times working so hard full time and then swimming like a fish and playing tennis, running with everyone, then cleaning for them on the weekend too.  I was exausted and could barely keep my eyes open sitting there not even having had dinner yet.
Mary
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline MG

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #23 on: May 22, 2005, 06:52:00 PM »
The sewing joke.....that is really not funny!  I resemble that comment.  We were really poor growing up and I sewed most all my own clothing and I even took the blue ribbon in a fair against old ladies for a reversable suit I made.  I made Art a totally hand embroidered and quilted pillow, which is a lot lot lot of work!  Resented that pillow all these years...LOL  Now I say if you tell anyone I can sew I will have to kill you.  Those jokes if they were made were sure not made to our faces!  As dedicated as I was I don't think anyone would have gotten a pillow out of me had I heard it!
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Offline cleveland

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #24 on: May 23, 2005, 09:32:00 AM »
That whole sewing joke makes me think of the little bit of competition betweed the 'guys' and the 'chicks.' I remember when I came in the Seed I thought it was really weird that the guys and girls sat on separate sides of the room. It seemed even weirder when I was an oldcomer and my only contact with the girls was playing football on the beach. We might say, 'good catch Mary!' or whatever but that was it. Sat on separate towels in separate sections.

I remember pretty intense raps when I was a newcomer about 'games' - basically, sex. It was pretty confrontational. It brought out a lot of shame for me, at 19 I had a very romantic view on relationships, but actually had been in a few that felt hurtful. I remember one staff member, Nona, who seemed to imply that she had been a hooker - 'there was nothing - NOTHING I wouldn't do to get high' I remember her saying and I'm thinking, whoa. That seemed pretty crazy, and she's crying and we're all crying and I'm basically feeling pretty bad about being male.

But later, it seemed that the guys and girls competed for Art's attention. Guys did 'guy' stuff, helped Art with his boat, dug ditches for the ball field, like that. Girls sewed stuff, painted, did crafts. The guys kind of made fun of that, but also, we were trying to feel better about being separate from the girls.

I remember John P. and Cindy dating. I remember how strange that was. They were the first I ever remember, and there were no Public Displays of Affection or anything like that. I worked with Randy who was married to Terry, but they were a long-established couple and Randy was an 'honorary' Seed kid, which meant the rules were different.

I remember being jealous of the Safecard crew, where guys and girls worked together. This was rare. It seemed like there were some friendships that came out of this. But for me, I lived and worked with guys exclusively.

I guess the end result of this was, on the plus side, we (guys) felt like we were good guys, treating women as equals, not objects. On the minus side, we had no relationships with women as friends, partners or in love.
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Offline Anonymous

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #25 on: October 16, 2005, 04:24:00 PM »
I am not sure girls were so different. I was a virgin when I went in and at some point during the program I found the libiotic energy to deflower myself.

Did you feel mastrabating was bad?  Did the  Seed contribute to that?  Was it something you confessed in guys rap.  Guys rap, it was so mysterious
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Offline cleveland

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #26 on: October 16, 2005, 06:47:00 PM »
We were told to get our heads out of the gutter, so the whole thing was confusing to me.
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Offline Anonymous

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #27 on: October 16, 2005, 08:00:00 PM »
Yeah, that's sort of what we, chicks were told too.  I just wondered if there was more of a boys will be boys sort of acceptance for guys or if maybe you were obliged to really talk about controling your sexual feelings(because they exspected boys libidos to be more controlled.)

In some other post, I read something about the ways that cults gain power by creating and enviroment in which everyone feels compelled to confesses compulsively but hides some deeper secrets so the members always feel a tinge of shame. Trading deeper secrets for lesser ones.

Sexuality seems to be one of those things.  As much as we may tryed to "get out minds out of the gutter," we had crushes, fantasies, and even if very occassionally, mastrubated but we never talked about any of that.

About a year after I graduated I began a relationship with another graduate.  When we had been together a good while( long enough to trust me I guess) he told me that when he was an old comer he used to occassional take off between school and heading to the seed just long enough to sleep with his old girlfriend.  He called those times vacations.  The first time he did it he said he was sweating bullets but by the time  he got out that night without anyone sensing what he had done he said he knew they were full of shit.

I never figured that out. I used to wonder for brief moments before I quickly got my "mind out of the gutter," how relationships between straight people started- how did anyone communicate interest without flirting.  Then I'd quickly tell myself I was still too fucked up to understand how healthy relationships began.  I also remember being sort of confused when Art would tell the story of how he met Shelly.  There seemed to have been a lot of game playing involved. How could that be, when I was told by staff and other seedlings that Art and Shelly were a template for the perfect relationship?
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Offline cleveland

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #28 on: October 17, 2005, 11:34:00 AM »
That post captures my experience too. As a newcomer, we were told to tell at least one person everything. Since I was terrified of leaving out even one step, and losing out on the 'gift of awareness' that I was promised, I put my hand up in group to confess my deepest sexual secret to a staff member in the back room. I was ashamed. I remember, he sort of looked at me coldly and told me to get my head out of the gutter. I did not feel any sort of relief. Later, as an oldcomer, one of the guy staff would joke and tell us that sometimes you just had to take care of business. So, I did, but not very often because of the mixed messages. There was a time, after I had been around for about five years, that the guys in our apartment started watching porn. We had a former staff member in our house, so it seemed OK - until staff told us to knock it off. Also, I had developed passionate feelings for someone in the group, and years into being an oldcomer, finally worked up the courage to talk to staff about asking her out. I was discouraged from that pretty strongly. I think that was one of the final straws for me leaving, because I felt emasculated.

So, I was never clear on what was right or wrong sexually and in relationships. I was led to believe that this was reserved for those who were 'really straight,' and after seven years I knew that I didn't make the cut.
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Offline ChrisL

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I was in the Cleveland Seed and went to Florida when it clos
« Reply #29 on: October 18, 2005, 10:22:00 PM »
I remember I used to have "contests" with myself when I was first in the program to see how long I could go, know what I mean... Seinfeld "master of your domain". After I got back home I spanked it nightly and twice on Sunday. At first I actually used to feel guilty about it, but that quickly passed... I just never really thought that they seriously expected not to masterbate, I mean come on a 16 y/o red-blooded american boy? After I had had been an oldtimer for a while I dated another oldtimer and it must have been close to a year before we went "all the way" Geeze-louise if I new then what I know now... what a wasteful conservation of youthful exerburance!!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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