Desisto School

[Anonymous]

that place was so sick...i always wonder why i dont hear more about it. I was there about 5-6 months? Unfortunetly, the place did permanent damge to my mind. I was VERY young and soon after leaving I develouped a chronic illness ( i know ..i hit the life lottery on oppisite day) so perhaps i didnt get to "rehibilitate" my mind simply by living an ordinary life. I feel like I have "autism" now. Im not connected like i used to be...

how did you force feed an anorexic girl? (thats so illegal)Bravo to her for fighting back though.
how did you run away?
 I never got "trusted" so was always "leashed" they insisted on watching me when i urinated and deficated as well. I honestly wonder if they got off on it as some girls enforced this rule more enthusiastically then others- or mabye they were just more sadistic. Its sad in the end no matter what I dont blame them- they were just turned into what desisto wanted to turn them into as. They really had no reason not to "trust" me (they detroyed that word for me) They just made me their scapegoat as I was emotionally weaker than the rest.
Did you know a girl named Caroline Atlantis...I kinda knew her family from church. Do you know if she commited suicide? I know she went there and i heard that

[RobertBruce]

Bump.

[Anonymous]

Tuesday, January 09, 2007
Cornelia Read on Being Hip, Reading Nabokov, and Eating Sassy Sauce in Syracuse



As you know, I read and loved Field of Darkness, and I saw on your Naked Authors blog that your next book is called The Crazy School. What

[sick of child torture girl]

huh?

[Anonymous]

is cornelia suposed to be caroline?

[Bsolomon85]

No one has written in a long time, and Im not much of a blogger/message board poster myself, but this school did so much damage to me personally that I will never forget it. Keep the thread alive keep posting or contact me.

[Anonymous]

RickRoss.com also has a thread going in his forum.  Search under DeSisto and also add your comments to Troubled Teen thread.

[Anonymous]

Will Do!  Thanks for the heads up!  It's unbelievable how these places scar people for life.  They should all be shut down.

[Anonymous]

I used to work at Desisto as a dorm parent.  All of the stories, all of the allegations, everything that seems too horrible to believe....it's all true.  I was there.  I witnessed a grown man restrain an 18 year old girl the entire day by laying on top of her, from early morning to THE NEXT MORNING!  She had been sitting in the corner staring at the wall for months.  Anyone would go crazy in those cirucmstances.  Then there was all the dorm parent support group crap and required group therapy sessions.  PLEASE!!!  If I had any problems, I wouldn't be working there, I'd be a client.  If you thought outside the box, or didn't think like they did, you were constantly threatened of job termination, and mentally abused.  I used to work in a lovely little place called "the farm".  It was for the kids that were acting out the most.  This hell hole was located in the basement.  It was the summer time and all of the windows were sealed.  Granted they had air conditioning, but it was only in the main room, not in any of the bedrooms.  There was mold and bugs and spiders.  For the girls who refused to bathe, it made it unbearable.  The children were essentially "closed off" from the rest of society, only doing chores and working around the campus.  There was no leasure time for activity.  The only time they had to sit around was spent in group therapy sessions.  
The incident that sent me packing occured the night I literally walked out without notice.  A girl had seperated herself from the group.  Her punishment for doing that was to strip to her underwear, and lay on a mattress in the center of the room with no sheet, pillows, or blankets.  The door had to remain open at all times, and a staff worker, woman OR MAN, had to sit and watch this child all night.  
I am SO GLAD the school closed.  I get physically ill just thinking about the living conditions, let alone how children AND staff were treated.

[Anonymous]

I used to work at Desisto as a dorm parent.  All of the stories, all of the allegations, everything that seems too horrible to believe....it's all true.  I was there.  I witnessed a grown man restrain an 18 year old girl the entire day by laying on top of her, from early morning to THE NEXT MORNING!  She had been sitting in the corner staring at the wall for months.  Anyone would go crazy in those cirucmstances.  Then there was all the dorm parent support group crap and required group therapy sessions.  PLEASE!!!  If I had any problems, I wouldn't be working there, I'd be a client.  If you thought outside the box, or didn't think like they did, you were constantly threatened of job termination, and mentally abused.  I used to work in a lovely little place called "the farm".  It was for the kids that were acting out the most.  This hell hole was located in the basement.  It was the summer time and all of the windows were sealed.  Granted they had air conditioning, but it was only in the main room, not in any of the bedrooms.  There was mold and bugs and spiders.  For the girls who refused to bathe, it made it unbearable.  The children were essentially "closed off" from the rest of society, only doing chores and working around the campus.  There was no leasure time for activity.  The only time they had to sit around was spent in group therapy sessions.  
The incident that sent me packing occured the night I literally walked out without notice.  A girl had seperated herself from the group.  Her punishment for doing that was to strip to her underwear, and lay on a mattress in the center of the room with no sheet, pillows, or blankets.  The door had to remain open at all times, and a staff worker, woman OR MAN, had to sit and watch this child all night.  
I am SO GLAD the school closed.  I get physically ill just thinking about the living conditions, let alone how children AND staff were treated.

[Anonymous]

I used to work at Desisto as a dorm parent.  All of the stories, all of the allegations, everything that seems too horrible to believe....it's all true.  I was there.  I witnessed a grown man restrain an 18 year old girl the entire day by laying on top of her, from early morning to THE NEXT MORNING!  She had been sitting in the corner staring at the wall for months.  Anyone would go crazy in those cirucmstances.  Then there was all the dorm parent support group crap and required group therapy sessions.  PLEASE!!!  If I had any problems, I wouldn't be working there, I'd be a client.  If you thought outside the box, or didn't think like they did, you were constantly threatened of job termination, and mentally abused.  I used to work in a lovely little place called "the farm".  It was for the kids that were acting out the most.  This hell hole was located in the basement.  It was the summer time and all of the windows were sealed.  Granted they had air conditioning, but it was only in the main room, not in any of the bedrooms.  There was mold and bugs and spiders.  For the girls who refused to bathe, it made it unbearable.  The children were essentially "closed off" from the rest of society, only doing chores and working around the campus.  There was no leasure time for activity.  The only time they had to sit around was spent in group therapy sessions.  
The incident that sent me packing occured the night I literally walked out without notice.  A girl had seperated herself from the group.  Her punishment for doing that was to strip to her underwear, and lay on a mattress in the center of the room with no sheet, pillows, or blankets.  The door had to remain open at all times, and a staff worker, woman OR MAN, had to sit and watch this child all night.  
I am SO GLAD the school closed.  I get physically ill just thinking about the living conditions, let alone how children AND staff were treated.

[Anonymous]

Hi anonymous staff, curious who you are? I attened Desisto and experienced sheeting on the farm. Yes, the majority of my stay at Desisto I cleaned which did not allow for much free time. Sometimes we were allowed to go to school, but that was a joke. I doubt that half of the teachers were certified to teach the subject they were teaching. Most of our time was spent cleaning. We spent 1 hour in the DR 3 times a day if the dorm was not farmed. We cleaned up after every meal. That was called being a waiter unpaid work. We spent a great deal of time in dorm meetings discussing why people were not following the rules, yelling at students who broke a rule and figuring out a collective punishment for those people. This was called therapy. Yelling and being mean to students, when they finally cried about it, they were taken care of by other students and friended. Then they paid $2. per day for being friended. It took the student getting everyone's vote to get unfriended. If more than half of the dorm was friended or buddied the dorm because grouped, hand held, or eventually farmed.
Being farmed meant that you did not attend school and that you were in dorm meetings most of the day, later you might do a few hours of work crews manual labor outside. Eating meals in the lobby of the dorm.
There was a special place on campus called the FARM. Kids were sent to the farm if they were causing too much trouble on campus. I was personally sent to the farm 3 times for long stays. I remember being on the farm and I was growing tired of work crews. My girlfriend L and I decided to protest the work and baracaded ourselves in the girls bedroom. This was easy because the windows had been locked already preventing access inside or out. This I am sure was a fire hazard. We pushed the closet in front of the doorm and the bed infront of that. There was not way the door could be opened. The staff member was furious and he eventually broke in through a window only to drag us out of there and push us around. We were yelled at etc. The staff at Desisto around this time were about to go on retreat and this staff was about to have a weekend off or a week off. He yelled at us and then turned us over to the level 3 students for punishment. The students some of which did not like me decided that I was to be sheeted. This meant that my clothes were removed and I was in my underwear. I was given a sheet to wear like a toga. I was dragged into the girls room for privacy while the 5 or 6 girls held me down and removed my clothes. This was a terrible experience. That being said it only got worse. I was told to stand in the corner of the lobby, silenced, restricted of food and water until someone deciced I deserved it. I rebelled and refused to stand and was held up in the corner. This resulted in a physical tassle and eventually I was allowed to lay on the floor. I was sobbing on the floor for many days. Eventually I was given a chair to sit in and was yelled at for not sitting properly. The level 4 in charge said he would bash my fucking head through the wall if I did not sit the right way. My feet had to be on the floor. My back hurt and my pride from embarrassment. I physically was exhausted. I think I was allowed to eat a peanut butter and jelly sand witch and water. I was taunted by other farmers and made fun of. My therapist, Dorthoy later decided to visit me on the farm and I was made fun of by her. She called me a mule and was no help what so ever. She was a new ineffective therapist that did not last long at Desisto.
I made a superficial cut on my arm out of anger about having been sheeted and a level 4 came down held me down and cut all of my finger nails so short my fingers hurt. That hurt more than anything as I was used to having long fingernails. I was wake shifted at night in my sheet by staff members and eventually one of the supervisors decided to unsheet me. I believe I was sheeted for 5 or 6 days possibly longer. That week was a blur. After that I was eventually sent to a psychiatric facility and I believe after this traumatic incident I quit talking for a long period of time. I was in schock from what happened and did not believe anyone cared about me. I asked to call my parents and I was denied access to a phone because I was on the farm. I asked if I could speak to the police because I felt that my rights had been violated. No luck with that either.
There were other things that happened I believe just as harmful to a teenager. We had sitting meetings if someone took something or moved something with out admitting it. We would not be allowed to attend school and were made it sit in the dining room in a large circle. No one was allowed to talk and you had to sit all day long until bedtime. 7am-9pm sometimes 10pm. Sitting in chairs like this is terrible for most bodies but especially teenagers. Most teens and children have a tremendous amount of energy so it is really hard to sit all day, not talk, and wait patiently until Michael and the staff agree that the sitting can stop. Eventually enough people would run away and we would stop. Usually this time was a great time to do your turn ins and admit the things you have done wrong. Breaking group friend, not doing homework, normal sexual activity such as holding hands and kissing were forbidden. Knowing that someone would run away and helping them... Staff occasionally would do their turn ins and admit to using drugs or alcohol etc. That was really amusing to hear your 20 year old dorm parent admit to the stuff that most of the kids had been sent there for. THese were the people taking care of us. Desisto normally hired young staff barely out of college people Michael could manipulate. Staff frequently were fired which would mean that they would have to work on their issues and recieve half the pay or no pay. Now that in my opinon goes to show how much control michael had. I bet the staff followed along for fear of losing their jobs. I also think that most staff got off on the power that they had and enjoyed the drauma of it all. Why would you work at a place like that? Did you really think you were helping children? I believe that staff were not trained properly because if you had been trained you would know there are ethics and laws protecting children and children's rights. Never should other children hold down other children yet this was encouraged at times. Often the person in the limit structure would be purposely provoked so they would feel their intense feelings of anger and helplessness which would further cause them to freak out even more. Limit structures lasted hours and we got in trouble if we did not hold down the kids that were going to run away or hurt someone etc.
I will never forget a specific incident that happend after I had been at Desisto about 2 weeks. I was in the new girls dorm. My dorm parent was an 18 year old former student of Desisto. She herself had been there for years. One of the students was refusing to clean during mandatory saturday cleanup. This special cleaning day happened on Saturdays and many times lasted until Sunday where you deep cleaned the already clean down. Also you recieved new bed sheets at this time. The girl was put in an empty room where she was told to stay. She laid down on the bed and that caused the dorm parent and other girls to feel angry. She was told to sit up in the bed. This quickly escalated into a power struggle where she and the dorm parent got into a physical fight. The dorm parents hair was pulled and the student was harmed and then the dorm parent punched the door of her apartment and stayed in her apartment to cool down. Then the girls took over and someone decided to throw the aggressive student into a limit structure yet the dorm parent was equally aggressive. Staff were not put in limit structures even when they looked like they needed one. This girl had a history of abuse and the girls held her down only to taunt her about her history of abuse. The girls said specific cruel things to the girl to purposely remind her of her rapes. She freaked out even more and was held down longer. This was a terrible day for all of us but especially this young girl. That incident still haunts me. Now this was considered therapy at the school. I am serious. That was considered therapy that I guess was supposed to improve peoples emotional state and behavior. Therapy was actually harmful most of the time. It was mean, cruel, and in some cases psychological torchure.
I remember once during the later part of my stay at Desisto I was in regular Girls dorm and I was a level 2 or 3. I was not friended or buddied which meant that I was a trusted student and that I was to carry more responsibility. Many of the other dorms on campus were not doing well. The NG dorm was farmed and the NB dorm was farmed. I think that Reg. Boys was also farmed. We got a new boy admitted to the school and staff and kids feared that he was a runaway risk. The new boys dorm could not be trusted to watch and shift this boy so the other students around campus had to do it even during the night time. This lasted many days and nights more than 3. I was told that I had to wake up in the middle of the night to do one or two hours of waking shifting this new boy. I protested because sleep has always been important for my self care. Also I was afraid to enter a boys dorm and did not want to get harassed or raped. I was told that if I did not do it, I would be expelled off from campus which meant I would lose many priveleges etc. I agreed to wake shift this new boy though I was scared to death. I was woken up by another student around midnight or one to walk across campus in the middle of the nigght and relieve the other student. I had to do this 2 or 3 nights in a row or else be expelled. The things that I had to do there were not safe. I was possibly 17 or 18 years old. My parents told me I had to graduate which meant not getting expelled off. I knew this so I agreed to waking shifting in the middle of the night.
Eventually we had a sitting meeting in our dorm and we were farmed as well. That was a terrible year for me. And the story continues to get worse.
I was told by my parents that I had to graduate from Desisto. I was about to turn 18. Many kids left at 18 because they can not keep you as easily. Eventually Michael, the owner got fed up with his level 4 graduating dorm and he walked all the level 4's and threw them out of the school. This was the graduating class. They had worked hard to be where they were. Michael just threw them out and the whole school was sitting at that time and we elected a new student body called Stewards. I was elected Head Steward with my friend, S. We were to run the new stewardship but had to live in Reg. kids dorms which meant that we did not get the perks that the level 4's had. That was too bad. It was considered a luxury to be in the level 4 dorm away from campus and closer to Michael.
Michael kept telling me to come by his house more and more at night as he wanted me to report on the dorms I was in charge of. I often told him I was busy with chores or asked if I could come by during the day time. I tried to take another student with me because going to his house was creepy. On several occasions he was not fully dressed. Once he told me to come by early in the morning. I knocked on his front door. He yelled come in. I entered and stood in the kitchen and he came out of his bed room to greet me in his blue calvin klein underwear and was buttoning his shirt. I looked away and told him he should not have had me come in if he was not dressed. Once a friend of mine, L. begged me to go with her to his house at night because she needed his permission to go home on vacation. We knocked on his door and he said come in. He was in his bed in his bedroom not dressed. He was angry at this student for bringing me along and angry at her telling her he would not give her a vacation. He wanted us to sit on the bed with him but I refused and we left.
Once Michael asked me to escort him and another new boy to the mall for clothes shopping. Michael insisted on buying me some clothes despite my insistance that I did not want or need them. He bought me gifts which set me apart from all my friends that were not allowed off campus and did not recieve gifts. Michael frequently did that. He would give some students special priveleges or gifts which caused jealously among the students. I always thought that he was sexually abusing the boys though I never could express that. I have heard other students say that they too witnessed Michael's inappropriate advances and that he was not always dressed. This was the head of the school the master therapist.
And one time I went to Michael's house when I was head steward and he was in his bath robe. He wanted me to sit with him on the couch. He wanted to get to know me and bond with me. I told him that I did not want to sit down and asked why I was there. This was late at night around 9 or 10 when the rest of the school was going to bed. This type of inappropriate behavior led me to believe that I may be abused by the owner of the school and I was in a bind because I was told by my parents that I had to graduate. Graduating meant having a relationship with this troubled man. Eventually I became suicidal and was sent to a psych hospital. Also at that time I was in charge of the farm, a place I knew well. There was a young boy freaking out on the farm. I could not figure out why this boy was so angry, I suspected abuse though I could not prove anything. Eventually the staff member on the farm was caught abusing boys and he was arrested and thrown in jail. This came out when I was in the hospital. Michael visited me when I was at the hospital and I believe to intimidate me and make sure I did not say anything to get him or others in trouble.
I even told the staff of the hospital and my parents about the abuse but I was later sent back to the school for anotehr 2 months before being withdrawn. I can not believe that my parents and the hospital staff did nothing about the abuse. I believe that noone cared what happened to me or my friends. That is the truth. No one cared.
When teens have trouble people believe they deserve the treatment they get when in fact the teens in trouble need help. Usually it is the whole family that needs help but the teen is singled out and sent away thrown out like a bag of trash.
There are more memories and bad times but this is a glimpse of what transpired during the years of 1988 - 1992 and beyond.
I was pretty sure that staff were having sexual relations with friends but could not prove it. I felt it was not my business.
I know this is a long post but it feels good to speak my truth and let others know what happened at The Crazy School, the Desisto School.
I celebrate the day Michael dies and I celebrate it like a national holiday. I am glad that the school closed down.
Still healing. Love to all of you who were there or were in a place that was just as terrible.
If I were a staff member at the school, I would feel really bad that I worked in a place that abused kids every day. I think it is a crime that child services was not called. Almost every day I was there, the child services could have been called about something. Staff should have been intelligent enough to know right from wrong. It just goes to show that staff were not educated or trained to work in a place for troubled teens.
I feel that the students are owed an aopolgy for all the wrongs and harms done to them. I have not recieved an apology for anything that happened.
At this point, all I want is validation that those experiences were wrong and that someone is sorry about it. There are hundreds of kids that are still suffering today because of what they went though at that place.
I know I am not the only one that feels this way.
If anyone doubts the stories I tell, I can find other students to verify that I am telling the truth.
Feeling better from telling part of my story to a group that I know understands. KM

[nimdA]

I used to work at Desisto as a dorm parent.  All of the stories, all of the allegations, everything that seems too horrible to believe....it's all true.  I was there.  I witnessed a grown man restrain an 18 year old girl the entire day by laying on top of her, from early morning to THE NEXT MORNING!  She had been sitting in the corner staring at the wall for months.  Anyone would go crazy in those cirucmstances.  Then there was all the dorm parent support group crap and required group therapy sessions.  PLEASE!!!  If I had any problems, I wouldn't be working there, I'd be a client.  If you thought outside the box, or didn't think like they did, you were constantly threatened of job termination, and mentally abused.  I used to work in a lovely little place called "the farm".  It was for the kids that were acting out the most.  This hell hole was located in the basement.  It was the summer time and all of the windows were sealed.  Granted they had air conditioning, but it was only in the main room, not in any of the bedrooms.  There was mold and bugs and spiders.  For the girls who refused to bathe, it made it unbearable.  The children were essentially "closed off" from the rest of society, only doing chores and working around the campus.  There was no leasure time for activity.  The only time they had to sit around was spent in group therapy sessions.  
The incident that sent me packing occured the night I literally walked out without notice.  A girl had seperated herself from the group.  Her punishment for doing that was to strip to her underwear, and lay on a mattress in the center of the room with no sheet, pillows, or blankets.  The door had to remain open at all times, and a staff worker, woman OR MAN, had to sit and watch this child all night.  
I am SO GLAD the school closed.  I get physically ill just thinking about the living conditions, let alone how children AND staff were treated.

Please feel free to contact me at dan.the.chainsawman@gmail.com
 I'm former staff from three springs and I'd like to talk with you. It is important.

Sorry I'm a tard.. wrong email addy.

[nimdA]

*le bump.*

[Anonymous]

i've never really talked too much about what happened at Desisto during my stay for nine months in 95 or 96. one night i decided to google it in and found out all this shit. it's all come back to me now. i went there the day before my 13th birthday, to a 'farmed' alternate girls dorm. our first night was spent in the lobby with all the mattresses on the floor and the furnature boarding up the windows and our male dorm parent sleeping by the door. the new girls were apperently 'rioting' upstairs from us and i could hear what a 'limit structure' sounded like. upon my arrival i had already been in a lock-down facility, and a foster home. I had been arrested countless times, was rejected by my mother and her lousy good for nothing boyfriends and had been in a foster home. by the sweet age of 13 i had seen it all... little did I know i was about to embark on a brainwashing experience from hell, that would turn me into an entirely different person. I kind of laid low the first few weeks and absorbed all the cult crap around me... where do I begin okay, the meetings I found it odd that people were crying on a daily basis not just crying, but recalling the horrid and unjust things that had happened to them in vivid detail. rapes, initiations, abuse you named it everything had to be 'relived' in great detail. people were stripped from their integrity and basic human rights, they were broken down and reduced to shit, all with two feet on the floor. The meds cabinet was never locked, bacause we were all to be trusted with that sort of thing, Give me a fucking break ... a dorm full of abused scarred teens, many of which had major problems with drugs were entrusted with the meds cabinet - load of shit! the arms length and hand holding whilst taking a shit, the walking with your head down and not being allowed to make eye contact with anyone... BEING REDUCED TO SHIT! Like a concentration camp, we woke up at four in the morning to break the ice in the driveway to our dorm with sledge hammers, heads down, in sub-zero degree weather. another time we were farmed. we were chopping wood by north (we couldnt have razors to shave but we could hold axes) and one of my dormates got pissed and swung at another with an ax, it sliced her coat. Needless to say we put her in a limit structure when and she struggled free and put her head through a window - anything wrong with this picture? what happened after that, this girl was cornered for i dont know how long untill someone deemed it was okay she got out. I remember seeing people in the corner for days BEING REDUCED TO SHIT! crying and rocking back and fourth no clothes the whole nine yards. IT wasn't fair they couldnt eat couldnt drink much went to the bathroom right then and there I saw people that I loved hurt and lonley and scarred- Fucked up. I remember sit- ins and all that crap. Heres the icing on the cake for me ... I think about it all the time. Before I got sent to Desisto I had run away on mothers day, my father spent that day looking all over for me and needless to say he had to cancel the plans he had with my grandparents. well later that year at Desisto, My Grandfather died and my grandmother too, I wasn't allowed to go to their funeral because we were farmed. It Was by the grace of god, allowed one 10 minute conversation with my father. the only time i heard him cry was then, I had fucked up his last mothers day with his mother and then he got fucked by Desisto's radical policies-make me fucking puke. I'll never be able to give that to him, I never got to make things right with my grandparents. This haunts me all the time- Fuck you DeSisto! i hate the way I was reduced to shit! i hate the way i had to recall and relive all the horrible things that had happened to me and all the horrible things that i did. Shit happens thats life, people fuck up and make mistakes and feel the pain caused by them and move on having learned from them. re kindling shit over and over doesnt do anybody any good. i still have problems with that too not directly, but indirectly. I feel as though i have to make up for lost time- CONSTSANTLY. does anyone else still carry the DeSisto shit with them everyday? I can never do anything well, enough. I still feel as though i have to be humble to the point of shit because i fucked up so badly as a kid. i work myself to the point where i make myself sick- just as we did when we were farmed. I hate taking medications I do it only when i really feel i need to, sometimes I'll buy them but wont take them- I remember people being so drugged up that they couldnt stay awake, but were forced to stand in the corner because they were physically unable to participate in the meetings. I remember having dangerous levels of lithium in my blood right after withdrawl. only now that im 25 i'm starting to realise that vacations arent a bad thing and that i deserve them once in a while. My first night after being withdrawn i was so scared of being alone, and to this day i have problems sleeping and dislike being by myself for long periods of time. It's gotten better over the years but at first it was so foreign to me to be by myself. my first night away i was in a hotel enroute to another boarding school (three total) and was afraid to turn the tv on, FUCKING BULLSHIT! THANKS DeSisto! And all the raw feelings, the experiences and the love I had for the people whom I shared DeSisto with, I dont know what ever happened to any of them. Another thing that i carry around with me. i think of the worst if i love someone i prepare myself that we may just part ways one day and that will be that- horrible feeling to have- needless to say i dont love too many people. just recently i have accepted the fact that love isnt so bad life is too short not to try it anyway. I think of all this stuff and read everything that had been posted and i feel comforted knowing that others know what i know, im not alone. it feels good to get it out after 11 years or so. i miss my friends. i am sorry so many people still hurt it's not fair, Michael was such a sick man who was worshipped like a god, I loved my dorms (new girls alternate girls) but never understood why everyone flocked around him. People said he would like me but he creeped me out and i never persued a relationship with him for that reason- he was a creep at least. I read that he died and i really believe he the is only person who has been in my life who is in hell, not rapists, not abusers, not dealers or any of those people i knew a long time ago, i tihnk they could be forgiven. but i tihnk about him and what he did and what he has done to so many people and wonder if he was ever forgiven. It's my personal belief that he is rotting in hell as i type, and if he was forgiven for all he did then god must really be pure love. I am sorry people are still hurting, I miss my friends. The experience changed me and i told you why, but i think in its own way, without it i wouldnt be as strong as i am today, it tested me to the max, and i can handle more then most...we can handle more then most ! Waiting for reply for MSN  i would love to see some old friends again AIM zanzabar2121 nothing but love for all my friends.