Independent Study Shows Success.

[Anne Bonney]

Yes Utah is a huge red flag. How many programs have been shut down that were based in Utah? All of the WWASPS (which even you have admitted to be abusive) programs and sister companies are based out of Utah. Utah is the only state which has parent rights and not child rights. That means a Utah based program can hold a child against his will.

lol but that doesnt mean everyone doing business in Utah is evil.  The research firm isnt a program, Gonzo, they do research.  The oversight committee were from Washington State.

Utah is the only state which has parent rights and not child rights. That means a Utah based program can hold a child against his will.

[shaggys]

 I am just presenting the facts.

 :roflmao:  :roflmao:  :roflmao:  :roflmao:  :roflmao:  :roflmao:  :roflmao:

Whooter has no facts.  He claims that his daughter was at ASR when Marcus was there and also claims his daughter was there during 9/11 and left in 2002.  Only one can be true.  He lied about having a daughter in the first place then slipped up on the details of her "program experience" a few times.  He says she was in the program 14 months, but in other statements he says "16 months."  Only one can be true.  He says she graduated high school at ASR but later said she dropped out of HS when she got home.  Only one can be true.

He's just jerking everyone's chain with a looooong series of fabrications about his family and ASR.  It's all lies and it's obvious when you just scratch the surface.

I wouldn't put too much stock in anything he calls a "fact" or his "personal experience."  He's been busted out lying about both way too often to have any credibility.

It bears repeating.  This person is incredibly dishonest and has been proven so many times by his own statements.  His entire story is pure fiction and is therefore not relevant to anything or anyone.

I know that Whoot has been asked before to clear up the inconsistencies in his story but he always seems to dodge it. Gotta side with DJ here.
Kids may be manipulative and lie sometimes but the program staff and program pushers lie way way more IMO.

[Whooter]

Utah is the only state which has parent rights and not child rights. That means a Utah based program can hold a child against his will.

I know but that doesnt mean every business in Utah holds kids against their will.  The local Mcdonalds or Ford dealership doesnt hold kids against their will.  The research firm which conducted the study doesnt hold kids against their will either.   lol.  

The logic here just cracks me up sometimes.



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[Whooter]

I know that Whoot has been asked before to clear up the inconsistencies in his story but he always seems to dodge it. Gotta side with DJ here.
Kids may be manipulative and lie sometimes but the program staff and program pushers lie way way more IMO.

I do my best to clear up any inconsistencies which I may inadvertently present.  I think we all do.  But like myself you need to go with your gut, Shaggys.  I do the same thing myself.

From my experience I think it depends on the kid.  If the child had been honest and consistent prior to entering the program then I would lean towards believing the child.  If the child had a history of lying then of course we would need to side with the staff initially.



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[Gonzotherapy]

From my experience I think it depends on the kid.  If the child had been honest and consistent prior to entering the program then I would lean towards believing the child.  If the child had a history of lying then of course we would need to side with the staff initially.



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You disgust me Whooter, you really do. You just let it all hang out here don't you. Programs wouldn't be able to survive if they didn't use the distrust already present between a child and his or her's parents. They are designed to prey on that distrust and exploit it to it's full monetary value. I don't know how you sleep at night.

[Gonzotherapy]

Utah is the only state which has parent rights and not child rights. That means a Utah based program can hold a child against his will.

I know but that doesnt mean every business in Utah holds kids against their will.  The local Mcdonalds or Ford dealership doesnt hold kids against their will.  The research firm which conducted the study doesnt hold kids against their will either.   lol.  

The logic here just cracks me up sometimes.



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Is that your logic that cracks you up? Does a Mcdonalds or Ford dealership make money off of holding kids against their will? The "research firm" may not hold kids against their will, but they profit when kids are. Aspen paid for the research. It says so right at the bottom of her report and on her website.

Does a Ford dealership or Mcdonalds in Utah sell magic underpants? Does that mean there are no Mormons in Utah?

[Whooter]

Utah is the only state which has parent rights and not child rights. That means a Utah based program can hold a child against his will.

I know but that doesnt mean every business in Utah holds kids against their will.  The local Mcdonalds or Ford dealership doesnt hold kids against their will.  The research firm which conducted the study doesnt hold kids against their will either.   lol.  

The logic here just cracks me up sometimes.



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Is that your logic that cracks you up? Does a Mcdonalds or Ford dealership make money off of holding kids against their will? The "research firm" may not hold kids against their will, but they profit when kids are. Aspen paid for the research. It says so right at the bottom of her report and on her website.

Does a Ford dealership or Mcdonalds in Utah sell magic underpants? Does that mean there are no Mormons in Utah?

Its a research firm lol.  They dont hold kids againt their will, gonzo.  People pay them to conduct research on their businesses.  The ford dealerships profit when the programs buy cars from them or when the parents come to visit the kids they may eat at McDonalds.  But that doesnt mean these businesses are evil.

You have to admit, gonzo, the logic is really twisted and a stretch.  This is funny.



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[RobertBruce]

And your lack of logic cracks us up. Can you actually show anyone claiming that McDonald's or Ford Dealerships hold kids hostage, or is this you attempting to distract from the fact that programs in Utah can hold kids against their will?

[Whooter]

And your lack of logic cracks us up. Can you actually show anyone claiming that McDonald's or Ford Dealerships hold kids hostage, or is this you attempting to distract from the fact that programs in Utah can hold kids against their will?

Ha,Ha,Ha,  Thank you Bruce.  I think we can safely agree that not all businesses in Utah hold kids hostage.  This is a great thread.

All this energy to try to discredit a study because the research firm was in the state of Utah.  



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[RobertBruce]

Whooter this is not unlike the time you attempted to claim that McDonalds should be held respondsible for the death of a child who was crushed to death by the overweight "counselor" at a program in North Carolina. I'm not sure what your fixation with that fast food establishment is, but this forum is focused on the abusive theraputic boarding school industry.

[Whooter]

Utah is the only state which has parent rights and not child rights. That means a Utah based program can hold a child against his will.

But the business that we are talking about is a research firm.  They dont even hold kids at all.  The study gained approval and was overseen by WIRB (The Western Institutional Review Board) which is located in the state of Washington.  The study itself was presented to the APA American Psychological Association during their annual meeting.

This is the study we have been focusing on:

Link



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[RobertBruce]

Bought and paid for by who again?

[Whooter]

Bought and paid for by who again?

All that information is in the "references" section of the study itself, usually at the end.  If you are asking if the research firm conducted the study out of the goodness of their hearts for free.  I think we all know the answer is "No".  I have never heard of a research firm conducting a study for free.  Businesses typically pay for the studies themselves which in this case is Aspen Education Group.

Link



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[RobertBruce]

All that information is in the "references" section of the study itself, usually at the end. If you are asking if the research firm conducted the study out of the goodness of their hearts for free. I think we all know the answer is "No". I have never heard of a research firm conducting a study for free. Businesses typically pay for the studies themselves which in this case is Aspen Education Group.

So Aspen Education Group pays for a "study" and magically it somehow comes out with a glowing review. Imagine that. There's a word for that sort of thing Whooter. No one but you and the paying customer in question takes this thing seriously, let us know when you have an actual independent unbiased study.

[Whooter]

All that information is in the "references" section of the study itself, usually at the end. If you are asking if the research firm conducted the study out of the goodness of their hearts for free. I think we all know the answer is "No". I have never heard of a research firm conducting a study for free. Businesses typically pay for the studies themselves which in this case is Aspen Education Group.

So Aspen Education Group pays for a "study" and magically it somehow comes out with a glowing review. Imagine that. There's a word for that sort of thing Whooter. No one but you and the paying customer in question takes this thing seriously, let us know when you have an actual independent unbiased study.

No one but me and the paying customer?  Only 2 people?  Oh my goodness, that cant be worth it.  Lets take a look to see if this independent study with 3rd party oversight which was presented to the APA's annual conference which shows these programs to be up to 85% successful is still there!

Link

Oh, Good.  Geesh, Bruce, you should notify some people.  Seems no one believes you.

Let me know if you want to take another look at the study or if anyone from the APA takes your position. lol



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