Author Topic: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids  (Read 56183 times)

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Offline Anne Bonney

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #90 on: October 06, 2010, 02:07:36 PM »
Quote from: "Shadyacres"
To address the point that Whooter was trying to make, I think the reason we use words like 'gulag' is that we have no adequate words for what those places are.  'School', 'Treatment Center', 'Boot Camp' are all wrong.  They are words for different, far less damaging institutions.  The TTI model that rose up in the seventies and eighties, and is in even greater use today, is so contrary to the values this country was founded on that most people just assume that this kind of thing does not happen in this country, and anyone who says it does MUST be lying.  We use words like gulag because we have no other adequate words to use.

Very well put.  :tup:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
traight, St. Pete, early 80s
AA is a cult http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-cult.html

The more boring a child is, the more the parents, when showing off the child, receive adulation for being good parents-- because they have a tame child-creature in their house.  ~~  Frank Zappa

Offline DannyB II

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #91 on: October 06, 2010, 02:09:23 PM »
...
« Last Edit: July 06, 2011, 04:48:21 PM by DannyB II »
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Offline DannyB II

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #92 on: October 06, 2010, 02:11:11 PM »
...
« Last Edit: July 06, 2011, 04:48:54 PM by DannyB II »
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Offline DannyB II

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #93 on: October 06, 2010, 02:12:38 PM »
..
« Last Edit: July 06, 2011, 04:49:20 PM by DannyB II »
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Offline Son Of Serbia

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #94 on: October 06, 2010, 02:15:57 PM »
Quote from: "DannyB II"
Quote from: "Son Of Serbia"
Quote from: "Shadyacres"
Quote from: "DannyB II"
Quote from: "Anne Bonney"
A lot of us use that term because that's how we felt.....like we were inmates in a prison.

Well for some of us who were in prison and know damn well you never were, it is like a slap in the face. Because you don't know a darn thing about Juvenile Detention Centers, County/Town/City Jails or Prisons.
So please do not refer to yourselves as inmates. Most of you were rich snotty little kids who finally got your butts whipped and want to cry about it now or not.
I'm not judging, I'm just say'in.
Anne there was abuse in the programs on a large scale back in the day but let me tell ya, it was nothing like the peer-pressure you would have received in prison.


Bullshit.  I was never in juvie, or prison, but I have been in a handful of adult rehabs and more county jails than I can remember.  NOTHING came close to that kiddie rehab I was in when I was 15.  The term 'inmate' is entirely appropriate. ' Victim ' would work too.

I agree with you 100% Shadyacres.  I've spent time in both juvie & county jail - I definately
preferred those places over the program I was sent to (CEDU).  Yes it is true that juvie &
county jail are more violent environments than Cedu was.  However, I coped with this by
not talking shit, staying out of other people's business, staying alert at all times, & making
as many friends as possible - and I left these places relatively unscathed.  

Nobody at county jail or juvie tried to brainwash me while depriving me of sleep for 30+ hours straight.  Nobody at juvie/county demanded that I constantly talk about my feelings.  I was never put "bans" from anyone or anything, or restricted from  discussing whatever the hell I wanted to.  Unlike Cedu, in county jail/juvie I could write letters to and/or call whoever the
fuck I wanted to.  Unlike Cedu, in county jail/juvie I could receive visits from anyone & everyone who wanted to come see me.  

In Jail, I wasn't forced to sit thru 15+ hours a week in raps, hearing other inmates talk about all the fucked up shit they did like sticking things up their asses, being molested in by their parents, being raped in foster homes, turning tricks for drugs, fucking their siblings, trying to get head from their dogs, etcetera.  Even better, in jail I didn't have to sit through raps hearing the STAFF talk about molesting 13 year old girls, setting a homeless man on fire, killing someone while drunk driving, or jerking into milk cartons filled with raw chicken livers -all of which happened Cedu.

At least in jail - my thoughts were my own.  I was expected to do my time - but how I felt about it and dealt with it was my own business, and no one elses.  And also my life went on,
sure I was in jail - but that didn't mean I had to be completely isolated from the world, and everone & everything that meant something to me.  Cedu on the other hand - took everything away from me, they completely alienated me from the real world - total isolation!

Furthermore, I went to juvie/county jail because I was arrested for and/or convicted of breaking the law.  At least I was there for a reason, and I received due process before being confined.  Most of the kids being placed in programs aren't ever arrested, charged, or convicted of anything.  They're imprisoned without even a hearing, let alone trial - in other words kids are being confined without it ever being proven that they did anything wrong!
In this respect - programs are no better than concentration camps!  In fact, while at Cedu
I met over a dozen kids who as far as I could tell, were sent there soley they weren't
getting alon with their new step parent!  This is NOT a valid reason for imprisoning someone!

"Inmate", "Prisoner" & "Victim" are all entirely appropriate terms for describing people
stuck in programs.  Also for many people I knew at Cedu, adding the pre-fix "Innocent"
to any of the aforementioned terms would be an appropriate description as well.

 Oh, OK. here is Serbia we will believe it now. Yeah T/C's are worse the prisons and juvie. You really got your embellished spiel down. So long as it works for ya. I can tell ya no body else is really listening parents, kids ect.... your way over the top.
Guys please keep writing because you bolster my opinion/point even more. The audience will read what you have wrote and realize exactly what we have here a bunch immature ex-residents who are still angry.
You folks sound like your romanticizing being the program tuff guys, Yeah throw me in prison, I can do it, no problem, better then here. Attica!!!!!Attica!!!! We Want Attica!!!!
Just saying this Juvie and Prisons are better then programs, makes once again, the readers leave shaking there heads.


Danny, I've given no one here any reason not to believe me.  I have no vested interest in keeping programs open, or shutting them down for that matter.  I don't make any money from it either way.  And by the way - you're a total fucking tool dude, seriously, all jokes aside.  And talk about being immature - you just can't tolerate anyone expressing an opinion that conflicts with your own warped, programmed views.  Not all of us are sheep like you Danny.  Most of us prefer thinking for ourselves - and thats why we find your pathetic rants so amusing.   I'll keep writing by the way, and I'll  keep laughing at you Danny.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2010, 02:16:57 PM by Son Of Serbia »

Offline Anne Bonney

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #95 on: October 06, 2010, 02:16:51 PM »
Quote from: "DannyB II"
Quote from: "Anne Bonney"
Quote from: "Shadyacres"
To address the point that Whooter was trying to make, I think the reason we use words like 'gulag' is that we have no adequate words for what those places are.  'School', 'Treatment Center', 'Boot Camp' are all wrong.  They are words for different, far less damaging institutions.  The TTI model that rose up in the seventies and eighties, and is in even greater use today, is so contrary to the values this country was founded on that most people just assume that this kind of thing does not happen in this country, and anyone who says it does MUST be lying.  We use words like gulag because we have no other adequate words to use.

Very well put.  :tup:

Since you folks are from Florida, I'm sure you would have no problem with our great values as a country. So then why protest, Straight. ???????

I have no idea what the hell you're trying to say.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
traight, St. Pete, early 80s
AA is a cult http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-cult.html

The more boring a child is, the more the parents, when showing off the child, receive adulation for being good parents-- because they have a tame child-creature in their house.  ~~  Frank Zappa

Offline Anne Bonney

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #96 on: October 06, 2010, 02:17:46 PM »
Quote from: "DannyB II"
Quote from: "Anne Bonney"
Quote from: "DannyB II"
.


Deleted again??  Why even bother posting if you're just gonna delete it?  You used to do the same thing with PMs.


OK....?


Good, then you'll stop deleting your posts, right?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
traight, St. Pete, early 80s
AA is a cult http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-cult.html

The more boring a child is, the more the parents, when showing off the child, receive adulation for being good parents-- because they have a tame child-creature in their house.  ~~  Frank Zappa

Offline Shadyacres

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #97 on: October 06, 2010, 02:19:49 PM »
Actually, I was thinking of;

 "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. "

Of course, there were no TTI's in those days, if there had been, I bet Jefferson would have included them in his 'long train of abuses'.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline shaggys

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #98 on: October 06, 2010, 02:23:59 PM »
I appreciate everyones' input on this thread. The comments here have confirmed what I suspected. There is still widespread abuse in the Troubled Teen Industry. Parents be very careful when considering a program. Your kid may come back alot worse off than before. They will probably be angry with you for sending them to a place that abuses them. Probably not a good idea at all. Consider other options.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Son Of Serbia

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #99 on: October 06, 2010, 02:25:57 PM »
Quote from: "Anne Bonney"
Quote from: "DannyB II"
Quote from: "Anne Bonney"
Quote from: "DannyB II"
.


Deleted again??  Why even bother posting if you're just gonna delete it?  You used to do the same thing with PMs.


OK....?


Good, then you'll stop deleting your posts, right?


DannyB II keeps deleting his posts to avoid getting caught with his foot in his mouth -
AGAIN!  Personnally, I think Danny should stop deleting his posts too.  It isn't
 fair to the rest of us who enjoy laughing at Danny every chance we get.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline DannyB II

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #100 on: October 06, 2010, 02:31:33 PM »
...
« Last Edit: July 06, 2011, 04:52:15 PM by DannyB II »
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Offline DannyB II

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #101 on: October 06, 2010, 02:34:58 PM »
....
« Last Edit: July 06, 2011, 04:53:05 PM by DannyB II »
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Offline DannyB II

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #102 on: October 06, 2010, 02:39:23 PM »
...
« Last Edit: July 06, 2011, 04:53:43 PM by DannyB II »
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Offline Whooter

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #103 on: October 06, 2010, 02:42:27 PM »
Quote from: "Shadyacres"
To address the point that Whooter was trying to make, I think the reason we use words like 'gulag' is that we have no adequate words for what those places are.  'School', 'Treatment Center', 'Boot Camp' are all wrong.  They are words for different, far less damaging institutions.  The TTI model that rose up in the seventies and eighties, and is in even greater use today, is so contrary to the values this country was founded on that most people just assume that this kind of thing does not happen in this country, and anyone who says it does MUST be lying.  We use words like gulag because we have no other adequate words to use.

I agree that it works well within your group of friends and fellow survivors.  But when the rest of the world is using School or program and student/Resident and you exaggerate/redefine it to a level of Gulag and inmate then the readers can expect that when you also use the word "abuse" this would also be an exaggeration or redefined.
How is the reader to know which wards are redefined and embellished and which are not?

IF I stated:

My teacher is a mass murderer and kills me with her homework and treats me like a common slave when she makes me clean the board.  I am abused everyday.

Should we dial 911?  or by reading that sentence we interpret that the words Murder, slave and abuse are all embellished to get attention and create drama?

Do you see the difference?

I am not saying you have to stop using the kidnapping, Gulag, inmate, abuse etc. words.  But just dont expect the average person to take you seriously that is my main point.  If someone has truly been abused then they need to drop the drama and take the situation seriously if you expect others to.



...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Shadyacres

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Re: Many Many Programs Abuse Kids
« Reply #104 on: October 06, 2010, 02:43:31 PM »
Quote from: "DannyB II"
Quote from: "Shadyacres"
Actually, I was thinking of;

 "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. "

Of course, there were no TTI's in those days, if there had been, I bet Jefferson would have included them in his 'long train of abuses'.


Yeah, and you told your mum you would be home clean and sober at 11 pm and did not come in until 2am lit up and smelling of booze.
We all lie....what's your point.


That months or years of emotional or psychological abuse is a wholly inappropriate and ineffective remedy for a kid who comes home late, drunk, a few times.  Or was found with weed in his pocket, or whatever.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »