How long ago were you in a program?

[DannyB II]

It was my experience at Hyde that they drove a wedge of mistrust between kids and their parents, unless and until both parties drank the kool-aid sufficiently.

I have heard this in the past also, here on fornits.  It has always been my experience and those of just about everyone else is that programs bring families closer.  That is their main function.

I thought their main function was to make money. That's what they're expert at. It sure as hell isn't "behavioral health," or "character development," or, God forbid, "preparation for life!" Lol.

Sure, maybe these programs turn out to be "just the ticket" for a few families. Some people really do seem to have a real need for having a close, ideological identification with an organization, or cult, but that's not how they market themselves, is it? That dire prognosis of deadinsaneorinjail if not for the program doesn't really apply to 99% of the kids who get sucked into these joints, does it?

And when you consider that coercion always has its cost, these programs are not exactly a "benign remedy" for those families unfortunate enough to have been charmed by the glossy websites, the effusive YouTube clips, the marketing hard sell spun by Edcons. Buyer beware!  :twofinger:

http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/posting.php?mode=quote&f=22&p=362800#


 :shamrock:  :shamrock:

Ursus, calling programs today cults I don't know about that. Ideological identification for parents, well ya. That is how they rationalize/process in their minds sending little Tommy to these centers.
Parents are lazy and want to be enabled, well 10000 programs are willing to do it. Look at our parents they are like the fore-fathers, are parents paved the way. I don't see our parents out there protesting or better yet here on fornits.
I know this all sounds crazy and it is, very crazy yet your parents and mine managed to be blind enough to send us to Maine to two crazy environments.
So keep blaming the Corporations and let the feeders go by, I personally think you would have more success with the feeders then the Corps.

Danny

[Whooter]

It was my experience at Hyde that they drove a wedge of mistrust between kids and their parents, unless and until both parties drank the kool-aid sufficiently.

I have heard this in the past also, here on fornits.  It has always been my experience and those of just about everyone else is that programs bring families closer.  That is their main function.

I thought their main function was to make money. That's what they're expert at. It sure as hell isn't "behavioral health," or "character development," or, God forbid, "preparation for life!" Lol.

Sure, maybe these programs turn out to be "just the ticket" for a few families. Some people really do seem to have a real need for having a close, ideological identification with an organization, or cult, but that's not how they market themselves, is it? That dire prognosis of deadinsaneorinjail if not for the program doesn't really apply to 99% of the kids who get sucked into these joints, does it?

And when you consider that coercion always has its cost, these programs are not exactly a "benign remedy" for those families unfortunate enough to have been charmed by the glossy websites, the effusive YouTube clips, the marketing hard sell spun by Edcons. Buyer beware!  :twofinger:

Well I guess we all need the pay check before we can help others.  Some of these places have very healthy balance sheets but others do struggle so they aren’t exactly cash cows.  But I can tell by your posts that you had a bad experience and therefore feel that maybe if you accept that others did well in a program than that maybe you would feel that there is something wrong with you and question the cause of your own experience.

If you step out and look at the larger view you will see that there are 50,000 kids going thru the system every year and only a few are damaged by it.  There are thousands of kids getting back on the right path without brainwashing or degrade to suicide or ptsd etc.  The programs work and the proof is in the pudding, Ursus.  Prospective families talk to families who have had kids go thru the system.  They hear the success stories first hand.  The programs have reunions with kids attending from years past and recent grads come back to attend future graduations.  These are not signs of cults or brainwashing.  Many programs have no fences and if you want out then you could break a few rules and get your ass tossed back home or just walk out….. we just read about a girl who ran away from a program and is now home with her family…. cults don’t operate like this.  The studies are now being performed by outside agencies with oversight from independent third parties.... its getting harder and harder for you to keep denying or ignoring the facts.

To keep your beliefs alive, Ursus, you cherry pick articles and identify an abusive staff over here, a picture of a Hobbit over there and a few abusive stories and wala you are able to sit back cozy with your world intact.  But your stories are collecting dust without new ones to replace them….things are changing around you and if you step outside your world you will see that todays programs just aint the same as the façade you have built for yourself over the years.


Sometimes a little sunlight is the best disinfectant.



...

[DannyB II]

It was my experience at Hyde that they drove a wedge of mistrust between kids and their parents, unless and until both parties drank the kool-aid sufficiently.

I have heard this in the past also, here on fornits.  It has always been my experience and those of just about everyone else is that programs bring families closer.  That is their main function.

I thought their main function was to make money. That's what they're expert at. It sure as hell isn't "behavioral health," or "character development," or, God forbid, "preparation for life!" Lol.

Sure, maybe these programs turn out to be "just the ticket" for a few families. Some people really do seem to have a real need for having a close, ideological identification with an organization, or cult, but that's not how they market themselves, is it? That dire prognosis of deadinsaneorinjail if not for the program doesn't really apply to 99% of the kids who get sucked into these joints, does it?

And when you consider that coercion always has its cost, these programs are not exactly a "benign remedy" for those families unfortunate enough to have been charmed by the glossy websites, the effusive YouTube clips, the marketing hard sell spun by Edcons. Buyer beware!  :twofinger:

Well I guess we all need the pay check before we can help others.  Some of these places have very healthy balance sheets but others do struggle so they aren’t exactly cash cows.  But I can tell by your posts that you had a bad experience and therefore feel that maybe if you accept that others did well in a program than that maybe you would feel that there is something wrong with you and question the cause of your own experience.

If you step out and look at the larger view you will see that there are 50,000 kids going thru the system every year and only a few are damaged by it.  There are thousands of kids getting back on the right path without brainwashing or degrade to suicide or ptsd etc.  The programs work and the proof is in the pudding, Ursus.  Prospective families talk to families who have had kids go thru the system.  They hear the success stories first hand.  The programs have reunions with kids attending from years past and recent grads come back to attend future graduations.  These are not signs of cults or brainwashing.  Many programs have no fences and if you want out then you could break a few rules and get your ass tossed back home or just walk out….. we just read about a girl who ran away from a program and is now home with her family…. cults don’t operate like this.  The studies are now being performed by outside agencies with oversight from independent third parties.... its getting harder and harder for you to keep denying or ignoring the facts.

To keep your beliefs alive, Ursus, you cherry pick articles and identify an abusive staff over here, a picture of a Hobbit over there and a few abusive stories and wala you are able to sit back cozy with your world intact.  But your stories are collecting dust without new ones to replace them….things are changing around you and if you step outside your world you will see that todays programs just aint the same as the façade you have built for yourself over the years.


Sometimes a little sunlight is the best disinfectant.



...

 :shamrock:  :shamrock:

Your going to hate me all you "haters" of programs but as I said when the message is clear and on the money "Who" cares about the messenger.
Not all programs smell the same.

Danny

[Ursus]

What do you expect little Tommy to say, hey I am having a great time hauling rocks around and telling folks how I feel.

I'm sure many programs have learned how to steel parents' hearts to that type of expressed discontent. They tell parents to expect it. It's all part of "the process!" If anything, such complaints sometimes end up — paradoxically — verifying the program's "analysis" of the kid. The program's reputation of being "expert" at what they do actually gets enhanced. At least for awhile...

What programs do not want parents to hear from their kids, in this case re. Hyde School, is that they or one of their classmates had a serious sports injury for which they never received medical attention (I guess the coach thought it too frivolous), that a kid is in danger of losing their thumbs due to frostbite (were the complaints of pain thought to be whining?), that someone's leg was broken due to strictly punitive 5-30 workouts (can you imagine the pain prior to the snap of bone?), that staff "forgot" to bring a kid's bipolar medication when dropping them off at outpost for some attitude adjustment (twice!), that a kid was sexually assaulted by staff or fellow student(s), or that a kid actually died there. These kinds of complaints have a substantially narrower range of interpretation though Hyde still manages to put an obfuscating spin on most of them!

Incidentally, I believe most of the above examples are relatively recent events, Whooter; if you wish, I can round up older examples of the same types of abuses. God knows, there are some real winners!!  

[RavingMad]

FROM THE LOOKS OF THIS PLACE ON FORNITS HALF OF YOU STILL NEED TO BE IN PROGRAM. HALF OF YOU ARE CRAZY AS HELLZ :suicide:

[Whooter]

What do you expect little Tommy to say, hey I am having a great time hauling rocks around and telling folks how I feel.

I'm sure many programs have learned how to steel parents' hearts to that type of expressed discontent. They tell parents to expect it. It's all part of "the process!" If anything, such complaints sometimes end up — paradoxically — verifying the program's "analysis" of the kid. The program's reputation of being "expert" at what they do actually gets enhanced. At least for awhile...

What programs do not want parents to hear from their kids, in this case re. Hyde School, is that they or one of their classmates had a serious sports injury for which they never received medical attention (I guess the coach thought it too frivolous), that a kid is in danger of losing their thumbs due to frostbite (were the complaints of pain thought to be whining?), that someone's leg was broken due to strictly punitive 5-30 workouts (can you imagine the pain prior to the snap of bone?), that staff "forgot" to bring a kid's bipolar medication when dropping them off at outpost for some attitude adjustment (twice!), that a kid was sexually assaulted by staff or fellow student(s), or that a kid actually died there. These kinds of complaints have a substantially narrower range of interpretation though Hyde still manages to put an obfuscating spin on most of them!

Incidentally, I believe most of the above examples are relatively recent events, Whooter; if you wish, I can round up older examples of the same types of abuses. God knows, there are some real winners!!  

Do you have anything that has been substantiated by an outside source?  Say a police report.  In the first one the kid bruised his thumb and the coach told him to get over it.  How do we know the kid wasnt just seeking attention and made a big deal out of it by wrapping a toilet tube around it?  There are kids who need more attention than others and will go to extremes to get it.  Athletic coaches see injuries all the time and can easily determine what level of attention each one needs.   Have you ever seen the daily injuries during football practice?  

I mean you insist in third party verification for reports coming out of programs yourself, so why not keep the same standard for all information?

Do you have anything that has been validated?



...

[SUCK IT]

Demand proof programs are safe. Provide no proof they are dangerous. It's the fornits way.

Psy and Ursus were not abused and they can provide no proof, not even an anecdotal statement of fact . They refuse to address this topic at all because by even the most liberal interpretation of the word abuse, it still does not apply to them!

Instead of saying abused they need to say they are mad for making bad choices , Psy signing himself in, and ursus for being such a pussy.

[RavingMad]

Demand proof programs are safe. Provide no proof they are dangerous. It's the fornits way.

Psy and Ursus were not abused and they can provide no proof, not even an anecdotal statement of fact . They refuse to address this topic at all because by even the most liberal interpretation of the word abuse, it still does not apply to them!

Instead of saying abused they need to say they are mad for making bad choices , Psy signing himself in, and ursus for being such a pussy.

WELL WE ALL SEE HOW PSY LIKES TO SHIFT BLAME AND NOT TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR HIS FUCKED UP ACTIONS. DOES THIS REALLY SURPRISE YOU HE WOULD MAKE CLAIMS EITHER. I AM SURE ABUSE DOES OCCUR BUT HONESTLY ALL I SEE IS A BUNCH OF ANGRY ADULTS PISSED THEY GOT CAUGHT BEING IGNRANT TO THEIR PARENTS AND BEING HELD ACCOUNTABLE. OF COURSE THEY DID NOT LIKE THE PLACES WHO THE FUCK WOULD. MY MOM WAS RAPED BUT IT WAS NOT DUE TO THE PLACE SHE WAS AT. HOW THEY HANDLED IT WAS WRONG BUT THEY ARE NOT TO BLAME FOR THE ACTUAL RAPE.

[SUCK IT]

Psy was not abused. He signed himself into a state regulated rehab at the age of 18 because he told his parents he was gay and not religious and somehow they convinced him to do it? All on the taxpayers dime because daddy worked for uncle sam! If Psy was abused, don't you think he would of called the cops and filed charges against them??? He already flew across the country to stalk the employees of the rehab he went to, and the cops had to stop him from stalking people. This place is a freak show run by the biggest freak of all!

[Anne Bonney]

This place is a freak show run by the biggest freak of all!

Then you fit right in darlin'.

[RavingMad]

This place is a freak show run by the biggest freak of all!

Then you fit right in darlin'.

FULL OF INSULTS ARENT YOU MISS SUPERIOR. YOU NEED THERAPY YOU ARE IN DENIAL BAD. SO STFU AND GO TAKE A NAP. SHIT HALF YOU OLD PPL NEED NAPS AND GET OFF THE DAMN COMPUTERS. ANTI SOCIAL MOTHER FUCKERS NO WONDER YOUR LIVES SUCK ASS.

[SUCK IT]

This place is a freak show run by the biggest freak of all!

Then you fit right in darlin'.

What year were you in a program, old timer?

[Anne Bonney]

This place is a freak show run by the biggest freak of all!

Then you fit right in darlin'.

What year were you in a program, old timer?

Years, plural.  Early 80s for two years, puddinhead.

[RavingMad]

This place is a freak show run by the biggest freak of all!

Then you fit right in darlin'.

What year were you in a program, old timer?

Years, plural.  Early 80s for two years, puddinhead.

SHE STILL NEEDS TO BE IN A PROGRAM CANT YOU TELL.

[Anne Bonney]

This place is a freak show run by the biggest freak of all!

Then you fit right in darlin'.

What year were you in a program, old timer?

Years, plural.  Early 80s for two years, puddinhead.

SHE STILL NEEDS TO BE IN A PROGRAM CANT YOU TELL.

What???  I can't hear you!  You're not typing big or loud enough yet!