Author Topic: Walkabout/Outback Therapeutic Expeditions  (Read 2561 times)

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Offline nm04wallaby

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Walkabout/Outback Therapeutic Expeditions
« on: February 05, 2007, 04:03:19 AM »
I have done some preliminary reading throughout this forum and elsewhere, looking for information on this business of "tough love" in the wilderness, as I suppose it is colloquially called.  Somehow, before today I never took much time to analyze the nature of these programs, from the sides of both its proponents and critics.  Now I'm finding it may be personally advantageous if I was to start a discussion with forum members here regarding my personal experience, particularly because it has been a subject which has seldom surfaced since leaving the West Desert years ago.

Although a more descriptive and thorough background may follow at some point, I want to first indicate what I hope to achieve by posting here.  I was told something upon my "graduation" from Walkabout:  There would likely be withdrawal periods during which I would long to return to the program, and this was to be expected.  With an approaching three years of retrospection since leaving Utah, these words of warning have evolved to mean something a little bit different than what they once were.  Rather than feeling a tinge of nostalgia or having temporary or intermittent bouts with wanting to return to the wilderness, I feel as though something much more chronic and irrepressible has resulted instead.

That experience has cemented itself in my mind as the only honest and absolute salvation to whatever problems I encounter in the rest of the world.  Just as victims of panic attacks are instructed to (or involuntarily) enter the fetal position because it subconsciously reminds the body of the safety of the womb, Walkabout has become a second womb.  It occupies the same cerebral space as my fondest childhood memories despite my being cognizant of its shortcomings and the problems which it was ultimately unable to solve, if not having created new ones altogether.

My trouble is in determining whether this is an unhealthy delusion, a dependency, a coping mechanism, or a true indication of needed personal change.  In any of those instances, it is a debilitating feeling.  My emotions stubbornly lurch me towards this fantasization, and though I've yet to succumb by dropping out of life and back into the desert, its appeal has only grown over time.  How would I realistically go about recreating or retreating to it again anyway?  Is this withdrawal-like behavior, which we ex-students are told is "standard," due to some deep emotional reprogramming, intended or incidental?  Or is it from the same "issues" warranting first having attended the program merely resurfacing due to my own poor decisions, habits or behaviors?  Or is it from a new set of problems altogether, for which the only (or most effective) treatment I can think of is re-enrollment in the program and recession from society?  Would that perpetuate or eliminate the problem?  I understand these are all questions which are very specific to my own circumstances.  What I take issue with is this ?syndrome? which I've found to be all too common in post-wilderness clients.  My hope is that my own personal details can help to describe and alleviate a broader affliction, or perhaps even to put words to something that those of us who have lived through this may have only felt but could not express.

If Walkabout and other programs like it aim to give sanity and confidence to "troubled teens" (a disgusting and dishonorable term), I now find myself overemphasizing my lack[i/] of direction and confidence with some strangely comforting notion that tomorrow two escorts will come out of my closet and put me back where I belong.  The degree to which that emphasis is either excessive or accurate depends entirely on just what kind of mental/emotional standing I am in, which is exactly what I feel more and more incapable of assessing.  Unfortunately, the clarity with which I had hoped to begin this post has been lost in my own ponderings.  It is ironic then that this be emblematic of what has been all too typical since my departure from Utah: a lack of focus.

I ought to have made this clear from the beginning.  I am not here to seek psychological help, nor would I interpret any comments or advice posted here as legitimate or credible medical instructions.  This is purely in the interest of my own exploration into this community's opinions given their apparent familiarity with the subject.

I sincerely welcome any and all of your replies with an open mind and heart.

-Danny N.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2007, 07:44:19 AM »
Danny, it may please, but probably horrify, you that I have seen a group of people with symptoms nearly exactly identical to yours.

I will not name that group here, as the word is far too insulting for me to direct it at you in public.

I can give my findings to you privately but I guarantee you won't like them at all.
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Offline try another castle

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« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2007, 08:20:23 AM »
Quote
I will not name that group here, as the word is far too insulting for me to direct it at you in public.


Like that's ever stopped you before.  :P


Danny, I'm still trying to figure out how to respond. As of now, I don't know what to tell you, because I honestly cannot relate. I wasn't in wilderness. (I DID wilderness, but it was in the broader context of a TBS, so it's not the same.)

I guess I'm dense about this, but I'm totally nonplussed. You stated the staff said this was common, but I'm wondering why that would be. Maybe that's the part I'm dense about.
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Offline Covergaard

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At "simple" explanation
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2007, 10:06:38 AM »
I have a relative who has been in hospital for depression. It was voluntary, but it was not a fun place to be.

(There was no abuse - only rest and medication - which the person acknowledged to need after being within inch. from death)

However, it was an odd feeling for the person to return home. The hospital did function as a kind of shield against the threats from the outside world. She felt safe in the hospital. So going home was a mixed feeling of joy and worry.

I think that it is the same kind of feeling, you experience.

Our mind does protect us. Speak to former soldiers. Regardless of bad whether, lost limps etc. it is the fun memories they keep. The bad thing are put away in a far and remote place in the brain. So they will always remember the fun and good old days, if you speak to them.

However - the far and remote place in the brain is easy to reach in your dreams. They come back as nightmares.

I can understand why you are confused. Everyone who has been away in an isolated environment for some time would find the normal world both fast, stressed-out and threatening. They will long back to the safety of those parts of the programs, which made out their comfortzone during the program.

Your feelings are normal. I can only give you one advise: Speak with someone, who has been through the same program, as you have been. Check myspace or this place out for these persons. Debriefing as you can call it, is very important. In fact, it is everything if a program has to be just a little bit of a succes.
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Offline nm04wallaby

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Reply to MGDP
« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2007, 05:19:43 PM »
Quote
Danny, it may please, but probably horrify, you that I have seen a group of people with symptoms nearly exactly identical to yours.

I will not name that group here, as the word is far too insulting for me to direct it at you in public.


My first inclination is that you would compare the circumstances I've described akin to that of a drug addict.  Even if I am mistaken and you had something else in mind, the purpose of my posting here is to educate myself, and so I would invite you to share your thoughts regardless of their potential impact, as long as it's something constructive.  But thanks for being polite.

-Danny
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Offline hanzomon4

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Walkabout/Outback Therapeutic Expeditions
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2007, 06:24:21 PM »
Covergaard has some good points, it is true that in the wilderness you were shielded from the every day stresses of life. More significantly, I feel, is that the program provided a ready made structure. Someone else made the schedule and ensured that you followed it. As an adult(18+) you have to create that structure for yourself and you're only accountable to yourself.  

Most likely when life starts to feel out of control you may crave that ready made structure provided by the program. It's not so much that you crave the wilderness, it's that you associate control and order with the wilderness, thus your mind seeks the wilderness when you need control and order.

Not knowing the particulars of your program I couldn't say if this is a Stockholm's syndrome(SS) thing. SS is forged in fear, high stress, a need to accommodate something horrible to survive. Whatever it is I don't think its healthy because as an adult you may be less able to cope with life minus the program.

Interesting topic........
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Offline nm04wallaby

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« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2007, 10:24:13 PM »
I would hate to, but am going to have to, consider that these feelings demonstrate a yearning for a return to structure.  Somehow this registers as contradictory.  Amongst all of the four-lettered phrases I got stuck with as a kid, the most memorable (and dearest to my heart) is Oppositional Defiance Disorder.  To me, that translates as "fuck you I won't do what you tell me," and quite frankly I am thankful, not resentful of this.  Had I not opposed or defied certain less-than-legitimate or overtly arrogant authorities in my life, I believe I would be much worse off.  It is a practice which I dutifully continue to this day and will carry out every day I?m alive.  So my tendency is to equate the defiance of authority to the rejection of structure, unless the two are totally apples and oranges to each other.  What I most cherish from the wilderness was purpose, meaning, self-direction, and likely some things that just can't come out in words; inarticulable gains, some of which could be lying in wait until some new challenge calls for their retrieval... but not necessarily structure.  And although it was rewarding, if only temporarily, it was by no means easy, though it became easier over time.  A memorable quote from the field:

"It doesn't really get good, but it gets better after a while."

If I was a structure whore, I think I'd have the college thing in the bag.  The opposite is true.  I?ve got all of the structure I could ever want right here, though not necessarily enforced from above, but from within, and on occasion from outside influence and expectation for performance and staying in line.  School has been a trying experience more than it?s been a liberating one.  I'm starting to dawn on what MGDP might have been thinking of... this is a rape victim, dreaming of his/her attacker, wanting to relive, reinvent, re-enact or reinsert the disaster into their now meticulous, mundane or ordinary existence.  I've always prided myself on a certain soundness of mind, having been a reliable source of advice and compassion for my friends, my parents' friends, and even my own parents on a few occasions.  But let's be realistic.  Being absolutely and mercilessly uprooted and transplanted from home into something completely foreign and unfamiliar (despite my already having a fondness for the outdoors), followed by 6-8 weeks of "treatment," will "fuck" your mind, and especially at age 16, no matter who you are.  A person's character or wherewithal might make them less susceptible, but never invulnerable.

I began reading a remarkable book, put out by a remarkable 'something' (they refuse the confines of any conventional category such as "publisher") called Recipes for Disaster.  The un-entity partially responsible for said book ending up in my hands is called Crimethinc.  I would now wish to quote something which makes what I am trying to say abundantly clearer than I ever could:

Quote
Once upon a time oil spills
and shootings were considered disasters; today these are
practically standard features of our society, built into the
social fabric and accounted for in advance. They are not
anomalies, but routines. Real interruptions in which the system
breaks down, on the other hand, such as blackouts and
bomb threats, are still described as disasters, whether or not
anyone dies. Already harrowed by the vicissitudes of the system
itself, we dutifully fear them, but those who have lived
through such disruptions know how sweet it can be when
Something Happens... but the real Disaster, the worst
one, is the Disaster we live every day: the emptiness of our
full schedules, the trivia that trivializes us, the machinery that
runs on rivers of blood. That would explain why we feel so
free whenever something, anything, however dangerous or
difficult, interrupts all this. Perhaps the excitement and immediacy
that break out in emergencies are simply indications of
a return to our natural state, in the break they herald from the
full scale slow motion train wreck that is our society. If that is
the case, then it is not disasters per se that are liberating?it
is, rather, a question of perspective: a ?disaster? that disrupts
a life of constraint is experienced as a moment of liberation,
when that ?normal life? is actually Disaster in disguise.


This was a welcome and an unwelcome change, as I?ll explain in a minute, but a violation all the same, leaving this stubborn stain on my conscience, desiring a return to upheaval.  Walkabout was indeed a disaster in both the good and bad sense of the word, but away from and toward what exactly is what has taken time to discern.  What did it bring about or put and end to?  What was lost or found?  Or with regard to structure, what did I need then that I don?t now, or vice versa?  What did this interrupt me from and introduce me to, then and now?

Just prior to the kidnapping, I had taken some daring but long-overdue steps away from a home that had been wracked with chaos, family illness, and vicious dysfunction for a solid two to three years, by physically moving myself out of the picture.  I was 16.  No combination of any of our contributions or ideas, with or without therapy, had worked prior.  My summers or vacations away from home, if only for a day or two, were always a welcome reprieve from the stress of being at home.  So upon leaving for good, I began reaping the rewards of life away from incessant fighting and verbal abuse at home, out from under the oppressive (rather than protective) wing of my disassembled, defunct parents, along with the trying but emboldening consequences of bearing the full weight of (almost) all of my decisions.  And I loved it.  In coping with almost two years? worth of subsequent illness from each parent, falling like dominoes, one after the other, the added responsibility wasn?t foreign.  The world which I was told I wasn?t "big" enough to handle on my own was well within my capability for how much of it I was trying to take on at once, especially with the help of the friend and his parents who took me in, no questions asked.  I paced myself, kept the essentials of my well-being intact, the first and foremost of which was my sense of self, which returned to me like a dream when it was allowed to come out of the figurative cage my parents kept it in with ?because I?m the adult? and ?do as I say? ideologies.  I?ll abbreviate a lot more background by mentioning that the credibility and character required for such parenting catch-phrases to function was trampled by repeated shows of outright disrespect and startlingly childish behaviors on the parts of my parents toward me, each other, and even guests in our home.  Thus, things like ?because I said so? began to sound more like temper tantrums than words of wisdom.  It was at the height of that emergence unto myself that I was plucked out of my world, one which I had begun for the first time to really mold with my own two hands, into one I could never have expected.  It was retaliation.  I had escaped the claws of a familial system I was sure would drive me to the ends of my sanity had I stayed, and the last laugh came in the form of a forced escort, a strip search, a full physical and a hot ride out to oblivion on graduation day, when many of my senior friends (I was a junior) would leave town for good.

I had succeeded in, or was beginning to succeed in escaping the greatest capital ?D? Disaster that had plagued all of us for years and years: my own family.  Once I crept my fingers out from under the rug, my parents, my cunt of a therapist who broke confidentiality about me to my parents and to me about other patients regularly, and the proverbial ?Educational Consultant? (whom, as I?ve been reading, plays an integral part in assigning ill-fated ?troubled-teens? to their programs and profiting from it accordingly) collectively hacked off my fingers before they could feel for more than a single, liberating instant.  They were to be replaced with a new hand (to draw out the metaphor) which would, as I?ve described in my first post, forever feel the world in a completely different way.  I don?t know if it?s better or worse, I just know it?s different.  This is what I will remember my parents for more than anything, because I feel its effects -- though I may not yet understand all of them -- in everything I do.

Structure.

I?ve gone a little belligerently off base here from the original topic of structure, so I?ll try to come back to it.  I will admit that I feel as though this program did for me what I was content to do for myself at the time I was hauled off, and now I attribute my sense of self, my certitude about or comfort with the world and my place in it, as compliments of $15,000 spent by my parents and the work of a therapist and a bunch of Mormons in the desert, not me.  If those bubbles of self-realization during the high points of the program were, in theory, the program giving me the tools with which to make manifest something already inside of me, something which I controlled and I had created, why am I now bereft of any idea of how to bring it back on my own?  I?m trapped into thinking that they have my only formula for success locked in an 8-week thick profile in a filing cabinet in a warehouse in Lehi.  I feel robbed of the promise I worked hard for, of being able to chart my own course, instead left with the worthless, vapid feeling that someone else did it for me.  This is all getting into the ambiguous Lifetime TV realm of emotional verbal diarrhea, but I think some semblance of the point is there.  Maybe I ought to start everything all over again from scratch and do what I?ve written about so many times:

Pile the new computer, the three bedroom apartment, the new mattress, the washer and dryer, dishwasher, the clothes, the $187 of groceries in the fridge, the designer hair products, the EXCESS, the money, the guilt, everything I?ve been given to make it seem as though this program was a gift and not a theft, everything my father?s soiled bank account has shoved in my mouth to make me forget prior transgressions, pile it in a heap outside my front door, lovingly douse it in gasoline, set it ablaze and walk naked in a straight line until God himself stops me.

One problem, and God how great it would be if I only had one, is that I don?t have the balls.  I feel as though something must kick my feet out from under me again in order to begin to walk how, when, where and to whatever beat I want to.  An even greater problem still is not knowing where to start.  Ultimately, I bear the weight of my decisions just as I always have, as well as the even heavier weight of not making them.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2007, 11:05:33 PM »
Never mind. I was wrong in my initial assessment. At least most of the way. (Thank God. I'd never want to see one of those guys in here...)

I can explain everything in the simple terms of euphoria and endorphins released by the fight-or-flight response. You miss the stress, and you miss not having to deal with everyday anything. In an important way, it was a vacation, mostly because you didn't have to put up with your parents' bullshit (despite everything else).

Also, it was an enemy you could sink your teeth into. I could be wrong here, but I'm guessing you miss the hate. It was two months in oblivion with people you despised. The rage, and the knowledge that you realized your parents were against you, must have been fuel.

The first thing to realize is that you gained nothing of substance while there. They gave you absolutely no tools whatsoever. Their therapy was entirely bogus. You must know this.

The only thing you're missing is the chance to get back at them all.

Which, I'm going to further conjecture, is why you're really here.

Welcome to Fornits.
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Offline Deborah

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« Reply #8 on: February 05, 2007, 11:21:44 PM »
Quote
I was told something upon my "graduation" from Walkabout: There would likely be withdrawal periods during which I would long to return to the program, and this was to be expected.

They may have been addressing the issue that is common with kids who've been in program. They have a hard time returning to the "real world", where they must think and respond on their own. Some have feelings of being damaged goods and longing to be back where everything is known and familiar, albeit abusive/oppressive. Programs absolutely can create dependency. Either way, they planted a seed (suggestion) that has grown. Are you easily suggestible, particularly following program?
 
Quote
Rather than feeling a tinge of nostalgia or having temporary or intermittent bouts with wanting to return to the wilderness, I feel as though something much more chronic and irrepressible has resulted instead.

 
Nature is inherently peaceful and soothing- provided you don't encounter a bear or other life threatening situation. If you were my kid, I'd suggest that you take a camping trip and see if it brings you peace or causes distress That's one way to begin determining if you just miss nature, or if it's a feeling of dependency set up by the program. I've always contended that being oppressed in a wilderness program could create a negative association with nature. That can be handled.
There is always the element of confusion when something oppressive and hurtful happens while something positive is simultaneously occurring. Reminds me of a young woman I knew who was molested at the early age of 7 or 8, by her uncle who was just a few years older. While she felt violated on one hand, she also experienced physical pleasure. Rather than focus on the forced 'affection', she focused on her own pleasure, and this somehow made it tolerable, but confusing none the less. This wasn?t sorted out until her mid twenties when she was in a committed relationship and the memories could no longer be suppressed. Unraveling the confusion wasn?t that difficult once she began talking about it.

Quote
In any of those instances, it is a debilitating feeling. My emotions stubbornly lurch me towards this fantasization, and though I've yet to succumb by dropping out of life and back into the desert, its appeal has only grown over time.

The mind is like that. Things will go round and round until they?ve been resolved.
 
Quote
-How would I realistically go about recreating or retreating to it again anyway?

I don?t think any therapist would advise ?recreating? your experience, unless of course, you were in complete control and making all the rules and decisions. Ensuring that all your needs are met. If it?s important to you, perhaps you can figure a way to make that happen.
 
Quote
Is this withdrawal-like behavior, which we ex-students are told is "standard," due to some deep emotional reprogramming, intended or incidental?

I think it is common. More or less for different people. I watched my son go through a period of withdrawal for a couple of years post program. He was an island unto himself, as he had been conditioned to be. Very serious, no fun and laughter, ever vigilant, on guard.  He no longer shared his thoughts and feelings openly. He was pleasant and cordial, but wasn?t himself. Wouldn?t engage in family games or anything competitive. I found him once in the livingroom playing billiards rather than water volleyball with all the guys. One of the adult males had made a disrespectful comment to him. Prior to program, that would?ve rolled off him like water on a duck. The programming is wearing off, but there is still a diminished self-esteem and fear of rejection.  
 
Quote
Or is it from the same "issues" warranting first having attended the program merely resurfacing due to my own poor decisions, habits or behaviors? Or is it from a new set of problems altogether, for which the only (or most effective) treatment I can think of is re-enrollment in the program and recession from society?

Doesn?t matter. You can start today in gaining the skills that will help to leave that crap behind. Find someone you trust, a friend, an effective therapist, and allow them to help you sort out the confusion and get working on some skills for tackling everyday problems. Their job is to listen while you fight your way out of the bag of confusion. Not to advise or rescue, criticize or judge, but to encourage you to keep fighting your way back to reality. You couldn?t possibly benefit from an environment that inhibits your ability to think and act. Anytime we do something for someone that they can do themselves, we are creating an invalid.
I don?t know if this applies to you, but if you were my son I?d remind you often that mistakes are O-tay. Make lots of them. Talk about them. Laugh about them. Lighten up. Cause the world ain?t nearly as boring or serious or dismal as program makes it out to be.

Quote
My trouble is in determining whether this is an
-unhealthy delusion
-dependency
-coping mechanism
-true indication of needed personal change.

My guess would be a coping mechanism, if it relieves your distress in the moment. I don?t know what your personal challenges are, but it seems to make sense that you?d want to gain some useful tools for dealing with them directly. When you?ve successfully done so, the ?coping mechanism? should fade away.

Quote
That experience has cemented itself in my mind as the only honest and absolute salvation to whatever problems I encounter in the rest of the world.
-find myself overemphasizing my lack of direction and confidence with some strangely comforting notion that tomorrow two escorts will come out of my closet and put me back where I belong.

So, Banish them. Throw them out. Every time they enter your thoughts. Tell them to get the fuck out, or ?thanks but no thanks?, whichever works for you.  And that you are in charge of your life and make the decision and choices you feel are in your best interest, and if you can?t figure it out, you?ll seek out someone to listen while you figure out what to do next. In the meantime, mistakes will happen, and that's okay.

And this seems key to me
Quote
The degree to which that emphasis is either excessive or accurate depends entirely on just what kind of mental/emotional standing I am in, which is exactly what I feel more and more incapable of assessing.


Sounds like more confusion. When we?re in good spirits, a flat tire is no biggy, might even lead to an adventure. When we?re carrying a heavy load of distress, it could be the thing that drives us over the edge. Despite program rhetoric, life is a roller coaster. There will be highs and lows, and without the lows, we wouldn?t know the highs. Without highs and lows, you?re flatlined, in a sense, dead. Know that the lows are temporary, and ride the highs.
 
Quote
Unfortunately, the clarity with which I had hoped to begin this post has been lost in my own ponderings. It is ironic then that this be emblematic of what has been all too typical since my departure from Utah: a lack of focus.


This is precisely what fighting your way out of the bag of confusion looks like. Until the thoughts and feelings are out of your head, and being sorted out, they go round and round with no place to grab on to stop them. Grab a piece, start there and let it go where it goes.
I don?t know how distressed you are, but if this sounds overwhelming or frightening? you might want to find a good therapist to do this with rather than a friend. Someone who won?t follow you into the confusion and get lost themselves.  It sometimes happens that when a person gets really sunk it's useful to have a hand out.

That?s my nickel?s worth.
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Offline Deborah

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« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2007, 12:30:35 AM »
Quote from: ""newmy51""
Amongst all of the four-lettered phrases I got stuck with as a kid, the most memorable (and dearest to my heart) is Oppositional Defiance Disorder.  To me, that translates as "fuck you I won't do what you tell me," and quite frankly I am thankful, not resentful of this.

Ah, the dx dejour of the industry. How about a new term and perspective. Righteously indignant? No reasonable person would expect a 15/16 year old to grin and bear that kind of situation. So-called "ODD" seems to me to be the best survival technique most kids can come up with. They aren't to be faulted or drugged for defiantely opposing irrational situations.

Quote
So my tendency is to equate the defiance of authority to the rejection of structure, unless the two are totally apples and oranges to each other.

Yep, that's where it can get confusing. They fucked up a good thing. Is structure currently useful to you? Lack of structure isn't useful to anyone. Accept it on your own terms. Decide how much or little you want.

Quote
I'm starting to dawn on what MGDP might have been thinking of... this is a rape victim, dreaming of his/her attacker, wanting to relive, reinvent, re-enact or reinsert the disaster into their now meticulous, mundane or ordinary existence.

Common to seek to recreate the experience, sometimes subconsciously. Great, each time, change a piece of the story. You're the author now. Speaking of which, you are a fabulous writer. Have you ever thought of writing about your experience? Have you read this blog:
http://www.63days.com/

Quote
What did it bring about or put and end to?  What was lost or found?  Or with regard to structure, what did I need then that I don?t now, or vice versa?  What did this interrupt me from and introduce me to, then and now?

Intriguing questions. Have you stopped to take them seriously and write about it?

Quote
If those bubbles of self-realization during the high points of the program were, in theory, the program giving me the tools with which to make manifest something already inside of me, something which I controlled and I had created, why am I now bereft of any idea of how to bring it back on my own?

Damn good question, to which it appears you know the answer.

Quote
I?m trapped into thinking that they have my only formula for success locked in an 8-week thick profile in a filing cabinet in a warehouse in Lehi.  I feel robbed of the promise I worked hard for, of being able to chart my own course, instead left with the worthless, vapid feeling that someone else did it for me.

One of the most damning side effects of programs. They take all the credit for attributes you had prior to program. My son, like most kids who oppose their involuntary incarceration, didn't show his finer attributes for months into the program. When he surrendered to being there (lost my court battle) he began to show who he really was.
Wa Lah... "the program was working", and they loved to take credit. Infuriated me. And I let them know they were not responsible.


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This is all getting into the ambiguous Lifetime TV realm of emotional verbal diarrhea, but I think some semblance of the point is there.  Maybe I ought to start everything all over again from scratch and do what I?ve written about so many times:
Pile the new computer, the three bedroom apartment, the new mattress, the washer and dryer, dishwasher, the clothes, the $187 of groceries in the fridge, the designer hair products, the EXCESS, the money, the guilt, everything I?ve been given to make it seem as though this program was a gift and not a theft, everything my father?s soiled bank account has shoved in my mouth to make me forget prior transgressions, pile it in a heap outside my front door, lovingly douse it in gasoline, set it ablaze and walk naked in a straight line until God himself stops me.

No. Why punish yourself. I don't think it's emotional verbal diarrhea at all. I think it's a way to sort out the confusion. You may not choose to continue in public. But, I can't help but think it would be useful to keep exploring, asking questions until you can answer them with relative certainty.

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One problem, and God how great it would be if I only had one, is that I don?t have the balls.  I feel as though something must kick my feet out from under me again in order to begin to walk how, when, where and to whatever beat I want to.  An even greater problem still is not knowing where to start.  Ultimately, I bear the weight of my decisions just as I always have, as well as the even heavier weight of not making them.


Sounds like more, "Common to seek to recreate the experience in order to resolve it." Make the decision first to take the monkey off your back and stop being so hard on yourself. Cut your ties with the oppressor (parent/program). Don't do their work for them.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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Offline nm04wallaby

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Re: Walkabout/Outback Therapeutic Expeditions
« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2009, 03:48:05 AM »
I've just revisited this post for the first time in several years, bringing a number of things to mind, new and old.  First of all, I never got around to thanking those of you who took the time to offer your insights, so thank you.  If I could bring any of the likely long-lost followers of this thread up to speed, I would, but I feel a very certain sense of the narrative being lost.  I am of an age now where the linear chronology of action-reaction, the sequential story-telling of one's life, feels more like a haphazard collection of loosely-cohesive pieces than a real story.  My life in retrospect, were I its author, would be a scrapbook, not a novel.  Absent the sound, clear perspective of where and who one is -- no longer intensely cognizant of the parts which constitute the whole -- the days, weeks, months and years bleed into each other, with greater sensations of resignation, mediocrity, and a complete lack of footing; like being alone in the wilderness, my own private wilderness.  I have either forgotten, or simply have a hard time remembering, my history, my story, and am rendered all the more susceptible to stumbling over old blocks and all kinds of predatory opportunism from the world as a result.

New neuroses have entered center stage since the time of my initial posting, most notably that of acute social anxiety, the most severe cases of which result in a seldom-seen facial spasm.  Gastrointestinal distress, tightness in the jaw, recently-discovered elevated blood pressure, and small, intermittent, involuntary bodily twitches are some of the more ubiquitous symptoms.  Alcohol can provide occasional relief, which is certainly more bad news than good, as I have been known to use it precisely for that reason.  One consequence of this anxiety is an inability to be assertive, forceful, or take the proverbial reins in interpersonal affairs, especially conflicts, especially romance.  My resourcefulness, ability to articulate myself in conversation, mental acuity, decision making, creativity, enthusiasm, self-control, diligence, discipline, courage and self-confidence are all stifled by this.  I will periodically get angry at 'it' before realizing there is no 'it' to be angry at.  

But the content that concerns this forum is that which pertains to the troubled teen industry and my place within it.  That said, my current proximity to and/or opinion of my 8 weeks in Utah is essentially the same, though if it's undergone any change or revision, it has only been to hold the experience in higher retrospective esteem; something about which I still have plenty of leery-eyed feelings.  The unconscious desire to return to those extraordinary, otherworldly circumstances was a stated concern from my previous posts, and it remains a current one.  I am at a loss to determine what I need, in this case and in all cases, so those things which profess to have 'it' naturally draw my attention, Walkabout Therapeutic Expeditions or otherwise.  I'm reminded of those who seek to bring new converts into their religious fold, and while those methods are anything but foreign to me, (indeed, the hook is one so plainly cast, how could anyone not see through such a dubious pairing as engineered desperation and supposed salvation?), the subterranean forces of human beings will go where they please, when they please, with or without reason, permission, or any input from the "better judgment" of the individual.

This conundrum exists, in which I feel that any form of treatment or rehabilitation for any of these ills must consist of a stripping down of life's details -- returning to a simpler, purer place, from which to gain a clearer perspective -- coupled with the uncertainty of whether that approach is an objectively decent one, or simply a mechanistic reversion to prior programming.  I won't mix words here.  I have good memories of this experience, or rather, this experience detached from all other experience.  It could very well be responsible, at least in part, for my embrace of minimalism since the time of the program; something which I'm completely fond of and constantly wanting to improve upon.  But I am undeniably broken.  I soberly come to this conclusion on a regular basis.  It is a realization, and often a liberating one at that; the recognition of the existence of a problem as the first step to its resolution.  One of the characteristics of being broken is that when I stop to consider that I, like a faulty kitchen appliance, was sent directly to a company which specializes in overhauling and repairing this very specific piece of equipment, only to find more problems down the line than previously existed, whether or not it is appropriate to do so, I can now call into question whether they a: did not address the problems that needed fixing, or b: created completely new ones where there were none (or at least not so many) before.  If a god were my manufacturer, my warranty would be void on account of the seal being broken.  I was serviced by a presumably authorized technician (and a bonkers expensive one at that), whom I now have the benefit of, if I so choose, holding accountable for any resulting damages.  This is either a very healthy suspicion, or a very sad, transparent crutch, and it seems like neither stand to do me any immediate good.  I'm leaning toward the latter, but I think it would be foolish to rule out the gravity of those eight weeks, and the part it may have to play in the person I am today, good and bad.  At the same time, blame has that perfect wet snow consistency, perfect for hurling ball after ball at the target of one's choosing.  Once again, I'm a little astounded at how unable I am to answer such questions for myself, questions which pertain exclusively to me and my own experience, questions which I should be the best equipped to answer.  Therein lies the disconnect.  I don't remember 21, much less 16, well enough to form my own opinion.

Consequently, two forms of therapy have arrested my attention, each of which appear to stir the the human being with the longest of spoons, renowned for bringing our long-neglected, crusted, caked remains to the surface.  They are Reichian or Orgone therapy, and psychedelic therapy, accordingly.  Both are subjects I have made great strides to better understand through discussions with practitioners, reading, membership with relevant organizations, and limited personal experience.  Undergoing treatment in either is exceptionally (and increasingly) cost prohibitive at the moment, but I'm holding out for a break in the financial clouds.  In the meantime, writing does wonders, as does the simple conversation, though rarely do any probe this deep into my personal history.

It would seem that this post could serve as a closing to the thread, just as much as it could spark new discussion.  I leave that at the discretion of the community.  In any case, you have my thanks for your contributions, past or future.

Allow me to reiterate that my intentions in posting here are not to pursue medical advice, only to generate dialog with the community and to give my curiosity some much needed exercise.

-Danny N.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Ursus

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Re: Walkabout/Outback Therapeutic Expeditions
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2010, 07:19:54 PM »
Quote from: "newmy51"
New neuroses have entered center stage since the time of my initial posting, most notably that of acute social anxiety, the most severe cases of which result in a seldom-seen facial spasm. Gastrointestinal distress, tightness in the jaw, recently-discovered elevated blood pressure, and small, intermittent, involuntary bodily twitches are some of the more ubiquitous symptoms. Alcohol can provide occasional relief, which is certainly more bad news than good, as I have been known to use it precisely for that reason. One consequence of this anxiety is an inability to be assertive, forceful, or take the proverbial reins in interpersonal affairs, especially conflicts, especially romance. My resourcefulness, ability to articulate myself in conversation, mental acuity, decision making, creativity, enthusiasm, self-control, diligence, discipline, courage and self-confidence are all stifled by this. I will periodically get angry at 'it' before realizing there is no 'it' to be angry at.
Acute social anxiety ... is often recognized as one of the features of PTSD, which many folks coming out of these behavior modification programs suffer from sooner or later.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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