Author Topic: Education about forced therapy (Read 6926 times)

Anonymous · « **on:** December 01, 2009, 01:00:49 PM »

I’m posting this page to address the main point of contention between program supporters and those against it.

Specifically this is the question of whether or not therapy should be forced in an individual.

The purpose of this is to give anyone, especially parents, the opportunity to experience first hand what it is like to be forced through therapy. As well it is a chance for industry supporters to attempt to prove to parents that this is an appropriate action to take. Those who are in support of the TTI, by their own logic, should be willing to engage in therapy here to illustrate their support for a therapeutic procedure that is forced upon someone who is resistant to therapy.

To program supporters, your willingness or unwillingness to engage in this situation will be taken as a statement as to how much you really care about kids as well as how concerned they really are about creating a safe, effective therapeutic environment for teens who are being forced through this treatment. Any program supporter who is engaging in dialogue on fornits and wants to have their position taken seriously by readers will also be willing to accept the situation here.

This is especially for those parents who are feeling ambiguous about whether or not they should do this. This can be a good experience for you that can help you towards making that final decision, for any parent who is deeply concerned, loves their child and is considering taking the extreme action of forcing them into an inescapable environment designed to force change upon a teen, it will at least be worth your while to engage in the process here. You will also have the added benefit of being able to say you were willing to subject yourself to a similar circumstance that you may choose for your child.

To those who are anti- program and are engaging in dialogue with program supporters please refer them to this page. It is important to know that their arguments are invalid without submitting to the process here. If they truly believe forced therapy is effective and doesn’t contain risk to the individual and/or family they will submit to the process. ((note: please only refer those who have openly stated their supportive position on the TTI))

Pretense for therapy here includes:
Patient MUST believe that forced therapy is valid, or have ambiguous feelings about this concept. Therapy in this case is only directed at the patients belief in forced therapy, and in reforming the resulting behavior.

Therapy is consistent with therapy provided by the TTI. this means….
You must continue therapy until the therapist considers you well. Failure to do so will result in a variety of potential methods to break down your resistance including, but not limited, to isolation, physical labor, removal to a more severe program, or committed to a mental institution if the behavior can justify that position.

It will also be concluded that if you decide to leave therapy you will be making a decision likened to a program runaway in which the choice to leave therapy is also a choice to be a fugitive of the law and being individually responsible for anything that might happen to you as a result (being raped, murdered, homeless, kidnapped etc.)

Patient also understands that the process of therapy here is not transparent, keeping with TTI traditions, meaning that you must accept going through a process that you will not have full information about. It is expected that you give your 100% TRUST in the process.

Patient is expected to give 100% honesty and participation in the process.

Anyone engaging on this board WITHOUT openly stating their position will be assumed to be a program supporter and therefore admitted into the therapeutic process.

Again, to program supporters, your position is not valid without submitting to this process. Any and all TTI supporters should be reffered to this board before engaging them in any further dialogue in which they are expecting to have their position taken seriously.

Therapist is ready to assist patients in personal growth and self awareness.

Anonymous · « **Reply #1 on:** December 01, 2009, 01:12:28 PM »

There's no point arguing with program supporters without first directing them here.

Anonymous · « **Reply #2 on:** December 01, 2009, 01:28:36 PM »

Anonymous · « **Reply #3 on:** December 01, 2009, 02:52:13 PM »

[subject has engaged on board without identifying him/herself. under the above pressupositions of the program they are identifying themselves as "program supporter" and "patient". They are admitted into therapy.]

What's with the anger?

Anonymous · « **Reply #4 on:** December 01, 2009, 06:24:33 PM »

[Patient has withdrawn from the therapeutic environment, a sign of their lack of conviction for their position that therapy should be forced on people. His actions suggest that he supports a therapeutic environment in which the patient has a right to choose. His/her withdraw from the environment can be related to a teen who must run away from a program to avoid treatment yet not be able to trust his parents to call home for help. Their actions further label them as "troubled' which support the therapist view that the patient needs treatment. Failure to progress is solely blamed on the patient. Therapists procedure is a success, paid for service, the outcome verified the pretense for therapy and the beliefs of the program, patient has acted to discredit himself publicly, and upon leaving creates room for new business]

Sorry to potential patients interested in getting something out of this. Its hard to watch someone go down a bad road. Hopefully you can learn from the bad choices they are making.

Anonymous · « **Reply #5 on:** December 01, 2009, 06:34:16 PM »

Where is the ANAL TROLL? He/she/it needs serious treatment.

Whooter · « **Reply #6 on:** December 06, 2009, 10:03:07 AM »

One of the misconceptions is that since many of the kids going to these programs are not thrilled about it, not bought into it or didn’t want to go at all then that means that the therapy they receive during their stay there is considered "forced". This isn’t the case. In almost all circumstances the child ends up embracing the therapeutic process within a very short time. I think we would be hard pressed to find many teenagers who approach their parents and ask to see a therapist. If this is true than any teenager who is in therapy is being forced into it and thereby being abused by therapists around the world. Should therapy be withheld until the child becomes an adult and can clearly think for themselves? What about the kids that take their own life? Should we have insisted on a therapist forcing abuse on them with the hope the child would live or just let the child go their own path and allow them to die?

Have you ever attended an initial swim lesson for young children and then revisted a month later? These kids were not abused because they didnt want to get wet initially. They are happy and enjoying themselves even though a month earlier they were resistant. The word "abuse" is Way overused here on this forum and in 90% of the cases the word "uncomfortable" could be used in its place.

Anonymous · « **Reply #7 on:** December 06, 2009, 10:33:50 AM »

So glad you decided to come! Sounds like we have a great place to start from, so lets get to it.

Quote from: "Whooter"

One of the misconceptions is that since many of the kids going to these programs are not thrilled about it, not bought into it or didn’t want to go at all then that means that the therapy they receive during their stay there is considered "forced". This isn’t the case. In almost all circumstances the child ends up embracing the therapeutic process within a very short time. I think we would be hard pressed to find many teenagers who approach their parents and ask to see a therapist. If this is true than any teenager who is in therapy is being forced into it and thereby being abused by therapists around the world. Should therapy be withheld until the child becomes an adult and can clearly think for themselves? What about the kids that take their own life? Should we have insisted on a therapist forcing abuse on them with the hope the child would live or just let the child go their own path and allow them to die?

Have you ever attended an initial swim lesson for young children and then revisted a month later? These kids were not abused because they didnt want to get wet initially. They are happy and enjoying themselves even though a month earlier they were resistant. The word "abuse" is Way overused here on this forum and in 90% of the cases the word "uncomfortable" could be used in its place.

Is that what your thinking tells you?

Anonymous · « **Reply #8 on:** December 06, 2009, 11:06:17 AM »

Quote from: "Whooter"

What about the kids that take their own life? Should we have insisted on a therapist forcing abuse on them with the hope the child would live or just let the child go their own path and allow them to die?

Forced therapy premised on fraudulent concepts. What about the kids who tried taking their own life after this ridiculous excuse for "therapy" specifically because of what was done to them in the name of "for their own good?" Funny how the programs never acknowledge the trauma those kids experienced.

Some programs will even spin a perverse PR tale meant to cast aspersion on said kids' credibility in an attempt to stave off blame. I would call that slander. Slander on top of injury on top of insult and harm. And where's the accountability here? No such thing for programs, I guess!

Troll Control · « **Reply #9 on:** December 06, 2009, 11:20:09 AM »

Quote from: "Whooter"

One of the misconceptions is that since many of the kids going to these programs are not thrilled about it, not bought into it or didn’t want to go at all then that means that the therapy they receive during their stay there is considered "forced". This isn’t the case. In almost all circumstances the child ends up embracing the therapeutic process within a very short time. I think we would be hard pressed to find many teenagers who approach their parents and ask to see a therapist. If this is true than any teenager who is in therapy is being forced into it and thereby being abused by therapists around the world. Should therapy be withheld until the child becomes an adult and can clearly think for themselves? What about the kids that take their own life? Should we have insisted on a therapist forcing abuse on them with the hope the child would live or just let the child go their own path and allow them to die?

Have you ever attended an initial swim lesson for young children and then revisted a month later? These kids were not abused because they didnt want to get wet initially. They are happy and enjoying themselves even though a month earlier they were resistant. The word "abuse" is Way overused here on this forum and in 90% of the cases the word "uncomfortable" could be used in its place.

I wouldn't put too much weight on anything Whooter says. He lies a lot and has a financial stake in programs.

Specifically, he uses Juvenile Justice funds to put kids convicted of crimes who were in jail into Aspen programs where they can mingle freely with your children while receiving no therapy and have nobody watching them, like the kid from MBA who raped a little girl there due to the lack of supervision and mixing convicted criminals with more or less normal kids.

He has no education or background in psychology and has absolutely no clue what he's talking about. he just tries to spin things to look "less bad" by providing false analogies, false testimony (posting as dozens of personas) and false "facts and figures" that were generated by marketing teams instead of clinicians. He's a phony and should not be listened to for any advice or opinion.

Whooter · « **Reply #10 on:** December 06, 2009, 11:25:36 AM »

Quote from: "John Edgar"

Quote from: "Whooter"
What about the kids that take their own life? Should we have insisted on a therapist forcing abuse on them with the hope the child would live or just let the child go their own path and allow them to die?

Forced therapy premised on fraudulent concepts. What about the kids who tried taking their own life after this ridiculous excuse for "therapy" specifically because of what was done to them in the name of "for their own good?" Funny how the programs never acknowledge the trauma those kids experienced.

Some people do not respond well to therapy and will end up taking their own lives anyway, even after intensive treatment to help them. As far as therapy being identified as the primary cause of a person taking their own life, I haven’t seen this documented anywhere. I dont think we have ever seen a case where the program was identified as the cause of a person taking their own life, but we have evidence that the program/therapy has reversed and eliminated the suicidal tendencies in adolescents.

Troll Control · « **Reply #11 on:** December 06, 2009, 11:27:09 AM »

Quote from: "Guest"

I wouldn't put too much weight on anything Whooter says. He lies a lot and has a financial stake in programs.

Specifically, he uses Juvenile Justice funds to put kids convicted of crimes who were in jail into Aspen programs where they can mingle freely with your children while receiving no therapy and have nobody watching them, like the kid from MBA who raped a little girl there due to the lack of supervision and mixing convicted criminals with more or less normal kids.

He has no education or background in psychology and has absolutely no clue what he's talking about. he just tries to spin things to look "less bad" by providing false analogies, false testimony (posting as dozens of personas) and false "facts and figures" that were generated by marketing teams instead of clinicians. He's a phony and should not be listened to for any advice or opinion.

Notice Whooter cites no sources, just "I'm not aware..." Well he's not aware of anything that has to do with treatment. He's an uneducated hack just like the "therapists' at Aspen programs.

Anonymous · « **Reply #12 on:** December 06, 2009, 12:25:26 PM »

Whooter, it sounds like you are being resistant to waht the group is saying. I'm wondering if you are willig give me a direct answer to the question i asked you about your first statement.

Is that what your thinking tells you?

[Therapist identifies patiets resistance]

Anonymous · « **Reply #13 on:** December 06, 2009, 01:47:44 PM »

No Eliscu2, I am not Whooter, I don't want him to take in any misconceptions about him in the group.

Whooter, I know you're probably a bit uncomfortable here, but this doesn't have to be a fight. You can relax, open up and be yourself.

Do you think you could answer my first question? If not maybe you could share a little bit about the feelings you are having.

Whooter · « **Reply #14 on:** December 06, 2009, 01:59:31 PM »

Quote from: "Eliscu2"

Swimming has the Potential to be FUN!
There was nothing FUN about ELAN!
FUCK OFF Whooter you started this thread so you could argue with yoursef again.

Now that was therapeudic.

No this isn’t my thread. Kids who are starting out in swimming or a program dont know if they are going to enjoy it eventually. Some kids never get use to the mucky water and are cold all the time and never enjoy it, just go thru the motions until it is over. Others move up through all the levels and become a life Guard in highschool. The same with programs. Some kids never get anything out of it like many here on fornits and others look back and remember the friends they made, the white water rafting trips, their personal growth, helpful staff and trips to Costa Rica etc. They dont focus on all the negative aspects like others do.

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