All kinds of libel from Willie(karenInDallas) on ST

[psy]

Shit!  well i guess i'm just bursting with negativity today.  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:

From: jena@woodbury.com; lon@woodbury.com
Subject: StrugglingTeens Discussion Moderator Alert
 
A user (psy at IP 70.174.129.21) has requested that you review the following post by WillieNelson in a forum you moderate:
As for Fornits- Psy, you are over here on ST promoting Fornits as a "Second Opinion". Perhaps you should warn these parents how they will be treated over there. Perhaps you should mention that the moderators over there (of which there are many) do everything possible to track down the identity of any parent-posters. They check IP addresses every time you post and compare them to the IP addresses on these posts here on ST. They then look up who has the IP addresses registered. Then they do a Google search on you and print out all of your information, inclcuding addresses and phone numbers, your kids' names and locations. Then they send you harrassing IMs and emails, as well as phone calls. Then they threaten to notify your employer that you are posting during work hours. They they publish disgusting pictures claiming they are of the person they have "outed". Next they make up things such as that your spouse is gay and that your post-program child is a druggie and a flunkie. You get to have whole threads dedicated just to YOU! Ask Anne from Minnesota and KareninDallas(my former log-in before I had to change it due to Fornits). This occurs if you challenge their views or try to offer positive feedback on a particular program. It also occurs if you do what I did and drop to their level to fight back. If you are like Exhausted, and want to get validation from anti-program people, you are welcome on Fornits. You will get lots of strokes. Otherwise, your experience will be exactly like Anne's and mine. It's a shame, because there ARE bad programs and they SHOULD be shut down. NO child should be abused in any way. Oh- I should mention that if your child has done well in a program and was not abused, this is merely a fiction. The child will eventually realize that he or she was, in fact, abused, but suppressed it to appease the parents so he or she would not be sent away again.
The user's reason for this request is: The information within is libelous. Please edit or delete this post. It is also offensive to me. If you want proof the information is libelous... you deleted it when you deleted my last post.

to which Kristie responded:

Psy,
 
This to me sounds like Getcha Gotcha? and your epiphany was not ?proof? of anything. This post may be ?offensive? to you, but it is not a personal attack on you, and therefore I see no reason to delete or edit it.
 
Kristie

PS? you might as her to edit it if you feel so strongly about it? she seems to want to make peace of sorts?

to which i responded:

Very well.  I will do that.  She and i have been chatting recently and i have no reason to be cross with here.  My post was not an attempt to attack her, but rather an attempt to defend Fornits from what I felt were false accusations.

Jena used this rationale when she forbade specific names of programs on Fornits:

"They made outrageous claims which could not be verified, or worse were verified to be totally untrue...The final straw was when a poster made a very serious accusation against a particular program, claiming first hand knowledge of the incident. After it was investigated, the poster admitted to making it up. That's all well and good, but in the meantime, there had been significant damage done to a totally reputable program."

From my perspective, it seems as if false accusations, against programs = bad, false accusations against Fornits = good.  Please explain to me why this is, because frankly, it confuses me.

PS...  It also seems odd to me that an entire thread of Fornits bashing is allowed on ST if other discussion forums are not allowed to be mentioned.

[Antigen]

a selfish need to have them at home

Wow! How selfish to need to be close to your kids. Anne, know why I'm not rockin out on the bay at your li'll hotel right about now instead of shivering in the frozen north? That's right, cause I'm just that pathologically selfish, that's all!  :roll:

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."

[exhausted]

Hmmm...well I can't reply there because the threads locked, as they all seem to be avid readers of the hated Fornites I'l reply here...

ARE YOU READING THIS.....(those who attacked me - ish)

You don't know jack about how my family got into this situation - how dare you presume that it's not difficult to see how.....it is very difficult to see how because I live with it & I don't know at what point it turned this way.

Justification....ok, you want me to justify why I want to keep my boys at home and do my absolute upmost to help them here, amongst their family, friends, school and surroundings that are familiar to them? Out of luck birdy, I don't have to justify a thing to you, I know my kids, you don't
So what if the kid ends up flipping burgers, if they are happy then it makes no difference as to what job they end up in, and any kid who is really bright can go back to school later on when they are secure in themselves as adults, you concentrate on the whole education thing the whole time, it seems that being ablle to tell the neighbours your child is a lawyer/doctor/freakin millionaire is mnore important than their stability ... go ahead, keep your social standing while your kid is being looked after by someone else - evidently that's far more important than seeing your child well adjusted and happy.

So it seems I just let my kids run riot and accept their behaviour without helping them, Holy Moses  - you know what? It would be easier of it were true, I wouldn't be on the edge of total breakdown knocking on every door trying to get help, trying to seek answers, trying to find out what exactly it is I have to do to help my kids if I was happy to just let it roll by me in the hope they'll turn out okay, only I know what i go through on a daily basis trying so hard with them, who do you think you are teling me I don't try to help them, when were you last at my house or living my life huh?
I do not 'blow off' their behaviour, i try to deal with it, as a parent it is ME who tries to deal wiht it, my children are not dogs who are going to be sent to obedience classes and come back all house trained and waggy tailed, even if they were, don't you know the owners have to learn how to continue with what the dog has learned?

You are way out of line - I don't criticise parents who have sent their kids away when they've done really dangerous shit, to both themselves and others, to me when  a kid gets to that point you have 2 options, try a program when EVERYTHING else has failed or see them go to jail, but sending them away because they are not getting the grades you want, the girlfriend you want, the career path you want is absolutely ludricous - they are not your posessions to mould into mini-you's, they are people who have to make their opwn choices in life and accept there are consequences, both good and bad in every decision that is made

Give me a happy burger flipper anyday over a miserable scarred and hate filled 'mother's pride'

[psy]

Well Exhausted.  That's one post that's for damn sure to get banned on st.    This just about sums it up:
 :nworthy:  :nworthy:  :nworthy:

I would be more verbose but i'm feeling a bit under the weather.

[MightyAardvark]

Deleted

[Anonymous]

Drama queens.

[Anonymous]

... I don't know at what point it turned this way.

Justification....ok, you want me to justify why I want to keep my boys at home and do my absolute upmost to help them here, amongst their family, friends, school and surroundings that are familiar to them? Out of luck birdy, I don't have to justify a thing to you, I know my kids, you don't
So what if the kid ends up flipping burgers, if they are happy then it makes no difference as to what job they end up in, and any kid who is really bright can go back to school later on when they are secure in themselves as adults, you concentrate on the whole education thing the whole time, it seems that being ablle to tell the neighbours your child is a lawyer/doctor/freakin millionaire is mnore important than their stability ... go ahead, keep your social standing while your kid is being looked after by someone else - evidently that's far more important than seeing your child well adjusted and happy.

So it seems I just let my kids run riot and accept their behaviour without helping them, Holy Moses  - you know what? It would be easier of it were true, I wouldn't be on the edge of total breakdown knocking on every door trying to get help, trying to seek answers, trying to find out what exactly it is I have to do to help my kids if I was happy to just let it roll by me in the hope they'll turn out okay, only I know what i go through on a daily basis trying so hard with them, who do you think you are teling me I don't try to help them, when were you last at my house or living my life huh?
I do not 'blow off' their behaviour, i try to deal with it, as a parent it is ME who tries to deal wiht it, my children are not dogs who are going to be sent to obedience classes and come back all house trained and waggy tailed, even if they were, don't you know the owners have to learn how to continue with what the dog has learned?

You are way out of line - I don't criticise parents who have sent their kids away when they've done really dangerous shit, to both themselves and others, to me when  a kid gets to that point you have 2 options, try a program when EVERYTHING else has failed or see them go to jail, but sending them away because they are not getting the grades you want, the girlfriend you want, the career path you want is absolutely ludricous - they are not your posessions to mould into mini-you's, they are people who have to make their opwn choices in life and accept there are consequences, both good and bad in every decision that is made

Give me a happy burger flipper anyday over a miserable scarred and hate filled 'mother's pride'

STILL, your kids are clearly not "well adjusted and happy"!  Is that out of  luck birdy?  Or is that something else?

I have met many many parents who have "sent their kids away", and not one did it because the kid wasn't getting the grades, girfirend, boyfriend, or career path the parent wanted.

Right now, the second best thing for your kids and for yourself would be for you all to go away for a week or so - separately.  You all need a break from current behaviors and patterns.  perhaps the kids could go camping.  perhaps you could go to a warm beach.

Take a break!!!!

[exhausted]

Pretty much Mighty Aaardvark, reading between the lines it seems I should be justifying why I wont send my kids to a program - don't get me wrong, I'm open minded enough to know that I could send them and it could be the best thing ever that happened to them, I'm just not prepared to take that risk at this stage.......I feel we as a family can work through this

Guest you are right, we do need a break from each other, the kids may appreciate me more and I would possibly come back to tackle our problems with fresh eyes and a more alert mind

You are also correct that my kids are not well adjusted and are certainly not happy, which is why I'm working really hard to help them break the mould of this current behaviour pattern, they are really unhappy at who they are, they need me, their mum to help them find themselves as people,to find what makes them happy, self esteem is a major issue, imagine telling your skanky 'mates' you don't want to commit a crime or make someone else's life miserable, the horror! Can you imagine being called a chicken or a grass??? I know, stupid isn't it? It's really that simple, simple when you look at it from an adult perspective - not quite so when you are 13 & 14 yr old boys, they don't know how to break the mould, they are afraid of breaking the mould, to them it's terrifying!! So it's up to me to help them .... I simply cannot see how a program can do this.

So for now I am not concentrating on their stupid school grades, I am not worrying about what they'll do for a living, I am worrying about giving them the opportunity to stay out of jail, away from drugs and a life of crime, right now, this is the most important thing to me - we as a family must pull together and work on this constantly, I am seeing little changes here & there, that mould isn't broken - but the cracks are appearing

If you read through some of the posts you will see people are worrying about their kids grades, their choice of boyfriend/girlfriend.....wasn't one lad sent away because he changed his girlfriend and didn't want to be a doctor, I mean c'mon!! So what???

But to be fair I've had a lot of support form various ST posters, they have been really good and insightful, I've seen light at the end of the tunnel through some of them.....hoever, if I don't agree with something I say so, I won't fall in with what everyone else wants me to, you tell me your kid is taking drugs and is killing himself, mugging ppl for the fix, then i'd tell you I think you're doing the right thing sending him to a hospital or program, I won't agree it's the right thing to do if he/she is being a sulk off teenager and totally disrespectful, it's not on, I wouldn't suggest putting up with it, but sending them away for it, no.....

So - don't turn on me because I am trying to get insight from both parties, parents, kids, ex program parenst, ex program kids, I need to know the WHOLE picture before I take further steps, after all i am deciding my child's future well being ultimately.

[Anonymous]

Do you have the financial resources to afford a program in the US? That would have been a minimum of five grand a month. If you have that available then I'm sure there are all sorts of solutions. Do you have that kind of money available, because medical insurance never would have paid for a program in the states. You would have been looking at fifty grand easy for a year's treatment.

[Anonymous]

Program parents are proxy child abusers. If I paid someone to kill an associate of mine, I would be charged with murder. Why then when a parent pays a huge sum of money to someone to hurt their child, emotionally and physically, suddenly the pity party begins and they are the victims? Don't fall for their bullshit. They hurt kids, and build financial empires while doing so. All the while believing they are societies chosen few, to clean up the rest of us scum. Struggling Teens is an infectious, disease like plague of a forum that spreads it's death spores on anyone who listens. Fuck 'em all to hell.

[exhausted]

Do you have the financial resources to afford a program in the US? That would have been a minimum of five grand a month. If you have that available then I'm sure there are all sorts of solutions. Do you have that kind of money available, because medical insurance never would have paid for a program in the states. You would have been looking at fifty grand easy for a year's treatment.

No i don't have that sort of money, it'd be better spent on affording a private specialist here in the UK .... i just couldn't send my kids away to another country knowing i wouldn't get to see them when they needed me to - there is no way on this earth I'd sleep at night not knowing how they're doing, how they feel, what's happening in their daily lives .... I know I've been called selfish in my need to have them home with me, maybe it is selfish i don't know, what i do know is that they need me more than ever throguh turbulent times and I feel I am unselfish enough to put up with the crap they give me to see them through this, and hopefully come out the other side.....it's a gamble, but so is sending them away, no one can know the outcome either way, only time will tell.

[Anonymous]

Selfish, according to karenindallas. That biatch is crazy. It takes crazy to know crazy, and she takes the cake. Maybe it was good her kids got away, who knows.

[Anonymous]

I can smell her from here. Phew!  :rofl:

[Anonymous]

What you smell is that pile of shit that you're sitting in.

[Anonymous]

What I smell is a cunt that needs a good douche. Like you, for instance.  :rofl: