Author Topic: Father and son WC  (Read 13487 times)

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Offline Badad

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Father and son WC
« on: December 08, 2006, 10:31:42 PM »
New here.
  Im a father of a 14 year old boy who reminds me of myself.  Except I was already a major pot head at 11 years old.  I Hated anyone with authority.  Planned on a career of selling drugs and corruption blah blah  blah . Was emancipated at 17.  And have completely fucked my life up.  My sisters are doctors.  Im a blue collar looser.

So you say I should never have become a father?  I agree.    But whats done is done..  Right?  I love him regardless.

After researching WC's it sounds like "I" need the reality check for even thinking about this.  So where do I go to get MY ass kicked, humiliated, abused and reminded how big of a dirtbag I am?  Somewhere where my son could even watch?

Would he then forgive me for the abusive things I have said and done?  Maybe.. Would I?

Is there a WC that both of us could attend and benefit from? Because after reading here.  I would never send him anywhere alone.  Some where that teaches character building, family values and Self esteem.  And in a beautiful remote area?

Or should I just take him and go alone?
« Last Edit: January 15, 2007, 08:10:33 PM by Guest »

Offline Oz girl

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« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2006, 12:33:26 AM »
Do you have anything in common with the boy? A like of a mutual sport or something? Perhaps you could follow that together or play. Even if it is just a casual kick of the footy in the park. Make it a regular standing activity.

You said you work in a blue collar industry. Are you good mechanically? If it is the boy's thing then mabey you could fix up and work on an old bomb of a car together.

Or you could see whether he has an interest in some sort of trade and perhaps he could get a part time job in a related industry. If he has a stubborn independent streak this may help him to feel like more of a man. Getting a pay packet every week is a real motivator for some kids.

Or you could look at some kind of outward bound type programme. they have an option to go on that as a family in the US Below is a link you can look at.

Try not to be so hard on yourself. A total loser would not even be involved in the kids life or would take the easy option of sending him off to a wlderness hell hole without really looking into it to "save his life". It sounds like in spite of your unruly youth you grew up to be ok. Perhaps you could do with more confidence. After all you are a role model for the kid. He does not need to hear that his nearest male influence has such a low opinion of himself. Try and dwell on what you are doing right as a dad

http://outwardboundwilderness.org/pages ... num=KBF721
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
n case you\'re worried about what\'s going to become of the younger generation, it\'s going to grow up and start worrying about the younger generation.-Roger Allen

Offline Deborah

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Father and son WC
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2006, 01:59:32 AM »
Great suggestions OG.

If you're going to consider OB or any other wilderness experience, even if you attend with him, atleast read this thread so you have a heads up on potential dangers. Don't let your common sense be overridden by program policy.

Outward Bound
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... ck&start=0
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
gt;>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Hidden Lake Academy, after operating 12 years unlicensed will now be monitored by the state. Access information on the Federal Class Action lawsuit against HLA here: http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=17700

Offline Badad

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« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2006, 12:02:04 PM »
Thanks People.

I'm in Iowa.  But I want to look for a warmer climate and stunning scenery for winter break maybe.

 I work in "the dungeon."  Its a state job. Loud ,and full of chemicals and back stabbers. No windows and a shiester boss. I could go on and on.  But again. I blame myself for not pursuing a professional career when I was young.  I was to busy getting stoned.  I'm stuck there.  I have bills to pay but it does have good benefits. Health and retirement. I am good with my hands and math.  I like to work on my house and hobbies.  Remote control boats, gliders,choppers etc. My son thinks it boring.  Unless we strap a gun on it.

I bought a house in a nice part of town because of the school district.  But I had to buy a fixer-upper to afford it.  My house is my second job.  Another thing I blame myself for.  I should have bought a condo and signed my life away so I could have spent more time with my family.  But I didn't and still have allot of work to do. But I owe nothing.  My son thinks its boring to help dad and would rather spend hours playing his Xbox.  Maybe if I offer to pay him?  But I always thought that I shouldn't pay for chores.

Things in common.   We both like to play the drums.  He is sounding good. I played in many bands.  That was my goal when I was young. I spent allot of time playing and it was fun.  But I never "became a rock star" like I wanted.  Another thing I blame myself for.  If I would have spent that time pursuing a professional career..

So it feels like I have dug myself into a hole.  Or painted myself into a corner.

I will look into the outward bound programs.

Thanks again.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #4 on: December 09, 2006, 12:23:57 PM »
I'm not even sure what, if anything, is really wrong with him in the first place.

 You can do a fair bit of kicking yourself for considering WCs, but you weren't crazy enough to go through with it so don't kick yourself too hard.

Going out into the wilderness for a few weeks with him might end up being worthwhile. Hell, it might even be an adventure. But it's not going to bring you closer together and it's not going to fix anything. Why would it? What are these mystical healing properties that this sort of thing is supposed to achieve?

Odds are, you take him out into the wilderness and you're just going to remind him why he'd rather not be with you. You take him out to the middle of boring-ass nowhere for a few weeks and then take him home to his Xbox and his friends and yeah, he's probably going to regret ever going with you. I don't know him, so I'm going to make a generalized guess at what most kids are likely to say: "Wow, that was a waste of time. Dad's getting weird. I better stay away from him."
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anne Bonney

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Father and son WC
« Reply #5 on: December 09, 2006, 01:03:59 PM »
I had a great experience with my oldest daughter when she was 'I hate everything about you' years.  We went down to the Keys for 2 weeks.  If you make the trip something he's interested in, it can bring you closer together.  She loved the water but was scared to death of sharks.  We went out on the reefs and snorkeled, she saw sharks and conquered her fear and thought that was really cool.  She had a great story to tell her friends.   We bummed around Key West for a couple of days and I just kind of let her decide where we went and what we did.  We learned a lot of things we hadn't known about each other and she found out that Mom wasn't such a clueless, boring bitch afterall.  It didn't solve everything, or anything for that matter, but it made things a little easier to deal with.  She saw that I wasn't just out to control her and make her life miserable.  It's easy to get caught up in the day to day stuff and we'd get short with each other which would lead to knock down, drag out fights.  They seemed to happen less often and with less intensity after that.  It was a start at building an adult relationship with her that was based on mutual respect for each other and our differences.  She saw that I respected the fact that she was becoming an adult.  She still scared the crap out of me after that, but like I said...it was a little easier to talk to her and deal with situations that came up.  It was a start.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
traight, St. Pete, early 80s
AA is a cult http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-cult.html

The more boring a child is, the more the parents, when showing off the child, receive adulation for being good parents-- because they have a tame child-creature in their house.  ~~  Frank Zappa

Offline Deborah

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Father and son WC
« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2006, 03:59:13 PM »
Quote from: ""Three Springs Waygookin""
The big thing is what you have lined up afterwards. DEBS! Scream at DJ for some FFT links will you? I am hoping he has some up to date information that might have something more regional for Badad.That there feller knows a thing or two.

What state are you from anyway Badad?


http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... nal#202609

And the thread on FFT that you initiated gookie
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... 911#199911

DJ: If your kid cannot be treated in the community, then it is appropriate to place them in a mental hospital.
My point is that if your kid requires out of home placement, then they are, by definition, out of the scope of treatment for WT, period.
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... nal#182807

And on the ills of coercion in captivity
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p= ... rick#16936
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
gt;>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Hidden Lake Academy, after operating 12 years unlicensed will now be monitored by the state. Access information on the Federal Class Action lawsuit against HLA here: http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=17700

Offline Badad

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« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2006, 04:11:50 PM »
I have more issues than he does.  Im talking to a shrink.

He was diagnosed with ADHD and ODD when he was in 3rd grade.  The latest sign of trouble was last year in 8th grade.  We only asked him if things in school were going OK.  I was so busy with my second job (the house) I didnt take the time to follow up and make sure things were as good as he claimed. My wife also works. We, my wife and I, were still smoking pot back then.  He ended up failing 5 classes.  He went to summer school only to fail them again. The school didnt want him back until he made up the classes elsewhere.  My wifes sister (Pat) & husband offered to take him up to minneapolis to a charter school.  He passed all the classes but had many disciplinary problems.  Throwing things in class.  Swearing. Stealing. Trying to be cool.   I still dont know all the details. But I will when he returns this weekend. Pat couldnt control him and has given up.  It was a situation she could not handle.

Pat spent at least 6 hours a day between school and home working with him.  And the charter school had small 15 student classes.  The public school he will attend here has around 30 students per class.  I know he will be to shy or embarrassed to ask questions.  And is already behind because the trimester started 2 weeks ago.

I hope to hire I younger Tudor he can get along with.

Im just so worried about him because he has no goals.  When I was his age I was into modeling, BMX (I was expert) and practiced drums for hours a day.

How do I motivate him? And help him realize that its so important to use his time wisely? Because He wont have the time when hes my age.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Oz girl

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« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2006, 02:10:12 AM »
You sound really caring and hard working. the only thing i would add is that given the cost of a Wilderness programme is that i would put the money you were going to spend on it, if it is something you already have, aside for his higher education.

This way even if he spends a few years completely fucking up but eventually comes out of it, he will still something set aside to help him go to college or learn a trade.

You mentioned that you thought about paying your son but feel he should help anyway. Do you give him pocket money or pay for stuff he wants above basic needs like food, clothes and school stuff? like x box games and cds anyway? if so you could just have him earn the EQ in cash by working on the house with you. He is still learning responsibility and hard work this way.

Good luck.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
n case you\'re worried about what\'s going to become of the younger generation, it\'s going to grow up and start worrying about the younger generation.-Roger Allen

Offline Nihilanthic

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« Reply #9 on: December 10, 2006, 03:36:58 AM »
The biggest thing that everyone tends to miss is you can not FORCE IT.

You can not FORCE a bond, or FORCE therapy!

Also, some 'camp' or 'program' will not 'fix' a person like a shop or a mechanic can fix a machine. A person is a person is a person, there is no black magic, voodoo, 'fixit' or whatnot that will just make him "work" like some person or entity (society?) thinks he should.

Well, that and "wilderness" has no magical therapeutic value. Its mostly used because its an extreme environment for city/suburbanite kids, offers great ways to push them emotionally and isolate them, make them suffer, and let you get away with doing things where they have zero contact with the outside world, and reduce the chances of running away.

The "wilderness effect" spoken of on ST is no more than a "program effect".

I am glad that you're willing to admit that its not all his fault, that parents share responsibilty for their children - but you can't turn to an industry full of quackery, mind-FUCK nonsense and greedy charlatans selling snakeoil to get help. You need to work on his terms, because its his mind and feelings and his issues, not force him using circumstance or a harsh, isolated environment where he has to rely on you or a group of 'counselors' with gay injun-ripoff names to survive.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Badad

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« Reply #10 on: December 10, 2006, 11:57:11 AM »
Thanks so much.  I agree with most that has been said here.  Im glad I didnt take the advice to "stay away from here" from the Woodbury forums.

We dont make allot of money. The cost of one years tuition at any of the so called "good" RTC's is more than we make in a year. Yet I was willing to sign my life away to help my son.

Quote from: ""Oz girl""

This way even if he spends a few years completely fucking up but eventually comes out of it, he will still something set aside to help him go to college or learn a trade.


Good luck.


Oz girl..  Your statement worries me.  Because when I was 17 I sold drugs.  A informant finally got me busted and I joined the coast guard (with visions of finding bales of dope on the beach) to avoid prosecution. So instead of going to college I ended up in boot camp.  I got my ass kicked in boot camp as I was demoted from one company to another for disciplinary issues.  I could have quit.  But I knew what awaited if I returned home.  I didnt "come out of it".  And after 4 years in the coast guard I had little to show for it. The CG runs off the DOT which at that time was almost bankrupt and the school I was promised closed.

This was a big stumbling block I dont wish my son to experience. But he knows and has seen first hand what drugs and alcohol can do to a person.

The FFT sounds good.  How do I go about setting this up?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Oz girl

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« Reply #11 on: December 10, 2006, 03:31:14 PM »
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
n case you\'re worried about what\'s going to become of the younger generation, it\'s going to grow up and start worrying about the younger generation.-Roger Allen

Offline Badad

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« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2007, 07:42:10 PM »
FFT isn't available unless my son is in the juvenile system.

Things have slowly reverted back to what they used to be and worse since he got back.  He makes his mom cry on a daily basis.  And just got done tearing his room apart. Then he said he was leaving forever.  But returned 1/2 hr later to eat and continue his rein.

Another 4 years of this?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #13 on: January 15, 2007, 07:48:19 PM »
Got back from where, Badad?
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Offline Badad

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« Reply #14 on: January 15, 2007, 07:59:20 PM »
He was up in minneapolis with my wifes sister for one trimester at a charter school. She (pat) finally gave up.

I started looking for schools again.  But Im glad I came back here to remind me what most of them are like.

But my wife and I are on the edge of sanity/divorce.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »