Academy at Swift River - Information Needed - IMPORTANT

[Anonymous]

Deborah,
           Of course I don't live on campus, but we are up there quite frequently in between our resolutions. ACtually, I have been up there on "regular days". I also have a network of other parents who do the same. We all check in on all of the kids we know. I usually take kids aside and talk to them, how is it going, any messages to their parents etc. So, I get updates from people other than staff. We also get 2 phone calls a week from our son, And lastly, when he was home last month AND this month, we had a heart-to-heart talk about ASR and how he is treated. We have always been close in that way and he assures me that he is not being mistreated.

        My only point is that I have more up-to-date knowledge about the day to day goings on. I am constantly e-mailing his therapist, and the academic director and they are very repsonsive. I may disagree with petty little issues but I am always e-mailed back immediately.

  The only way to know for sure how students are being treated, is to plant a spy there to report back, since obviously you won't believe what you are hearing. I have no reason to lie or defend ASR. There are policies I don't agree with and I do make it clear. I seriously doubt that you will believe anything that I have to say. Keep this is mind, I have entrusted my most precious gift to ASR, something that I wouldn't take lightly. The boy that was home 2 weeks ago is a boy that I haven't seen in many,many years. If you are a parent, then hopefully you can understand that I would NEVER send my son to a place that I felt uncomfortable with, Hope this helps give you my perspective, I am not here to cause trouble, just to present a side that I am familar with.





   AS for the 2002 study, you know as well as I do that a lot can change in 4 years. Also, I am sure that you have read Dave Marcus' book which was published in 2002. The administration has deifinetly changed (for the better). Also, ASR has a staff person hired soley to follw-up on all ASR students, post ASR. That report should be ready soon.

[Deborah]

Shapiro's study was posted at ST as a reference as recently as two months ago.
http://www.strugglingteens.com/artman/p ... 5288.shtml

They made no mention that the information was outdated or inaccurate, or that any changes had been made at ASR.

No I haven't read Marcus's book but it was discussed here, ad nauseum. I have read excerpts online and find it interesting that a world affairs journalist is now promoting himself as a parenting expert.
This critique was particularly interesting:
http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib ... teens.html

*Families arrive at the Academy at Swift River so ready to get their unruly child out of the house that few ask for statistics demonstrating a successful track record.
Good thing. The school, located in a former dairy, is run by a for-profit company and does not compile such figures.

*One day, a student has an apparent breakthrough in therapy. Soon after, she's having sex with a classmate in the bathroom.

*One unorthodox punishment is to withhold spices ? including salt ? from students' food.

*Swift River revolves around ritual, yet the staff struggles, and sometimes fails, to keep order. The intensity of the work leads to burnout. One beloved teacher is later spotted by a former student working in a New York deli.

*The only misfit in this well-crafted book is the title: It's unclear what it takes to pull these kids through. Counselors acknowledge some would outgrow their problems without Swift River. And one kid who absorbs all the nurturing Swift River can provide still ends up dead of an overdose.

TheWho never could tell me the source Marcus cited which might support his fear mongering "Skyrocketing Suicide Rate" comment. Might you be able to provide that information?

If you have more up to date information, then share what specifically has changed.

[Anonymous]

Hi Deborah,
              I will check in the Dave Marcus book later on today and let you know if anything comes up (again this info if from 2001).

   I can dispell the witholding of spices, particularly salt. I think that rumor was when ASR had the wilderness component. Salt is  necessary physiologically, and it helps prevent dehydration. I have seen that the kids get a gatorade-like drink at meals. I have eaten there many times since August and the food is good. Sage has improved nutrition by marking foods as red, yellow and green and there is always a salad bar, vegetarian selection and usually a deli bar. Fresh fruit is ALWAYS available 24/7, as is the drink dispensor of juices etc.
  I can't think where the rumor of sleeping in the janitor's room came from. I think the best thing that happened was the administartion overhaul (esp getting rid of the Benzs'). I did contact Dave Marcus before we sent our son, and he was honest that ASR had positives and certainly its share of negatives (as ALL schools will do).
        I will be more than happy to answer any questions that you may have. I am honest and when parents call me for references, I give cons along with pros. My major complaint (and I have voiced this many times, is that the kids seem bored on the weekends. A new residential suoervisor was recently hired to remedy this and it seems much better now. This was primarilly in the winter, so now that it is nice outside, it is much better. My son is into basketball and goes into town to scrimmage against another team weekly. I also am impressed with the psychiatrists and nursing on site (from 7am-10pm)and at night 7 days a week. A nurse is always on call. I also like the drug abuse counsleor who is ther full-time. It was the only TBS we looked at that had one.
Deborah, I know that I sound like a program parent, but I am being totally honest about what I have seen. I have no alterior motives other than loving my son and doing what we feel was needed in our particular case. Please feel free to ask any questions that I can help you with!
Again, thanks for not bashing me. We are on the same side in that we want what is best for our kids.

[Troll Control]

On 2006-06-28 07:35:00, Dysfunction Junction wrote:

"

On 2006-06-28 06:43:00, Anonymous wrote:


"DJ,


          As for therapist qualifications (which is the MAIN reason we chose ASR) our son's therapist has a BS in Science from UMAss,an MSW in Clinical SOcial WOrk from SMith and A post graduate fellowshhip at Harvard. In addition, she has lots of experieces counseling and educating both kids and adults.


I would think that this makes her quite qualified to counsel. I would also urge you to check out the other current therapists who also have good credentials.





   As for the academics, a 75% turnover is due to the small number of teachers on staff, so the number looks worse than it is. One very qualified teache is on Maternity leave, and one is pursuing graduate school work in her field. Just a quick note, we personally did not choose ASR for the acdemics (I would have chosen a private school for that). His QPA and test scores are quite good and he will get into a good 4 year program next year.


 


    As for the LGAT style seminars, if you read my posts, they have changed the format to make it more positive and self-esteem building over the past month or two. So yes, you do need to do some research in this department before passing judgement on current practices at ASR since 2002.





  My only point is that it is unfair to group all TBS/RTC programs as abusive and uncaring, I can't speak for other programs but only first hand from our experience. There is no perfect school (at home or away).





"

I actually was talking about counselors, not therapists.  There are zero licensed counselors and many with substandard education or none at all.



As to the teachers, there are at least two on staff with no degrees whatsoever.  How can this be happening?  How can someone be qualified to teach without even having a degree?  Did you ever have a highschool teacher with no more education than you had at the time?  It's absurd to defend this.  



75% turnover rate was for all staff, not just teachers.



As for the seminars, they have zero therapeutic value.  The very premise they are based upon is ineffective and damaging.  Making some changes to the tone/format may help reduce damage, but hardly increases effectiveness.



So, what we're talking about is the people who mange your child's life on a day to day basis.  People with no degrees and no qualifications in many cases.  For the money being spent, why can't your child have access to quality care and education?
"

Parent, I see you skipped over these facts.  Can you address these items, please?

[Deborah]

***I can dispell the witholding of spices, particularly salt. I think that rumor was when ASR had the wilderness component. Salt is necessary physiologically, and it helps prevent dehydration.

What rumor? It apparently was stated in Marcus?s book. And yes, why would they deny salt as punishment in a wilderness program where dehydration is a problem. It?s a common practice in WPs and several kids have died dehydration? I think that knowledge has been common for hundreds, if not thousands, of years.

If Shapiro and Marcus's works are outdated and inaccurate, why are they consistently posted to support ASR? Do you refer those potential parents to these works?

Re: food and Sage Food Service- here?s an analysis of what they served at HLA. A staff member accused an 04 grad of lying about the lack of quality and vegetarian options.
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=75#85408

Does it matter that fruit and drinks are available 24/7? I read that no food was allowed outside the cafeteria, and there was no eating between meals.

Sleeping on the floor of the night security?s office wasn?t a rumor. It was stated, as I quoted, in Shapiro?s study. This is another common practice in programs.

I?m not sure you will be happy to answer questions. I?ve asked you several that you?ve avoided. You could start with outlining the old techniques and what they were replaced with. And why this occurred.

***I also am impressed with the psychiatrists and nursing on site (from 7am-10pm)and at night 7 days a week.

Two psych are listed- Cohen and Newman, both listed as ?consulting?. That usually implies they aren?t there on a daily basis. I don?t see a drug abuse counselor listed. Newman?s bio states he?s there two days a week, and Cohen sees kids throughout the week.

***I also like the drug abuse counsleor who is ther full-time. It was the only TBS we looked at that had one.

I don?t see a drug abuse counselor listed. Who is it?

And to revisit the Wilderness issue. Here?s what I?ve read:
Jan 2003  New  3-week ?Transition Program? directly following completion of ?Passages Wilderness Phase?.
Jeremy McGeorge, who has returned to campus as a science teacher, will also spearhead their new Transition Program
http://www.strugglingteens.com/archives ... heard.html

Oct 2003- No More Wilderness: Base Camp/Orientation ?Passages? Wilderness phase- While maintaining its core principles, it will be integrated into the ?Crossroads Program?, creating an 8-week program, mostly outdoors during the day, housed indoors at night, with its students primarily interacting with Upper School Peer Mentors and staff. Through a merit system, students can integrate into the main campus as early as three and a half weeks into the program and counseling staff will now begin working with their Peer Group during Passages. For the last two years the Passages program has been directed by Jim Markham, who has an MA in Counseling and Music Therapy at The Naropa Institute in Boulder, Colorado. The Crossroads Director is Jeremy McGeorge, who has a BA degree in psychology from the University of Arizona and a BS degree in biology from Northern Arizona University.
http://www.strugglingteens.com/archives ... heard.html

So, they?re outdoors all day and sleep in dorms at night. That?s an improvement, but apparently the ?core principles? (policies) were maintained, which might include denying salt.
Jim Markham nor Jeremy McGeorge are listed as staff.

And, while you?re here, someone said that ASR had hired a Clinical Director two years ago. Might you know who that is?

We may be on the same side in terms of wanting what?s best for kids, but I don?t know that we will agree on what?s best.

[Anonymous]

I will try to address many of your questions now, but my daughter has a guitar lesson soon. I don't know who or why people keep quoting studies and info from 2001/02. I guess because that is all that is formally published for now. I will need to skim Marcus' book and Shapiro's article to try to find what policies,staff etc has changed. Most staff changes I believe is for the better.This applies as well to policy changes.

let's see where to begin. The cafeteria is directly attached to the dining room and is always open. The kids hang there, play board games, cards, crafts, read and can do homework there, so they do have access to fruit/drinks at all times.

AS for sleeping in the security office at night- I have NEVER heard of this, but I will ask my son when I get a chance.
The current staff should be on the website:
The drug counsleor is Mike Valuski and he is awesome. Someone new has also joined him (an't remember his name).
The clinical director is Frank Barolomeo (and he has vey good credentials).
Jeremey McGeorge is no longer there. He is at King George now.

Dr. Cohen and Dr. Newman are there 3 days a week, with another professional named Richard Champoux (who is younger and the kids relate well to him) who is there one day a week.
The wilderness component was replaced by a program called Passages (usually 4 weeks or so). The name was just changed to Pathways (not sure of the differences). The kids don't go to academics as they work on transitioning the kids slowly into the program. The kids eat and sleep with the other students. Wilderness is not required, but is preferred. Pathways works on some of the work done in wc.

The trip to Costa Rica is no longer. The capstone was replaced with a program to Transition the kids to post-ASR plans which was a component that was really needed (a major plus).

AS you can see, there is nothing secret that I am witholding. It will take me some time to list the differences from 2001-present. It is a shame that Fornits is going by old info. No wonder you guys think it is such a terrible place.

It is OK for us to want what's best for the kids and I don't expect that we will agree on every point. I am trying to help sort out the truth from fallicy or just plain outdated info.

[Troll Control]

On 2006-06-28 08:56:00, Dysfunction Junction wrote:

"

On 2006-06-28 07:35:00, Dysfunction Junction wrote:


"

On 2006-06-28 06:43:00, Anonymous wrote:



"DJ,



          As for therapist qualifications (which is the MAIN reason we chose ASR) our son's therapist has a BS in Science from UMAss,an MSW in Clinical SOcial WOrk from SMith and A post graduate fellowshhip at Harvard. In addition, she has lots of experieces counseling and educating both kids and adults.



I would think that this makes her quite qualified to counsel. I would also urge you to check out the other current therapists who also have good credentials.







   As for the academics, a 75% turnover is due to the small number of teachers on staff, so the number looks worse than it is. One very qualified teache is on Maternity leave, and one is pursuing graduate school work in her field. Just a quick note, we personally did not choose ASR for the acdemics (I would have chosen a private school for that). His QPA and test scores are quite good and he will get into a good 4 year program next year.



 



    As for the LGAT style seminars, if you read my posts, they have changed the format to make it more positive and self-esteem building over the past month or two. So yes, you do need to do some research in this department before passing judgement on current practices at ASR since 2002.







  My only point is that it is unfair to group all TBS/RTC programs as abusive and uncaring, I can't speak for other programs but only first hand from our experience. There is no perfect school (at home or away).







"

I actually was talking about counselors, not therapists.  There are zero licensed counselors and many with substandard education or none at all.





As to the teachers, there are at least two on staff with no degrees whatsoever.  How can this be happening?  How can someone be qualified to teach without even having a degree?  Did you ever have a highschool teacher with no more education than you had at the time?  It's absurd to defend this.  





75% turnover rate was for all staff, not just teachers.





As for the seminars, they have zero therapeutic value.  The very premise they are based upon is ineffective and damaging.  Making some changes to the tone/format may help reduce damage, but hardly increases effectiveness.





So, what we're talking about is the people who mange your child's life on a day to day basis.  People with no degrees and no qualifications in many cases.  For the money being spent, why can't your child have access to quality care and education?

"

Parent, I see you skipped over these facts.  Can you address these items, please?
"

Uh, you skipped these points again.  It's nice that you address the fluff points like consulting therapists and food service, but these are the people responsible for your kid all day every day.

Teachers - very poor.  So poor that they would be barred from every single public school in the nation.  Some with no degrees whatsoever.

Counselors - equally poor.  So poor that not a single one would be allowed to see clients privately or in any licensed facility.  Some with no degrees, most without masters, all without licenses.  These are the people who run groups and deal with the kids' issues every day - a frightening thought.

WHY IS STAFF SO LOW-RENT WHEN YOU PAY TOP DOLLAR?

[Anonymous]

DJ,
I will reply to your questions when I have more time. Just curious, but does Fornits grill every program parent about all of the TBS/RTC's.
I see that you are being respectful and mature about this, but realize I am not paid by Aspen or ASR. I am just trying to explain what I can to dispel fact from old info from rumor. No program is perfect, we all agree on that point. See if any of my answer to Deborah's questions are any help to you.

PS I am not going to add fuel or info to help Andrea shut file a report. ASR is one of the better programs. They are working on getting licensed and from I understand takes time. For now, there first priority and as it should be is taking care of our kids and I am confident that they are doing a good job.

[Troll Control]

On 2006-06-28 12:05:00, Anonymous wrote:

"DJ,

I will reply to your questions when I have more time. Just curious, but does Fornits grill every program parent about all of the TBS/RTC's.

I see that you are being respectful and mature about this, but realize I am not paid by Aspen or ASR. I am just trying to explain what I can to dispel fact from old info from rumor. No program is perfect, we all agree on that point. See if any of my answer to Deborah's questions are any help to you.



PS I am not going to add fuel or info to help Andrea shut file a report. ASR is one of the better programs. They are working on getting licensed and from I understand takes time. For now, there first priority and as it should be is taking care of our kids and I am confident that they are doing a good job."

Yeah, parents do tend to get grilled.  It's a hot kitchen here.

I appreciate your answering questions to the best of your ability.  I sincerely do.  It's a service to all.

I do, however, fundamentally disagree with your assessment.  I have no confidence that the kids are safe from physical and psychological harm.  I know unregulated, unmonitored programs are safe-havens for sadists, child molesters and people generally unfit to serve children in other modaliites, like private practice or licensed treatment centers.  I have seen this first hand many, many times.

What is of grave concern to me is that most ASR parents say "academics isn't really a concern" but "treatment" is.  What you are saying is that ASR is in fact not a "school" (no licensed or credentialed teachers, unaccredited academics), but rather a "treatment center."  As such, it is incumbent upon them to provide safe, effective treatment to their patients.  It has been made abundantly clear through their methodology, hiring of completely unqualified staff and coercive, restrictive environment that they are not achieving this end.

So, if they are not delivering quality care through licensed professionals that stands up to scientific scrutiny and is measurable in it's success, they are failing miserably as both a school and a treatment center.

I am just amazed sometimes that people pay so much for the absolute bottom-of-the-barrel treatment with no track record of quantifiable success (not that paying less would make it any more acceptable, but the sheer pricetag should spur some investigation into measurable success).

[Anonymous]

Parents especially tend to get grilled when, well, they're not really parents.

Brrring brrring! I call lying programmie troll.

[Anonymous]

You know what Gurgling Milk Death Penatly?
                  You attitude sucks and personally, I am sick of it. I was having a meaningful conversation with both Deborah and DJ
to try to answer some questions about ASR. It is guys like you frustrate the hell out of me on this forum. I wash my hands of trying to have any meaningful conversations with you anymore on this forum. Like the WHO, who was smart enough to leave, I am too. I don't need or deserve your abuse. Let me know when you decide to grow up! In the meantime-shut up.

[Anonymous]

On 2006-06-28 17:08:00, Anonymous wrote:

"You know what Gurgling Milk Death Penatly?

                  You attitude sucks and personally, I am sick of it. I was having a meaningful conversation with both Deborah and DJ

to try to answer some questions about ASR. It is guys like you frustrate the hell out of me on this forum. I wash my hands of trying to have any meaningful conversations with you anymore on this forum. Like the WHO, who was smart enough to leave, I am too. I don't need or deserve your abuse. Let me know when you decide to grow up! In the meantime-shut up."

Does this look like a fucking program to you, idiot? Do I look like I take orders from you? You're just pissed that someone called your bluff. I assure you, your unreality was in the back of both Deb's and DJ's minds; they just were polite enough not to mention it. Guess what, I'm not.

And you do deserve my abuse. You deserve more abuse than I can give. You deserve even more abuse than I can think up. You openly defend, through pure denial, nothing short of child abuse, bizarre, perverted "therapy", and Soviet-style "psychiatric" incarceration that was supposed to have ended with the Cold War. The only thing that should be done to you to stop the pain is a .45 to the back of the head, to put you out of our misery.

And hopefully The Who left this plane of existence, as well.

[Anonymous]

I call b.s. also on this being a parent...it's pretty obvious.  I love the way that they always slip in "ASR is one of the better programs"

Ed con or program employee is my call.

[Anonymous]

On 2006-06-27 20:24:00, Anonymous wrote:

"To Deborah,

              I have a student currently enrolled and blah blah blah
I HATE that posters on this website cite outdated and inaccurate data. blah blah blah"

hate?

hate is a pretty strong word.

don't you guys still teach "I'm usually not upset for the reason I think I am"?

oh...and nice admission that things have changed in the last couple months :roll: ...all that does is tell us that you admit that you were WRONG 2 months ago...but I....

jeeze...you're not even worth my time...like the who...

you also are the proud recipient of...

[Deborah]

***I don't know who or why people keep quoting studies and info from 2001/02.

Because another parent brought them into the discussion.

***The kids hang there, play board games, cards, crafts, read and can do homework there, so they do have access to fruit/drinks at all times.

So, you?re saying that they have access to fruit/drinks anytime? You make it sound like summer camp. If I was so inclined I could post numerous links outlining the rigorous, structured schedule, with little down time. I got the impression that wasn?t much ?hangin? time.

***The clinical director is Frank Barolomeo (and he has vey good credentials).
Jeremey McGeorge is no longer there. He is at King George now.

Was Frank hired two years ago?

***AS you can see, there is nothing secret that I am witholding.

No, I?m not sure of that. I think you?re sharing what you think you know, what you?ve been told, what you want to believe.

***I am trying to help sort out the truth from fallicy or just plain outdated info.

I hear that, and I?m not sure a ?parent? is qualified to answer technical questions, but what the hey.