Perhaps one of the reasons I believe Three Springs has been successful in our case is because we are NOT expecting their therapy to fix her or us.
What I think the program did do was bring her to a point where the real therapy between her and us, and her ability to process those awful events of her past, could occur. But I see there's a huge gap here that most of the time may not be crossed successfully.
I have spent untold hours communicating with my daughter. The ten minute phone call per week is only a "hi" between more extensive communication. When we are together we have had VERY deep discussions. She is insightful and very much in touch with her inner being. We share on a level that I believe transcends most parent-child communication - and indeed is much deeper than I have with my other children (and I would say it is because of the experiences and processing she has done, and what she has learned through it, and what she is able to teach me). She is not a brainwashed kid.
I have been told by other parents and by the program that I have an amazing ability to communicate with her in writing - and that these writings have made a world of difference. Perhaps therein lies one of the reasons for our success - and maybe that's why my view is clouded. Because we have had, in my opinion, tremendous success.
And you're also right... this entire topic about BM will definately be one her and I talk about. In fact I will use this as an illustration with her. One time she found a bunch of money in a pay phone. So every time she saw a pay phone - she checked it. For a while. But then, the "payment" wore off. That's the problem with BM. Unless there is a deep seated reason that goes beyond feels good / hurts... it won't last when the feels good / hurts is removed.
I do not believe her treatment has been inhumane or abusive. I have seen no evidence, and she has said nothing, that would indicate such. But, that doesn't mean it can't happen - and it certainly doesn't mean I won't continue to talk to her about her experiences. I do want to find out what additional therapy we need in the future.
Thank you for sharing in a rational way. I trust the threats by others are over - but I'm ready to put on the thick skin and armor... 
This reeks of programmie apologetics.
First, you say it works because therapy doesnt. Okay? Thats really uh... scientific and totally in line with the way things are done in late 2006... (no, its not)
Then you say the program somehow "brought her to a point" (mmm, buzzwords!) where "the real therapy between her and us" (which is what?) and ability to "process bad events of her past" "could occur".
Ok, first, how the fuck did Three Springs do that? Secondly, how do YOU or any of those uneducated bumpkins know that? Thirdly, even if this process did occur, just keeping her captive in some hellhole in the middle of the woods somehow become justified becuase of your uneducated sophistry claiming it did her good?
Then you say the ten-minute censored monitored phonecall somehow does her good. Riiiiiiiight. This is too ludicrous to even address.
Then you say shes not a brianwashed kid when you're neither aware of what brainwashing is nor do you lack a vested interested in saying she isnt... :roll:
Then you say the other parents, and the program (more uneducated people who are interseted in justification of this program, not unbiased people who are educated enough to make such a observation) claim you have an amazing ability to communicat ein writing.
Tremendous success in your view! All of your information is censored and sugar-coated by Three Springs, and youre not educated, AND youre going to be swayed by your desire for it to work! You're not a trained scientist nor do you have the relevant education to even make such a statement, and yet you do. This comes down to your FEELINGS on the matter, which have about as much value as the same volume of dirt. Why? Youre going to be biased, youre not educated, and that lil thing called 'vested interest'.
Well, that and youre spewing buzzwords so much Im more inclined to think youre an apologietic or someone trying to advertise three springs than a parent of it... especially given that a ex-counselor from Three Springs is here telling it like it IS, not how you want us to think it is.
Then you talk about how BM doesnt work when the "good / hurts" is removed (more of your buzzword laden LGAT-derived blatherings?) as if that somehow justifies putting her through it?
Then in the penultimate paragraph you asy that you dont BELIEVE its inhumane or abusive, when youre still as uneducated as you were in the rest of your little 'treatise du programmié', saying youv eseen no evidence nor has she said anything, when our biggest complaint is they wont LET you see it nor LET her tell you if its going on.
Im fine with being rational about it, the second YOU are. Educate yourself and realize they are controlling information back and forth, that there is a
TOTAL AND COMPLETE LACK OF EVIDNECE TO SUPPORT EVERYTHING YOU ARE SAYING OR THAT PROGRAMS WORK IN THE LEAST, and that without outside investigation theres no way to know what is going on with your daugther short of removing her from the program, immediately, no questions asked, and telling her you'll believe everything she says, and that you wont send her back regardless of what she says, and you listen to her.
Though, of course, at least at first the first thing shed think is that its a 'test' and youre trying to bust her speaking out of group... and yeah, lots of programs Do do that.
Finally, before you even consider bitching, moaning, or whining, what is being done to children (and your supposed child should she exist) in a program of any sort is orders of magnitude more harmful than being talked badly to in a internet forum, and lasts all day, EVERY day, and she cant escape it, defend herself, or even try to ignore it, whereas you can... and in your case, this is just text. In her case its a bunch of people in her face, loud, and threatning violence.
But then again, granted youre even real, youre probably just going to 'stick to your guns' regardless of what that might impose on another sentient, breathing, living, feeling human being (not to mention YOUR OWN CHILD) and find a way to justify keeping her in there and weasel around the facts.
If you wonder why there is such resentment or outright antipathy for program parents, I've explained it pretty fully. Its up to you to 'internalize' and face the facts here. Not the pretty buttered up sugar coated cherry on top facts the program tells you to make you feel better, the REAL ones. Im sure theres at least one lingering doubt in your mind, granted you grew up in the USA Im sure you know how to be rational, critical (thats NOT a bad word, btw, its the lynchpin of democratsy) and skeptical, so why not start doing it.
Shit, EVERYONE ON EARTH outside of the "program parents" would never trust a facility like you do! Yet you buy into them and justify illegal (or at least grey-area) practices and trample all over your childs rights and act like they magically do something without an explanation you dont have to give and then flip the burden of proof on us!
You see why we dont bother talking to you yet? Oh, thast right, you PROBABLY just glazed over the second you had to turn and face yourself and realize that youre not 100% correct and the program isn't totally fine, becuase you dont want to, and becuase as long as things remain the way they are its totally okay for a grown adult to blame it all on a kid and let a kid go through HELL so that an adult doesnt have to admit they were wrong and do the right thing.
Ugh. :flame:
