Author Topic: anonymity on this board  (Read 19609 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2006, 03:44:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-11 11:33:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Awful PR bleeding?  With topics like "hyde is great""


Oh please, do you think that people will think Hyde is a great school because somebody ocassionally comes on this board and says things like, "Hyde is great" or "I love Hyde."  

I think a person can find some good in most anything on this earth.  The problem is that there are some desperate parents out there who truly need the help of a good school or program.  They need to know ALL that Hyde has to offer as well as it's limitations. It is not only a big financial investment, but an investment of time, emotion and energy for the entire family.  Hyde needs to be more honest about what their capabilities are in helping.  Someone from Hyde will now say, "what you get out of the program is up to you" but in reality it is much more complicated than this.  If you simply have a character disorder then maybe Hyde can help, but if there are true medical issues, ADD, eating disorders, psychological disorders, Hyde is not the most appropriate place for your child nor does Hyde tell you this.  

I simply ask that Hyde be more honest about this when enrolling a family rather than taking the money and when it doesn't work out, say "bye bye."  This is not "honesty" IMHO.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2006, 04:19:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-11 12:44:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-04-11 11:33:00, Anonymous wrote:


"Awful PR bleeding?  With topics like "hyde is great""




Oh please, do you think that people will think Hyde is a great school because somebody ocassionally comes on this board and says things like, "Hyde is great" or "I love Hyde."  



I think a person can find some good in most anything on this earth.  The problem is that there are some desperate parents out there who truly need the help of a good school or program.  They need to know ALL that Hyde has to offer as well as it's limitations. It is not only a big financial investment, but an investment of time, emotion and energy for the entire family.  Hyde needs to be more honest about what their capabilities are in helping.  Someone from Hyde will now say, "what you get out of the program is up to you" but in reality it is much more complicated than this.  If you simply have a character disorder then maybe Hyde can help, but if there are true medical issues, ADD, eating disorders, psychological disorders, Hyde is not the most appropriate place for your child nor does Hyde tell you this.  



I simply ask that Hyde be more honest about this when enrolling a family rather than taking the money and when it doesn't work out, say "bye bye."  This is not "honesty" IMHO."


Oh please, do you think that people will think Hyde is a bad school because somebody ocassionally comes on this board and says things like, "Hyde is cult" or "I hate Hyde."
Back at you.  A robin, a spring does not make.  A bunch of post on an obsure web forum does not a bleeding PR wound make.

BTW I do love Hyde even thought I agree with some of the things I have seen posted that are less then flattering. I have posted some my self.  To me Hyde is more then Joe or any of the bozo staff. It as the place and the time and the people that I was there with.  When you say Joe is a looney that chews tennis balls, it is hard to disagree. I think this old supertramp song expresses my thoughts at this  moment:

So you think your schooling?s phoney
I guess it?s hard not to agree
You say it all depends on money
And who is in your family tree
Right, you?re bloody well right
You know you got a right to say
Right, you?re bloody well right
You know you got a right to say
Ha-ha you?re bloody well right
You know you?re right to say
Yeah-yeah you?re bloody well right
You know you?re right to say
Me, I don?t care anyway!
Write your problems down in detail
Take them to a higher place
You?ve had your cry - no, I should say wail
In the meantime hush your face
Right, quite right, you?re bloody well right... etc

Except for the hush your face part.  Rock on Garth with your Hyde sucks riff. Play it til it satisfies your soul.
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Offline Lars

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« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2006, 06:22:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-11 10:50:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-04-06 06:36:00, Lars wrote:


"Hyde does not respect anyone's privacy and I don't want anything to do with the place."



Hmmmm.  Let's see.  



1. You effectively outed youself by providing tons of details about your life that made it obvious who you were.  (Didn't you even provide your own name on here at one point?  I haven't looked back to check.)



2.  It's my understanding that Hyde contacted you as a way to reach out to you and see if you were open to a dialogue.



3.  Hyde contacted your parents for fundraising, and in the course of the conversation, mentioned they had spoken with you.



So where is the lack of respect for privacy?  You outed yourself.  They called you to talk about it.  They called your parents in the ordinary course (fundraising, where you would be natural subject of the call, just like any fundraising of this sort).



Anyway, I'll bet it would rock your world to learn that Hyde contacting you was based on compassion and concern for you.  



Point is, for some it may be helpful to out themselves.  For others, not so much.  Its a personal decision.  But make no mistake, this is a public forum, and not a private AA meeting, as someone else suggested.



Hyde's actions could be consistent with either (a) a school so terrified by this board that they will stop at no lengths to put an end to it, or (b) an institution that cares about its alum, no matter how disgruntled.  



You seem to have chosen (a), but provide no backup for that.  



On good information, I happen to believe it was (b).

"


So, asshole, which campus do you teach at?

I don't care what their reasons are, they have no business bringing it up with my family.  If you're too clueless to understand that, you're not even worth responding to.  You missed the point of my original post as well...who the hell wants to have a potential employer finding out that you've been involved with such a fucked up place?

You might want to take your foot out of your mouth before it chokes you.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2006, 07:14:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-11 15:22:00, Lars wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-04-11 10:50:00, Anonymous wrote:


"
Quote


On 2006-04-06 06:36:00, Lars wrote:



"Hyde does not respect anyone's privacy and I don't want anything to do with the place."





Hmmmm.  Let's see.  





1. You effectively outed youself by providing tons of details about your life that made it obvious who you were.  (Didn't you even provide your own name on here at one point?  I haven't looked back to check.)





2.  It's my understanding that Hyde contacted you as a way to reach out to you and see if you were open to a dialogue.





3.  Hyde contacted your parents for fundraising, and in the course of the conversation, mentioned they had spoken with you.





So where is the lack of respect for privacy?  You outed yourself.  They called you to talk about it.  They called your parents in the ordinary course (fundraising, where you would be natural subject of the call, just like any fundraising of this sort).





Anyway, I'll bet it would rock your world to learn that Hyde contacting you was based on compassion and concern for you.  





Point is, for some it may be helpful to out themselves.  For others, not so much.  Its a personal decision.  But make no mistake, this is a public forum, and not a private AA meeting, as someone else suggested.





Hyde's actions could be consistent with either (a) a school so terrified by this board that they will stop at no lengths to put an end to it, or (b) an institution that cares about its alum, no matter how disgruntled.  





You seem to have chosen (a), but provide no backup for that.  





On good information, I happen to believe it was (b).


"




So, asshole, which campus do you teach at?



I don't care what their reasons are, they have no business bringing it up with my family.  If you're too clueless to understand that, you're not even worth responding to.  You missed the point of my original post as well...who the hell wants to have a potential employer finding out that you've been involved with such a fucked up place?



You might want to take your foot out of your mouth before it chokes you."


Hey,
 
 It is good that you are getting in touch with your feelings.  Let that anger out.

 If I saw you write a letter to the editor and I knew your Mom, I might say "did you see that letter to the editor Lars wrote"  What is wrong with that?

sue doenym (not my real name)
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Offline Lars

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« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2006, 08:00:00 PM »
Quote

Hey,

 It is good that you are getting in touch with your feelings.  Let that anger out.

 If I saw you write a letter to the editor and I knew your Mom, I might say "did you see that letter to the editor Lars wrote"  What is wrong with that?

sue doenym (not my real name)"


If I wrote a letter to the editor, I'd sign my name to it.  And you didn't answer my question, which campus do you teach at? [ This Message was edited by: Eudora on 2006-04-11 18:28 ]
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #20 on: April 12, 2006, 07:10:00 AM »
Quote
On 2006-04-11 17:00:00, Lars wrote:

"
Quote



Hey,



 It is good that you are getting in touch with your feelings.  Let that anger out.



 If I saw you write a letter to the editor and I knew your Mom, I might say "did you see that letter to the editor Lars wrote"  What is wrong with that?



sue doenym (not my real name)"




If I wrote a letter to the editor, I'd sign my name to it.  And you didn't answer my question, which campus do you teach at? [ This Message was edited by: Eudora on 2006-04-11 18:28 ]"


 Eudora,

 Are you editing the posts because of legal pressure from hyde?  Do you log ip address against posts?  My concern is that if you have ip addresses log and linked to posts there is not real anonymity if hyde hires a slapp lawyer.

Lars,

I am not the poster to whom you adressed your original question. I never taught at hyde. In my day only the Creme de la creme came back to teach.  I was the dregs de la dregs.

Sue Doenym
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #21 on: April 12, 2006, 02:49:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-11 11:21:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-04-11 10:50:00, Anonymous wrote:


"
Quote


On 2006-04-06 06:36:00, Lars wrote:



"Hyde does not respect anyone's privacy and I don't want anything to do with the place."





Hmmmm.  Let's see.  





1. You effectively outed youself by providing tons of details about your life that made it obvious who you were.  (Didn't you even provide your own name on here at one point?  I haven't looked back to check.)





2.  It's my understanding that Hyde contacted you as a way to reach out to you and see if you were open to a dialogue.





3.  Hyde contacted your parents for fundraising, and in the course of the conversation, mentioned they had spoken with you.





So where is the lack of respect for privacy?  You outed yourself.  They called you to talk about it.  They called your parents in the ordinary course (fundraising, where you would be natural subject of the call, just like any fundraising of this sort).





Anyway, I'll bet it would rock your world to learn that Hyde contacting you was based on compassion and concern for you.  





Point is, for some it may be helpful to out themselves.  For others, not so much.  Its a personal decision.  But make no mistake, this is a public forum, and not a private AA meeting, as someone else suggested.





Hyde's actions could be consistent with either (a) a school so terrified by this board that they will stop at no lengths to put an end to it, or (b) an institution that cares about its alum, no matter how disgruntled.  





You seem to have chosen (a), but provide no backup for that.  





On good information, I happen to believe it was (b).


"




What is the source of your "good information"?  How would you happen to know enough to say that, to use your words, "It's my understanding that Hyde contacted you as a way to reach out to you and see if you were open to a dialogue."  Are you on the Hyde staff or part of the Hyde "team"?



What you say about Hyde's reasons for reaching out may be true; I have no way of knowing.  My guess is that some Hyde staff are concerned and want to have the kind of dialogue you suggest for honorable reasons.  In addition, my guess is that some Hyde staff are also deeply concerned and troubled by this website and are doing what they can to stop the awful PR bleeding.  That's merely a hunch.

"


I notice that you haven't answered my question about the source of your information.  Are you not willing to disclose the nature of your Hyde affiliation?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #22 on: April 12, 2006, 03:21:00 PM »
Lars said
Quote
I don't care what their reasons are, they have no business bringing it up with my family."

I didn't miss the point of your original post Lars.  I said in my first response that I actually agreed with you there are good reasons not to disclose one's identity here, but that it's also a personal decision.  I didn't elaborate on that, but personal or not, I only agree with this to the extent one speaks of their personal experience. Acuse Hyde of a crime or mistreating others when without having the details or inside info, yes, that seems inappropriate and self-serving and worthy of challenge, including exploration of the posters bias, which requires their identity.

The concept of bias brings me back to your (secondary?) point that "Hyde doesn't respect privacy".  Lars, when you were a little boy, your parents established a relationship with Hyde that focused on you.  When Hyde called you recently (out of compassion) and then mentioned this to your family, that was business in the ordinary course.  My issue is thus not with the primary point of your post, its how you chose to present it.    

Lars said
Quote
Also, when the school figured out who I was, they actually contacted me and later mentioned it to my parents in a fundraising appeal. Hyde does not respect anyone's privacy and I don't want anything to do with the place.
"When Hyde figured out who I was"?  Lars, you outed yourself.  That was your choice.  Take responsibility for it.

"They actually contacted me".  What I find interesting was your use of the word "actually", as it seems to imply impropriety instead of presenting the facts about the compassionate nature of the call.  And later Hyde "mentioned" your call with them to your parents.  (And that's really all it was, right "mentioned"?)  I have to say, big whoop there Lars.  So what?  You know as well as anyone that Hyde calls former parents and talks about former students.  This was no surprise, and was both predictable and standard in the industry.

Your point about not wanting to share your association with Hyde with the world is valid, at least to the extent you are talking about your personal experience.  Your jump to a point about Hyde not respecting privacty, based on your bizarre example which includes you outing yourself (a cry for help?), Hyde contacting you compassionately (and you leaving these details out), and then mentioning it to your parents like every fundraising group I have ever known, is unwarranted.  What I find more interesting is why you make this connection, because you do it again in your latest post.

Lars said:
Quote
I don't care what their reasons are, they have no business bringing it up with my family....who the hell wants to have a potential employer finding out that you've been involved with such a fucked up place?


In that Hyde actually does have "business" bringing your conversation up with your parents, it started me thinking about what was really going on for you, so here's my guess: The fact you left out was that Hyde mentioned to your parents you were posting on this site.

Your real concern is that now your parents know you are posting on this site and that fact raises a host of potential issues, as it potentially highlights your unresolved issues with them (they sent you to Hyde, right)...and you don't like that one bit, so instead of dealing with the source of your issues, you project them onto Hyde.

Just a guess.  I know I wouldn't want my parents to see all of my diary-like posts I make on various sites.  That's why I would never out myself (on those sites)....and if I did, then even a non-lawyer would know I can't hold anyone other than myself responsible if my post somehow ends up on the front page of the New York Times.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #23 on: April 12, 2006, 08:02:00 PM »
"Your real concern is that now your parents know you are posting on this site and that fact raises a host of potential issues, as it potentially highlights your unresolved issues with them "

Hey that was pretty insightful for an unskilled Hyde staffer.  Anger is seldom about what we think it is about.  Let me know if you see anything in my posts.  I always open to good free advice.

Sue Doenym
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #24 on: April 12, 2006, 08:09:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-12 04:10:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-04-11 17:00:00, Lars wrote:


"
Quote





Hey,





 It is good that you are getting in touch with your feelings.  Let that anger out.





 If I saw you write a letter to the editor and I knew your Mom, I might say "did you see that letter to the editor Lars wrote"  What is wrong with that?





sue doenym (not my real name)"







If I wrote a letter to the editor, I'd sign my name to it.  And you didn't answer my question, which campus do you teach at? [ This Message was edited by: Eudora on 2006-04-11 18:28 ]"




 Eudora,



 Are you editing the posts because of legal pressure from hyde?  Do you log ip address against posts?  My concern is that if you have ip addresses log and linked to posts there is not real anonymity if hyde hires a slapp lawyer.



Lars,



I am not the poster to whom you adressed your original question. I never taught at hyde. In my day only the Creme de la creme came back to teach.  I was the dregs de la dregs.



Sue Doenym"


LOL, no! I edit for formatting because I'm too lazzy to figure out why the tag counter fuckes up and renders unmatched quote tags.

Otherwise, I only edit at the request or, or at least w/ permission by, the author. In the exceedingly rare event that I wind up editing anything (or even if I refuse) because of any kind of legal pressure, I habitually squack about it in a number of ways. Here's a favorite: http://DCHFans.org/ I've found it works pretty well and highly recomend anyone who agrees to do the same. In fact, I'd be happy to add any donated autograph samples to the (slowly) growing archive at the Dewey, Cheetham & Howe Fan Website.

I keep the usual server logs. Anyone w/ a pressing need will see about making that data meaningless before divulging anything that really, requires anonymity. But, for most purposes, nobody knows anything you don't tell them explicitly, except that logging info and I'm not in the habit of sharing that.

I told all four that there are going to be some times where we don't
agree with each other, but that's OK. If this were a dictatorship, it
would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I'm the dictator.
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #25 on: April 12, 2006, 08:12:00 PM »
And thanks for bringing my full attention to this thread. It's already been worth it.

"So to all the jerks trying to get people to out themselves, get a clue. Life is not a Hyde seminar."
Lars

You cool w/ that attribution, Lars?

The only maxim of a free government ought to be to trust no man living with power to endanger the public liberty.
-- John Adams, (1772)

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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #26 on: April 12, 2006, 08:48:00 PM »
hey,

 Thanks for the reasurrance.  The tin foil falls off my windows some times and I am sure they are reading my thoughts, usually when I mis dose my meds.
 Nice board. you are doing a nice job of kicking some asses that richly deserve kicking. The ghost of Tom Joad be with you.

 Returning undef when you have a case insensitive match to coersion, is a great idea.

Sue Doenym
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #27 on: April 12, 2006, 10:35:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-10 08:12:00, StephenLong wrote:

"I am not associated with Hyde, other than having been a student there. The only reason I found this website is because a friend who knows I went to Hyde sent me a link.



Opinions about what Hyde was or is like are fine. My biggest problem with the Anonymous posters are the ones who make accusations of criminal acts, but won't state their names.



If are not willing to sign your name to such an accusation, you shouldn't make it. I believe many of the posters who make such statements are just being slanderous and I want to make sure that everyone who reads the posts realize that.







Stephen Long

Hyde '81"


That's why the anonymity and confidentiality rule is a double edged sword. It's also hypocritical and deceptive from the get go. In AA and other Stepcraft sects, they frame it in the language of the well respected medical/clerical/professional tradition. In reality, the people entering into the contract are avowedly fucked up and none too good at keeping agreements, plans or even mental continence and discretion. What's the first step? Tell these admitedly untrustworthy people your most sensitive secrets and then take their advice and criticizm in the spirit of brotherly love.

Yeah, right?

So there is no meaningful protection or expectation to protect the member's legitimate privacy. But it sure is a handy tool for keeping potential marks in the dark about how it all works so they won't see it coming!

Rampant talking out in group! Often enough, the reasons people have for wanting to speak anonymously here are every bit as valid and even nearly identical to those of the founders of this Republic. Remember Publius? Extra credit, remember A Farmer?

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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #28 on: April 12, 2006, 10:42:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-11 10:50:00, Anonymous wrote:

Anyway, I'll bet it would rock your world to learn that Hyde contacting you was based on compassion and concern for you.


At some point, the stalking laws kick in.

To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false friends; to appreciate beauty, to find the best in others; to leave the world a little better; whether by a healthy child, a garden patch or a redeemed social condition; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is the meaning of success.
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #29 on: April 12, 2006, 11:44:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-12 17:48:00, Anonymous wrote:

Returning undef when you have a case insensitive match to coersion, is a great idea.


Why thank you!

Every sensible man, every honorable man, must hold the Christian sect in horror.
--Francois Marie Arouet "Voltaire", French author and playwright

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