Author Topic: Are you kidding ME  (Read 1407 times)

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Offline sammiegirl

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Are you kidding ME
« on: December 27, 2005, 07:17:00 PM »
Write this person please as I will be...
 
Date:         Thu, 14 Apr 2005 09:58:30 -0500
Reply-To:     Orthodox Christianity <[log in to unmask]>
Sender:       Orthodox Christianity <[log in to unmask]>
From:         "[log in to unmask]" <[log in to unmask]>
Subject:      Re: Fr. Cassian Newton
Dear Friends:

Well Greta has used the rhetoric of victimhood quite normally and
effectively here.   Has she used it validly?  That is another question entirely.

One clue to whether or not she is being intellectually honest with herself,
the readers of the site, or us on this list can be found in the fact that
she cites such well informed, highly trained and dispassionate commentators
as Fr. Cassian's current neighbors to spread tar and feathers concerning his
past.  Their clarity of their mental processes is perhaps demonstrated by
the person who mixes his metaphors most effectively in stating the belief
Fr. C brings baggage to the table.  Folks I have been involved in the land
use neighborhood dispute wars for 30 years around here, 26 of them as an
advocate, and read the newspaper accounts of them which were *invariably*
inaccurate.  I can tell you *flatly* that the least likely source for
unvarnished truth and objectivity is a newspaper account of what an angry
neighbor has said about rumors about the past conduct of a neighbor with
whom s/he is then embroiled in disputation.  So if Greta wants us to take
her comments about people seriously I suggest that she resort to a more
carefully researched and objective source of *facts*.

Back to the rhetoric of victimhood.  Let's start with the most fundamental
word of all - victim.  Like the catch- all terms "love" and "hate" in
English, the word "victim" is asked to carry a great deal of freight.  And
like "love" and "hate" in English, the supposed denotation of the term is
often completely (and intentionally) swallowed by the connotations it carries.

I am not fully conversant with the situations she describes on the pokrov
site. I believe I know enough to make the following valid statements:

1.  All of the allegations arise from the days before Fr. Cassian's
conversion and ordination.

2.  For many years he was involved with trying to heal or cure the worst of
the worst, out-of-control, drug-addicted, messed-up kids around.  As I
understand it the clientele consisted largely of pretty sophisticated kids
who had tried or been placed in, and then washed out of, at least one, and
often many, other treatment programs.

3.  Since politer and less intrusive methods had failed, the only hope of
achieving a different result with these kids was 24 hour control, which in
turn necessitated dorms, locks, fences, etc.  (Does it sound like it was the
enxt step from what our society recognizes would have been the next official
step - other than the morgue - a mental ward or prison)

4.  The kids were not shanghaied - desperate parents or authorities who had
a very good idea of what they wanted and the organization would deliver in
terms of treatment.

5.  None of the allegations involved sexual impropriety by Fr. Cassian
toward anyone of either sex.

6.  Fr. Cassian was the lead personage, but hardly available to supervise at
all times.  Because his was the visible name asociated with the
organizations, however, he was always the "target" im the press or the
courts, as to some degree the coach or general or whatever properly is if
his team or army is defeated.

One should not forget that a great deal of the grist for Greta's mill on Fr.
Cassian is the by-product of the cynical and symbiotic relationship between
the plaintiffs' bar and the popular press.  The latter wants to sell
newspapers or TV advertising or whatever.  The former wants to get money.
The former therefore feeds the latter well-crafted allegations, pumped full
of as much hot air as counsel thinks that particular balloon will hold.  And
presto, the defendant's insurance carrier comes up with a lot of money to
shut them up, avoid the costs of defense, and eliminate the risk of a bigger
loss at trial.

There is another symbiotic, albeit less cynical, relationship to think about
in such situations too: the relationship between the consigning authority
(parental or governmental) and the consignee.  The parent or social worker
or truant officer typically tries all the lollipop and roses methods first.
"Don't you want to have a piece of candy and go sit in the nice classroom
with the boring teacher and all the other kids who don't want to be there?"
When the kid kicks them in the shins enough times, steals money and the car
keys here and there, and keeps on sliding down the slope to destruction the
authority feels guilty and worried.  "Hey this kid is gonna die or kill
somebody else if this keeps up.  I may have helped cause this.  I am in a
responsible position of authority and am supposed to do something about it.
 What I have done is failing.  I need to find something better."

The organization and its head offers hope.  Sometimes they can deliver and
sometimes not.  The best merely have a lower failure rate than the others.
And when the inevitable failures occur, the blame game is the refuge of next
resort in our society.

The political version thereof involves a hue and cry starting, often with
the aid of our friendly enemy, the free press.  A kid who is a public ward
doesn't get well or runs away or requires hospitalization or something.
"Why didn't you prevent it, Mr. Public Authority" is the entree with greater
or lesser side dishes of indignation, self-righteousnes, and blame.  What
does any self-respecting son of Adam and Eve (the serpent told me..., the
woman you gave me...) do?  Lay off the blame of the person or organization
that "failed," of course.

The parental version is comparable.  You can fill in the blanks.

And in our juridically addicted society, that has no cross, little grace,
and no Redeemer, what is next?   Judgment Day!  It matters little if the
accusing attorneys are hired by the state or private parties.  Licenses must
be revoked, damages claimed, barn doors slammed loudly and publicly
regardless of the underlying temperament or whereabouts of the horse, etc.

So really the old public agency reports or press accounts of the alleged
past abuse situations are not the greatest place to go trolling for good
info either, especially if the ostensible purpose is to figure out if an
Orthodox clergyman, who now operates a sort of hospice for adult souls who
come for short term stays, is on the hot seat.  Greta et. al. may feel an
anointing for this sort of think, but I think they are the one pouring the
oil of anointing on themselves in this case.

So back to "victims."  My kids are in a sense my victims, as I was of my
parents or Greta is of Cappy.  I am toubled by the label throwing unless
Greta does a better job of looking into what Fr. Cassian does now and then
draws some kind of logical line to connect the dots of the past to the
present.

My understanding is that having gone through all of theat stuff from a
protestant standpoint and found the spirituality shallow and ineffective he
was drawn to convert to the authentic spiritual methods of knowing God and
dealing with passion as found in traditional Orthodoxy.  Hence the name he
took - Fr. Cassian.

But if Greta is willing to take a challenge, I will put my money where my
mouse is: Greta I will pay one half of a round trip plane flight from SFO to
Florida in May, 2005 for you to go to Fr. Cassian's meet him, hear him, see
what he is doing, and then report on it here and on your site as you see
fit.  Please let me know.

love,
Fr. George

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Offline Anonymous

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Are you kidding ME
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2005, 07:43:00 PM »
As a suggestion, remain cool, candid, and professional with replies. Nothing ruins an argument more than expletives and rage, even though this painfully or willfully ignorant person deserves a first phase chair and a flogging.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Antigen

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Are you kidding ME
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2005, 07:58:00 PM »
Well, I don't really feel like registering and all that. I did wander around a bit. Reminds me of the bad old days when my brother in law, sunday school teacher and decon was into Reussus Rushdoony. Bunch of idiot chin strokers, thinly masking their contempt for all as piety. Nothin' special. Not at all surprised that Virgil finds himself right at home among them.

As to Fr. George, he's obviously a damned fool. Let Virgil have a summer alone w/ HIS daughter and see how he feels about the dear, sweet, reformed old cleric. I guess they deserv each other.

Keep close to Nature's heart... and break clear away, once in awhile, and climb a mountain or spend a week in the woods. Wash your spirit clean.
-- John Muir

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
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Offline sammiegirl

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Are you kidding ME
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2005, 12:12:00 PM »
what an ass. Hypotheticly TED BUNDY becomes an Antioch Priest so his murders dont count. Plus all those people he killed were the bad people not TED
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
ND THE TRUTH WILL SET US FREE