My son is currently at Aspen Ranch

[Whooter]

It is a good first step that you're finally able to acknowledge those who were battered. The next would be for you to comprehend that that number is far more than a few.
Helpful to that end would be you’re considering the various kinds of injuries caused to children in programs.

Not all are as physical violence. Assaults like rape and battery do happen in programs, as well as imposed stress positions, prolonged physically exhausting exertions (death marches for some) and inadequate or even no proper medical care.
In addition to these injurious violations of children the damages accrued from dehumanizing humiliations and infliction of emotional abuse and destructive thought reform tactics are very real, very pervasive in the TTI, and completely unnecessary to extending guidance to children.

99% of those accounts are fictitious.  We all know that the kids are helped at these places.... kids here post to blow off steam, its healthy for them but dont rely on the accuracy of the posts.

[Anonymous]

It is a good first step that you're finally able to acknowledge those who were battered. The next would be for you to comprehend that that number is far more than a few.
Helpful to that end would be you’re considering the various kinds of injuries caused to children in programs.

Not all are as physical violence. Assaults like rape and battery do happen in programs, as well as imposed stress positions, prolonged physically exhausting exertions (death marches for some) and inadequate or even no proper medical care.
In addition to these injurious violations of children the damages accrued from dehumanizing humiliations and infliction of emotional abuse and destructive thought reform tactics are very real, very pervasive in the TTI, and completely unnecessary to extending guidance to children.

99% of those accounts are fictitious.  We all know that the kids are helped at these places.... kids here post to blow off steam, its healthy for them but dont rely on the accuracy of the posts.

You are very petty. You’re small-mindedness is apparent. By your own contradictory inflated assertions that most programs help most kids and that the accounts of abuse are made by kids blowing off steam and that they are lies, one can apprehend the limitations of your thinking.
If these kids had “benefitted” (as you put it) from the TTI, there would not be behaviors exhibited that include the compulsion to then lie about that, let alone the sheer volume of accounts and testimony offered by survivors that you are so blithely dismissive of.

[Anonymous]

99% of those accounts are fictitious.  We all know that the kids are helped at these places.... kids here post to blow off steam, its healthy for them but dont rely on the accuracy of the posts.

This coming from the local anonymous parent impersonator.

[Anonymous]

99% of those accounts are fictitious.  We all know that the kids are helped at these places.... kids here post to blow off steam, its healthy for them but dont rely on the accuracy of the posts.

This coming from the local anonymous parent impersonator.

And survivor impersonator. He can't hide his signature style

http://fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php? ... &start=120

Get a hold of  the exclamation points in his “survivor account.” Its like he’s purposefully making the tone of his story so comically, exaggeratedly joyous, and the focus of the info in it so improbable, that he’s being facetious. It seems he does not wish to trick readers into believing his story is authentic, but simply to taunt survivors.

He did the same thing here:

I am not suppose to say this but personally I would recommend Calgary, at this time, because the kids get a little more one on one attention there. AARC is at capacity right now and has just lost a key staff person. Their quality hasn’t suffered but Calgary can offer more attention at this time until Alberta can get new people in."

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=27459&p=331467#p331467

Sorta like visiting a holocaust victim forum and posting  he was served ice cream at Auschwitz using an exaggerated European ex-pat syntax style.

[Whooter]

So fornits has finally reached the point where parents and survivors stories which are not negative are just tossed aside as fictitious. "Lets tighten things up and only allow the battered few thru the door!!!" Ha,Ha,Ha Finally got you to admit it...... its a good first step.

[Whooter]

Sorta like visiting a holocaust victim forum and posting he was served ice cream at Auschwitz using an exaggerated European ex-pat syntax style.

Thats funny!!!  I never thought of it that way.  There is another guest poster who posts alot here.  He is easy to spot and tilts his hand when he uses the words "Gulag", "Torture", "Concentration Camp", "Prison", kidnapping" in his post.  These are his favorite words.  Anytime you see these words you know it is the same guy posting over and over again.

[Troll Control]

I am the parent of a boy who spent a year in treatment was was out for less then 30 days before he got busted for possession at school -- ask me how good I am feeling 100K later.....

Another Aspen 'success story.'  Readers should be aware that there is only one single person here advocating Aspen, the poster known as TheWho, aka John Reuben.  He posts lots of ficticious 'positive survivor stories' (but since he knows nothing of the program, he gets all the details wrong) as well as ficticious 'happy parent' stories.

The story quoted above is succinct and deadly accurate in describing most people's experience with Aspen.  John Reuben, the 'pro-post' troll in this thread had a similar experience with Aspen, only insted of getting arrested, his son OD'ed and died.  John still relentlessly plugs Aspen, however, as he sees financial gain from enrollment and retention at Aspen (he runs an Aspen feeder program called 'Saving Teens In Crisis' that gets kickbacks for its referrals).

Just be aware that, for this troll, a few extra duckets in his pocket is more important than kids' lives being ruined by being arrested for drugs post-program (i.e. they wern't helped) or kids dying in the program or from ODs after the program like his own son. It's ALL about the money for this troll and Aspen, regardless of the consequences to children.

Just ask him to provide a clinical study that shows kids are helped by Aspen.  DEMAND it from him and don't let him off the hook until he provides evidence to support his claims.  You will see him squirm, wiggle, divert and eventually change the topic without ever supporting his position.  

Aspen programs are not evidence based in any way, shape or form.

[Whooter]

Well, Bottom line is that 99% of all the kids that finish the program do extremely well.  But dont take the word of someone on line in a forum someplace.  Call the specific programs and schools and ask to speak with some parents who had kids complete the program.  Of course they will give you names of the kids who were successful but you will be able to ask questions to someone who went thru it just like you may be and calm some of your fears.

[Troll Control]

Well, Bottom line is that 99% of all the kids that finish the program do extremely well.  But dont take the word of someone on line in a forum someplace.  Call the specific programs and schools and ask to speak with some parents who had kids complete the program.  Of course they will give you names of the kids who were successful but you will be able to ask questions to someone who went thru it just like you may be and calm some of your fears.

Bottom line is that you're full of shit.  Don't take my word for it, just post the study that proves you right.  We already know that 99% of enrolled kids don't even STAY ALIVE after the program, so how you spin that as doing 'extremely well' is beyond reason.

Show the study proving Aspen works, or just shut up.  You make yourself look even dumber than you are, which is nearly impossible, but you've pulled it off, Whooter.

[Whooter]

We already know that 99% of enrolled kids don't even STAY ALIVE after the program

Okay, I'll bite.  Show us the clinical peer reviewed study which backs up your statement.

Ouch, kind of hurts when its on the other foot doesnt it?

So while you are looking for that study the rest of us will get some real time information by talking to parents who have had kids finish the program.  This allows parents to ask questions and calm their fears about TBS's.

[RMA Survivor]

Aspen might have been a good place for you.  I'm not saying that it is a horrible place I'm just saying it is corporate which is not a good thing for the interest of our children.  My son was there and I was paying big bucks and he was not seeing a Psychiatrist regularly, he was not seeing a Therapist more then once a week for the 30 minute phone calls and with all the kids coming and going group therapy was useless it's basically hello and good bye.  He did not go to drug or 12 step because that was not his problem.  After visiting him and seeing that all the money in the world given to the ranch was not going to give him the proper treatment I hired someone outside of the Ranch to give him tests and that is when we found out that he had the Autistic thing going on, so we pulled him out.  Now if there are kids there with neurological problems, or have suicidal tendencies or are schizophrenic etc and now they are down to only one Psychiatrist and the kids aren't getting the help they need those kids that are truly sick are really going to get damaged.  That is were the shame is if they turned those kids away and only babysat the spoiled brats that would be one thing but they should not take kids with the real problems.  I'm glad that they helped you and I know that they have helped some of my son's roomates that were solely there for drug issues.

I am glad this parent was able to see the light after just a couple of pages of feedback.  A lot of times Fornits does come off as abusive to those who express any pro sentiments towards these schools but in this case it actually appeared as though the parent was "scared straight" by the early feedback.  She saw that Aspen had problems, the big one being what this site tries to educate parents about the most; That these schools are not qualified to do the stuff they claim to be able to do.  With some sarcastic and frank feedback, she was able to act on what she saw for herself.  That the program was abusive.  She didn't seem to accept this however, at least not openly.  She still felt that a school that advertised one thing, yet provided something else, was a healthy environment.  And that what was advertised was a safe, happy environment where kids will be loved, nourished, experience emotional growth and serious devotion to their individual needs...  Except that was clearly not provided.  I think as a mother, seeing her son appear outwardly happy was a positive thing given the earlier turmoil when the son was at home.  It is unfortunate that she did not have her son properly assessed before sending him away, but ultimately I think she never gave up on her son and based on her descriptions of repeatedly visiting and being a part of his life while he attended Aspen, she did not give up on, or abandon him and I think she deserves a lot of praise for that.  

This parent in her first post was saying it  was a wonderful school....with an endless list of serious and glaring problems.  Like her son, she knew there was a problem and was seeking help, clarification of what was readily apparent already.  But ultimately it was the professional industry, the MD, who moved things forward in the proper direction.  A professionally administered testing was given to the son, he was properly diagnosed, and now the parents have some idea of what to do next.  Not crackpots out in the wilderness using cult methods developed in the 1950's to punish children in to proper behavior.  

I just think it needs to be shouted as often as possible: THESE SCHOOLS DO NOT POSSESS THE ABILITY TO TREAT YOUR TROUBLED TEEN OR BACK ANY CLAIMS IN THEIR BROCHURES.

A guy hired to be a cook at my former school is now running his own school.  Another who was hired from the nearby town to work as a handyman on campus is also now running his own school and he raped a co-worker who had also worked at my school.  These people are not only lacking in qualifications to run any program or school, many have committed serious crimes in their past.  But I guess that just means they are qualified because they too have been messed up...

[Whooter]

A guy hired to be a cook at my former school is now running his own school.  Another who was hired from the nearby town to work as a handyman on campus is also now running his own school and he raped a co-worker who had also worked at my school.  These people are not only lacking in qualifications to run any program or school, many have committed serious crimes in their past.  But I guess that just means they are qualified because they too have been messed up...

RMA that was actually a pretty good post (and convincing).  But your last paragraph here plunged you into the depths of the BS meter.  If you can manage to provide a link to these two people who are running programs and links to the articles indicating they rape people we would appreciate it.

Note:  Its funny how these types of post get through here so easily as credible, but when some one says something positive about a program they are hounded as a troll or thought of as being paid by the industry.

 I am amazed that I am the only one here that is neutral enough to see this.  If this were reversed fornits would light up like a cheap carnival.

[Curious George]

KK

Don't let the jag bags get you down...somtimes it's fun to engage them, all in the guise of getting to the truth.  But after all they are the know it all's who haven't done anything to improve your situation.  These guys are usually the pissed off program teens or usually staff from the program having fun with you.

Just so you are aware, it's doubtful if the program will help you either.  

See the CALO postings and organization for concerned parents.  You are not alone.  I know you are looking for help, so are we.  General consensus is that Parents are the problem, kids are the problem and the programs are the problem.  Yea, it's sick twisted situation but someone's got the truth out there are we are looking for it.  If you are too, contact me.  

Personal message me and we can go from there.

CG

[Anonymous]

:agree:

[RMA Survivor]

Yes, I will provide further evidence.

The handyman was named Richard "Rowdy" Armstrong.  The female former staff member he raped was named Twila Stevenson.  There is a newpaper article, not too hard to find and linked all over Fornits, from the Bonners Ferry Newspaper where Rocky Mountain Academy was located.  The article goes in to great detail about how he was now an escort, working with Twila before she pressed charges on him.  He recently opened his own Wilderness program for troubled teens called Boundary Lines.  Located naturally in Boundary County, Idaho.  

The chef was named Stephen Rookie.  He later went to work at Monarch School and then started his own school called Ventures in Peace.  It is located across the border in Missoula, Montana.