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Offline Ashley's Mom

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« Reply #495 on: January 09, 2006, 06:01:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-01-09 14:48:00, Anonymous wrote:

" Just as you could say it was wrong of Jacki to have sent alex there. I could say it is wrong that you let and pay for you daughter to dress and dye her hair, tattoo her body like that. She said she wasn't aloud to have piercing other then her ears one time I was around her. Then Alex comes home with a bar in the back of his neck. On ashley's vampire site she talks about the tattoo/piercing party she had. wonder how many other kids got in trouble with their parents for getting something done to their bodies. But it is not my place to tell you how to raise your daughter. Ways I handle my kids to ways you or millions other handle there's will never match. Could I say I totally disagree that a parent should allow there child to look like that? YES Dose it matter or make me right? NO 50% could say it is screwing up her life. how she is excepted as an adult what type of doors in life it may open for her. 50% could say she will be fine she is expressing herself she is artistic. In the end it is up to you.

I know.. But Jacki sent her child to a abusive bad bad place! She didn't hear any of this until after he was placed there. Even ashleys mom admits to that. Now it is her job to do what she thinks is right for him. Then I will hear.. What dose she have to think about he could be abused. There is so much info. she is doing more then most of these parents possibly do. There is Doctors here that are reviewing and keeping a close eye on what is going on with him she isn't taking only SCL word on it all, until she can find the best place for him. one could say that allowing your child to look and hang in a group such as she dose is abuse. Drug use is higher in the goth world then some. Vi lance is high because they are not excepted by all. It is still the parents job to raise and make decision with there kids. Not everyone is going to agree."


Now, who is this?  Is it necessary to insult me in that way?  I never said his parents were "bad" or put them down.  Yep, we had several tattoo/piercing parties at our home.  We have several friends who received tattoos, including Ashley.  It was done by a close friend, and we were present.  No, no underage kids received anything unless the parents were there to sign a waiver.  Yes, a couple parents actually came and did just that!  We had nothing to do with Alex's piercing.  Didn't know about it until his father told me.  Ashley will be 18 in a few weeks, she could go anywhere and get whatever she wants, but she won't.  This way, we know who is doing the work - we like to call this "communication". Hair dye - washes out in a about a week.  Big deal!  Yes, she does only have ear piercings.  Will she get more after she turns 18, I hope not - but who knows.  
Didn't know it was an abusive facility, well maybe his parents should have done more investigating before shipping him off, it wasn't hard, we did it.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #496 on: January 09, 2006, 06:11:00 PM »
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On 2006-01-09 14:21:00, Shlee wrote:

"Trying to get technical now?  I'm reaching out to ALL of his family members.  Extended and all.  I know for a fact that his aunt has been posting and his cousin and her friends.  And, well thanks to Antigen and the fact that they can read the addresses they came from, there's not too much you can hide."
I believe I apologized for my youngest daughter.  Maybe getting crashed into in the hall had something to do with her and her friends posting bull.  She wont be posting ever.  What comes from my computer will be from me.  I have not tried to hide who I am. Neither has caught in the middle.  You have been a guest in my home on a few occasions, and you have always been treated kindly.  Getting bashed isnt fun for either of us.  We are both truly caught in the middle.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Shlee

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« Reply #497 on: January 09, 2006, 06:15:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-01-09 15:11:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-01-09 14:21:00, Shlee wrote:


"Trying to get technical now?  I'm reaching out to ALL of his family members.  Extended and all.  I know for a fact that his aunt has been posting and his cousin and her friends.  And, well thanks to Antigen and the fact that they can read the addresses they came from, there's not too much you can hide."

I believe I apologized for my youngest daughter.  Maybe getting crashed into in the hall had something to do with her and her friends posting bull.  She wont be posting ever.  What comes from my computer will be from me.  I have not tried to hide who I am. Neither has caught in the middle.  You have been a guest in my home on a few occasions, and you have always been treated kindly.  Getting bashed isnt fun for either of us.  We are both truly caught in the middle.  "


Crashed into in the hallways??  I don't even see her.  I only go to that school for 2 hours anyways.  Maybe, if you wanted to sit down and think about it, that your daughter is lying too.  I don't even walk out of that classroom when I'm there, I'm too busy doing artwork on the computer.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #498 on: January 09, 2006, 06:15:00 PM »
I am trying to figure out how to get a name.  Im sure its not hard but im a little computer illiterate.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #499 on: January 09, 2006, 06:17:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-01-09 15:15:00, Shlee wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-01-09 15:11:00, Anonymous wrote:


"
Quote


On 2006-01-09 14:21:00, Shlee wrote:



"Trying to get technical now?  I'm reaching out to ALL of his family members.  Extended and all.  I know for a fact that his aunt has been posting and his cousin and her friends.  And, well thanks to Antigen and the fact that they can read the addresses they came from, there's not too much you can hide."


I believe I apologized for my youngest daughter.  Maybe getting crashed into in the hall had something to do with her and her friends posting bull.  She wont be posting ever.  What comes from my computer will be from me.  I have not tried to hide who I am. Neither has caught in the middle.  You have been a guest in my home on a few occasions, and you have always been treated kindly.  Getting bashed isnt fun for either of us.  We are both truly caught in the middle.  "




Crashed into in the hallways??  I don't even see her.  I only go to that school for 2 hours anyways.  Maybe, if you wanted to sit down and think about it, that your daughter is lying too.  I don't even walk out of that classroom when I'm there, I'm too busy doing artwork on the computer."
okay, thats fair.  you may be right.  too much is being said by everyone.  what is true and what is a lie?  I cant even tell anymore
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #500 on: January 09, 2006, 06:19:00 PM »
So now it's been a month.  How long does he have until his 18th birthday?

Ashley's Mom, Alex's parents are obviously all screwed up.  I say this because it's what I say of *any* parents who look at their child's approaching eighteenth birthday as "running out of time."  That, in my educated opinion, is an indicator of an extremely unhealthy desire to maintain control over an adult child's life.

When Alex is 18, please be kind enough to him to hire an attorney file a habeas corpus petition to produce him in court so he can physically say if he wants to leave.

If his parents try to get the court to order him to stay, please be kind enough to hire an attorney to represent his interest, seeking a new trial or hearing or doing everything possible, to get the court to revisit the case or move him.  It should be possible for an attorney to argue that his presumable conviction was not a truly adversarial process because his parents felt they were "running out of time" and *wanted* to put him away past his 18th birthday and were seeking legal leverage to be able to do so.

The juvenile justice system can incarcerate someone until age 21, usually.  But even in juvenile court, the accused has the right to representation that represents *him* and whether *he* is guilty or innocent---not his parents.

If he is found guilty and can't get it thrown out, a family court has to apply the standard of doing what is in the best interests of the child (in the case of delinquency, to rehabilitate the child). An attorney could base the case in court on SCL being abusive or neglectful, or being ineffective, and some other placement being better.

I know lawyers have to be paid, but Ginger probably has enough information from you to be able to substantiate who you are when you post.  That means when Alex is coming up on his 18th birthday, you can come on here and ask for donations to his legal defense fund.

If Alex did whatever he is charged with, it is not necessarily wrong for him to be incarcerated until age 21---I can't possibly read all this, I don't know the charges, I don't know the potential penalties, I don't know if he did it.  But accuseds and even convicts have rights. Youth or adult.

People's rights may frequently get violated, but their chances of successfully asserting them are a lot better with a good lawyer.

If Ashley wants to help Alex, the very best way to do it is to get a McJob and save all the money for a lawyer.  You can save a lot in six months, even from a minimum wage teenage job.

If you want to help Alex, the very best way to do it is to set up a legal defense fund on his behalf, not owned by him (because then his parents could take it), and have his lawyer go to bat for him the day he turns 18.

If you want to give Alex money for when he gets out that he can get to but that his parents cannot touch, then what you probably need to do is open a UTMA account with a bank---which is real simple---in Alex's name with yourself as custodian.

Then it's Alex's money automatically on his 18th birthday (in most states, 21 in some, but even in those you can probably specify in the account creation that it becomes his at 18).

If you can't do the lawyer thing, then maybe what to do is just set up the UTMA account with yourself as custodian, give the account information here, so people can send donations to his account.  Then he'll have his own money that his parents can't touch.

Here's a tricky bit I think might work with the lawyer thing.  His parents, of course, are going to try to claim this guy isn't his lawyer.  If you set up a UTMA account with yourself as custodian, from the day you set up the account, everything in it is legally *his money*.  It's just that nobody can access it but the custodian (in this case you) of the account.  As the custodian for that account, you can spend his money on his behalf, and your custodianship continues until he shows the place (bank, brokerage, whatever) where the account is that he's of age.

I *think* that if you open a UTMA account for Alex with yourself as custodian, and after he's 18 if he doesn't show up as having gotten out you retain an attorney on Alex's behalf using his money out of that UTMA account, that in the eyes of the court, that is going to make the lawyer you hire for Alex legally Alex's lawyer.

Which will make it a lot easier for that lawyer to file motions with the court(s) on Alex's behalf.

If I opened an account in your name and mine to give you money, I could hire a lawyer with it and say that's your lawyer, but the court might question whether it's really your money.

Because of the way UTMA law works, there is no legal question at all it's Alex's money, and if your custodianship hasn't been ended by an adult Alex, there's no legal question that you as custodian have the right to spend it on his behalf.

If his parents tried to tell the court the expenditure wasn't a reasonable expenditure on his behalf, and he's 18, the obvious next move for the lawyer you retain for him would be to say, "If Alex wants to end the custodianship and claim his money, we certainly encourage that, at which point he can decide for himself if he wishes to continue to retain my services.  We would be more than happy if Alex claimed his money today, Your Honor.  Our whole contention is that we are concerned Alex may be being coerced and misled into believing his has no money and no options and is not free to leave.  We would be overjoyed and greatly reassured to know that Alex has been made aware that he owns this money."

This is probably the most effective strategy to help this particular kid.

I'm checking on some of the details of UTMA (Uniform Transfer to Minors) accounts to find out the best way to get Alex access to this money the day he turns 18.  By "access" I also include Alex knowing he has this money.

There's nother sneaky way to get information to Alex, or get him produced, once he turns 18 if he doesn't leave, if the "you aren't really Alex's lawyer" contention is successful. People support some other recent survivor in suing SCL, pick a survivor that knew Alex at SCL, and have that survivor's lawyer issue a subpeona to Alex to appear in Court.

The lawyer can tapdance all over their asses if they try to keep the process server from serving 18 year old Alex, and the lawyer can then make him physically show up.  At which point people can tell him that he has his own money, doesn't have to go back, isn't stuck choosing between coercion and a shitty exit plan.

The reality is that probably nobody is going to break Alex loose before he turns 18, and that after he's 18, because of him having charges against him, getting him loose is quite possibly going to involve lawyers and money.

Julie
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Shlee

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« Reply #501 on: January 09, 2006, 06:37:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-01-09 15:15:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I am trying to figure out how to get a name.  Im sure its not hard but im a little computer illiterate."


Just go over to the sidebar on the left.  You will see Gray bars that say titles.  Under forums, it will have orange sub-titles.  Register is the second one.  Click on that and then fill out your info.  I know, I was confused at first, also.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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Offline CaughtInTheMiddle

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« Reply #502 on: January 09, 2006, 06:45:00 PM »
Sorry forgot to sign in. I have never tried to  hide who I was. I talked about my daughter. Things I new that you would know. Sorry I am not the best speller but I will get over it. So dose /does it make you feel big and bad to threaten that you have my ip address should I put cameras around my house so my car and house doesn't get vandalized. The point that you would try to find out who I was. Is a bit disturbing. This is my point exactly you try to scare people. so why would they listen or want their child around you? I have said many times this is my opinion or understanding and that a lot of emotions for every one was happening. Things were said earlier on that was done in a finger pointing way. Then I decided to try and talk about things that may have misunderstood on both sides. Trying to help. Finger pointing wasn't. You have no idea unless you found away to listen to my phone conversations and have put a bug on me so you can hear everything I say what I am doing about it. Do you think the things you have said are going to make Alex happy?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline CaughtInTheMiddle

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« Reply #503 on: January 09, 2006, 06:46:00 PM »
your such a child
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline CaughtInTheMiddle

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« Reply #504 on: January 09, 2006, 06:47:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-01-09 15:15:00, Shlee wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-01-09 15:11:00, Anonymous wrote:


"
Quote


On 2006-01-09 14:21:00, Shlee wrote:



"Trying to get technical now?  I'm reaching out to ALL of his family members.  Extended and all.  I know for a fact that his aunt has been posting and his cousin and her friends.  And, well thanks to Antigen and the fact that they can read the addresses they came from, there's not too much you can hide."


I believe I apologized for my youngest daughter.  Maybe getting crashed into in the hall had something to do with her and her friends posting bull.  She wont be posting ever.  What comes from my computer will be from me.  I have not tried to hide who I am. Neither has caught in the middle.  You have been a guest in my home on a few occasions, and you have always been treated kindly.  Getting bashed isnt fun for either of us.  We are both truly caught in the middle.  "




Crashed into in the hallways??  I don't even see her.  I only go to that school for 2 hours anyways.  Maybe, if you wanted to sit down and think about it, that your daughter is lying too.  I don't even walk out of that classroom when I'm there, I'm too busy doing artwork on the computer."


everyone is lying but you
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline CaughtInTheMiddle

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« Reply #505 on: January 09, 2006, 06:53:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-01-09 15:01:00, Ashley's Mom wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-01-09 14:48:00, Anonymous wrote:


" Just as you could say it was wrong of Jacki to have sent alex there. I could say it is wrong that you let and pay for you daughter to dress and dye her hair, tattoo her body like that. She said she wasn't aloud to have piercing other then her ears one time I was around her. Then Alex comes home with a bar in the back of his neck. On ashley's vampire site she talks about the tattoo/piercing party she had. wonder how many other kids got in trouble with their parents for getting something done to their bodies. But it is not my place to tell you how to raise your daughter. Ways I handle my kids to ways you or millions other handle there's will never match. Could I say I totally disagree that a parent should allow there child to look like that? YES Dose it matter or make me right? NO 50% could say it is screwing up her life. how she is excepted as an adult what type of doors in life it may open for her. 50% could say she will be fine she is expressing herself she is artistic. In the end it is up to you.


I know.. But Jacki sent her child to a abusive bad bad place! She didn't hear any of this until after he was placed there. Even ashleys mom admits to that. Now it is her job to do what she thinks is right for him. Then I will hear.. What dose she have to think about he could be abused. There is so much info. she is doing more then most of these parents possibly do. There is Doctors here that are reviewing and keeping a close eye on what is going on with him she isn't taking only SCL word on it all, until she can find the best place for him. one could say that allowing your child to look and hang in a group such as she dose is abuse. Drug use is higher in the goth world then some. Vi lance is high because they are not excepted by all. It is still the parents job to raise and make decision with there kids. Not everyone is going to agree."




Now, who is this?  Is it necessary to insult me in that way?  I never said his parents were "bad" or put them down.  Yep, we had several tattoo/piercing parties at our home.  We have several friends who received tattoos, including Ashley.  It was done by a close friend, and we were present.  No, no underage kids received anything unless the parents were there to sign a waiver.  Yes, a couple parents actually came and did just that!  We had nothing to do with Alex's piercing.  Didn't know about it until his father told me.  Ashley will be 18 in a few weeks, she could go anywhere and get whatever she wants, but she won't.  This way, we know who is doing the work - we like to call this "communication". Hair dye - washes out in a about a week.  Big deal!  Yes, she does only have ear piercings.  Will she get more after she turns 18, I hope not - but who knows.  

Didn't know it was an abusive facility, well maybe his parents should have done more investigating before shipping him off, it wasn't hard, we did it."


 I am not insulting you in any way. I said it is your right as a parent. That I do not have to agree. how is that an insult? I am sure there are things I do you may not agree on. I have tattoos also you are missing the point. You do not have to explain it is your choice.
Maybe they would have more time IF Ashley wasn't controlling him?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Aunt Shelly

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« Reply #506 on: January 09, 2006, 07:04:00 PM »
I think I did it
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Offline Aunt Shelly

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« Reply #507 on: January 09, 2006, 07:05:00 PM »
Now there will be no mistake on who is saying what.  I hope this helps!  Caught In the Middle, your a riot!
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Offline Aunt Shelly

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« Reply #508 on: January 09, 2006, 07:05:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-01-09 15:37:00, Shlee wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-01-09 15:15:00, Anonymous wrote:


"I am trying to figure out how to get a name.  Im sure its not hard but im a little computer illiterate."




Just go over to the sidebar on the left.  You will see Gray bars that say titles.  Under forums, it will have orange sub-titles.  Register is the second one.  Click on that and then fill out your info.  I know, I was confused at first, also."
Thanks
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Aunt Shelly

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« Reply #509 on: January 09, 2006, 07:14:00 PM »
I must say that there was miscommunication on both sides.  Everyone wanted what they wanted and we all lost, especially Alex.  I hope that something can be worked out between both Ashley and the Azzopardi's before Alex comes home.  Maybe we can concentrate on that.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »