Author Topic: Questionnaire for Survivors of Programs  (Read 5378 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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Questionnaire for Survivors of Programs
« on: August 27, 2005, 09:02:00 PM »
Seeking survivors

If you are survivor of a residential teen program and would like to take part in this survey, please answer the following questions:

1. Which program did you attend?

2. How long were you in the program?

3. Why were you sent there?

4. Did you feel your parents were justified in sending you away?

5. How did you get there? Escort service pick you up in the middle of the night, or did you go willingly.

6. If you went willingly, do you feel the program was misrepresented to you? If so, how?

7. Education: Did you get a good education while you were in the program? Did you have teachers who gave lectures or was it all self teaching?  Did you receive a high school diploma, or were you able to finish and get a diploma on time? Do you feel the education was adequate and helped you move on to college?

8. How was the food? And the cleanliness of the place?

9. Were you abused? If so, how? How many times? By whom?

10. Did you witness others being abused? If so, what form of abuse and how often?

11. Overall, was your experience positive or negative?

12. If it was positive, please summarize your experience.

13. If it was negative, please summarize your experience.

Thank you for your help with this survey.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #1 on: August 27, 2005, 09:04:00 PM »
14. What's with the survey, who are you?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2005, 04:10:00 AM »
There are many people who would like to know answers to those questions, and it seems this is a good place to ask.

Nothing's up with the survey, just thought it would be a good place for everyone to sum it all up.

Who am I? Well, I post anonymously because I, like many others here, don't want to share my identity. That's the beauty of this forum, right?

So don't over analyze this. Do know for sure I am someone on the side of the kids who have been harmed by programs. And I have my own personal story, as well.  

It's all good. Thanks for asking.
 ::cheers::
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #3 on: September 02, 2005, 06:38:00 AM »
okay. you go first.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #4 on: September 02, 2005, 04:26:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-08-27 18:02:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Seeking survivors



If you are survivor of a residential teen program and would like to take part in this survey, please answer the following questions:



1. Which program did you attend?

Straight, Inc., St. Petersburg FL, 1982-83


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2. How long were you in the program?

Thirteen months, from Oct '82--Nov '83.

Quote



3. Why were you sent there?

My parents found a bag of marijuana of mine, they were recruited by other Program parents that told them I'd be DEADINSANEINJAIL in the next week or so if I didn't go to Straight.


Quote

4. Did you feel your parents were justified in sending you away?

Absolutely not. In fact, they ignored the advice of psychologists and psychiatrists and chose to believe Program dogma rather than trained professionals.


Quote

5. How did you get there? Escort service pick you up in the middle of the night, or did you go willingly.

My parents told me it was a two week program, so I went sort of voluntarily.  I had NO idea what it was really like.  I kind of envisioned a medical facility.


Quote

6. If you went willingly, do you feel the program was misrepresented to you? If so, how?



Absolutely.  I had no idea what methods and conditions I would be subjected to at Straight.  I thought it would be more like a two week vacation from my family, with trained staff, more like a detox or psychiatric facility, maybe like a juvenile detention center (none of which I had been in before Straight)

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7. Education: Did you get a good education while you were in the program? Did you have teachers who gave lectures or was it all self teaching?  Did you receive a high school diploma, or were you able to finish and get a diploma on time? Do you feel the education was adequate and helped you move on to college?

Are you kidding?  Education was non-existent at Straight---they considered it a way to "avoid yourself and your drug problem".  They had a pathetic excuse for a classroom where I was given reading assignments I could have done in first or second grade (I was 16-17 at the time, in my sophomore year of high school when I went in).  I got a HS diploma at an adult high school at night after I got out of Straight.  The "education" I received at Straight did absolutely nothing to help me, college preparation or otherwise.  A complete joke.



Quote

8. How was the food? And the cleanliness of the place?

Worse than jails I have been in on both counts, although many of the "foster homes" (where we were locked in and treated as slaves) were cleaned by a continuous stream of slave labor.



Quote

9. Were you abused? If so, how? How many times? By whom?

Yes, both by the program and it's methods and conditions, and by individual staff members and other clients at the direction of Staff.  The whole apparatus was a big abuse machine.  I was physically abused by staff on numerous occasions, ranging from being beaten and deprived of food and sleep, to hairpulling, to being spat on, to being psychologically abused, to being sat on, to being made to sit in my own feces after being denied the use of a bathroom.  I blame the staff members, particularly the executive staff, but I do blame the lower level staff, too.


Quote

10. Did you witness others being abused? If so, what form of abuse and how often?

Yes, every day, in the manner described above, plus other ways involving humiliation, forced confessions, and physical deprivation or torture.


Quote

11. Overall, was your experience positive or negative?

It was easily the worst experience of my life.


Quote

12. If it was positive, please summarize your experience.

Not applicable


Quote

13. If it was negative, please summarize your experience.


Thirteen months of hell, that scarred me more than I realized at the time.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #5 on: September 04, 2005, 05:08:00 PM »
Thank you for responding. I am sorry for what you, and thousands of other teens and children, have had to go through at the hands of sick, power-hungry, and demented human beings. I wish there were a way that all of those injured could speak out to this country in a huge way. I know the reasons it doesn't happen, and it's a shame. I know that they try to make it seem like it's all the kids' faults. Of course it could never be the fault of the parents who lie and decieve their children. The very same children who are called manipulators. Who are the manipulators in these cases? I think it's obvious by your response. The parents who lied and deceived you and the program owners and operators who then abused you and others. Sick. I am truly sorry for your experience.

I would appreciate it if more of you would reply like this because I would like to prepare a survey of hundreds, if not thousands, of accounts such as these. Eventually, if I have enough, maybe, just maybe, someone will listen. I think it's worth a shot.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #6 on: September 04, 2005, 09:16:00 PM »
Its not a bad idea. If you go around to some universities you may find a professor who will help you or sponsor you in this, and they could publish it for you too. Professors love stuff like this it shouldn't be too hard to pull of at all. Publishing stuff helps them get tenured and if you have a great idea and want to do all the work for them, I'm sure lots of them would jump at the opportunity. You should start going by and talking to people.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2005, 11:41:00 PM »
Thank you for your response. I will give it a shot with the university as I think it's a great idea.

So everyone please take a few moments to answer the questionnaire. Who knows, it could make a difference. It's worth a shot and I'm willing to do the work.

Thanks again, it's each other working together that is going to make a difference. I'm convinced.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline bandit1978

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« Reply #8 on: September 05, 2005, 03:46:00 AM »
Okay, I'll start to try and answer.  You may reproduce what I write at any time, or quote me, or whatever.  

My parents sent me to Provo Canyon School when I was 14 years old- upon the recommendation of our pediatrician (the notorious Dr. Schwartz of northern VA).

Basically, I was just a smart ass who skipped a bit of 9th grade and really knew how to push my mothers buttons.  

I physically and voluntarily traveled to Utah with my father to enroll in the place.  I was young and from the suburbs and really didn't see any other choice.  Plus my mother was crazy.  

Turns out Provo Canyon School wasn't all that it said it was.  My mother had a personal shopper at Nordstrom round up some things like winter snow boots, jackets, things like that...and it turns out that I was not to be skiing down the mountains and snowmobiling, as she had thought I would be.  In fact, there was 1 corner window on the orientation unit (where I spent 3 months), and looking out of this window at any time was considered "run plans", a highly punishable offense.  Suprised my mother was when all of these things were sent home to her.  

But by then it was too late.  She had already signed me over, and wasn't gonna turn back now.  She ignored many of the "red flags" that people talk about now- the monitored communications, physical restrictions/methods of punishment, terrible food;  thing she hadn't thoroughly investigated before sending me there.  

Yes, I was too young to really understand what was going on there, too young to recognize abuse and too young to effectively advocate for myself and others.  I was scared, and the whole program the staff seemed so bizzare, I just went along with it.  

I saw lots of abuse...I could write a book about it.  What else do you want to know??

I'm 27yo now, have finished college, am RN, successful, BF an MD.  I live in a beautiful loft on Capital Hill (yes, that Capital Hill).  

I still suffer from symptoms of PTSD.  

My parents regret ever sending me there, said they are not medical professionals, and did not understand just how fucked up that place was, how ineffective and inhumane, and how badly it would hurt me.  

Any further info or anything you would like me to elaborate on?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
egan Flynn
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Survivor- Provo Canyon School

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #9 on: September 05, 2005, 04:02:00 AM »
Re: the university thing.

Try speaking with Dr. Richard Ofshe of UC Berkeley, who is a specialist in cults, and ask him if he has ever done a study on behavior modification schools. I was just speaking about him in another thread, because I spoke with him years ago about the Synanon/CEDU connection.

He is very hard to get in touch with, however, because he is a very busy man.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #10 on: September 05, 2005, 06:20:00 AM »
Ok, I'll give it a crack.

Quote
On 2005-08-27 18:02:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Seeking survivors



If you are survivor of a residential teen program and would like to take part in this survey, please answer the following questions:



1. Which program did you attend?

Rocky Mountain Academy (of the CEDU school network)

Quote
2. How long were you in the program?

2 and a half years

Quote
3. Why were you sent there?

I was a discipline problem. Getting in trouble at school, my parents were scared of me. Anger issues. I had attempted suicide twice. I had been diagnosed with bipolar disorder. (A valid diagnosis, actually. I really do have bipolar disorder. But RMA certainly did nothing to address that. They weren't treating psychological disorders and dispensing medication when I went there. Probably to my benefit, since I heard there was a lot of overdiagnosis and misdiagnosis when it was going on.) I was also into wicca, and that scared my parents, but that is NOT a valid reason for sending someone away to school, but that's not the reason they sent me, that was only one extra thing that gave them pause. (But it was a stupid, prejudicial thing to be worried about.) I actually had a lot of real problems that had nothing to do with wicca. There was another kid who had been sent up there who was into wicca, too.

Oh yeah, I was a fag, too. That didn't help. I can't honestly say whether or not my parents were hoping that RMA would de-fagify me (although RMA sure tried) but they sure weren't happy at that time that their son was an out teenage fairy. They were much more concerned about my most recent suicide attempt and whether or not I would be successful the next time. But having me bouncing around school as an out queer didn't help my case.

Quote
4. Did you feel your parents were justified in sending you away?

I'm not sure how to answer that question. I know I had serious problems. I wasn't just some kid who had smoked pot once for fun, or cut school for kicks, or was a simple rebellious teen, I actually had some serious problems. (Teens don't try to kill themselves for no reason.) But I honestly don't know what would have been the best solution. All things considered, I think I turned out OK, even though the school was screwed up. I'm not a parent, and I haven't been put in the position of having to deal with a troubled child, so I honestly can't understand what it is like.

My parents just wanted to find a place for me that was better than a hospital and putting me on lithium. This place seemed nice. It was out in the woods. You weren't locked up in rooms and put in restraints. You went on camping trips. All the kids looked happy and they looked you in the eye when they spoke to you. Which program would you have chosen? My parents also had no idea the kinds of things that went on up there. I was indoctrinated so quickly after I arrived, that I never mentioned to them the kinds of things I went through, because I didn't want to get pulled out and put in a worse place.

Quote
5. How did you get there? Escort service pick you up in the middle of the night, or did you go willingly.

I went willingly, but under false pretenses. I was told that we were going up there to tour the campus for two days and visit the school. I had no idea I wasn't going to come back for two years! They had a back up plan and the escort service set up in case I decided to bolt or get uppity, however. (Upon advice from the school.) A lot of kids got up to school this way, actually.

Quote
6. If you went willingly, do you feel the program was misrepresented to you? If so, how?

The program itself was not misrepresented, no. Mainly because my parents knew as much about the program as I did, really.

Quote
7. Education: Did you get a good education while you were in the program? Did you have teachers who gave lectures or was it all self teaching?  Did you receive a high school diploma, or were you able to finish and get a diploma on time? Do you feel the education was adequate and helped you move on to college?

The academic education was mediocre, at best. Especially when I first got there. But we certainly got high school credits. We got credits up the yin yang. Raps were "interpersonal dynamic workshop" credits, wood corral was some sort of credit, wilderness expeditions were "experiential" credits. Just call them "bullshit" credits. We all complained about the quality of our academic education. It was so funny, because most of us hated school before we got there, but now that we were there, we actually missed having a decent education! As we got towards the upper school, our education got better, though, because they built a new academic building, and hired some new teachers, and the upper school families actually dedicated most of the daytime to academic classes, so I actually started to get some decent education towards the later part of my stay there, but nothing spectacular. We even got a computer lab and everything. (whoopdeefuckindoo.) I graduated with my high school diploma, (as did most of the kids when I was there) and did just fine grade-wise in college, but I don't credit RMA for that. I credit that to the fact that I'm smart.

Like I said, it was mediocre. My mom wasn't at all happy with the quality of the academic education that place had.

Quote
8. How was the food? And the cleanliness of the place?

The food was actually very good and healthy. (except that it made you fart like crazy) It had to be, because we had to work very hard physically, and raps, propheets and workshops would take a lot out of you, because it was all about breaking you down as much as possible. If we got no nutrition, the kids would have just fallen apart. The students actually helped out in the kitchen, too. The place was kept pretty clean, since the students had to clean it constantly. (As clean as you can get wood, anyway, since every-fucking-thing there was made of wood.) Every single day we had to clean, and then on saturday, was a super-cleaning day. I wouldn't say the cleanliness standards were military-grade, because it's impossible to get wood that clean, but they liked to keep a tight ship.

Quote
9. Were you abused? If so, how? How many times? By whom?

There was no physical abuse in the sense that there were no beatings or restraints. However, there was plenty of verbal abuse and humiliation. The very structure of "raps" (the group confrontational therapy meetings that we had three days a week for several hours) and the "propheets" (overnight workshops) involved lots of browbeating, airing of dirty, embarrassing secrets that were nobody's business, and faculty screaming at students. The raps were incredibly abusive, in my opinion. People just screamed like crazy at each other, and none more than the faculty. Some faculty had a reputation for being particularly sadistic, too. There was also regression therapy mixed in with primal scream (which was dubbed "running your anger"), something else they called "diads", and bizarre physical exercises done in the propheets and workshops, that involves things like shoving each other, punching cushions, being held down on the floor by your peer group, running in place to the point of exhaustion, excluduing two members in your peer group from a group circle and having them try to force their way in while everyone else tries to keep them out, biting down on a towel while pulling on the ends as hard as you can, and holding that position for two to three minutes. You know, stuff like that.

CEDU also bought out the copyright to use Lifespring as their final workshop. Lifespring is a now defunct white-collar cult which was popular in the early 90s. They had a five day workshop that cost several hundred dollars. Mel Wasserman made a deal with them that allowed him to use it at his school, so he bought the copyright, and added a day of his own stuff. He called it the Summit. That workshop was hideous. Dr. Phil does stuff from it now, (the extremely mild stuff) did you know that? He does the red/green game, and that whole bit about "are you a giver, or a taker?"

CEDU was all about breaking down resistance, both physically (through exhausting physical labor and bizarre "theraputic" exercises) and mentally, so they could make you more receptive to their own ideology.

Quote
10. Did you witness others being abused? If so, what form of abuse and how often?

My peers went through the same things I did.

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11. Overall, was your experience positive or negative?

Mostly negative. Although I did come out in a better situation than I went in there, so I have to give RMA props for that. I graduated from there ready for college. And I have some good memories from the wilderness expeditions.

Quote
12. If it was positive, please summarize your experience.

It is very hard to remember any positive things from there. (I don't really even care about any of my old friends from there.) Mostly I remember the scenery. It's in a nice part of the country. I liked rock climbing, and skiing. I remember seeing a really wicked sunset on my Wilderness Quest that I have a slide of. The nicest memory I think I have from RMA is from my solo on my Wilderness Challenge. (We went to the Owyhee desert in southern Idaho.) I just remember that for four wonderful days, I was in this beautiful canyon, and I didn't have to talk to anyone from my peer group, or speak to any faculty from the school, or listen to anybody's crap, and I could get up when I wanted, and go to bed when I wanted, and nobody screamed at me, and I wasn't at that horrid school, and I didn't have to hike anywhere or carry my pack, and it was quiet and wonderful. I just sat around, ate my trail mix, and wrote stupid silly naive things in my journal that make me laugh now when I think about it. I was so sad when those four days were over and I had to go back and deal with all of those assholes again.

Quote
13. If it was negative, please summarize your experience.


It was extremely disturbing and alienating. I think I covered most of this in the "abuse" section, though. However, when I was there, I was totally brainwashed, and thought the program was great. But I was of two minds. I was terrified of being sent anywhere else and totally wanted to be at that school, yet I was constantly tormented mentally and was always struggling and paranoid. Every rap day was a day filled with anxiety. The physical labor wasn't shit compared to the mental crap I had to go through. It just wasn't normal.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2005, 06:25:00 AM »
Uh, to specify on question 6. My parents knew about as much as I did about the program, which was next to nothing. So in a sense, the inner workings of the program were misrepresented to both of us, but my parents did not misrepresent the program to me, which was what I was trying to say.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #12 on: September 05, 2005, 10:19:00 AM »
Anon,


I aspprteiate your kindness and empathy toward surviors ofthe abusive schools in the Teen Help Industry.

As a parent who was decieved and lied to,I resent your implication parents deliberty hurt their children. That is not always the case.

Until you have walked the long journey and have been a parent whose child was in need of intervention, please don't judge harshly.

I know our truth.  It wasnt as you make it seems.

Put the energy in shutting down or overhauling the industry.

There may be parents who use schools as a dumping ground. I never met any. We did get brain washed .That's  a fact. I didnt realize it at the time.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #13 on: September 05, 2005, 11:04:00 AM »
QUOTE: Try speaking with Dr. Richard Ofshe of UC Berkeley, who is a specialist in cults, and ask him if he has ever done a study on behavior modification schools. I was just speaking about him in another thread, because I spoke with him years ago about the Synanon/CEDU connection.

He is very hard to get in touch with, however, because he is a very busy man.

Thank you for this information. I will try contacting him this week. I am happy to see others responding and hope that we can make this a survey of hundreds, if not thousands, of survivors.

I do believe this will have an impact, so thank you and keep them coming.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #14 on: September 05, 2005, 11:18:00 AM »
QUOTE:

I aspprteiate your kindness and empathy toward surviors ofthe abusive schools in the Teen Help Industry.

As a parent who was decieved and lied to,I resent your implication parents deliberty hurt their children. That is not always the case.

Until you have walked the long journey and have been a parent whose child was in need of intervention, please don't judge harshly.

I know our truth. It wasnt as you make it seems.

Put the energy in shutting down or overhauling the industry.

There may be parents who use schools as a dumping ground. I never met any. We did get brain washed .That's a fact. I didnt realize it at the time.

Dear Parent:

I am the one who began this thread and who is planning on putting together this survey. I understand that many parents have been not only fooled into believing these programs will help their children dramatically, but who were then brainwashed and taken for a ride financially. It has devestated families financially and emotionally and I feel for you.

Please, others who read and post here, please understand that yes, some parents are sending their children to these programs for the wrong reasons ... we all know that.

But please remember that literally thousands of parents have felt they were either at their wits' end or they wanted to do something that would help their child who, in their eyes, was straying and going down the wrong path.

Our children are, for the most part, the most important thing in our lives, as parents, and we want to do whatever we can to make them safe and whole. I am not a  parent who sent a child to a program but I have spoken to many parents who did. I have heard them as they agonize over what has happened to their children. They were conned, for lack of a better word. into sending children who really did not need to go.

I try to equate it to parents who send kids to boarding school, for whatever their reasons, or fat camp (if it's what the child wants), diabetes camp, anything to better the lives of their children. They send them there because they feel it will benefit their child. They do not think that these people are going to abuse their children.

I just can't imagine that parents, as a whole, are going to spend $45,000 to $90,000 and more to send their child away to be abused. That just doesn't make logical sense. Yes, there are those parents who want to simply get rid of a problem child, but I think they are far and few between.

So please, if a parent tells you they were brainwashed and they have regrets for sending their child away, please understand the agony they are living with on a daily basis. I can't imagine that reality - knowing I sent my child to a place and he/she was abused there.

Thank you for listening. I support the children who were abused and the parents who have regrets for sending them there.
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