Guantanamo Bay vs Tranquility Bay

[Anonymous]

On 2005-06-22 11:05:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I explain to each child that thier parents are scared for them and that they have chosen for them to get help. The child can come with us without cuffs if they just follow my directions.

It of course is imtimadating and scary to each child just being a strange person in thier room. I don't need to bully anyone. It is all about care and compasion with me and my company. I don't use any weapons or even have any. As I said 98% of the time they come without cuffs and I can usually have a pretty good talk with the kids in the 6-8 hours or more that I do get to know them. I also have spoken in length with the parents about thier child so I can try to understand them as much as possible, and thus try to council them on the trip. It is not a pretty job, but yes thier are allot of transporters that use cuffs as procedure. It is not our policy. It is already probbably the most difficult day of the childs life. I am the one who cares."

One Who Kidnaps, you are a real loser. You HURT and ABUSE children to feed your delusions of being "helpful" or "compassionate". There is nothing compassionate or helpful about what you're doing.

You bully these kids all the time. Bullying comes in many forms, not only physical. You intimidate them and threaten them with physical violence. That is considered bullying.

You kidnap children. You should be behind bars. And stay there for a long, long time.

[OverLordd]

Yay, he finally tried to defend him self, your coming along troll, keep it up, and we might not have to use the cattle prod. Well then, what do you do if the child does not want to come? What do you do if its obvious the parents are way out of line, what do you do if you find in the 6 to 8 hours that you spend with this kid that he is emotionally scared, what do you do if you find out he is normal and its not his fault and he truely has been abused and you realize your only going to make it worse? hmm? you people keep with the plan, you dont know commpassion, if you knew commpassion you would be happly killing your selfs for your transgressions against people. you still did not tell us where you stand on child rights.

[Nihilanthic]

I explain to each child that thier parents are scared for them and that they have chosen for them to get help. The child can come with us without cuffs if they just follow my directions.
It of course is imtimadating and scary to each child just being a strange person in thier room. I don't need to bully anyone. It is all about care and compasion with me and my company. I don't use any weapons or even have any. As I said 98% of the time they come without cuffs and I can usually have a pretty good talk with the kids in the 6-8 hours or more that I do get to know them. I also have spoken in length with the parents about thier child so I can try to understand them as much as possible, and thus try to council them on the trip. It is not a pretty job, but yes thier are allot of transporters that use cuffs as procedure. It is not our policy. It is already probbably the most difficult day of the childs life. I am the one who cares.

vague-a-riffic!

BTW, do you even realize what youre doing psychologically? "Your mommy and daddy are scared for you, you need help, they sent me to take you somewhere". That is going to terrify the shit out of any child. PLUS, being late at night and with you basically invading their safety zone, their room, with parental permission, theyre more than likely too scared to think about anything.

So, yeah, you drag a scared and disoriented kid somewhere. Congratulations, jackass.

Incase you forgot, dumbass, the issue we bring up is the programs you take kids to, and how they operate, and what goes on. You're just a cog in the machine, and youre obviously only that. You repeat "I am the one who cares" like parroted program-speak you must have learned in a seminar, or made up yourself to feel good about yourself and what you do.

Getting a hug in 9 months doesnt mean shit. Do you even have the ability to comprehend what we're saying when we say "THE PROGRAMS ABUSE AND BRAINWASH THE CHILDREN. THEY ARE EMOTIONALLY AND PSYCHOLOGICALLY FUCKED UP BY THEM. THEY ARE MADE TO BE AFRAID TO SAY ANYTHING BAD ABOUT THE PROGRAM BECUASE THEY ARE PUNISHED FOR DOING SO!".

They wont tell you shit if they are abused because they know that if they do they'll be punished for it. God, didnt you pick up on the fact that EVERYONE is told "the kid will lie to get out" upon program entry, regardless of why they went there? That really should be VERY fishy if you went to the program for reasons that had nothing to do with lying, especially if its a voluntary case.

But, well, you dont care. You belive all the press releases and bullshit from the programs, believe in what you do, and you get reinforcement from yourself and others because you dont want to think  otherwise, youd never entertain the possibility of it, and terrified children hug you and act glad to see you because they dont want to be hurt anymore.

You might not be as bad as the people who actually hurt those kids, but you are a thug who kidnaps children and takes them to people who will hurt them, regardless of if you know about it or not.

Here's freedom to him who would read;
 
Here's freedom to him who would write;

None ever feared that the truth should be heard,

But them that the truth would indict.


--author unknown (circa 1914)

[Anonymous]

God has laid out a plan for all of us and there is nothing we can do to alter it.

[Anonymous]

On 2005-06-22 17:47:00, Anonymous wrote:

"God has laid out a plan for all of us and there is nothing we can do to alter it."

 :wstupid:

[OverLordd]

God has laid out a plan for all of us and there is nothing we can do to alter it.

Filthy Heritic, I swear to God if I find out who posted that I will rip you a new one! I cannont stand that dirty stinking perdestionationism, look at it this way. If good has a plan, then nothing we do matters, if nothing we do matter than we dont have a reason for living which is not in the bible. Also if predestionationism is correct then we are robots for jesus, with programming and everything, if we are robots then God does not truely love us, becaus he can have some one else praise him, why would he deal with all the crap we put him through other wise. You people that say things like that piss me off, because your so wrong!

...

Im sorry... that really a hot button issue with me...

[Anonymous]

Been debating this in my head for awhile... Like sometimes I think, I don't know if it's God or a higher power, the stars or just destiny, or =will=, but sometimes I wonder if I was meant to go to lockdown for some specific reason, like how Burroughs went to Los Alamos (when it was a boy's ranch school) I think in the twenties or thirties before it became nuke research center for atomic bombs '42.  Maybe it's just all part of the training camp- we're taught to fear our enemies, good vs evil dual, which side are you on?  But shit, I would have never found out about lockdowns if I didn't go there.  I would have never reaffirmed my stance on human rights if I never had to undergo that torture, but yet no one should have to endure that, so was it really necessary in my case?  Soon as I got out I read Berkman's Prison Memoirs, in fact it was really one of the first books I ever read and actually absorbed.  He was in for fourteen years!  But I wonder what I could have done had I never been locked up? How much more confident I'd be in myself- I wouldn't have Provo back problems either, or recurring nightmares, so I'd probably have more energy.  But everything happens for a reason.  the boy I met once and totally connected with died last month from an accidental gunshot wound to the head just weeks before his 21st.   it just misfired.  Does everything really happen for a reason?  That's how Joan went out which got old Bill writing in the first place.  Does everthing happen for a reason?  Does God or whatever have a preplanned agenda for our lives, and we're all just puppets on a string?  Are we really all that brainwashed that we ignore all the subtle subliminal suggestions pressuring us into our decisions?  What am I supposed to do invest in a tin-foil hat?  Children dying of cancer- Is that part of God's plan?  Kids being harassed in 24/7 lockdown, is that part of God's plan?  Holocaust has a secure place in the language when it refers to the massive destruction of humans by other humans.  I have almost every Program Kid tell me that imprisonment is worse than death.  If I was going to be taken again, I would risk it all to get away, whatever route OCH-bi means enter the road, which means die.  All part of God's plan, my man.  Then he puts on a new DVD.


.


***And to that GUY who kidnaps kids:  Have you no talent?  Or do you just get a rush being in a teenager's room and watching them get dressed at dawn?

[Antigen]

On 2005-06-22 11:05:00, Anonymous wrote:

 The child can come with us without cuffs if they just follow my directions.

Ok, let's try that logic in similar scenareos.

"Give me $1,000,000 and I won't kick your ass". = extortion.

"Just let me hit it and I won't blow your brains out" = rape

"Just come along quietly and I won't cuff you" = kidnapping.

Look, there's no getting around the simple fact that you take these kids against their will, cuffed and dusted if they won't go along. And you have stated before that some of the places you take them are abusive; that you dissagree w/ the placements. So you're telling a bald faced lie when you assure them that it's for their own good. You don't even know these kids when you kidnap them. You just assume that the parents know what they're doing, despite glaring evidence to the contrary.

Look, why don't you just get a job euthenizing unwanted puppies and kittens. It would certainly be a more honest way to make a living.

Preacher man don't tell me heaven is under the earth; you don't know what life is worth;.......If you know what life is worth, you will look for your's on earth.

--Bob Marley

_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
Drug war POW
Seed `71 - `80
Straight, Sarasota
   10/80 - 10/82
Anonymity Anonymous
return undef() if /coercion/i;

[Antigen]

On 2005-06-22 17:47:00, Anonymous wrote:

"God has laid out a plan for all of us and there is nothing we can do to alter it."

Then why do anything?

Seriously, I think when people say "It's all in God's plan" is code for "Sit down and shut up, this is the way it's going to be" or "just get over it."

Note that when God wanted the Turks off the holy land, he (according to the clerics) needed all kinds of help and sacrifice from us mere humans. But when those humans wanted some freedom, to keep the product of their labours or to not have to share their brides w/ the nobles, all that was "all in god's plan." So now God's plan for these kids is to go through hell to get them to quit annoying or frightening their parents. To the kids they say "it's all in god's plan for you" (suck it up!). But the parents they get the other stock response, "God needs plenty of help (and cash, btw) from you in order to carry out his plan."

This God character seems a little shady to me. Seems to rely a lot on double binds and guilt trips.

 

When we are pleading with foreign governments to stop the flow of cocaine, it is the height of hypocrisy for the US to export tobacco.  Years from now, our nation will look back on this application of free trade policy and find it scandalous.

1989 testimony before the US Trade Representative,September 1989
--Surgeon General, Everett Koop

_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
Drug war POW
Seed `71 - `80
Straight, Sarasota
   10/80 - 10/82
Anonymity Anonymous
return undef() if /coercion/i;

[Nihilanthic]

Saying that god laid out a plan is the most useless statement to make!

Because, see, no matter what you do, think, or feel, youre just following his plan!

You are, Ginger, I am, OWC is, the kids in the programs do, including those who fail or succeed, and the abuse is all part of the plan to.

So, basically, its saying "keep doing whatever the fuck youre doing, god approves".

 :roll:

We are a one party country. Half of them call themselves Democrats and the other half call themselves Republicans. All the good ideas come from the Libertarians.
--Hugh Downs

[OverLordd]

There is a verse in the Bible.

"I know the plans I have for you declares the Lord, plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you a hope and a future."

I want it noted, as the person who most likely has the most theological knowledge on the board (unless some one is hideing a masters of divinity somewhere) that yes, God has plans for us, but they are not as some one seems to think THE thing that is going to happen to you, you have the choice to go along with the plans or not to, we are seintent human beings, with knowledge and a soul given to us by God, we are unlike any other creature on Earth because of this, and because God loves us so much we get to choice our own destiny, its called free will.

When parents start forcing us to behave the way we want things like these camps and schools, think about it, if God started forcing us to do things, what terrable things would happen? Some people willingly submit them selfs to God so he can use them more directly, yet his actions are always moving through people that dont want to help him like a undercurrent. Think of a kind word you said to some one, or when you helped some one out, basicly whenever you indirectly helped some one that could of been God.

Yes, God is all powerful, he can do whatever he wants, be he loves us, so he lets us make our own mistakes, then if we come to him, he helps us out of those mistakes, but we must come of our own free will!!!

You, anon, were sent to lock down because your parents exersiced their free will to send you there, God does have a plan, but we are not pupets, we can work by our selfs, we can do by our selfs, but its not the best way to do so. Children dieing or beening sent off is not part of Gods plan, its a example of this corupt world, and corupt people that are working on their free will.

[BuzzKill]

Myself, I don't see it as God's plan, that people suffer the indignities and pains, life so often dishes out; but rather, that He is able to turn these negative things into strengths and blessings.

[OverLordd]

Your the man buzzkill, good summary.

[Anonymous]

I found out about the lockdowns without having to go through one.  A lot of my friends were having conniptions and afraid for one of their friends that got sent, so I started digging.

So no, you don't have to get sent to one to learn about it and learn that there's a problem with it.

I became stronger than I was before I was raped by all the hard work I had to do to recover from the rape.  That doesn't mean the rapist did me any favors.  I could have gotten the very same strength from putting the same effort into developing strength of character.

You can learn about combat and come out a tough and skilled soldier by going in with a hundred comrades in arms and being one of only ten that survive a hell battlefield---the surviving veterans of Omaha Beach in Normandy on D-Day are some tough sons-of-bitches.

Or you can learn about combat at Coronado as part of SEAL training--also tough, also selective, also weeds out a lot who can't hack it or whose bodies fail them.  But the ones who don't make it rarely die, and the ones who are good but would have simply been unlucky in battle survive and learn.  End result is more surviving tough sons-of-bitches.

(At Coronado, you can ring the bell and go any time you want to leave.  It's hell on earth, but it's all strictly voluntary hell for people who want to serve badly enough, and think they have the physical and mental ability, to save the lives of others who would have died going in their place.)

There are character building experiences that *don't* leave you scarred that are just as effective as the ones that do.

Those of you who come out of the lockdowns and heal and make yourselves over into better people are just doing an exemplary job of making lemonade from lemons.

Timoclea

[Anonymous]

My whole point with that is as a strong survivor of some bad shit, never let anyone try to sell you the bullshit that the person who hurt you was doing you some kind of favor.

Your strength is a testimony to *your* will and effort to overcome the bad shit.

The predator who sunk you in the bad shit gets no credit whatsoever for *your* will and *your* hard work amd *your* compassion that you somehow kept alive.

The predator is just another sadistic scumbag in a world that already has way too many of those, trying to justify his evil behavior by taking credit for *your* good work.

It's a con job.  Yet another one.  Don't be drawn into it.

Timoclea